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Child Item

Exit poll: The post referendum thread. No electioneering.

Ozymandius2011

This is for people who have already voted in the referendum. How did you vote? I voted yes.

Mod: This thread is little more than a survey about how you voted. Please don't the ins and outs of abortion.

Mod: This is not a reiteration of the previous 8th threads. If you were threadbanned from those, you are not threadbanned here.

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neonsofa

tretorn wrote: »

The NO people felt the tiny human being mattered but now they have been educated by their betters to know its worth less than a chicken. People wont eat chicken because of the way its killed but they dont care about abortion.

It wasnt the hundreds of people screaming with excitement that sickened people opposed to abortion, it was our leaders joining in.
Speaking for myself, I dont care what you do with your young now, i dont care how much the twelve week limit is abused, I dont care how pills are handed out, i dont care how women will be used even more by men for a quick shag, ye wanted abortion so ye are welcome to it.

The whole "love both" thing didn't last long.

Crea

The cost of the abortion pill and consult is actually cheaper then getting an iud or a vasectomy or the cost in a UK clinic.

Initial consult and fitting of iud €230
Coil cost €134

Cost of a vasectomy is €450

The total cost of the abortion pill in the UK is €510.

ohnonotgmail

WillContribute wrote: »

It's a lot more than child benefit Leo and Harris can beam about.

Assuming we go to half the rate in the UK, say 1 in 10 here. That's a min of 4,000 additional abortions a year.

4,000 less deliveries each year in maternity hospitals. (Maternity overcrowding anyone?) Complicated births,
nearly a thing of the past.

56,000 less in the school system over the 14 years of school. => 2,000 less teachers needed & 100 less schools needed. (School places pressure anyone?)

4,000 less bedrooms. => 1,500 -2,000 less apartments needed each year. (Housing crisis?)

These may not be the drivers, but the calculations no doubt have been done.

we already have between 4 and 6000 abortions a year. they just dont take place in ireland.

Buford T. Justice XIX

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I noticed none of the Yes posters had a of a baby on it not one...

It was all MY, MY, MY muscular female arms and saint like pictures of Savita.

Baby was never mentioned on the yes posters....

MY was never mentioned on the no....

Mod note: gormdubhgorm, no electioneering as per the OP. Don't post in this thread again.

Buford T. Justice

ELM327

Crea wrote: »

The cost of the abortion pill and consult is actually cheaper then getting an iud or a vasectomy or the cost in a UK clinic.

Initial consult and fitting of iud €230
Coil cost €134

Cost of a vasectomy is €450

The total cost of the abortion pill in the UK is €510.

The abortion pill in the UK is €470
But the UK residents qualify for it for free under NHS.

https://www.mariestopes.ie/abortion-care/how-much-does-an-abortion-cost/

tretorn

There is a slight difference between segregation and abortion.
Abortion involves extermination of family members.
Fine Gael are a party for the wealthy and ncoraging the poor and uneducated to have abortions means the rich can pay less taxes. Eventually though abortion will result in less cheap labour but inward migration of poor uneducated from third world countries will sort that problem.
The State can now in a way wash its hands of duty of care for sharon with five children under six, in future FG will say you have the option to abort and we will even pay you to do it.
Yep, that sounds good, buala bus

Crea

WillContribute wrote: »

It's a lot more than child benefit Leo and Harris can beam about.

Assuming we go to half the rate in the UK, say 1 in 10 here. That's a min of 4,000 additional abortions a year.

4,000 less deliveries each year in maternity hospitals. (Maternity overcrowding anyone?) Complicated births,
nearly a thing of the past.

56,000 less in the school system over the 14 years of school. => 2,000 less teachers needed & 100 less schools needed. (School places pressure anyone?)

4,000 less bedrooms. => 1,500 -2,000 less apartments needed each year. (Housing crisis?)

These may not be the drivers, but the calculations no doubt have been done.

You do know that Irish women are currently having abortion along the numbers you are stating so there will be no impact on medicine, education, housing.

