Starving myself? Apparently I am

koHd · 06-08-2010 12:58pm #1

In the last couple of months I decided to watch what I eat with an online food diary. I was 186lbs in May, and I'm now 176lbs. So I'm happy with the gradual improvement of around 1 pound per week dropped.

I eat plenty and rarely feel hungry due to never going more than 3 hours without a decent bite to eat. Most of the week my daily calorie intake is around 1300. Fridays and Saturdays this usually spikes to 2500 though.

I've just been reading from a lot of different online sources that apparently a male my age and height should not go below 1800 calories per day or they can cause long term damage?!

I eat two dinners and apparently I'm starving meself!

Can any nutritionist tell me if I will start having any issues if I continue to just eat 1300 calories a day? I'm male and 5'7 by the way.

Here is a general breakdown of Monday-Thursday + Sunday 1300 calories per day intake;

Breakfast (9am);
Weetabix + Low fat milk = 178

Mid morning snack (11am);
Granola Bar + coffee with low fat milk + splenda = 111

Lunch (1pm);
130g CousCous + 50g Chicken breast peices (boiled) = 236

Snack (3pm);
Snackrite Satin Crunch = 80
Rice cake caramel = 26

Dinner (5pm);
Lightly dusted cod/haddock + cup of broccoli, 50g peas, 50g green beans, 20g sweet corn, half cup carrots, half cup salad potatoes boiled = 360

Second Dinner! (8pm);
Stir fry (50g green beans, 1 cup broccoli, 50g peas, 20g sweet corn, half cup carrots, 1 spring onion, 60g sweet & Sour sauce, 50g chicken breast, half cup of boiled rice, half tablespoon olive oil) = 400

Now to me that's a lot of food. Although healthy. I can't believe that somehow this would be considered unhealthy.

Here is a breakdown of the average total daily intake of the different nutrients;

Fat = 35g
Carbs = 180g
Sugars = 40g
Protein = 80g
Fibre = 20g

Seems balanced to me

I'm asking because a mate of mine went on a terrible diet and ended up with some issues around his ribs. Not sure exactly what the problem was, but he had to see a nutritionist. But he was extreme dieting, eating hardly anything. I wouldn't call my two dinners a day dieting! heh

Cheers for any help.

Lantus · 06-08-2010 2:24pm

1300 a day is on the low side. 2500 at the weekend is higher. You don't say how it's higher? alcohol or take aways perhaps? This gives a weekly average of around 11500 or 1643 a day over the course of a week.

That isn't too bad but still a bit low. Your BMR would be around 1600 without any exercise or measured activity.

Your frequency and timing is excellant though. If I would do anything it is eat a larger breakfast. Consider natural oats with something like a bit of low fat yogurt and fruit. If you can measure it out to give you say 400 calories then great. Remember you have just fasted for 10+ hours, your body desperatley needs energy and food. Also try shredded wheat without sugar. Weetabix are ok but they tend to have added refined sugar.

EileenG · 06-08-2010 2:30pm

People get carried away with ideas about "stavation mode" and "crashing metabolism". Here's the thing: if you are not hungry, you are not starving. Simple as that. Your body is not stupid. If you are not eating enough, it will let you know.

Real starvation does not mean you get peckish coming up to meal times. It means you are constantly hungry, real painful hunger. It means you are constantly thinking of food, constantly fascinated by the idea of it. You frequent places where people are eating, but for some reason, can't eat anything yourself. You can't sleep at night because you are hungry. And you have no energy for anything constructive, so you find yourself repeating comfort actions far too often.

If you are not hungry, you have plenty of energy to work out, and you sleep well, then you are not in any danger of starvation mode or any damage.

I'm be more inclined to think that you portions are a bit more generous than you realise. You didn't list weights, and when people don't weigh their food, they often tend to under-estimate the amount they are eating.

Anyway, I reckon "If it's not broken, don't fix it."

