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Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread VIII - MOD NOTE POST #4781

Steve

Continuing on from the previous thread....

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ClanofLams

Buer wrote: »

He was roasted against Glasgow on more than one occasion.

He's an excellent 13 generally but he's just as good at 12. The role he fills at 12 just isn't as eye catching as the one at 13 is.

Fair enough. As I said I didn't see it.

Time will tell but I certainly wouldn't rule out Aki Henshaw emerging as the first choice partnership.

Bazzo

Aki is also an excellent distributor btw. Henshaw's passing is often underrated but I still think Aki's is better. See the Toulouse game last year where he took a heavy knock and had to ease back the contact part of his game, he essentially played out the game as a second 5/8th. Also watch any of his passing off the base of a ruck when he steps in as scrum half, quick, snappy and accurate. It's just overshadowed by other aspects of his game.

Buer

ClanofLams wrote:

Henshaw's a better 13 than 12. I didn't see the Leinster game last weekend but his performance at 13 the week before was the best I have seen him play for Leinster.

He was roasted against Glasgow on more than one occasion.

He's an excellent 13 generally but he's just as good at 12. The role he fills at 12 just isn't as eye catching as the one at 13 is.

Bazzo

Deleted User wrote: »

I think Aki could be a top class 12 or 13 and he maybe first choice centre for Ireland quite soon, but he'll replace one or either of Ringrose or Henshaw, I can't envisage him replacing one to be shunted into the position of the other.

You're ignoring the fact that 12. Aki 13. Henshaw was a long established and very successful partnership.

damianmcr

Ah come on. Rob is well past it. Once a great but he just isnt that good anymore. See Tommy Bowe also.

Zebo is a great loss to Ireland.

Buer

Strange that everyone who was extolling the virtues of Henshaw at 13 on the basis of one game against Montpellier have been very quiet in relation to one game against Glasgow.

[Deleted User]

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Does that suggest that Hench himself is nobody's favourite player. Which if so, would in itself tell us something, highish regard as most of us have of him not withstanding?

Actually you're wrong on both counts. The reality is that everyone has the same favourite player and when you think about it, how could we not all love Gorgeous Rob:

The fact that some people have a right go at him on the forum is the clearest case of 'I doth protest too much' I've ever seen.

The Rape of Lucretia

Deleted User wrote: »

Some of it's that, you can't help but get the feeling that Henshaw's best position at times is whatever position doesn't clash with poster 'x's favourite players position.

Does that suggest that Hench himself is nobody's favourite player. Which if so, would in itself tell us something, highish regard as most of us have of him not withstanding?

awec

Former Former wrote: »

This is the serial position effect. People remember his breakthrough at 15/13 and his recent good showings at 13.

The fact that he became world class with the move to 12 is forgotten because it came in the middle.

If you go back through the forum you'll see Henshaw as a 13 has come up time and time and time again, even when he was playing 12. People have hardly forgotten, it's hardly a new opinion. In fact, I think Henshaw as a 15 was discussed originally, either way there has always been a view that he is a wasted talent at 12.

ClanofLams

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Some of it's that, you can't help but get the feeling that Henshaw's best position at times is whatever position doesn't clash with poster 'x's favourite players position.

You could go back through my posts for years and I've said he's a better 13, long before Aki was about to play for Ireland. Henshaw is a very good 12 but it doesn't make the most of his skill set.

Admittedly I don't watch him every week but the last performance I seen from him at provincial level to match his game v Montpelier was the Pro12 final when he was also at 13.

[Deleted User]

gleesonisgod wrote: »

Henshaw has a better workrate, possibly the best of any centre anywhere, and is possibly a better defender than Aki, althoguh Aki is pretty good here.

Aki's a better carrier, off.loader, has a better passing game, much better qualities for a 12. Teo worked better with Ringer than Robbie does because his offloading and carrying was so good.

Henshaw has a better passing game than Aki and Henshaw / Ringrose is a far superior partnership than Teo Ringrose was. Teo has improved since then, but let's not revise history here.

gleesonisgod wrote: »

Nobody's undderating Henshaw at 12 , theyre underrating Aki at 12.

Henshaw is a great 12 but there's a reason he didn;t get near the Lions team. He dosen't have either the bosh/offload game, or the creative game.

WTF? He was basically as close to making a Lions team as you can get without making a Lions team???

No one is underrating Aki, he's not played any international rugby, no european knock out rugby and yet everyone has him pencilled in for the National squad. That is the opposite of under rating.

I think Aki could be a top class 12 or 13 and he maybe first choice centre for Ireland quite soon, but he'll replace one or either of Ringrose or Henshaw, I can't envisage him replacing one to be shunted into the position of the other.

Wegians89

Former Former wrote: »

This is the serial position effect. People remember his breakthrough at 15/13 and his recent good showings at 13.

The fact that he became world class with the move to 12 is forgotten because it came in the middle.

He would have become world classER if he had stayed 13.
Joking aside he's a brilliant player to hane and would have stood out at international level in 12,13 or 15 just so happens it was 12 he's played most his internationals at

[Deleted User]

Former Former wrote: »

This is the serial position effect. People remember his breakthrough at 15/13 and his recent good showings at 13.

