Kevin Irving wrote: » No harm for some jobs in fairness. I say that as someone who does absolutely as much as I can myself. They'll have any specialist tools required for a particular brand. It can be hard for many people to find a reliable and trusted independent in a hurry. It seems like that Electric power steering was shut off by the alternator failure. I would have expected it to be powered for some time by the battery. More of a design flaw perhaps? In my current car (E-Class), the brake lights and horn are reliant on the key being in and turned to P1. In my view, that's a serious design flaw.
ohnonotgmail wrote: » why do you need brake lights and a horn when you are parked?
Kevin Irving wrote: » Why wouldn't you want them? I can see no reason not to wire a car in such a way as to have that feature. My Volvo S40 could do it. Was in a car park one day just about to get out of the car and leaned on the horn when I saw a child about to run out in front of a car. Both the car and kid stopped. If you ever accidentally cut the car out (say pulling out of a junction on a country road at night), directly connected brake lights might just save your life if a car comes around the bend.
In my current car (E-Class), the brake lights and horn are reliant on the key being in and turned to P1. In my view, that's a serious design flaw.
ohnonotgmail wrote: » you said If your car cuts out the key is still in the ignition so the brake lights will still work or am i misunderstanding you?
Kevin Irving wrote: » ohnonotgmail wrote: » you said If your car cuts out the key is still in the ignition so the brake lights will still work or am i misunderstanding you? I would think that the Toyota should have maintained steering power for a little time even in the event of Alternator failure.
Kevin Irving wrote: » Maybe P1 should be P2. What I mean the key has to be turned to the first click position before these are powered. ie: not just sitting in the ignition Really, my comparison here is just to show how different manufacturing or design decisions can impact the end user. I would think that the Toyota should have maintained steering power for a little time even in the event of Alternator failure.
TheBoyConor wrote: » More like a fail-deadly design flaw than a manufacturing defect if the car's electrical system is designed in such a way that a failure of the alternator would have a knock on effect of knocking out the power assist steering. <SNIP>
Wibbs wrote: <SNIP> There's also a bit of a technique difference in driving unassisted. It never really occurred to me TBH until I was giving an uncle of mine a lift last year. After we set off he said it was easy to see I had learned on cars without power steering. When I asked how come, he pointed out that in setting off I only started to turn the wheel after we had started to move. Which is what you tended to do in the old days if you didn't want arms like Popeye.
route66 wrote: » It's not just that. Even with Popeye arms and power steering you should not twirl the wheel when stationary - if you can avoid it - for various reasons, mainly:Shreds the tyres Put's unnecessary loads on the mechanical linkages of the steering system leading to premature wear
beauf wrote: » I think that older cars without power steering had a different steering set up to lighten the steering. New cars don't bother with this so without power they are ridiculously heavy. Only my theory. I had cars without power steering for years. But I don't remember them being that heavy. That said I had a stock 80s GTI that the GF couldn't park because the steering was too heavy.
mloc123 wrote: » How did we manage before power steering was standard :d
TheBoyConor wrote: » Just thinking about this at a basic level, even if the alternator failed suddenly the car still should have an ample reserve of electrical power in the battery to be able to run the power steering. The fact that the rest of the electrical items still worked would indicate that there was ample electrical supply left.
dudara wrote: » Exactly my thoughts. One of the first cars I drove, a Lancia Prisma, was an absolute wallower at low speeds. We had bigger wheels back then mind. More leverage to turn.
gctest50 wrote: » Or the Lancia Gamma, with the power steering driven from the timing belt
Gammas have an unenviable reputation when it comes to their toothed camshaft drive belt, and not without reason! The camshaft serving the nearside (left- hand) pair of cylinders also drives the power steering pump. A lack of development, in early cars in particular, showed itself when unsuspecting owners would start their Gammas on a cold morning with the steering on full lock. This would cause the cambelt to break / jump with the load from the steering pump, resulting in one pair of cylinders firing-up whilst the other pair tried to destroy themselves, at the least causing bent valves
my3cents wrote: » But thats not how driving instructors teach learners now a days. Drivers are taught to make full use of the power steering even when the car is stationary. I was taught the old way and always "get the steering in while the vehicle is in motion". A classic example being the three point turn my wife was taught to turn the wheel when the vehicle was stationary and I was taught only to turn the wheel when the vehicle was moving.
CoBo55 wrote: » I can't believe this thread is 7 pages!!! Your car broke, you got it fixed, end of.
wonski wrote: » The op already thanked all for advice. Smart ones keep posting smart things On the other hand there were few good posts along the way so not sure what your problem is?
CoBo55 wrote: » What good posts? Bigger steering wheels on manual steering cars, what a load of cobblers. I was driving a 90's jap import diesel corolla, the alternator belt broke, I had no brakes as the vacuum pump is on the back of the alternator, guess what? I got a new belt didn't start a thread in boards, didn't contact my solicitor, I just got on with it. Suck it up buttercup.
wonski wrote: » If you read back you will notice the op already thanked for the explanation and moved on. You should do, too. There were few more posts explaining the difficulties of losing the power in more detail than in your post. For some losing a power steering is an event and they have every right to ask about it on boards. You had brakes, just no servo, so why you post it here
CoBo55 wrote: » Same as the op, he had steering just no power assistance, car is now fixed, case closed...
DJ WIPEOUT wrote: » Thanks CoBo55 for your masterful display of dominance! Maybe this is your world and you're comfortable in your knowledge of what happened here. I've got my world too... My father also said I should listen to everyone I meet (online and offline) as everyone has some nugget of knowledge that I don't! The thread was opened in a question form and any notion of contacting a solicitor is entirely your own as I haven't mentioned or done that! To me (as a non mechanic/engineer), intuition alone would beg the question as to what happens to a car and it's driver/passengers when it's electrically assisted steering fails (it becomes like a dead weight) and you're trying to avoid a crash by trying to get out of this situation or travelling at speed. The "ah it'll be grand sure" attitude of replacing the part and motoring on none the wiser admiring the buttercups in the passing fields is just pure dumb in my view. Tip: never be afraid to ask a question and there's no such thing as a silly question ;-)
ohnonotgmail wrote: » If you had been travelling at speed the steering would have been lighter.
colm_mcm wrote: » Jesus