Khannie · 06-08-2010 2:36pm

koHd wrote: »

Breakfast (9am);
Weetabix + Low fat milk = 178

Mid morning snack (11am);
Granola Bar + coffee with low fat milk + splenda = 111

Lunch (1pm);
CousCous + Chicken breast peices (boiled) = 236

I have only one question for you:

HOW ARE YOU ALIVE?????

500 odd calories by the time you're finished lunch?!?!?! Oh my god. The thoughts of that are making me hungry. I'm around the same height as you. I weigh 65KG right this minute (Around 10 stone). If I'm dieting (and I generally exercise a fair bit if I am) I will typically finish lunch with 1000 calories gone for the day and feel like I'm doing well.

koHd · 06-08-2010 3:03pm

Thanks for all the replies. I'll respond individually...

Lantus wrote: »

1300 a day is on the low side. 2500 at the weekend is higher. You don't say how it's higher? alcohol or take aways perhaps? This gives a weekly average of around 11500 or 1643 a day over the course of a week.

That isn't too bad but still a bit low. Your BMR would be around 1600 without any exercise or measured activity.

Your frequency and timing is excellant though. If I would do anything it is eat a larger breakfast. Consider natural oats with something like a bit of low fat yogurt and fruit. If you can measure it out to give you say 400 calories then great. Remember you have just fasted for 10+ hours, your body desperatley needs energy and food. Also try shredded wheat without sugar. Weetabix are ok but they tend to have added refined sugar.

It's a combination of alcohol one day and the other a take away.

I know people go nuts over take aways and advise never to eat them, but you only live once and I love a take away at the weekend.

I've actually heard the idea about the breakfast should be around 400 cals. I also heard 2 peices of weetabix and low fat milk is one of the best breakfasts?? I really don't wanna add any more cals if I absolutely don't have to ?

EileenG wrote: »

People get carried away with ideas about "stavation mode" and "crashing metabolism". Here's the thing: if you are not hungry, you are not starving. Simple as that. Your body is not stupid. If you are not eating enough, it will let you know.

Real starvation does not mean you get peckish coming up to meal times. It means you are constantly hungry, real painful hunger. It means you are constantly thinking of food, constantly fascinated by the idea of it. You frequent places where people are eating, but for some reason, can't eat anything yourself. You can't sleep at night because you are hungry. And you have no energy for anything constructive, so you find yourself repeating comfort actions far too often.

If you are not hungry, you have plenty of energy to work out, and you sleep well, then you are not in any danger of starvation mode or any damage.

I'm be more inclined to think that you portions are a bit more generous than you realise. You didn't list weights, and when people don't weigh their food, they often tend to under-estimate the amount they are eating.

Anyway, I reckon "If it's not broken, don't fix it."

Sorry I didn't wanna go into the weights on everything. but I do weigh on a food scale and measure with cups etc. All meals I listed are calculated on the food diary I'm using, with the precise weights of the ingredients I'm using.

EDIT: I've edited in the measurements now

Khannie wrote: »

I have only one question for you:

HOW ARE YOU ALIVE?????

500 odd calories by the time you're finished lunch?!?!?! Oh my god. The thoughts of that are making me hungry. I'm around the same height as you. I weigh 65KG right this minute (Around 10 stone). If I'm dieting (and I generally exercise a fair bit if I am) I will typically finish lunch with 1000 calories gone for the day and feel like I'm doing well.

Yea I work from home during the day and generally sit on my arse most of it. I do make an effort to get in around 60 mins of casual walking each day though with various things such as going to the shop/walking the dog etc.

I went through a period of working out alot in the gym 3 times a weekand also playing football 3 times a week, but I have lost all enthusiasm for working out the last couple of years. That's why I gained weight. But now I'm happy losing it with minimal effort. Just don't want to end up with any problems from lack of nutrients.

Khannie · 06-08-2010 3:29pm

koHd wrote: »

I really don't wanna add any more cals if I absolutely don't have to ?

