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Irish schools are in the top 25 in the world....happy news, just for a change

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  • 07-12-2010 11:08pm
    #1
    baltimore sun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 483 ✭✭


    According to the latest Pisa study, it says that Ireland's schools are in the top 25 in the world.

    Can't link to site, as it seems to be down...a la wikileaks :D
    but here's the link to the article
    http://howd.ie/03Afa17

    I hadn't expected it but it's nice to know that teachers are doing their jobs well and that we have some bright kids coming though in the coming years...so long as they don't flood out of the country in another braindrain like in the 80s


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    #2
    FreudianSlippers
    Registered Users Posts: 20,397 ✭✭✭✭FreudianSlippers


    I think they used to be higher :happysad:


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    #3
    Revolution9
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,743 ✭✭✭Revolution9


    Rest of the world must have really sh!tty schools


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    #4
    El Weirdo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,646 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    RTE have a different spin on it.
    There has been a significant decline in literacy standards among Irish 15-year-olds over the past ten years, according to a highly regarded international education survey.
    The OECD's latest PISA study ranked the reading ability of Irish 15-year-olds in 17th place out of 39 countries, compared to 5th place in 2000.
    Tánaiste and Minister for Education Mary Coughlan has said she is disappointed with the outcome.
    Every three years the OECD measures the performance of 15-year-olds in reading, maths and science across dozens of countries.
    In its latest survey, Irish students fared well in science, once again significantly above average. Achievement has fallen in maths, from average to below average.
    However, the really significant decline is in reading - from 5th place among 39 countries ten years ago to 17th place now.
    The Department of Education commissioned Irish and Canadian researchers to find out why. Their research says changes in the school-going population may have had some influence.
    There are more migrant children, fewer early school leavers and a greater inclusion of students with Special Education Needs.
    But both groups say these and other factors cannot account fully for such dramatic change.
    The Department of Education says it is taking the OECD findings seriously but it is also urging caution and points to other studies of the same student group which showed no decline in ability.
    The INTO has said the results will damage the international reputation of Ireland's education system.
    However, the primary teachers' union said the results should be treated with caution as all other evidence shows that Irish literacy and numeracy standards are stable.
    The INTO said it was important to note that experts from the Educational Research Centre concluded that changes in the curriculum at Primary level cannot explain the decline in performance on reading literacy between 2000 and 2009.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1207/literacy.html


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    #5
    who what when
    Registered Users Posts: 810 ✭✭✭who what when


    The land of saints and scholars my ass!


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    #6
    baltimore sun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 483 ✭✭baltimore sun


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    RTE have a different spin on it.



    http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1207/literacy.html

    you'd think they'd be happy of some good news for a change, I think so long as the schools are still ranked in the top 25 then it's happy days, surely?


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    #7
    Ickle Magoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,485 ✭✭✭✭Ickle Magoo


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    you'd think they'd be happy of some good news for a change, I think so long as the schools are still ranked in the top 25 then it's happy days, surely?

    I'm not sure how they marry top 25 schools with the 1 in 4 illiteracy stats NALA are quoting... :confused:


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    #8
    Fight_Night
    Registered Users Posts: 720 ✭✭✭Fight_Night


    There is no way the United States could be ahead of us. Majority of the non private schools there are a complete joke.


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    #9
    El Weirdo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,646 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    you'd think they'd be happy of some good news for a change, I think so long as the schools are still ranked in the top 25 then it's happy days, surely?
    Out of 39? You're easily pleased.


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    #10
    sock puppet
    Registered Users Posts: 4,586 ✭✭✭sock puppet


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    Out of 39? You're easily pleased.

    Well you'd assume that by and large these are the 39 countries with the best education systems because of our wealth.


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    #11
    W.Shakes-Beer
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,975 ✭✭✭W.Shakes-Beer


    Jaysus, thats terrible news. What next?


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    #12
    baltimore sun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 483 ✭✭baltimore sun


    El Weirdo wrote: »
    Out of 39? You're easily pleased.

