Eir rural FTTH thread

Allison Puny Appetite wrote: »

You would know more than me but I guess they are relying on inertia. Do most people switch providers regularly?

During the boom, unlikely. These days, when it hurts enough certainly.

And I do agree, that they rely on inertia, which would have worked in the past.

The issue that Eir didn't cop on to is, that the customers they've targeted would have had connections from alternative providers previously. A scenario that Eir isn't familiar with. And these alternative providers still have their adress and phone details in their database ... so can target the customers directly.

That's the part that Eir didn't factor in. A lot of people will change provider, when we're talking a saving of 10 and up to over 30 EUR/month.

/M

Bored Accountant

Marlow wrote: »

That's the part that Eir didn't factor in. A lot of people will change provider, when we're talking a saving of 10 and up to over 30 EUR/month.

/M

I currently have DSL and will be able to order fibre from 14th Feb. I'm in contract with Eir, so can't change provider.
But by signing up with Eir, I have free eir sport, I have discount for having mobile on the account, and must move my other phone onto it since its now with eir since Metoer rebranding happened. I will consider getting eir TV if its offered free for 6 months and then get rid of SKY TV.

So depending if you combine all your services, it can work out cheaper.

Dev84

https://www.independent.ie/business/technology/news/high-prices-force-firms-to-boycott-eirs-rural-network-36558816.html

The fact the it's Eirs network surely means they can charge what they want for others to access it? After all they have gone to the expense of developing?

Sky and Vodafone are huge multinationals. No reason why they couldn't develop there own network rather than bit*hing about Eir all the time.

Dev84 wrote: »

The fact the it's Eirs network surely means they can charge what they want for others to access it? After all they have gone to the expense of developing?

They can't. Comreg regulates the pricing. But that regulated pricing is way above what the rest of the market charges. And OpenEIR opts to charge the maximum ... is not competitive.

Dev84 wrote: »

Sky and Vodafone are huge multinationals. No reason why they couldn't develop there own network rather than bit*hing about Eir all the time.

Well, this is where a history lesson is required: Neither Sky nor Vodafone are traditionally internet or broadband providers.

Sky is a satellite and tv broadcast company, that solved some issues by expanding in the telephone and broadband market. They did that relying on other providers infrastructure, so they have no network to speak of nor the know how in house.

Vodafone is a mobile operator, that has branched out into broadband worldwide. They have a network to speak of, but it was designed for much lower volumes of data, compared to what they have to cope with now.

So when they wholesale VDSL and FTTH, they rely on other operators the same as Sky. Even when it comes to SIRO, they didn't build that network. The know how lies with SIRO and ESBt, not Vodafone. Vodafones part of that venture is the retail side of things.

For both building their own network or bringing their network up to scratch would break the bank. Nevermind, that Vodafone already has problems financially (or network wise ... whatever way you put it), because they've neglegted the 2G and 3G infrastructure in their network for years and half of the cells are in disrepair. They used to have the best coverage for mobile phones you can get in rural Ireland. They're far from it today.

/M

joe_99

Marlow wrote: »

They can't. Comreg regulates the pricing. But that regulated pricing is way above what the rest of the market charges. And OpenEIR opts to charge the maximum ... is not competitive.

The regulation on open eir requires them to cover their costs. They are restricted by ComReg to price below cost. It would be deemed abuse of a monopoly position as other operators would be unable to compete in the market. SIRO for example can make a loss on their connections (which they do) open eir can't.

oscarBravo

Dev84 wrote: »

The fact the it's Eirs network surely means they can charge what they want for others to access it? After all they have gone to the expense of developing?

That's a libertarian sort of a point of view. The market knows best; regulation is bad.

Social democracies recognise the reality that markets often don't work optimally - or, at least, they often don't work in the best interest of the consumer - which is why regulation is needed. In this case, open eir is deemed to have significant market power, and to be in a position to use that significant market power to disadvantage other players in the market. The requirement to allow others to access their network at regulated prices is the remedy.

Sky and Vodafone are huge multinationals. No reason why they couldn't develop there own network rather than bit*hing about Eir all the time.

No reason, except that it's wasteful and prohibitively expensive to develop an entirely new wholesale network from scratch every time you want to bring a new retail offering to the market.

By way of comparison, imagine if switching electricity providers required a new mains line to be brought to your house, connected to an entirely new national grid built in parallel to the existing one by each operator. That would be pretty stupid, and result in incredibly high prices to the consumer.

joe_99 wrote: »

The regulation on open eir requires them to cover their costs. They are restricted by ComReg to price below cost. It would be deemed abuse of a monopoly position as other operators would be unable to compete in the market. SIRO for example can make a loss on their connections (which they do) open eir can't.

