splinter65 wrote: » I don’t know where your getting this “few” from 78%+ is a pretty big “few”!
mcmoustache wrote: » Glad you asked. Alligators are considered fish to Catholics. Just like beavers.
splinter65 wrote: » Yes. Observing a religious tradition is a fairly normal practice for literally billions of people across the world, and across many religions.
housetypeb wrote: » You seem obsessed with the idea that anybody who doesn't agree with religion is doing it to be "cool".
branie2 wrote: » Speaking of steak, I had it for dinner this evening
Sleepy wrote: » Do you think that over 78% of our population believe in transubstantiation? Attend mass weekly? Don't use "artificial" contraception? Understand that the immaculate conception relates to Mary rather than Jesus? Don't believe in sex before marriage? Believe gay sex is sinful? You've worse delusions than your religion if so. Most Irish "Catholics" are lapsed, non-practicing or more accurately described as some form of Protestant that attends the odd Catholic mass for Christmas, weddings and funerals. Their self-declaration of their religion as being Catholic when entered on census is done more from a sense of cultural association more than out of any faith in the Catholic church or it's teachings.
the_syco wrote: » Also, Capybara are considered fish.
Atoms for Peace wrote: » As a non practicing atheist I didn't eat any pancakes on Shrove Tuesday.
Bob_Marley wrote: » This is true, most of them could not care less what the Church teaches, but it's not up to you or the Church to decide what a person does, or does not do, including inventing their own pick and mix versions of Catholicism/Atheism/Homosexuality/Abortion/Whatever-floats-their-boat, they are one's that are responsible for deciding what they do. Have you heard of the no true scotsman fallacy ?
Sleepy wrote: » They're free to believe in whatever they like. I just ask that they be honest about it. The bit I have a problem with is the corruption of our education system by "their" church which is "justified" by their lying about their religion on the census form.
splinter65 wrote: » Who on earth would lie about their religion on a census form and why? That’s some conspiracy theory you have there sleeper, 78%+ of citizens lying... Also, I’m a Catholic and a citizen so it’s “my” education system too, or is it not?
Sleepy wrote: » While I've no doubt there's plenty of Irish Mammys lying about the religious affiliations of their children (whether knowingly or not) the largest number of those marking themselves as Catholic on the census form are lying to themselves about their religious beliefs simply because the word "Protestant" has negative historical associations for many in this country. As a Catholic would you be happy if your children were being taught to praise Allah as part of their education? Or if they were having weeks of their 6th class year of school preparing for their classmates Bar Mitzvahs? Or if they were being made to memorise passages from Richard Dawkins "The God Delusion"? If you want to indoctrinate your children into your religion, as much as I'd personally disagree with you that as a parent myself, it is your prerogative and I have no issue with you sending them to Sunday School, arranging after-school lessons for them or whatever. While you, and your fellow church members, however, are arrogant enough to believe you have a divine right to force that indoctrination on the majority of the population's children, however, I take serious issue with it. Faith is the antithesis of education. It literally means choosing to believe something despite a lack of evidence or in the face of all available evidence suggesting the contrary. It has no place in our education system.
Sleepy wrote: » splinter65, maybe if you spent less of your time in school learning about deities you might have learned to read a little better. Nowhere in my post did I say "all" of the 78% plus were lying on their census form. Just a lot of them. You know, the difference between that number and the numbers actually attending mass weekly (A 2006 Poll conducted by RTE put that at about 48%, as compared to 81% in 1990. A 2011 Dublin based survey found weekly attendance rates to be as low as 14%.) Also, most of us who object to religious involvement in the Irish education system didn't just "move" here. We were born, and raised here and weren't gullible enough / scared of the unknown enough for the indoctrination attempted on us in our childhoods to work. Srameen, that's a bit of a strawman: the Catholic indoctrination isn't working on my son or daughter any more than it did on me. It's still depriving them of the chance to be taught something worthwhile however. I'd say 10% of my daughters school hours were wasted last year as her classmates prepared for their communion. Our schools are open for 183 days (primary), and 167 days (secondary) per year. Lets average the religious education out to about 2 hours per week over the course of that time. That's roughly 74 hours per year primary and 67 hours per year secondary, or 1048 hours over the course of an education (excluding transition year). That's a massive opportunity cost. It's not quite the reputed 10,000 hours required to become an expert in something but it's a hell of a grounding in any subject of study: I think you could expect to be fairly proficient in another European language with that investment of time for instance.
Sleepy wrote: » I think you're falling for IDA marketing if you believe we're doing a "a bang up stupendous job of educating our children" (that wording is so Trumpian it's hard to take seriously) btw. We're doing an adequate job but could be doing far, far better. You, your brother, and indeed I, may have received decent educations from institutions controlled by the Catholic Church. Others however, weren't so lucky: they were beaten, raped and enslaved. Did you read the link you posted? I'll point out the key words in it for you: State funded. The state has no business paying for indoctrination. We're a secular state. Sadly, the greatest opportunity we ever had to wrest control of so much of the educational infrastructure of this state away from the Catholic Church was squandered when Fianna Fail sent an alter boy to negotiate with the various orders responsible for the physical and sexual abuse of generations of Irish children who was unbelievably happy to use taxpayers money to cover the vast majority of the reparations for that abuse (a percentage the orders involved still haven't paid by the way).
splinter65 wrote: » Could it be that the Catholic schools under the control of the Catholic Church are doing, as they always have done, a bang up stupendous job of educating our children?!?!? ...to the point where we are the envy of many other not-Catholic-educated EU countries? If I didn’t know better, I’d say it was a miracle!
iguana wrote: » The vast majority of us are mono-lingual.
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