    ......"a major study of 65 countries reveals today".
    no mention of 39 anywhere...where you getting that figure from?

    ,......ah wait I see, from the RTE report...well, the one from 10 years ago only had 39 schools, this one had 65.
    Yea, I'm happy with that, small country with a small population, I don't think it's too shabby at all.


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    #13
    El Weirdo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,646 ✭✭✭✭El Weirdo


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    ......"a major study of 65 countries reveals today".
    no mention of 39 anywhere...where you getting that figure from?
    The RTE story.


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    #14
    orourkeda
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,918 ✭✭✭✭orourkeda


    must be all the irish they're being taught


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    #15
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    you'd think they'd be happy of some good news for a change, I think so long as the schools are still ranked in the top 25 then it's happy days, surely?
    Yeah, aim high :confused:
    If we're ahead of Sudan, sure that's good enough for us.


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    #16
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    ......"a major study of 65 countries reveals today".
    no mention of 39 anywhere...where you getting that figure from?

    ,......ah wait I see, from the RTE report...well, the one from 10 years ago only had 39 schools, this one had 65.
    Yea, I'm happy with that, small country with a small population, I don't think it's too shabby at all.
    What does the size of the country have to do with it :confused:
    Do you think they were counting aggregate IQ?


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    #17
    Naikon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭Naikon


    These league tables are complete bollix. All the metrics used to determine school status is subjective fluff. The best schools are usually the ones that cost lots of $$$


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    #18
    baltimore sun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 483 ✭✭baltimore sun


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    What does the size of the country have to do with it

    less teachers per students, less money invested in education and so on.

    Here's more results
    Ireland's reading score was 496, highest was 539, S.Korea
    Ireland's maths score was 487, highest was 600, Shanghai
    Ireland's science score was 508, highest was 575, Shanghai again


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    #19
    TheZohanS
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,582 ✭✭✭✭TheZohanS


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    less teachers per students, less money invested in education and so on.

    Here's more results
    Ireland's reading score was 496, highest was 539, S.Korea
    Ireland's maths score was 487, highest was 600, Shanghai
    Ireland's science score was 508, highest was 575, Shanghai again

    We haven't slipped back to 2000 levels of teachers per students yet and we certainly haven't cut investment in education to anything near 2000 levels.


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    #20
    goose2005
    Registered Users Posts: 4,798 ✭✭✭goose2005


    TheZohan wrote: »
    We haven't slipped back to 2000 levels of teachers per students yet and we certainly haven't cut investment in education to anything near 2000 levels.
    Nor have we started firing bad teachers, which would improve education more than any other step.


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    #21
    Mike 1972
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,018 ✭✭✭Mike 1972


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    less teachers per students, less money invested in education and so on.

    Irish schools are obviously shyte at teaching how to understand statistics

    Smaller country = Less teachers AND less students therefore effect of countries size on pupil teacher radio = damn all.


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    #22
    Novella
    Registered Users Posts: 13,713 ✭✭✭✭Novella


    Yeah, Irish schools are great. Students spend about twelve years learning Irish, the majority sit the Ordinary level Irish Leaving Cert paper and at that stage they're able to write a essay saying that they like, I dunno, milseáin and that they have one sister. Impressive stuff! :rolleyes:


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    #23
    Sticky_Fingers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,379 ✭✭✭Sticky_Fingers


    Novella wrote: »
    Yeah, Irish schools are great. Students spend about twelve years learning Irish, the majority sit the Ordinary level Irish Leaving Cert paper and at that stage they're able to write a essay saying that they like, I dunno, milseáin and that they have one sister. Impressive stuff! :rolleyes:
    Or perhaps we should be applauding their initiative in not wasting their time on a dead language when they could be brushing up on maths or other subjects that may be useful in their future. Having compulsory Irish is a joke, I never had any interest in the subject (or learning any other language apart from English for that matter) and I had to waste my time "learning" stuff that has yet to be of any use to me.