You absolutely don't have to.

koHd wrote: »

I'm happy losing it with minimal effort. Just don't want to end up with any problems from lack of nutrients.

Whatever works for you. I would be slightly concerned about proper nutrition given the (very) low calorie levels alright. (edit: though your dinners look very good).

neuro-praxis · 06-08-2010 8:37pm

People get carried away with ideas about "stavation mode" and "crashing metabolism". Here's the thing: if you are not hungry, you are not starving. Simple as that. Your body is not stupid. If you are not eating enough, it will let you know.

This is simply not true, and neither is its converse. A body has basic calorific needs to function. Undereating can slow your metabolism so that your propensity to gain weight increases.

You are not eating enough fats and you are not consuming enough calories and long-term this is bad.

Have some oils, peanut butter, OILY fish and nuts, in addition to your current diet.

EileenG · 06-08-2010 9:20pm

He's losing weight at a reasonable rate, he feels well and is healthy. Whatever he's doing (and I'm not keen on that diet either) is working.

I'm all for using the latest research and theories, but you also have to apply common sense. If it's working for him, it's clearly not starvation. I've done the starvation thing, and I know what it feels like.

There are some good BMR calculators out there, but people vary. Some people need a lot of calories, while others simply don't need as many. Force feeding someone (baby or adult) because they "need" more calories rarely results in anything except fat.

neuro-praxis · 06-08-2010 11:22pm

EileenG wrote: »

I'm all for using the latest research and theories, but you also have to apply common sense. If it's working for him, it's clearly not starvation. I've done the starvation thing, and I know what it feels like.

I never quite agree with you EileenG.

To me, common sense dictates that his body and all of its complex workings and chemical reactions requires a minimum amount of calories, and to deny his body these calories is dangerous.

There have been cases where super morbidly obese people (BMI of 40+) have actually died of starvation while losing weight on hospital programmes. I'm not implying the OP is in danger of dying. I'm simply saying that losing weight is not a sign of health, it is simply a sign that the body is burning adipose and/or muscle tissue.

EileenG · 07-08-2010 10:49am

He's losing weight at the rate of a pound a week. He's eating reasonable food (yes, it could be better, but I've seen a LOT worse) and he's not hungry. It's possible his lifestyle is not active, which would lower his calorie requirements, or that he is eating a little more than he thinks - those weekend refeeds can often get out of hand.

If you just looked at his food, and not the calorie count beside it, you'd have no complaint, except to improve the sugar/fat ratio.

You're basing a recommendation to eat more on a number, and one you haven't calculated yourself.

koHd · 07-08-2010 11:39am

After advice here, and some more research, I will be adding an extra 200 calories to my daily intake from now on, in the form of natural nuts and raisens. Maybe even chop some almonds or cashews into the stir fry.

Just to hit on a point by Eileen above me about fat and sugar...what exactly do you mean? Should my fat intake be more than my sugar intake?? Or should both be much lower/higher?

EileenG · 07-08-2010 7:45pm

A common mistake is to restrict fat too much, but fat is an essential nutrient, so your health will suffer if you avoid it. Go for good quality fats like eggs, salmon, nuts, avocado and steak. Feel free to continue avoiding chips and crisps.

Avoid sugar or food containing sugar as much as possible. They are nearly always processed junk which contain no real nutrition.

Sapsorrow · 10-08-2010 1:28pm

My 2 cents: It's not so much the amount of calories I'd be worried about it's the quality of the food and the amount of procssed junk and refined sugars you're eating. Even if the granola bar, satin crunch, caramel rice cake and sweet and sour sauce are low kcal doesn't make them healthy or ideal for weightloss so it would be worth replacing them with healthier options. In terms of your health and weight loss you'd be better off ditching those refined sugars/carbs and adding in more healthy sources of fats. I can't imagine you're getting nearly enough fat in there and that's why your calories are so low, you definately need to fix that. Try an make sure you're eating your carbs as wholegrains, root vet, fruit etc not processed junk, cous cous is usually refined unless you go out of your way to find wholegrain. Eat plenty of oily fish, olive oil, butter, coconut milk and fat, nuts (in moderation) and fatty meats (but not too much pork or bacon) and consider a fish oil supplement. Are you intentionally restricting your fat? You mention using low fat milk and only 1/2 tbs of olive oil in your dinner so it would seem like it.

