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Child Item

Cycle Lanes in Phoenix Park

papu

Bought a new bike, went for a spin up and down chesterfield avenue today on the "Bike Lane". Pedestrians every 100m, whole families, buggies, kids. Asking them to move to the pedestrian lane I was told to "Get over myself" "f** off" etc. etc. one lady even told me to use the "bike lane!:rolleyes:".

I would have thought the signs on the bike path are fairly self explanatory, do they need to put up more explicit signage? How do other people get on? Is this what it's like every weekend??:(

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Chips Lovell

For me, parked cars aren't really the problem. It's the traffic. And it's not so much the traffic, but people driving like c**ks, without appreciating that it's first and foremost a leisure amenity, not another N-Road.

Hurrache

cgcsb wrote: »

Take public transport. Chose to drive elsewhere if you like, it is a very special park and shouldn't be stuffed with cars.

Not sure how familiar you are with public transport in Ireland, but it can't be done by public transport.

And even if I was to do on my own, I couldn't get there by public transport without going into the city centre and back out again, despite it being 10 minutes or so away by car.

And be realistic, it's not stuffed with cars.

cgcsb

Hurrache wrote: »

And how do I get there and park with a car load of kids, their bikes and bags, and dogs? It's just adding unreasonable hurdles to using it. For all that hassle I'd just drive to Marlay Park, Malahide Castle or Ardgillan Castle, adding a bit more to my carbon footprint.

Any business will then be taking from what is pretty much my local area and spent elsewhere.

Take public transport. Chose to drive elsewhere if you like, it is a very special park and shouldn't be stuffed with cars.

Hurrache

buffalo wrote: »

Bloom is a recurring event and therefore not an exception, and is an interesting aspect as to how the OPW views the Park and how it should be used.

Yes, but in the daily and weekly use of the park it's an exceptional event in terms of the numbers and traffic it brings.

Spanish Eyes

I've often wondered why car traffic was never diverted from Chesterfield Ave to North Road perimeter route instead. I'm sure there is a reason. A new entrance to the Zoo car parks could be made from North Road if the will was there.

Then ban cars and parking on Ch/Ave altogether and just allow pedestrians, cyclists, and the hop on hop off buses. Sounds too simple I suppose but would be great!

Anything can be done if the vision (and the money) is there really. It is a fantastic amenity Ch/Ave is just choking with cars who are commuting or parked.

buffalo

Hurrache wrote: »

Bloom though is an exceptional circumstance, and certainly shouldn't feed into why the park should be changed as a result.

Bloom is a recurring event and therefore not an exception, and is an interesting aspect as to how the OPW views the Park and how it should be used.

Hurrache

cgcsb wrote: »

Not really, Extend the Chesterfield avenue route to Heuston Station and Castleknock Station. Very easy interchange with PT in the rest of the city. You wouldn't need parking at all.

And how do I get there and park with a car load of kids, their bikes and bags, and dogs? It's just adding unreasonable hurdles to using it. For all that hassle I'd just drive to Marlay Park, Malahide Castle or Ardgillan Castle, adding a bit more to my carbon footprint.

Any business will then be taking from what is pretty much my local area and spent elsewhere.

cgcsb

Hurrache wrote: »

So you'd still have the issue of getting to them and parking.

Not really, Extend the Chesterfield avenue route to Heuston Station and Castleknock Station. Very easy interchange with PT in the rest of the city. You wouldn't need parking at all.

Hurrache

Bloom though is an exceptional circumstance, and certainly shouldn't feed into why the park should be changed as a result.

buffalo

Tombo2001 wrote: »

I've never really thought to myself - this place would be way better if there werent so many parked cars.

In fact, thats only really ever been an issue when I've been looking to park a car myself.

You've never been to the Park during Bloom so.

Hurrache

cgcsb wrote: »

A small depot could be built within the park for them to charge and store overnight.

So you'd still have the issue of getting to them and parking.

Tombo2001 wrote: »

I've used the park a lot through the years - for cycling, running, visitor centre farmleigh, rolling down the hill at the popes cross....etc etc.....

I've never really thought to myself - this place would be way better if there werent so many parked cars.

In fact, thats only really ever been an issue when I've been looking to park a car myself.

Agree. There's only really problems around the Parkgate street end, particularly around the Zoo when the weather is good, or at the visitor centre. Outside of that I never really found it to be a problem.

cgcsb

Hurrache wrote: »

The buses go from where though?

A small depot could be built within the park for them to charge and store overnight.

Tombo2001

Weepsie wrote: »

Let's flip that. By removing parking, it will improve one of the best facilities on that side of Dublin for many.

It's a virtual car park for too many people. Too many people use it for free parking and head into town on it.

I've used the park a lot through the years - for cycling, running, visitor centre farmleigh, rolling down the hill at the popes cross....etc etc.....

I've never really thought to myself - this place would be way better if there werent so many parked cars.

In fact, thats only really ever been an issue when I've been looking to park a car myself.

Hurrache

The buses go from where though?

cgcsb

If we were more ambitious about the Park it could be car free. 2 bus routes operated by electric single deckers:

1: Parkgate Street to Castleknock gate
2: A circular route, North Road, Military Road, Upper Glenn Road

make them every 10 minutes in summer and every 20 mins in winter

Make the buses free to use, have the rest of the park for cycling and walking. Make the whole thing a zero emissions zone, Close the entrances to cars. No doubt the scheme proposed by the OPW will be much less ambitious.

