gctest50 wrote: » All outstanding reasons why women in Ireland need access to terminations without travelling on a plane or boat
Shurimgreat wrote: » I'm not convinced. Maybe I will be proven wrong, then happy days if so. .
Shurimgreat wrote: » This post had numerous thanks at lunchtime. I look again and they are all gone. Odd.
Shurimgreat wrote: » Not ignoring you cupcake. Numerous posters to respond to. When I respond to a few, there is always one or two others who says "why are you ignoring me?". So it was nothing personal. I doubt he will sleep tonight haha. I think you will agree that just as no two pregnancies are the same, no two abortion scenarios are the same re the mother or the baby. The mother may have a medical condition such as diabetes, high blood pressure, or others. Taking two pills may not be the answer and it becomes a case of surgery. Some women if they do take the two pills will react differently to others. There's the potential for botched surgery where the abortion is not completed effectively. There is the risk of sepsis in many cases. There is the prescribing of medicines afterwards. There are I think you will agree numerous different scenarios at play, often complex ones. And we don't have the experience for it here. Its not enough to have the occasional doctor here or there with experience. The whole thing has to be properly coordinated and lead by experts and operated by dedicated experts. Recruitment I can see being a problem. They are struggling with recruitment and training in the UK according to the report I posted. I can't see it being different here. If mass provision of abortion is provided I want it open and transparent with all the stats published at the end of the year to see how we are progressing and also proper oversight. As for putting people on ignore, only as a last resort. I'm also getting tired of the Happy Clappy, I love abortion types as are most of the country. Time to move on from that nonsense.
Shurimgreat wrote: » The UK has 50 years experience in providing abortion services. They perform close to 190,000 a year. Many are performed at clinics such as Marie Stopes. These are run by professionals in the field with decades and decades of experience. More importantly the abortion services industry is highly regulated with significant oversight. And yet despite all this, there are many problems with the industry in the UK.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4783694/Nearly-400-botched-abortions-two-months-Marie-Stopes.html So you think we are going to hit the ground running over here, what with our record of abysmal healthcare and laughable oversight. You only have to look at the recent cervical check scandal to see how transparency and oversight is handled. So by all means run with abortion here.If my partner ever required an abortion in extreme circumstances such as FFA I would still be heading to the UK to get it carried out. I wouldn't trust the Irish healthcare system or grossly incompetent politicians like Harris and Varadkar who are still ducking and diving when it comes to dealing with the women of the cervical checking scandal.
Shurimgreat wrote: » FFS grow up. I responded to Cupcake.
Shurimgreat wrote: » I think you will agree that just as no two pregnancies are the same, no two abortion scenarios are the same re the mother or the baby. The mother may have a medical condition such as diabetes, high blood pressure, or others. Taking two pills may not be the answer and it becomes a case of surgery. Some women if they do take the two pills will react differently to others. There's the potential for botched surgery where the abortion is not completed effectively. There is the risk of sepsis in many cases. There is the prescribing of medicines afterwards. There are I think you will agree numerous different scenarios at play, often complex ones. And we don't have the experience for it here. Its not enough to have the occasional doctor here or there with experience. The whole thing has to be properly coordinated and lead by experts and operated by dedicated experts. Recruitment I can see being a problem. They are struggling with recruitment and training in the UK according to the report I posted. I can't see it being different here. If mass provision of abortion is provided I want it open and transparent with all the stats published at the end of the year to see how we are progressing and also proper oversight.
Overheal wrote: » Your personal incredulity about how the healthcare system operates and stays up to date on changes in medicine, law and practice doesn't dismiss the reality that while it will of course take a couple years to fully implement and firmly establish this does not negate the requirement abortion facilities and practices. So what if your purpose, exactly, for regurgitated these arguments about "a shur its too complicated" exactly? That Ireland should just never bother? Cancer treatment is hard and complicated too and has a very mixed success rate, should Ireland just say fcuk it?
Trasna1 wrote: » In a democracy the losing side is still allowed to protest the result. Would you tell anti Trump or anti Brexit campaigners to shut up too? They lost as well, are they sore losers too? Should they just get over it? Or are you so politically immature that you only call the side you don't agree with sore losers?
