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28-10-2014, 03:49   #1
ferretone
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Puppy spay dilemma

Okay, so we adopted our bitch from a well-known rescue 6 weeks ago. They took us around their puppy wing, as none of the adult dogs they had at the time suited our requirements, and we just fell in love with Nyssa right away. It was the next day when we filled out their forms with them, and became aware that they have a requirement that their dogs must be neutered at six months.

That didn't sit well with me, and I tried to argue with them, that best practice nowadays suggests later neutering is preferable, but they stopped me right there, basically insisting that they cannot trust adopters to be having sexually mature dogs, and not further exacerbate the problem of too many unwanted dogs around the country. I can see their point, as far as it goes, but clearly I would not be letting her loose in season, and am now really cut up by the idea that either her health or temperament could be ruined by too early neutering.

Yes, I can see you all thinking, well then I shouldn't have adopted from this rescue! Perhaps you're right. But now I have, and am caught in the dilemma. Her spay is booked in their centre in December, but it does say on there to please let them know if that doesn't suit, so they can book another dog in for the appointment.

So should I just cancel, and field calls from them for the next few months, assuring them I will be doing it soon, and that no, Nyssa has not been in a situation where she could get impregnated? Should I try to get my own vet to basically perjure himself, and pretend to them that he has done it? Or should I just suck it up, get her done in December, and hope for the best?

Obviously I do feel really stupid now. I told myself at the time that it would be ok. Lola was done early, but then, she did end up a somewhat nervous dog in certain ways. My aunt assures me her wonderful dog was done at 6 months too, but then she is quite small, and these things tend to be more so with bigger dogs. I just really do want to do the best for Nyssa, but am not terribly keen on breaking a promise, or ticking off the rescue either.

Any advice very much appreciated

Last edited by DBB; 28-10-2014 at 04:25. Reason: Removed references to named rescue
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28-10-2014, 04:28   #2
DBB
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Hi ferretone,
I've edited your post to remove reference to the rescue, as per the charter.
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28-10-2014, 04:29   #3
ferretone
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Oops, sorry Thank you
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28-10-2014, 06:51   #4
Millem
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Originally Posted by ferretone View Post
Okay, so we adopted our bitch from a well-known rescue 6 weeks ago. They took us around their puppy wing, as none of the adult dogs they had at the time suited our requirements, and we just fell in love with Nyssa right away. It was the next day when we filled out their forms with them, and became aware that they have a requirement that their dogs must be neutered at six months.

That didn't sit well with me, and I tried to argue with them, that best practice nowadays suggests later neutering is preferable, but they stopped me right there, basically insisting that they cannot trust adopters to be having sexually mature dogs, and not further exacerbate the problem of too many unwanted dogs around the country. I can see their point, as far as it goes, but clearly I would not be letting her loose in season, and am now really cut up by the idea that either her health or temperament could be ruined by too early neutering.

Yes, I can see you all thinking, well then I shouldn't have adopted from this rescue! Perhaps you're right. But now I have, and am caught in the dilemma. Her spay is booked in their centre in December, but it does say on there to please let them know if that doesn't suit, so they can book another dog in for the appointment.

So should I just cancel, and field calls from them for the next few months, assuring them I will be doing it soon, and that no, Nyssa has not been in a situation where she could get impregnated? Should I try to get my own vet to basically perjure himself, and pretend to them that he has done it? Or should I just suck it up, get her done in December, and hope for the best?

Obviously I do feel really stupid now. I told myself at the time that it would be ok. Lola was done early, but then, she did end up a somewhat nervous dog in certain ways. My aunt assures me her wonderful dog was done at 6 months too, but then she is quite small, and these things tend to be more so with bigger dogs. I just really do want to do the best for Nyssa, but am not terribly keen on breaking a promise, or ticking off the rescue either.

Any advice very much appreciated
The vet was only telling my dad that bigger dogs should not be speyed at 6 months. I don't know anything about it tbh. My 2 girls were done at 6 months, they are rescues too but that was 6 and 7 years ago.

I can see where the rescue are coming from as they are afraid that there could be an accident. I don't foster anymore but I would still say they all go by the same rules with regard to neutering.
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28-10-2014, 09:27   #5
tk123
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You could..
1 - tell them the truth - that you're waiting to minimise health/behavioural issues further down the line
2 - tell them you'll be taking her to your own vet because it's more convenient/you'd prefer your own trusted vet to carry out the procedure. I know somebody who adopted from the same rescue (well I'm assuming it's the same rescue ) who went to our vets as it's closer to them and they trusted the vet there more. I myself cancelled Lucy's keyhole spay at a different vet 50 mins away when I decided I wanted it to be done by my vet for the same reasons - she's going in on Friday and is 17 months now having had her first heat at 13 months.
3 - lie and call them up a couple of weeks before the appointment saying she's already gone into heat meaning she won't be able to get spayed for a few months - although some vets will spay 4 weeks after a heat (my vet wanted to wait 3 months)

What are they going to do about it at the end of the day anyways?
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28-10-2014, 10:10   #6
ShaShaBear
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If it is something you do plan on doing and are leaving it for a more appropriate time with regards to Nyssa's health, why not book the procedure with your own vet at a date that agrees with her age, and then have that vet release that information to the rescue in question as a show of faith.

