Oaklyn Early Fauna wrote: » Tip for the protestors - turn up outside the Munster and Leinster games today, two big matches that will be shown internationally. Nothing like giving people plenty of opportunity to make fools of themselves.
munsterlegend wrote: » Leinster playing tomorrow and Munster today.
Appledreams15 wrote: » No. I said I was treated with much more respect in Spain, and I was. I could talk to men my age, and older men about philosophy, politics, etc I cane home to Ireland, and I had to leave a group that I joined due to some of the older men in the group making jokes about paedophilia. Ireland's disgrace.
Aragon77 wrote: So if they are all free and not guilty, will she be charged for falsifying statements, if they are genuinely innocent then this is a real life changing experience if they’re actually guilty, but free in a legal sense, then karma and her family will undoubtedly find them...
optogirl wrote: » I think if that same style evidence was given in say, a 4 white cops versus black woman case in the States there would absolutely be race riots and I'd totally understand why. Consent or no consent, those beasts sent that girl home in a bloody, hysterical heap. How anyone can say she is 'crying rape' or the myriad other vile words I've heard used to describe her (not least from the men of good character themselves) is sickening to me. We're at a point where women don't care if they are laughed at by a certain cohort for being angry about this - this disgusting language, the treatment, the bragging...and all of it boiling down to 'that's the way lads talk' and 'not indicative of the true character of the author' is terrifying and a lot of people - men and women, have had enough. It's sad that is always has to come back to what if it was your daughter/sister etc and that some men cannot just have empathy for that girl as a fellow human but again, read that court testimony, read what their lawyers said, read those messages and seriously think how you would feel if that was your sister/niece/cousin/friend/daughter. We are sick of it. It is genuine anger on display here - not band wagon hopping. I really wish I hadn't spent the last few days thinking about this, that I didn't have to, that it didn't honestly make me feel sick in my stomach but here we are.
professore wrote: » I know Spanish men and women personally and they ALL say men treat women far better here than in Spain. So not sure where you are getting that from. The age of "consent" is 13 in Spain FFS.
optogirl wrote: » I think if that same style evidence was given in say, a 4 white cops versus black woman case in the States there would absolutely be race riots and I'd totally understand why. Consent or no consent, those beasts sent that girl home in a bloody, hysterical heap. How anyone can say she is 'crying rape' or the myriad other vile words I've heard used to describe her (not least from the men of good character themselves) is sickening to me. We're at a point where women don't care if they are laughed at by a certain cohort for being angry about this - this disgusting language, the treatment, the bragging...and all of it boiling down to 'that's the way lads talk' and 'not indicative of the true character of the author' is terrifying and a lot of people - men and women, have had enough.
It's sad that is always has to come back to what if it was your daughter/sister etc and that some men cannot just have empathy for that girl as a fellow human but again, read that court testimony, read what their lawyers said, read those messages and seriously think how you would feel if that was your sister/niece/cousin/friend/daughter. We are sick of it.
It is genuine anger on display here - not band wagon hopping. I really wish I hadn't spent the last few days thinking about this, that I didn't have to, that it didn't honestly make me feel sick in my stomach but here we are.
Aragon77 wrote: » So if they are all free and not guilty, will she be charged for falsifying statements, if they are genuinely innocent then this is a real life changing experience if they’re actually guilty, but free in a legal sense, then karma and her family will undoubtedly find them...
hynesie08 wrote: » And I believe you when you say that, but there's an element of these protests who need SOMETHING to be offended by, and like in the case of ssm and the eighth, they have no actual idea what they want, they just try to shout down anyone who disagrees with them and repeat the same sound bites ad nauseum, it's them I have an issue with.
Tell me how wrote: » Real life is not black and white. She believes she was raped, I believe the men are not rapists because they were tried and found not guilty.They showed abhorrent attitudes to women, but are not rapists. Her case was not upheld, she is not a liar. She has nothing to fear from karma.
GingerLily wrote: » Why are you saying she falsifyed her statements? There is no evidence to suggest she lied, the only verdict was that the jury didn't find them guilty, beyond a reasonable doubt, not that she didn't believe she was raped. It's quite clear she did.
professore wrote: » Appledreams15 wrote: » Do people really not see how Ireland is preceived abroad. Had anyone been abroad for a considerable length of time, that is talking on here? We are seen as an alcoholic, misogynistic nation. You do know other countries don-t treat women the same way that we do? Ive lived in Spain for a considerable length of time. I have lived in different countries (teaching English). Spain is known for having a macho culture. I was treated with 10 times more respect in Spain than I was in Ireland. Youve got to look at ourselves. Hatred of women in Ireland has been passed from father and son down for generations. How do we change it? Do you want to continue on like this? Teach the next generation to hate? I know Spanish men and women personally and they ALL say men treat women far better here than in Spain. So not sure where you are getting that from. The age of "consent" is 13 in Spain FFS.
Appledreams15 wrote: » Do people really not see how Ireland is preceived abroad. Had anyone been abroad for a considerable length of time, that is talking on here? We are seen as an alcoholic, misogynistic nation. You do know other countries don-t treat women the same way that we do? Ive lived in Spain for a considerable length of time. I have lived in different countries (teaching English). Spain is known for having a macho culture. I was treated with 10 times more respect in Spain than I was in Ireland. Youve got to look at ourselves. Hatred of women in Ireland has been passed from father and son down for generations. How do we change it? Do you want to continue on like this? Teach the next generation to hate?
FrancieBrady wrote: » Tell me how wrote: » Real life is not black and white. She believes she was raped, I believe the men are not rapists because they were tried and found not guilty.They showed abhorrent attitudes to women, but are not rapists. Her case was not upheld, she is not a liar. She has nothing to fear from karma. I think this 'generalisation' is dangerous to be honest. They showed 'abhorrent attitudes' to one woman. The idea that that means they have 'abhorrent attitudes' to ALL women or to womankind is wrong imo and it is where the reaction to this case goes pearshaped. I don't have the same 'attitude' to all women as I have to my wife or women friends just as I don't have the same attitude to all men.
FrancieBrady wrote: » I think this 'generalisation' is dangerous to be honest. They showed 'abhorrent attitudes' to one woman. The idea that that means they have 'abhorrent attitudes' to ALL women or to womankind is wrong imo and it is where the reaction to this case goes pearshaped. I don't have the same 'attitude' to all women as I have to my wife or women friends just as I don't have the same attitude to all men.
irishrebe wrote: » What you're suggesting is almost worse. That the victim deserved to be talked about in that way because of her sexual behaviour? Where are you going with this point?
Pelvis wrote: » irishrebe wrote: » What you're suggesting is almost worse. That the victim deserved to be talked about in that way because of her sexual behaviour? Where are you going with this point? He suggested nothing of the sort. What are you smoking?
py2006 wrote: » I always found it odd if a man criticises, disagrees with or insults a particular woman a whole wave of women think they are targeted too.
irishrebe wrote: » Well, you go ahead and dismiss someone's lived experience with your second hand anecdotes. I grew up in Ireland and on my mile long walk home from school each day, I was beeped at repeatedly by grown men starting from the age of 11. They knew I was a child, I was wearing a school uniform. Sometimes they would put the window down and shout lewd comments. I'm living in Spain now and pretty much every time I go home to visit, I'll get some sort of moronic comment or beeping or wolf whistle on the street. You know how many times that has happened to me in Spain? Once. And the age of consent is 16, not 13.
irishrebe wrote: » They showed an abhorrent attitude towards one woman, he says, which doesn't mean they have this attitude to all women. So why would this one woman deserve to be spoken about in this way? What could possibly justify them making the comments they made?
