martian1980 wrote: » Fantastic. On post 442 we get to the shrill point of this piece of hyperbole. This hypothesis is entirely rubbish however - experience tells us that this would be more akin to infanticide where the courts almost never impose a custodial sentence.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide_Act Another attempt to paint people with reservations about abortion as nutters fails.
PucaMama wrote: » By looking into the most common reasons they have the abortions and trying to tackle those? Want an abortion because you will be a single mother? No single mother in Ireland in 2016 is without support so make that support obvious and accessible and try and tackle the prejudice against single mothers
PucaMama wrote: » If someone doesn't want support for their mental health issues they can be treated for their own good. These women are in crisis and should be shown there's more than abortion out there.
eviltwin wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » By looking into the most common reasons they have the abortions and trying to tackle those? Want an abortion because you will be a single mother? No single mother in Ireland in 2016 is without support so make that support obvious and accessible and try and tackle the prejudice against single mothers Do you really think your idea of punishment by jail is going to encourage anyone or just makes things worse ?
rjpf1980 wrote: » How do you deter abortions without making it illegal and throw people in jail? No punishment? Why would people obey the law then??????
rjpf1980 wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » By looking into the most common reasons they have the abortions and trying to tackle those? Want an abortion because you will be a single mother? No single mother in Ireland in 2016 is without support so make that support obvious and accessible and try and tackle the prejudice against single mothers If she doesn't want the baby and tells you to stick your support what then? Thousands of women are doing that every year. You want to force them to give birth? That is the implication of your view.
rjpf1980 wrote: » If abortion us murder and illegal then not just the doctor but all the abortion clinic staff including the receptionists would be punished with life sentences or execution in jurisdictions that allow it. Why wouldn't the woman who wanted an abortion not be as guilty as the "executioner" of the baby? Wouldn't that be the logical follow-on from making it illegal? Absolutely baths*t of course but that's where things would go if abortion was murder before the law courts. We don't have theses cases EVER because Irish women flee to England to get it done. If the right to travel for an abortion or information on abortion had been removed 25 years ago we would be throwing women in the slammer by the thousands every year. We would not be talking about lunatic hypotheticals. It would be REALITY!
PucaMama wrote: » Where do you draw the line with abortion
rjpf1980 wrote: » Donald Trump wrote: » I don't think that they do. I think they want the woman just not to have the abortion in the first place Hence no need for punishment. Simples How do you deter abortions without making it illegal and throw people in jail? No punishment? Why would people obey the law then??????
Donald Trump wrote: » I don't think that they do. I think they want the woman just not to have the abortion in the first place Hence no need for punishment. Simples
rjpf1980 wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » I'd punish the person who performed it, if they done it here, with a sentence. Maybe some kind of course of therapy groups aimed towards preventing repeat abortions for women who have more than 1. If abortion us murder and illegal then not just the doctor but all the abortion clinic staff including the receptionists would be punished with life sentences or execution in jurisdictions that allow it. Why wouldn't the woman who wanted an abortion not be as guilty as the "executioner" of the baby? Wouldn't that be the logical follow-on from making it illegal? Absolutely baths*t of course but that's where things would go if abortion was murder before the law courts. We don't have theses cases EVER because Irish women flee to England to get it done. If the right to travel for an abortion or information on abortion had been removed 25 years ago we would be throwing women in the slammer by the thousands every year. We would not be talking about lunatic hypotheticals. It would be REALITY!
PucaMama wrote: » I'd punish the person who performed it, if they done it here, with a sentence. Maybe some kind of course of therapy groups aimed towards preventing repeat abortions for women who have more than 1.
rjpf1980 wrote: » You wouldn't execute them so you think they should be put in vast prisons then? Thousands have abortions every year so over decades that works out as a vast prison population decade upon decade. Are you sure you have thought this true?
PucaMama wrote: » Don't be dramatic no one wants to kill anyone. It's all good for them to be free to choose but it's not only themselves that's involved here it's not a bad tooth they are having removed.
Widdershins wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » In your opinion. Mine is only an opinion too. In reality do I think they would be punished. Not a chance. Mine, and the UN Human Rights Committee s.
PucaMama wrote: » In your opinion. Mine is only an opinion too. In reality do I think they would be punished. Not a chance.
eviltwin wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » I'd punish the person who performed it, if they done it here, with a sentence. Maybe some kind of course of therapy groups aimed towards preventing repeat abortions for women who have more than 1. So if a woman takes pills herself or a friend helps her you think they should go to prison?
rjpf1980 wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » Unless she's pregnant because of rape or abuse, unless the child is dead or definitely dying, or unless the mother is dying then why not have a punishment for abortion 1. What kind of punishment? Life sentence or death? 2. Are you going to pay for the vast prisons plus the wardens police and soldiers needed to detain thousands and thousands of women and their friends and family who has helped them murder their babies? 3. Don't you think it would be a better idea to let women make their choice and butt out?
PucaMama wrote: » Unless she's pregnant because of rape or abuse, unless the child is dead or definitely dying, or unless the mother is dying then why not have a punishment for abortion
eviltwin wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » Unless she's pregnant because of rape or abuse, unless the child is dead or definitely dying, or unless the mother is dying then why not have a punishment for abortion What kind of punishment would be appropriate in your opinion?
Depp wrote: » I suppose its not that I dont understand where you're coming from its that I have a similar reaction to your viewpoint as you do to mine but i guess everyone cant agree on everything! My thoughts about the whole contraception thing is that while a fetus will develop into a sentient human, a sperm or an egg on its own will not. the more I think about it, while its an an importiant factor, its not neceserily the brain activity that matters to me the most But I dont think a fetus that has a heartbeat should be aborted because sentient or not, theres no denying that once its heart is beating, its hard to argue that a fetus is not 'alive'
Widdershins wrote: » PucaMama wrote: » Unless she's pregnant because of rape or abuse, unless the child is dead or definitely dying, or unless the mother is dying then why not have a punishment for abortion Because it doesn't warrant any.
PucaMama wrote: » The choice has to be responsible tho
thee glitz wrote: » Carrying a child to birth is not some kind of punishment - it's the reason we're all here. If you're lucky enough to have it happen, you should have that baby's interests at heart. Whether that involves raising him or her, or putting them up for adoption.