Granted you could just not show up for it, but then again you could do the same with them so it matters not either way. Showing them that it is booked, maybe even with a small deposit, might indicate that you have strong reasons for waiting, but still understand the necessity of getting it done.

As you said though, you can see where they are coming from. All too often someone walks in to adopt a pup and insist that they will make sure he/she doesn't get loose and there will never be a pregnancy and even go so far as to say they have plenty of experience with bitches.
And all too often they turn back into rescue barely a year old with their litter of puppies in tow
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28-10-2014, 10:23   #7
Toulouse
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Originally Posted by tk123 View Post

What are they going to do about it at the end of the day anyways?
At the end of the day the OP signed a contract with this rescue which they will be in breach of. If its the rescue that I'm thinking of then they do have the resources to pursue this unlike the smaller ones.

I'm not going into right or wrongs but that's the long and short of it so I would read the fine print and then decide what you are going to do.

Having said that if a potential adopter was making noise about a policy when they were about to adopt a pup from me I'm not sure it would go through so perhaps the fact that they overlooked this means they won't be that bothered. Who knows?
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28-10-2014, 13:42   #8
VonVix
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A friend of mine got a rottie x gsd pup from a certain well known rescue as well, apparently he was neutered at 8 weeks old... a bunch of us were quite shocked when we heard.
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28-10-2014, 14:17   #9
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I understand where they are coming from - I'm sure you do too. I wouldn't give me own mother an un-neutered puppy or kitten! They don't know you from Adam to see how responsible you are.

I have been reading all the evidence for and against paediatric neutering, and still fall within the spay-early camp, apart from the giant breeds. The recovery is so much faster and I don't want a dog that will end up needing mammary strips in years to come so I'll always opt to spay before the first heat. So far I don't think the evidence against early spay/neuter is irrefutable. Actually it's funny how this issue never comes up in relation to cats? All our gang are neutered at 11 or 12 weeks so long as they are in perfect health.

I'm not being helpful, am I. I think if you love this puppy, don't get hung up on the spay date. I know you had an experience in the past where nervousness might have been linked to spaying, but in that instance the age of spaying is not relevant, AFAIK.

This is why I'll always adopt from rescues too, so that I don't have these quandaries! How old is Nyssa? To be honest I'm amazed they are rehoming an un-spayed pup at all.
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28-10-2014, 14:20   #10
ShaShaBear
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How old is Nyssa? To be honest I'm amazed they are rehoming an un-spayed pup at all.
Every rescue I have ever dealt with will rehome an un-neutered puppy, either with a spay voucher, a contracted promise to neuter at 6 months, or even both. Rescues would have died out long, long ago if they kept all the unwanted puppies until they were old enough to be neutered
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28-10-2014, 14:24   #11
boomerang
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Originally Posted by ShaShaBear View Post
Every rescue I have ever dealt with will rehome an un-neutered puppy, either with a spay voucher, a contracted promise to neuter at 6 months, or even both. Rescues would have died out long, long ago if they kept all the unwanted puppies until they were old enough to be neutered
Our local rescue neuters puppies at 12-16wks, before rehoming.

Having been the person ringing up the adopters when it was time to neuter and finding them stalling or resistant, I fully endorse their policy!
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28-10-2014, 14:28   #12
tk123
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IActually it's funny how this issue never comes up in relation to cats? .
Maybe because they're all around the same size? My vet advised me to wait but I'd already made my decision anyway. She put it that a spay/neuter would affect growth plate closure - having been there with Bailey (surgically straightened legs) I wasn't going to go there again. There's loads of evidence to wait for larger breeds for joint issue prevention, bone cancer, cruciate injuries etc. I was going to spay Lucy early until I did my research and waited
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28-10-2014, 14:37   #13
angeldaisy
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There's loads of evidence to wait for larger breeds for joint issue prevention, bone cancer, cruciate injuries etc.
What do they consider to be larger breed. I'm currently debating whether to spay Elly just yet as well. She's a collie cross, who's currently around 5mths and weights 8.5kg
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28-10-2014, 14:44   #14
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Yes but so far all we have are nearly all atomised, small-scale studies.

My collie was spayed at ten months, because she didn't come into rescue until eight or nine months.
She later ruptured a cruciate ligament when she was six and sadly, at just nine years old, haemangiosarcoma took her life.

Do I think either condition relates back to being spayed at ten months, or do I wish she hadn't been spayed at all? No.
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28-10-2014, 14:51   #15
tk123
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What do they consider to be larger breed. I'm currently debating whether to spay Elly just yet as well. She's a collie cross, who's currently around 5mths and weights 8.5kg
All I've read are retriever based studies - sorry! Maybe have a look on collie specific forums and see if there's any advise there.
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