Based on 2016 figures 3, 265 Irish women had abortions in the UK. 878 Irish women received abortion pills last year.

ohnonotgmail

tretorn wrote: »

There is a slight difference between segregation and abortion.
Abortion involves extermination of family members.
Fine Gael are a party for the wealthy and ncoraging the poor and uneducated to have abortions means the rich can pay less taxes. Eventually though abortion will result in less cheap labour but inward migration of poor uneducated from third world countries will sort that problem.
The State can now in a way wash its hands of duty of care for sharon with five children under six, in future FG will say you have the option to abort and we will even pay you to do it.
Yep, that sounds good, buala bus

I see the George Soros white genocide theory is still alive and well.

ELM327

tretorn wrote: »

There is a slight difference between segregation and abortion.
Abortion involves extermination of family members.
Fine Gael are a party for the wealthy and ncoraging the poor and uneducated to have abortions means the rich can pay less taxes. Eventually though abortion will result in less cheap labour but inward migration of poor uneducated from third world countries will sort that problem.
The State can now in a way wash its hands of duty of care for sharon with five children under six, in future FG will say you have the option to abort and we will even pay you to do it.
Yep, that sounds good, buala bus

Take off the tinfoil hat.
Conspiracy theories is that way ->

(PS : extermination of family members? LOL! Thats ridiculous. It could be argued that segregation is worse than abortion. An aborted foetus has no sentience, whereas a black man who is beaten and made to work knows that pain)

Crea

ELM327 wrote: »

The abortion pill in the UK is €470
But the UK residents qualify for it for free under NHS.

https://www.mariestopes.ie/abortion-care/how-much-does-an-abortion-cost/

But Irish people travelling to England have to pay for it and it is expected to be significantly cheaper here

Bpas are quoting €510 https://www.bpas.ie/prices/

tretorn

Irish women werent encouraged into abortion up to this but now they will be. It will be seen as a reasonable solution to disability and poverty and if more abortions mean less taxpayers money being used for school places and public housing then the rich wont mind abortion being free.
No wonder Simon and Leo are beaming, they have worked out the figures.

ArmaniJeanss

WillContribute wrote: »

It's a lot more than child benefit Leo and Harris can beam about.

Assuming we go to half the rate in the UK, say 1 in 10 here. That's a min of 4,000 additional abortions a year.

4,000 less deliveries each year in maternity hospitals. (Maternity overcrowding anyone?) Complicated births,
nearly a thing of the past.

56,000 less in the school system over the 14 years of school. => 2,000 less teachers needed & 100 less schools needed. (School places pressure anyone?)

4,000 less bedrooms. => 1,500 -2,000 less apartments needed each year. (Housing crisis?)

These may not be the drivers, but the calculations no doubt have been done.

I'm not sure you'll be interested, but it's oversimplistic to say 4000 abortions = 4000 less children, and no government financial people would base plans on such shoddy theory.

e.g., the girl who has an abortion at 18 may turn into the woman who has 3 kids at 30,32 & 35 that she otherwise wouldn't have had a with a near teenager running around and having not had the financial/career advantage that being child free during her 20s gave her. So society is up two kids there despite the termination.
Someone else who always wanted to have two kids may in future go abortion, kid, kid, sterilization instead of kid, kid, sterilization. End result is the same number of kids they always intended.

WillContribute

Crea wrote: »

You do know that Irish women are currently having abortion along the numbers you are stating so there will be no impact on medicine, education, housing.

Based on 2016 figures 3, 265 Irish women had abortions in the UK. 878 Irish women received abortion pills last year.

Please read more closely, I said "additional" abortions. I am only counting those. It would not be unreasonable to suggest Ireland goes from 4,000(existing) to 8,000 per year. 8,000 (1 in 10), which is 50 per cent of the rate in the UK (ie 1 in 5 ). Now that it is freely available, an additional 4,000 abortions, will result in those figures. And there are of course lots more results.

gctest50

WillContribute wrote: »

.....

Now that it is freely available, an additional 4,000 abortions, will result in those figures. And there are of course lots more results.

It was the lizard people, they sunk Loveboats battleship

Now, how about exclusion zones around hospitals ( esp. maternity ) , GPs etc ?