Overheal wrote: » *Tao points out your evasion* ... *Shur finally responds to cupcake* *Jesus come off it I already responded to her!* :rolleyes:
[Cullinan] has chosen certain statistics and repackaged them in a way to suit his particular narrative. His miscommunication of information in this way puts the health and lives of women in Ireland at risk. This is unacceptable for a person in his position.
Shurimgreat wrote: » When you come up with the lie of the century like this is it any wonder No siders don't bother? No side stands up for themselves on here and calls out lies - No sider gets infractions. A Yes sider can post a massive like like Overheal and try to stir sh*t and nothing is done about it. No sider will probably get the infraction instead. Any wonder the thread has gone to pot?
spookwoman wrote: » Link to podcast of the bishop of Waterford and Lismore Yes voters “should examine their conscience and they should talk to the priest, they should go to confession”. and Cullinan said the Yes vote means euthanasia is essentially now accepted in Ireland.https://soundcloud.com/wlrfmwaterford/bishop-alphonsis-cullinin-tells-eamon-that-john-halligan-excluded-himself-from-his-godsons-confirmation
Shadowstrife wrote: » A few reasons why Donegal voted No by a very tiny margin.
Cabaal wrote: » Trump did not win the popular vote. Brexit was won barely with a compaign of lies, scaremongering and misinformation.... Same as no side tried here. Not the best examples for you to give. 8th was repealed by a landslide, one of the largest if not THE largest ref turn out and votes in favour.
Graces7 wrote: » Nah... that would have meant maybe a 85-15 vote. Exaggeration comes of insecurity and mendacity does not impress, quite the opposite.
spookwoman wrote: » Oh FFS they cannot just accept they lost. Councillors for No stand firm despite row over all-male photo. 'When that photo was taken – it wasn’t a criminal offence to be a man. The reaction told a story to me'https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/councillors-for-no-stand-firm-despite-row-over-all-male-photo-1.3516546
dudara wrote: » However you want to describe it, or not describe it, it was a far greater majority than I had hoped for. I had thought and expected a 55-45 vote. To end up with 2-1 was quite frankly amazing, and in parts it was even 80-20 or greater. It’s time to move on now and focus on the legislation. I personally have no doubt that anti-choice campaigners will continue to lobby strongly. Their mandate has clearly been shown to be less than I thought, but they will still be a strong voice. The discussion should listen to all sides, but not be subject to excessive fillibusting or time wasting. In other news, I’m finally glad to see the end of all the referendum posters, from both the Yes and No sides. What an eyesore they were.
It wasnt me123 wrote: » Well the electorate in Waterford need to note these no sayers and if they don't agree with them, vote them out. By the way describing them as middle aged was very polite IMO! They are fossils and out of step with the majority of Waterford and the rest of Ireland. The trouble with TDs / Councillors voting with their conscience is that they probably weren't voted in because of their conscience, they were voted in probably on party lines and/or a local issue. I personally don't care what their personal views are, though they are quite at liberty to state them, I want them to think of the good for the majority and vote accordingly. Its a shame that more women don't get involved in local / party politics. I'm too old but it would be great if younger women got more involved. Give a balance to politics in Ireland.
JRant wrote: » The hard work starts now really. I think people forget that there is a minority government in place so any legislation proposed will be a real battle ground in the Dail.
Loafing Oaf wrote: » I wouldn't worry about that. If you thought the referendum result was a landslide wait till you see the majority in favour of the legislation in the Dail. I'd be surprised if there were more than 20 Nos...
retro:electro wrote: A sore loser is shunned by all, but everyone loves a winner
JRant wrote: » I would be more concerned with FF or FG TD's voting against it. They would lose the whip and it could very well collapse the existing government. The Shinners and the "free everything" brigade will vote for the legislation but I would be concerned of a huge rift in the minority parties causing the whole thing to be delayed. Unfortunately politics in Ireland is anything but straight forward.
Even TDs, like John McGuinness, who voted no, told the Irish Examiner that colleagues must listen to the will of the electorate. Sligo-Leitrim TD Marc MacSharry, who did not support repeal, confirmed he will unequivocally support the legislation.
Wanderer78 wrote: » My fear with this campaign is the fact, those that voted no maybe now made feel excluded in our society, we must remember that 'exclusion and shame' was thrust onto those that had to leave this country for termination, let us not thrust the same on to those no voters, we must accept their beliefs, and include them into our society