DublinWriter

magicbastarder wrote: »

and possibly cap it at a max of four hours. that should be ample time for a trip to the zoo.

Maybe for a first date, but not when you have a rake of kids.

Hurrache

Weepsie wrote: »

Let's flip that. By removing parking, it will improve one of the best facilities on that side of Dublin for many.

It's a virtual car park for too many people. Too many people use it for free parking and head into town on it.

If the issue is with people parking in order to commute, that's an issue that's easily resolved without the detriment to park users.

Hurrache

beauf wrote: »

If they block you driving through, (as everyone always suggests) it cuts off the zoo for you anyway. You'll have to drive around outside the park to get to it. Same if you want to get to Farmleigh from city end.

If they close it to through traffic that leaves D15 with the single lane Navan road as the only main road into city.

They could close chesterfield Ave and just have an orbital route inside the walls for access.

It depends on where they close though. If access to the park is kept open from the west/north west there's nothing stopping us driving to some point within the park.

RayCun

magicbastarder wrote: »

and possibly cap it at a max of four hours. that should be ample time for a trip to the zoo.

should be possible to link car parking to zoo tickets - parking included in ticket price if you are going to zoo, standard charges otherwise

RayCun

beauf wrote: »

If they block you driving through, (as everyone always suggests) it cuts off the zoo for you anyway. You'll have to drive around outside the park to get to it. Same if you want to get to Farmleigh from city end.

That isn't cutting off though, it would still be accessible by car.

beauf wrote: »

They could close chesterfield Ave and just have an orbital route inside the walls for access.

'for access' implies no through traffic

Chesterfield <-> Parkgate will always be kept open for zoo, Aras, embassy, and car park at the cross.
Chesterfield to North Road, Ordnance Survey as far as Farmleigh, the road to the visitor centre, and North Road to North Circular could be kept open for some through traffic and access to the amenities in the zoo, but would stop the park being used as a main road and car park.

magicbastarder

and possibly cap it at a max of four hours. that should be ample time for a trip to the zoo.

beauf

Introduce paid parking during business hours. Free for two hours. End of problem.

beauf

Hurrache wrote: »

There needs to be, otherwise you're removing it as an amenity from most families. I live relatively close to it, but anyone from the D15 area knows how "entertaining" the cycle to it is when alone, never mind in a family group.

A good walk around the park, or Zoo, is enough to half kill your kids too without having them walk or cycle home.

By removing parking, or excluding park and ride facilities, it will take away one of the best facilities on that side of Dublin from many.

If they block you driving through, (as everyone always suggests) it cuts off the zoo for you anyway. You'll have to drive around outside the park to get to it. Same if you want to get to Farmleigh from city end.

If they close it to through traffic that leaves D15 with the single lane Navan road as the only main road into city.

They could close chesterfield Ave and just have an orbital route inside the walls for access.

magicbastarder

they should also allow bike hire within the park (as in a business to operate from the papal cross car park or somewhere similar).
i suspect the bike hire place at parkgate street would love the chance, would make them far more visible.

buffalo

buffalo wrote: »

Surprised this wasn't posted already: http://phoenixpark.ie/visitor-experience-strategic-review/

Deadline for submissions is tomorrow at 6pm:

Observations with respect to the draft report can be made to visitorpark@opw.ie

Now's the time to ask about some pedestrian and cyclist crossings, priority for same at junctions, less through-traffic, making the Park available for cycle races more easily, etc. Or whatever you're having yourself.

Two summaries of the proposed changes:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/skateboard-lanes-segways-and-even-a-funicular-a-look-at-the-new-proposed-visitor-experience-at-the-phoenix-park-38045201.html

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/vote-funicular-and-driverless-shuttle-for-the-phoenix-park-have-your-say-1.3869557

Chips Lovell

Make it easy to drive to, hard to drive through.

Hurrache

beauf wrote: »

Why? Walk to the park or cycle to it. No parking in it at all.

There needs to be, otherwise you're removing it as an amenity from most families. I live relatively close to it, but anyone from the D15 area knows how "entertaining" the cycle to it is when alone, never mind in a family group.

A good walk around the park, or Zoo, is enough to half kill your kids too without having them walk or cycle home.

By removing parking, or excluding park and ride facilities, it will take away one of the best facilities on that side of Dublin from many.

beauf

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Would be a great idea, close the park to through traffic at least... Special access only.
Authorities would have to make car parking available somewhere though...

Why? Walk to the park or cycle to it. No parking in it at all.

beauf

magicbastarder wrote: »

they did something reasonably akin to this a few years ago when the main avenue was closed for months for reconstruction.

I think it was closed for most of year. Even though they only worked on one section at a time. I used to cycle past it, and it was noticeable how little of it was being worked on at a time. Also noticeable how much less busy the park was with recreational users as well.

Did the same when they were working on Blackhorse Ave. They closed North road in the park when it wasn't effected at all.

magicbastarder

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Would be a great idea, close the park to through traffic at least... Special access only.
Authorities would have to make car parking available somewhere though...

they did something reasonably akin to this a few years ago when the main avenue was closed for months for reconstruction.