ELM327

tretorn wrote: »

Irish women werent encouraged into abortion up to this but now they will be. It will be seen as a reasonable solution to disability and poverty and if more abortions mean less taxpayers money being used for school places and public housing then the rich wont mind abortion being free.
No wonder Simon and Leo are beaming, they have worked out the figures.

continue dropping irrelevant BS, no response to any posts.
#loveboat

kunst nugget

ELM327 wrote: »

#loveboat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_wFEB4Oxlo

gctest50

but then

Fighting Tao

Mavis Warm Stranger wrote: »

He's clearly very passionate about his beliefs. At the same time I see no reference to rape victims having to carry children.

So you have read some more of his posts since. Are you still going to misrepresent him and accuse me? He doesn't need anyone to add more drivel on his behalf.

Fighting Tao

tretorn wrote: »

People wont eat chicken because of the way its killed but they dont care about abortion.

What people? I'll eat chicken no matter how it's killed. You're giving me cravings. A nice southern fried snack box could be on order for dinner.

tretorn

The special needs education budget will be slashed. We have to be spending more per capita on special needs education than any other european country. We wont have to do this in the future because the brainy consultants will advise termination of the lesser beings.
There was a reason too why we hosted the special olympics.
Now I understand why other European countries have abortion up to twelve weeks, there are so many benefits to it. No wonder Harris is chomping at the bit to get started, every days delay bringing in abortion makes it likely a foetus will live, down with that, the pills have been bulk ordered so we are all set.

Calina

tretorn wrote: »

The NO people felt the tiny human being mattered but now they have been educated by their betters to know its worth less than a chicken. People wont eat chicken because of the way its killed but they dont care about abortion.

It wasnt the hundreds of people screaming with excitement that sickened people opposed to abortion, it was our leaders joining in.
Speaking for myself, I dont care what you do with your young now, i dont care how much the twelve week limit is abused, I dont care how pills are handed out, i dont care how women will be used even more by men for a quick shag, ye wanted abortion so ye are welcome to it.

The metric tonne of posts since this says you care an awful lot about something whatever it is.

The No campaign nevet cared what happened our young so long as they were born. They washed their hands of our young before the cord was cut.

WillContribute

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I'm not sure you'll be interested, but it's oversimplistic to say 4000 abortions = 4000 less children, and no government financial people would base plans on such shoddy theory.

e.g., the girl who has an abortion at 18 may turn into the woman who has 3 kids at 30,32 & 35 that she otherwise wouldn't have had a with a near teenager running around and having not had the financial/career advantage that being child free during her 20s gave her. So society is up two kids there despite the termination.
Someone else who always wanted to have two kids may in future go abortion, kid, kid, sterilization instead of kid, kid, sterilization. End result is the same number of kids they always intended.

Your point is well made and I accept this would be true in an ideal world, but the reality is that this is not an ideal world. Across Europe birth rates have dramatically fallen, many causes, but readily available abortion is one of them. One can equally argue of the woman who becomes pregnant in her 20s, due to financial pressures, aborts, settles in her 30s, wants children but then finds time has caught up. Few family are able to plan exactly ahead how many kids they'll have.

I suppose the best test will be to see how and where investment is targetted spent in 5 year's time.

Neyite

Captain Obvious wrote: »

That is such a ridiculous comparison it has to be a joke right? That Mulligan one wouldn't come out with such tripe. Well, maybe she would but still.

It's odd to me that people are acting like the debate is over and everything is sorted. Both sides still have a lot to fight for and referring to a fetus as a parasite or to an abortion as murder is the kind of stuff that will push everyone further apart.

No, it wasn't a joke. I was explaining to someone who will never experience a pregnancy as a result of rape what it might be like finding out you are carrying your rapists baby.

A pregnancy is parasitic. A parasite is an organism which lives in or on another organism (its host) and benefits by deriving nutrients at the other's expense. That's what happens during pregnancy like it or not. The baby will get the nutrients first and the mother gets whatever is left over the extent of which is too long to list here but to give you three easy ones, the pregnancy is capable of softening ligaments, dental decay, and eyesight deterioration.

Not all parasites are gross. Mistletoe is lovely for example.