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    #24
    amacachi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,316 ✭✭✭✭amacachi


    TheZohan wrote: »
    We haven't slipped back to 2000 levels of teachers per students yet and we certainly haven't cut investment in education to anything near 2000 levels.

    Hmmmm...


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    #25
    Novella
    Registered Users Posts: 13,713 ✭✭✭✭Novella


    Sticky_Fingers wrote: »
    Or perhaps we should be applauding their initiative in not wasting their time on a dead language when they could be brushing up on maths or other subjects that may be useful in their future. Having compulsory Irish is a joke, I never had any interest in the subject (or learning any other language apart from English for that matter) and I had to waste my time "learning" stuff that has yet to be of any use to me.

    Ah, I was just half joking! :)


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    #26
    Einhard
    Registered Users Posts: 6,920 ✭✭✭Einhard


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    you'd think they'd be happy of some good news for a change, I think so long as the schools are still ranked in the top 25 then it's happy days, surely?


    That's a bloody terrible result. Mid table mediocrity. We're the Stoke City in terms of our education system. But we pay Man City wages to our teachers. How on earth can our standing in literacy slip when we're employing more teachers and support staff, and paying vastly increased wages?
    baltimore sun wrote: »
    ,......ah wait I see, from the RTE report...well, the one from 10 years ago only had 39 schools, this one had 65.
    Yea, I'm happy with that, small country with a small population, I don't think it's too shabby at all.
    baltimore sun wrote: »
    less teachers per students, less money invested in education and so on.

    Here's more results
    Ireland's reading score was 496, highest was 539, S.Korea
    Ireland's maths score was 487, highest was 600, Shanghai
    Ireland's science score was 508, highest was 575, Shanghai again

    It's not about the amount money spent overall, it's about what's spent per capita, or better still, per child. Ireland has less money but obviously less children to educate so it all evens out in the end. Given that our teachers are amongst the highest paid in the world, we should be demanding vastly improved performances. Actually, I think it's unfair to blame it all on the teachers. I'm not an old fogey or anything (I'm a fogey, but not that old!:D), but the system has seriously dumbed down in the ten years since I finished school. Bah humbug I say!


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    #27
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users Posts: 33,107 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Einhard wrote: »
    It's not about the amount money spent overall, it's about what's spent per capita, or better still, per child. Ireland has less money but obviously less children to educate so it all evens out in the end. Given that our teachers are amongst the highest paid in the world, we should be demanding vastly improved performances. Actually, I think it's unfair to blame it all on the teachers. I'm not an old fogey or anything (I'm a fogey, but not that old!:D), but the system has seriously dumbed down in the ten years since I finished school. Bah humbug I say!

    It's not about the money full stop, it's about the system. When I see a well rounded education system that does more than breed consumers and base intelligence on exams, I'll believe good schools.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



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    #28
    Einhard
    Registered Users Posts: 6,920 ✭✭✭Einhard


    Ikky Poo2 wrote: »
    It's not about the money full stop, it's about the system. When I see a well rounded education system that does more than breed consumers and base intelligence on exams, I'll believe good schools.

    Have to disagree with you there. You can't have a good education system without investment. Obviously, it's not the only factor, but it's an important one.


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    #29
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users Posts: 33,107 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Einhard wrote: »
    Have to disagree with you there. You can't have a good education system without investment. Obviously, it's not the only factor, but it's an important one.

    Oh, I agree, but a bad system will never work no matter how much money you throw at it.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



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    #30
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ickle Magoo wrote: »
    I'm not sure how they marry top 25 schools with the 1 in 4 illiteracy stats NALA are quoting... :confused:

    Our numeracy rates being even worse than our literacy rates probably covers that one.


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    #31
    kincsem
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,013 ✭✭✭kincsem


    baltimore sun wrote: »
    According to the latest Pisa study, it says that Ireland's schools are in the top 25 in the world.
    Or Ireland's schools rank 21st in the top 25 in the world.


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