There are floor prices on some types of wholesale service in some regions, but in terms of access connections (broadband to customer premises), the prices generally have ceilings.

shigllgetcha

Eir are claiming 170,000 FTTH premises passed with 21,000 connections

https://www.eir.ie/pressroom/eir-announces-second-quarter-results-to-31-December-2017/]300,000
73% of premises now passed with fibre technology, including over 170,000 FTTH
35% take up of high speed broadband
Strong momentum in FTTH - 21,000 connections

They mean that 170k have fibre close to the house but not all are ready to be connected dont they? So we cant really tell what the actual take up is right?

shigllgetcha wrote: »

Eir are claiming 170,000 FTTH premises passed with 21,000 connections

They mean that 170k have fibre close to the house but not all are ready to be connected dont they? So we cant really tell what the actual take up is right?

No, we can't tell what the actual take up is. OpenEIR don't have to provide that data.

As for the FTTH enabled homes passed .. that figure is about 10k inflated. And part of those a little over 160k homes passed end of January are not within the 300k, but stuff they've rolled out urban previously.

/M

dollylama

shigllgetcha wrote: »

Eir are claiming 170,000 FTTH premises passed with 21,000 connections

They mean that 170k have fibre close to the house but not all are ready to be connected dont they? So we cant really tell what the actual take up is right?

I've seen just this week in an area I pass through on my way to work a team of 4 foreign lads working for KN hang just under 5 kilometres of fibre along an R road! They've covered serious ground and have "passed" probably 250+ houses along the way

They've ended exactly where the rollout map had them ending but they seem to be taking a different approach to the rollout here now. Where I have seen before a gradual built out... poles marked, fibre ran in small sections and spooled up on specific poles, distribution points added to them poles... this KN dream team instead have ran and tightened huge continuous spans of fibre along the poles, no breaks to be seen for kilometres only probably where they finished for the evening and spooled a little at the last pole. Is it possible they will come back later and splice into the hung fibre every place they need a distribution box?

It sure seems a bit of a shoddy way of rolling out but I'm sure it's quick and probably keeps the "homes passed" figures happy

Gonzo

Dev84 wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/business/technology/news/high-prices-force-firms-to-boycott-eirs-rural-network-36558816.html

The fact the it's Eirs network surely means they can charge what they want for others to access it? After all they have gone to the expense of developing?

Sky and Vodafone are huge multinationals. No reason why they couldn't develop there own network rather than bit*hing about Eir all the time.

that's a real shame, I thought Vodafone were going to launch on OpenEir's network as their system checker starting showing up speeds of up to 1000 available at our address's. I was really hoping for Sky tho as they would either have no cap or a one that is certainly larger than 1tb. Right now there is zero competition on rural FTTH between Digiweb, Eir and Pure Telecom, all have the same allowances and prices, the only difference is the modem.

dollylama wrote: »

I've seen just this week in an area I pass through on my way to work a team of 4 foreign lads working for KN hang just under 5 kilometres of fibre along an R road! They've covered serious ground and have "passed" probably 250+ houses along the way

They've ended exactly where the rollout map had them ending but they seem to be taking a different approach to the rollout here now. Where I have seen before a gradual built out... poles marked, fibre ran in small sections and spooled up on specific poles, distribution points added to them poles... this KN dream team instead have ran and tightened huge continuous spans of fibre along the poles, no breaks to be seen for kilometres only probably where they finished for the evening and spooled a little at the last pole. Is it possible they will come back later and splice into the hung fibre every place they need a distribution box?

It sure seems a bit of a shoddy way of rolling out but I'm sure it's quick and probably keeps the "homes passed" figures happy

Would it be core fibre for an exchange? Otherwise it seems an odd way of doing it and is in complete contradiction with any of the work I've seen done.

dollylama

Allison Puny Appetite wrote: »

Would it be core fibre for an exchange? Otherwise it seems an odd way of doing it and is in complete contradiction with any of the work I've seen done.

No, it's running away from the exchange (which has fibre backhaul) into blatant country side. There's no businesses or infrastructure in the area either, well none that would be getting private fibre and it ends at the very point marked on the fibrerollout map

Seems to be a new "method" alright but I fear it's a case of speed above all else. Some of their workmanship (and their traffic management plan) leaves a lot to be desired!

Johnboy1951

dollylama wrote: »

No, it's running away from the exchange (which has fibre backhaul) into blatant country side. There's no businesses or infrastructure in the area either, well none that would be getting private fibre and it ends at the very point marked on the fibrerollout map

Seems to be a new "method" alright but I fear it's a case of speed above all else. Some of their workmanship (and their traffic management plan) leaves a lot to be desired!

It could also be an error by new staff not understanding there are intermediate connections to be made and what they need.

Bored Accountant

dollylama wrote: »

no breaks to be seen for kilometres only probably where they finished for the evening and spooled a little at the last pole.

