Gone Drinking wrote: » So if a delivery company has 10 vans and 10 drivers which for most of the time was fine, however two days a month they had more to deliver, you would expect them to buy another van and hire another person? You'd be complaining about the delivery charge then, because that would need to go up to cover it. Or the other option: The company ask two drivers can they do an extra hour or two, to make sure they get all their deliveries done thus helping the customer/the company. One driver says no, the other driver agrees. The a new position comes up in the company a year down the line. Which of those guys is going to be considered a better option? The guy who does right by the customer or the guy who's about getting out on time? What about if you're waiting on a bus or train and it never arrives? See here: http://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/luas-driver-refused-operate-tram-13553744 I think some of the attitudes here are a bit laughable. Maybe its a lack of understanding of business or just a lack of ambition.
noel100 wrote: » I get paid more than 60k With the compressed work week i work overtime every week, i get 1.5hrs for day time rate of overtime and 2hrs for night time rate of overtime. I get all the other benefits vhi pension 5weeks holidays etc. I wouldnt take a job if overtime wasnt paid.
myshirt wrote: » We still have this per hour mentality which stems from the public service. A per hour rate is suitable for a less developed economy, less complex work, unskilled, minimum wage, or manufacturing led for example. There used to also be a piece rate if you recall, where you would get paid per unit you produced. The per hour rate is not at all suitable now. Op you should work a minimum of 39 hours excluding breaks, but overall I would expect you to average out at anything from 42 to 48. In my profession, it is not uncommon for people to work every second Saturday unpaid, and a few odd half day Sundays. Other than that, normal hours are 8.00 or 8.30ish to 7 or 8 that night with two 15 minute breaks and a 30 minute break, usually lunch al desco. Get rid of this civil service mentality, it is for a different age.
Gone Drinking wrote: » noel100 wrote: » I get paid more than 60k With the compressed work week i work overtime every week, i get 1.5hrs for day time rate of overtime and 2hrs for night time rate of overtime. I get all the other benefits vhi pension 5weeks holidays etc. I wouldnt take a job if overtime wasnt paid. It comes down to your job and the type of work you do. It sounds like you might work in the pharmaceutical industry, a skilled process technician maybe? In my job, customer relationships are very important. I couldn't let someone down because I finish at 5 and my boss doesn't pay overtime. If I did that I'd have no relationship with my customers, they would leave and I would lose my job. I would never be expected to work the 11 hour days mentioned earlier but that person could be doing that so they overachieve their targets and earn much more. My job though offers other benefits on top of good salary/bonus/paid leave/medical. I can work from anywhere in the world for example.. It's swings and roundabouts but I know that I certainly wouldn't be where I am without putting in extra hours free of charge over the years. In my line of work at least, that sort of commitment goes a long way.
Gravelly wrote: » On a side note, if we're looking to move someone up to management, we will usually give them a project to work on that would test them a bit. This might involve working longer than they're used to, and with more responsibility. It would be a red flag straight away if their first concern was overtime. Not saying this is the case with you, but an employee whose chief concern is overtime is probably never going to be management material - and that's fine, lots of people would rather not have that stress and responsibility anyway.
Gone Drinking wrote: » This really depends on your position and type of work I guess but for a lot of professional or salary positions, its a necessary evil.. All my jobs have been salary and the only time I got paid overtime was when I would have to do on call work. I'm not always doing unpaid overtime, but I will when things need to get finished, or someone is waiting on me for something. Or just to get my job done well. What about taking on projects or work that might fall slightly outside your job scope, in the hope of progressing yourself further in the company? How can you do that without working a bit of unpaid overtime? How does anyone get further up in their profession not doing that.. I see a lot of lads in my work who have the "I'm here from 9-5" mindset and they're still doing the same crap they started doing 5 years previous where as others have moved into better paid positions up the ladder.
I'd also like to know how those who don't believe in unpaid overtime would feel if they were waiting on a service or product, but didn't get it because the person helping them downed tools at 5pm on the dot because they don't get paid overtime.
TallGlass wrote: » I tell you something, if I ever had unfortunate experience to come into such a role, I would be down to the local Social Welfare office within the hour and signing on. No way would I be working under them conditions.
myshirt wrote: » We still have this per hour mentality which stems from the public service. A per hour rate is suitable for a less developed economy, less complex work, unskilled, minimum wage, or manufacturing led for example. There used to also be a piece rate if you recall, where you would get paid per unit you produced. The per hour rate is not at all suitable now. Op you should work a minimum of 39 hours excluding breaks, but overall I would expect you to average out at anything from 42 to 48.In my profession, it is not uncommon for people to work every second Saturday unpaid, and a few odd half day Sundays. Other than that, normal hours are 8.00 or 8.30ish to 7 or 8 that night with two 15 minute breaks and a 30 minute break, usually lunch al desco. Get rid of this civil service mentality, it is for a different age.
Hollister11 wrote: » I'd rather do them hours and look for a new job, then be on the dole.
callaway92 wrote: » Pathetic way of looking at things
TallGlass wrote: » Hold on here for a moment, if your looking for managers to hire within a role, why are you not looking at the people who can manage to get there work done within the allotted hours of 9-5. Surely to become a manager, oneself must know how to manage themselves. Why would you want to hire a manager, whos own time keeping has them running over the clock. You then expecting this same person to deliver projects or tasks on time? Sounds like you just want a 'yes man' for the role.
Gone Drinking wrote: » You missed the point where I said taking on extra work or projects to ultimately help you succeed further down the line may require you to work past your allotted hours. The other scenario can be that a customer requests your assistance at 7pm, which is outside of your working day.. I can't say no if its the only time that suits them (in my position, at least) What if you dropped your car to a mechanic, most don't get paid overtime in my experience. He thought he would have your car ready that evening but due to issues out of his control (lets say part delivery was delayed!), he wouldn't get the work done till 6:00pm, 1 hour after his day finishes. I've seen this very scenario happen. The mechanic in question isn't going to push the suppliers fcuk up down to you because it'll leave you with a bad taste in your mouth and could result in the loss of repeat business. He knows you need your car first thing.. You might think its unfair, but in some jobs there's no overtime. I wouldn't hire someone if they told me they were walking at 5pm in the scenario above.
Gone Drinking wrote: » I've seen this very scenario happen. The mechanic in question isn't going to push the suppliers fcuk up down to you because it'll leave you with a bad taste in your mouth and could result in the loss of repeat business. He knows you need your car first thing.
grogi wrote: » But in this case it is the business OWNER that typically stays to complete the job.
testaccount123 wrote: » I suspect the amount of unpaid overtime required in your organisation is due to the inability to attract decent staff due to a toxic work ethos. Decent staff have their pick of where they work, they dont work somewhere they are permanently on-call for free. I feel a bit sorry for some on this thread tbh.
testicles wrote: » This post has been deleted.
testaccount123 wrote: » I suspect the amount of unpaid overtime required in your organisation is due to the inability to attract decent staff capable of delivering the work in normal timeframes due to a toxic work ethos. Decent staff have their pick of where they work, they dont work somewhere they are permanently on-call for free. I feel a bit sorry for some on this thread tbh.
martingriff wrote: » I am not so sure if its toxic work environments or ethos but I do agree that excessive overtime is an inability to hire new workers be it because they are just not there with the qualification or they want to hire as few people as possible (which now I think about it could be a toxic work ethos)
Gone Drinking wrote: » I'm not doing 60 hours a week, i'm talking about a few hours a month.
Gone Drinking wrote: » No, this person wasn't the business owner. This was a real scenario. They just know that repeat business keeps them in a job also.