koHd · 10-08-2010 8:12pm

Sapsorrow wrote: »

My 2 cents: It's not so much the amount of calories I'd be worried about it's the quality of the food and the amount of procssed junk and refined sugars you're eating. Even if the granola bar, satin crunch, caramel rice cake and sweet and sour sauce are low kcal doesn't make them healthy or ideal for weightloss so it would be worth replacing them with healthier options. In terms of your health and weight loss you'd be better off ditching those refined sugars/carbs and adding in more healthy sources of fats. I can't imagine you're getting nearly enough fat in there and that's why your calories are so low, you definately need to fix that. Try an make sure you're eating your carbs as wholegrains, root vet, fruit etc not processed junk, cous cous is usually refined unless you go out of your way to find wholegrain. Eat plenty of oily fish, olive oil, butter, coconut milk and fat, nuts (in moderation) and fatty meats (but not too much pork or bacon) and consider a fish oil supplement. Are you intentionally restricting your fat? You mention using low fat milk and only 1/2 tbs of olive oil in your dinner so it would seem like it.

Hi Sapsorrow,

Yes I was trying to keep fat to 40g a day max. I have added raw almonds and raisens to my daily diet. Around 15g almonds and 20g raisens. So my average daily fat intake is actually around 45g now.

I take large cod liver oil supplements every day also.

What would you suggest as a healthy alternative to sweet & sour sauce on my stir fry? I really love the sweet & sour sauce though. I haven't found any other stir fry sauce I like, unfortunately. But if there is a healthier, but tasty alternative, I'd try it out.

VonLuck · 11-08-2010 10:27pm

koHd wrote: »

Breakfast (9am);
Weetabix + Low fat milk = 178

How are you calculating that? 2 Weetabix alone is 127 calories so that leaves just 51 calories for milk - thats about 100mls I think. Either you have miscalculated or you have a couple of weetabix milk sponges in the morning!

koHd · 13-08-2010 9:50pm

VonLuck wrote: »

How are you calculating that? 2 Weetabix alone is 127 calories so that leaves just 51 calories for milk - thats about 100mls I think. Either you have miscalculated or you have a couple of weetabix milk sponges in the morning!

I skimp on milk. It's actually half a cup of milk in there. But I do like it low on milk so the bisks don't melt away into porridge like slush

koHd · 23-08-2010 12:10pm

I just have to post an update on the small change I've made;

Adding nuts and the extra calories to my diet I've actually started to lose more weight

I've gone from losing 1 pound per week on the 1200 calorie a day diet (this was a constant loss for around 10 weeks), to losing 2 pound per week on a 1500 calorie a day diet for the last two weeks in a row, with no change in exercise (I only do a small amount of casual walking each day).

Obviously I've been eating the non-salted natural nuts (almonds & cashews).

So although they're high in calories and look daunting from the nutrition information printed on the back, they're actually good for weight loss. Well for me anyway.

I've always heard this was the case, but the numbers on the packet always had me thinking twice about eating them. But a couple of handfuls a day (about 30 grams total intake of nuts a day) seems to help weight loss.

EDIT: I've also slightly upped my olive oil intake to bring my calories up to the 1500 a day.

El_Dangeroso · 23-08-2010 12:57pm

You wouldn't be the first person to notice faster weight loss eating more calories. Low carb forums are full of anecdotal reports of people losing faster after adding in more fat. I know someone who couldn't lose at 1200 calories on low fat but could lose at 1500 calories on low carb, no idea why. Go figure!

In any case, who cares right? 2lb a week is brilliant, well done!

Starving myself? Apparently I am

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