When they were rolling out my road (eir team), they used to drop the roll of fibre off the trailer every night and pick it up again in the morning without breaking.
A few loops at each spot where there would be a DP box.

They said that's the way they are meant to do it. As few breaks as possible so to minimise the db loss

dollylama

Bored Accountant wrote: »

When they were rolling out my road (eir team), they used to drop the roll of fibre off the trailer every night and pick it up again in the morning without breaking.
A few loops at each spot where there would be a DP box.

They said that's the way they are meant to do it. As few breaks as possible so to minimise the db loss

Hmm... I think they're hauling the (massive) spool of fibre away with them each night. I've counted only 3 or 4 of these small spools over the entire 5 kilometres so I really don't think they're for distribution points

What worries me more about their method other than the lack of spools for dp's, I don't see any reserve on the poles where I have in other places (fibre spooled in a circle onto a cross shaped apparatus atop the pole). The area they're in gets frequent storm damage yet they've pulled the fibre string tight with no spare for thousands of meters

[Deleted User]

dollylama wrote: »

Hmm... I think they're hauling the (massive) spool of fibre away with them each night. I've counted only 3 or 4 of these small spools over the entire 5 kilometres so I really don't think they're for distribution points

What worries me more about their method other than the lack of spools for dp's, I don't see any reserve on the poles where I have in other places (fibre spooled in a circle onto a cross shaped apparatus atop the pole). The area they're in gets frequent storm damage yet they've pulled the fibre string tight with no spare for thousands of meters

They installed them like that here, banjo string tight! When the next crew came along to connect the fibre splice boxes they failed and had to replace the entire fibre run.
Now the fibres have a drop of a few centimetres between poles.

I live in Knockavilla, Co.Tipp and we thought everything was progressing fine with the FTTH rollout. All ducts, cabling and splicing has been done and were told it was going live in Dec. That didn’t happen and still hasn’t. We are now the only area that’s connected to the exchange in dundrum that hasn’t gone live.
It appears there’s some issue with a fibre cable not having been laid or something and we’ve seen **** all sign of KN coming back to sort it out. We are currently in limbo even though we are in a blue area.
No idea when it’s going to be sorted.
Asked for info from the fibre Power Team at opener and they said it would go live in March, now they say it will be june but could be sooner but won’t firm up on anything. I mean, for god sake, June will be 12 months behind schedule and i , like everyone else in the area am totally annoyed.

Anyone come across this kind of carry on before ?

Is there ANYONE I can contact to find out what the hell is going on ?

Johnboy1951

thehorse wrote: »

I live in Knockavilla, Co.Tipp and we thought everything was progressing fine with the FTTH rollout. All ducts, cabling and splicing has been done and were told it was going live in Dec. That didn’t happen and still hasn’t. We are now the only area that’s connected to the exchange in dundrum that hasn’t gone live.
It appears there’s some issue with a fibre cable not having been laid or something and we’ve seen **** all sign of KN coming back to sort it out. We are currently in limbo even though we are in a blue area.
No idea when it’s going to be sorted.
Asked for info from the fibre Power Team at opener and they said it would go live in March, now they say it will be june but could be sooner but won’t firm up on anything. I mean, for god sake, June will be 12 months behind schedule and i , like everyone else in the area am totally annoyed.

Anyone come across this kind of carry on before ?

Is there ANYONE I can contact to find out what the hell is going on ?

Its all down to eir/openeir as it is a commercial roll-out and they can connect or not as suits themselves.

I guess all you can do is to organise some local group who can pressurise a local politician who just might be able to have a word with someone who can arrange things in eir.
If that happens then someone else suffers when the manpower is re-assigned to your location.

thehorse wrote: »

I live in Knockavilla, Co.Tipp and we thought everything was progressing fine with the FTTH rollout. All ducts, cabling and splicing has been done and were told it was going live in Dec. That didn’t happen and still hasn’t. We are now the only area that’s connected to the exchange in dundrum that hasn’t gone live.
It appears there’s some issue with a fibre cable not having been laid or something and we’ve seen **** all sign of KN coming back to sort it out. We are currently in limbo even though we are in a blue area.
No idea when it’s going to be sorted.
Asked for info from the fibre Power Team at opener and they said it would go live in March, now they say it will be june but could be sooner but won’t firm up on anything. I mean, for god sake, June will be 12 months behind schedule and i , like everyone else in the area am totally annoyed.

Anyone come across this kind of carry on before ?

Is there ANYONE I can contact to find out what the hell is going on ?

Could it be some planning or civil issue delaying things? It doesn't make much sense for Openeir having the equipment sitting idle when it could be earning money. Ask a local politician to enquire on your behalf.

thehorse wrote: »

Anyone come across this kind of carry on before ?