ELM327

tretorn wrote: »

The special needs education budget will be slashed. We have to be spending more per capita on special needs education than any other european country. We wont have to do this in the future because the brainy consultants will advise termination of the lesser beings.
There was a reason too why we hosted the special olympics.
Now I understand why other European countries have abortion up to twelve weeks, there are so many benefits to it. No wonder Harris is chomping at the bit to get started, every days delay bringing in abortion makes it likely a foetus will live, down with that, the pills have been bulk ordered so we are all set.

On January 2, 2017, one day before the 115th United States Congress was scheduled to convene for its first session, House Republicans held a "surprise vote" to effectively place the OCE under direct control of the House Ethics Committee, therefore making any future review of potential violations of criminal law by members of Congress subject to approval following referral to the Ethics Committee or an appropriate federal law enforcement agency. These new rules also bar the OCE from independently releasing statements publicly on pending or completed investigations. This move was immediately met with criticism by Democratic leaders in both the House and the Senate, with House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, claiming that "ethics are the first casualty of the new Republican Congress", and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer saying that the GOP had failed to keep their promise to "drain the swamp",referring to the frequent use of the phrase by President-elect Donald Trump and other Republican leaders during the 2015 campaign.

ohnonotgmail

tretorn wrote: »

The special needs education budget will be slashed. We have to be spending more per capita on special needs education than any other european country. We wont have to do this in the future because the brainy consultants will advise termination of the lesser beings.
There was a reason too why we hosted the special olympics.
Now I understand why other European countries have abortion up to twelve weeks, there are so many benefits to it. No wonder Harris is chomping at the bit to get started, every days delay bringing in abortion makes it likely a foetus will live, down with that, the pills have been bulk ordered so we are all set.

There shall in that time be rumors of things going astray, erm, and there shall be a great confusion as to where things really are, and nobody will really know where lieth those little things with the sort of raffia-work base, that has an attachment. At that time, a friend shall lose his friend's hammer, and the young shall not know where lieth the things possessed by their fathers that their fathers put there only just the night before, about eight o'clock.

Fighting Tao

Same crap different day on these threads. Can someone not provide a valid point from the No side that might make a few of us go "oh, we never thought about that"? You've had tonnes of times to think of just one thing!

Cupcake_Crisis

tretorn wrote: »

Irish women werent encouraged into abortion up to this but now they will be. It will be seen as a reasonable solution to disability and poverty and if more abortions mean less taxpayers money being used for school places and public housing then the rich wont mind abortion being free.
No wonder Simon and Leo are beaming, they have worked out the figures.

Get an grip on yourself, seriously. You seem to have lost touch with reality entirely.

Women are not going to be encouraged into abortions. It’s just not going happen. What will happen is those women who would have had to board a plane to avail of abortion services, now won’t have to. Simple as.

As everyone has repeated until they’re blue in the face- disability is not a grounds for termination. There you go. Do with that information what you will.

Fighting Tao

Cupcake_Crisis wrote: »

Get an grip on yourself, seriously. You seem to have lost touch with reality entirely.

Women are not going to be encouraged into abortions. It’s just not going happen. What will happen is those women who would have had to board a plane to avail of abortion services, now won’t have to. Simple as.

As everyone has repeated until they’re blue in the face- disability is not a grounds for termination. There you go. Do with that information what you will.

What do you mean? Everyone knows Mrs Doyle will be visiting every pregnant woman to encourage abortions.

Bredabe

tretorn wrote: »

The scenes at Dublin Castle appalled and intimidated them and they feel like outcasts in their own country.

The 'scenes at the castle' were ones of release, from ppl who had put in every minute of their time to inform, offer choice and in lots of cases listen to previously untold stories on the doorsteps of the 26 counties. It was an expression of relief that women now have choices around how they are treated in their maternity and other health-related experiences. Women had experiences forced on them by the 8th that would be classified as assault in other countries.

It was also a release from the face to face abuse many experiences on the canvas or at stalls, the ones who were threatened with rape of both themselves and/or their kids/siblings before we start of the willful damage to their personal property.

In the end, even my girl who is very very pro-life and campaigned for No, said the behaviour of that side was getting out of hand.

Repeal Release!

Zubeneschamali

Captain Obvious wrote: »

It's odd to me that people are acting like the debate is over and everything is sorted. Both sides still have a lot to fight for

What exactly have the pro-life side to fight for?