The fact that he became world class with the move to 12 is forgotten because it came in the middle.

Some of it's that, you can't help but get the feeling that Henshaw's best position at times is whatever position doesn't clash with poster 'x's favourite players position.

He had a great game at 13 against Montpellier. Montpellier showed awful effort to rejoin the line after a few phases which gifted us tons of space in mid field that he took advantage of.

Not to take away from his performance which was top drawer, but the moment of the match for me was when Nadolo shunted him and he had the wherewithal to get onto his bootlaces for another go. It's something you'd expect to see from a top class 12 used to heavy traffic.

gleesonisgod

Former Former wrote: »

This is the serial position effect. People remember his breakthrough at 15/13 and his recent good showings at 13.

The fact that he became world class with the move to 12 is forgotten because it came in the middle.

Nobody's undderating Henshaw at 12 , theyre underrating Aki at 12.

Henshaw is a great 12 but there's a reason he didn;t get near the Lions team. He dosen't have either the bosh/offload game, or the creative game.

gleesonisgod

Clegg wrote: »

Henshaw is being vastly underrated here. He's the best 12 on the island.

Henshaw has a better workrate, possibly the best of any centre anywhere, and is possibly a better defender than Aki, althoguh Aki is pretty good here.

Aki's a better carrier, off.loader, has a better passing game, much better qualities for a 12. Teo worked better with Ringer than Robbie does because his offloading and carrying was so good.

Former Former

Clegg wrote: »

Henshaw is being vastly underrated here. He's the best 12 on the island.

This is the serial position effect. People remember his breakthrough at 15/13 and his recent good showings at 13.

The fact that he became world class with the move to 12 is forgotten because it came in the middle.

RichieRich89

gleesonisgod wrote: »

How is McCartney not a long term option if he's only 32?

Yeah. That line of thinking would see everyone dropped once they reach the age of 32. It's nonsensical.

Bazzo

He was the best IQ 12 before Aki became(or becomes in a few days...) qualified alright.

Whether he is after is entirely subjective.

ClanofLams

Henshaw's a better 13 than 12. I didn't see the Leinster game last weekend but his performance at 13 the week before was the best I have seen him play for Leinster.

It will be interesting to see what happens if Aki and Henshaw tear it up v South Africa.

Clegg

Henshaw is being vastly underrated here. He's the best 12 on the island.

Erik Shin

gleesonisgod wrote: »

Henshaw will be FB in the 6N.

Aki a much better 12 and Ringer a better 13.

Ringer?!.... Can we not just settle on either
Ringtone.
or
Rosie..

[Deleted User]

gleesonisgod wrote: »

Henshaw will be FB in the 6N.

Aki a much better 12 and Ringer a better 13.

Henshaw and Ringrose will stay at 12 and 13. Aki may replace one of them, but I don't see either changing position to accommodate, one will fall to the bench if that's the case.

gleesonisgod

Henshaw will be FB in the 6N.

Aki a much better 12 and Ringer a better 13.

gleesonisgod

How is McCartney not a long term option if he's only 32?

Bridge93

Bazzo wrote: »

Marshall isn't qualified for another 2 years. Sean Cronin will surely feature.

Totally forgot Cronin, no idea why. Yeah he'll bench behind Best in the bigger games I'd assume. Tracy or Heffernan to start the Fiji one for me. No real qualms either way

Erik Shin

Bridge93 wrote: »

Would like to see Heffernan come in if it's 3 hookers named after best and Tracy. When is Marshall Irish qualified? Can't see it being McCartney nor do I think should it be seen as he's 32 already and hardly any sort of long term option

Marshall won't be qualified until after the WC....
Munster aren't short of hookers.... Mike Sherry for a recall

Bazzo

Bridge93 wrote: »

Would like to see Heffernan come in if it's 3 hookers named after best and Tracy. When is Marshall Irish qualified? Can't see it being McCartney nor do I think should it be seen as he's 32 already and hardly any sort of long term option

Marshall isn't qualified for another 2 years. Sean Cronin will surely feature.

Bridge93

Would like to see Heffernan come in if it's 3 hookers named after best and Tracy. When is Marshall Irish qualified? Can't see it being McCartney nor do I think should it be seen as he's 32 already and hardly any sort of long term option

Bazzo

FellasFellas wrote: »

Niall Scannell out of action with broken thumb, Tracey doesnt cut the mustard for me at International level so is it going to be a recall for Strauss as the 3rd choice or will JS go Heffernan/McCartney?

Strauss is absolutely miles away from being in the squad. Any of TracyTray-Z, Heffernan, Herring, McCartney and probably more should be ahead of him.

Burkie1203

FellasFellas wrote: »

Niall Scannell out of action with broken thumb, Tracey doesnt cut the mustard for me at International level so is it going to be a recall for Strauss as the 3rd choice or will JS go Heffernan/McCartney?

JS will pick Tracy in extended squad IMO