It's normal. It also takes OpenEir more than often up to 6 months to deliver NGN circuits, that take other carriers less 3 months.

And that's for circuits they get paid big money for.

Patience is a virtue.

/M

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Its all down to eir/openeir as it is a commercial roll-out and they can connect or not as suits themselves.

I guess all you can do is to organise some local group who can pressurise a local politician who just might be able to have a word with someone who can arrange things in eir.
If that happens then someone else suffers when the manpower is re-assigned to your location.

They were here then disappeared and seems haven’t finished the rollout.
We have a local group setup.
We are in a commercially viable area, hence we are in a blue area
Local politicians are a total waste of time

Is there anyone who can be contacted in kn/eir to find out what the problem is ?

thehorse wrote: »

They were here then disappeared and seems haven’t finished the rollout.
We have a local group setup.
We are in a commercially viable area, hence we are in a blue area
Local politicians are a total waste of time

Is there anyone who can be contacted in kn/eir to find out what the problem is ?

No. Not unless you know someone locally.

banjopeter

thehorse wrote: »

Anyone come across this kind of carry on before ?

Is there ANYONE I can contact to find out what the hell is going on ?

Par for the course I'm afraid. Countless stories from people, including myself, who have been totally frustrated, with no one willing to take any responsibility. If you have a choice of supplier in your area, choose anyone but Eir...

tbh, its a disgrace. Eir/KN should have a dept that you can ring to find out status on the rollout. Fibrerollout.ie can be hit & miss.
When you consider the costs that Eir charge for FTTH and the fact that the simply play the 'dont know' game when you ring customer services, it REALLY pisses me off.
Fact is with us is that KN rolled out 95% of the infra last year, FTTH was meant to go live in dec and we havent seen them since end of nov.
even the broadband officer in the council isnt sure whats going on and he's in contact with them on a fairly constant basis. If he doesnt know, what chance have it.
The whole project is extremely badly managed and Eir dont give a ****e about people.

tbh, its a disgrace. Eir/KN should have a dept that you can ring to find out status on the rollout. Fibrerollout.ie can be hit & miss.
When you consider the costs that Eir charge for FTTH and the fact that they simply play the 'dont know' game when you ring customer services, it REALLY pisses me off.
Fact is with us is that KN rolled out 95% of the infra last year, FTTH was meant to go live in dec and we havent seen them since end of nov.
even the broadband officer in the council isnt sure whats going on and he's in contact with them on a fairly constant basis. If he doesnt know, what chance have i.
The whole project is extremely badly managed and Eir dont give a ****e about people.

turbbo

thehorse wrote: »

tbh, its a disgrace. Eir/KN should have a dept that you can ring to find out status on the rollout. Fibrerollout.ie can be hit & miss.
When you consider the costs that Eir charge for FTTH and the fact that they simply play the 'dont know' game when you ring customer services, it REALLY pisses me off.
Fact is with us is that KN rolled out 95% of the infra last year, FTTH was meant to go live in dec and we havent seen them since end of nov.
even the broadband officer in the council isnt sure whats going on and he's in contact with them on a fairly constant basis. If he doesnt know, what chance have i.
The whole project is extremely badly managed and Eir dont give a ****e about people.

Eir are a private company that are only interested in cash - end of. Irish people seem to think they are still semi state. Unlike the ESB they owe us nothing. ESB on the other hand owe us a lot - including an NBP. The sooner our dozy political elite figure this out the better for everybody.

Grab All Association

Any update on Borrisoleigh? Seen a KN van driving around Bouladuff yesterday

Passatb7

KN crews finished ducting for fibre on back road heading towards Glenkeen at Nenagh side of Borrisoleigh yesretday afternoon.

thehorse wrote: »

I live in Knockavilla, Co.Tipp and we thought everything was progressing fine with the FTTH rollout. All ducts, cabling and splicing has been done and were told it was going live in Dec. That didn’t happen and still hasn’t. We are now the only area that’s connected to the exchange in dundrum that hasn’t gone live.
It appears there’s some issue with a fibre cable not having been laid or something and we’ve seen **** all sign of KN coming back to sort it out. We are currently in limbo even though we are in a blue area.
No idea when it’s going to be sorted.
Asked for info from the fibre Power Team at opener and they said it would go live in March, now they say it will be june but could be sooner but won’t firm up on anything. I mean, for god sake, June will be 12 months behind schedule and i , like everyone else in the area am totally annoyed.

Anyone come across this kind of carry on before ?

Is there ANYONE I can contact to find out what the hell is going on ?

The KN fibre rollout PM contacted me this morning and explained the problem. KN will be back next week to resolve the prob and complete the rollout. Should be live in a few weeks.
Looking good.....fingers crossed !