Student Players Vote Please

carfax · 14-02-2008 10:44PM #1

Hi all,

Ok student poker players only please vote in this thread.

The whole marketting campaign for the National Student Poker Championships 2008 involves us travelling around the country promoting the tournament in college poker soc games. The flyers and posters we have done up have a real underground feel to them and the badges are pretty cool (so I've been told, haven't actually seen them yet but a friend of mine who is a brilliant person has made them, she lives in London hence the involvement of the postal service).....

Cool Hand Luke's have already offered to run an added value satellite and we will be organising many more in poker clubs and poker sos around the country on different student poker nights.....

We will also be offering each poker society a real financial incentive to get involved in this tournament, to promote poker and bring lots and lots of new players into the game.

Judging by emails so far there are a lot of players that want to play in this tournament, are in their early twenties but not in third level education....They have lots of friends that are in third level but they themselves are not.....

Its a simple question and I will go by whatever the vote is here.

cooker3 · 14-02-2008 10:54PM

Rename it to something else and let everyone play

carfax · 14-02-2008 11:03PM

cooker3 wrote: »

Rename it to something else and let everyone play

I'm not renaming it, I will give players what they want and it is a student tournament, we can just set the rules of registration....i.e. Do players trust my judgement in terms of putting together a student tournament or do they need the rules clearly defined?...Either way is fine by me (the hope is that the tournament "National Student Poker Championship" will become more valuable as it gets more established over the coming years so we're not changing the name)....Plus Devilfish Poker have sponsored the event, we can't really move the goalposts that much now that they have given us a load of money

.....

ooops, I mean a little bit of money

14-02-2008 11:07PM

If you look at the guys who are gonna make up the backbone of this event they are all guys who are around the edge of leaving college or just have. I think the 20-somethings are ok. If it was only students Ditpoker couldn't play for example (congrats on finishing Jeff) and where is the value in that?

carfax · 14-02-2008 11:17PM

Well the poll closes in 5 days and not including my own vote or any others that are shown to be from non-students whichever has the majority will be the way it is run.

Mr.Plough · 14-02-2008 11:28PM

I'm a student but I still voted for B as I want more monies when I own it

Idoubtit · 14-02-2008 11:36PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

carfax wrote: »

we can't really move the goalposts that much now that they have given us a load of money .....

Isn't it moving the goalposts to not restrist this to students?

carfax · 14-02-2008 11:40PM

Idoubtit wrote: »

Isn't it moving the goalposts to not restrist this to students?

No they've trusted us to run a great tournament and that means everything from now until April 6th.....We make decisions as regards who is and who is not eligible to play, but of course we simply listen to players and try to provide a service...We'll set a rule for this in 5 days.

carfax · 15-02-2008 08:12AM

Come on guys and girls, please don't give us another dead-heat

.

Just vote for what you think will make for the best "National Student Poker Champs 2008".

ditpoker · 15-02-2008 09:50AM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

Deleted User wrote: »

If you look at the guys who are gonna make up the backbone of this event they are all guys who are around the edge of leaving college or just have. I think the 20-somethings are ok. If it was only students Ditpoker couldn't play for example (congrats on finishing Jeff) and where is the value in that?

YEA!... hey... what!!!?

HEY!!!

fortunately for me I'm now working in a college and have access to the student card printer!

i really need to play cards more if keith is calling me the value!!! havent played in AGES!

ditpoker · 15-02-2008 09:55AM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

i voted for check that all players have a student ID.

the problem is the term student is quite broad. It implies 18-22year old wasters who dont wanna get a job yet and next step in further education seems more sensible. but realistically my mother is a student as she has to keep updating her qualifications on a annual basis. anyone in their 50's doing a PhD is a student. Anyone training to be a football coach is a student, anyone doing the FE1's or accountancy exams are students, these guys can be any age.

realistically, this has been called the National Student Poker Championships, i'd advertise it as STUDENTS ONLY and if someone in theri 60's turns up, you ask them "are they a student" and they say "yes, i'm completing a course in horticulture" you let them in.

you could specify its for u-25's, that way there is no ambiguity regarding who or what is a student... title of event "national student poker championship", rules for entry "must be under 25"

dannydiamond · 15-02-2008 10:09AM

carfax wrote: »

Hi all,
Ok student poker players only please vote in this thread.
.

Just having a gander at this stephen and it looks like your vote is tainted with non-students.

carfax · 15-02-2008 11:15AM

dannydiamond wrote: »

Just having a gander at this stephen and it looks like your vote is tainted with non-students.

Aside from me, who?.....I don't think BIG-SLICK-POKER is Neill Kelly, is it?

15-02-2008 01:12PM

ditpoker wrote: »

i really need to play cards more if keith is calling me the value!!! havent played in AGES!

I wasn't calling you the value Jeff... ok maybe I was but to be fair I haven't seen you in ages at any tournament and I would've won our prop bet about final tables hands-down if you were ever in a tournament. You get to 2-2 and just disappear? Weak...

So for sheer rustiness you must be the value:D:D:D

I, luckily, am still a student so I'll be playing either way but I think this tournament would be a lot less interesting without some of the players recently leaving college. Oh and I swear Stephen I want the head of Trinity Poker Soc from last year at my table; we have a little business to clear up...

Goodluck2me · 15-02-2008 01:43PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

Deleted User wrote: »

I wasn't calling you the value Jeff... ok maybe I was but to be fair I haven't seen you in ages at any tournament and I would've won our prop bet about final tables hands-down if you were ever in a tournament. You get to 2-2 and just disappear? Weak...

So for sheer rustiness you must be the value:D:D:D

I, luckily, am still a student so I'll be playing either way but I think this tournament would be a lot less interesting without some of the players recently leaving college. Oh and I swear Stephen I want the head of Trinity Poker Soc from last year at my table; we have a little business to clear up...

geoff is the value.

Theresalwaysone · 15-02-2008 01:44PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

Students only. Makes more sense. Plus, there are definately more student players out there than any other demographic. You just gotta convince 'em to break out of their fishy homegames and play in a "real" tourney.

15-02-2008 01:56PM

This post has been deleted.

carfax · 15-02-2008 02:04PM

The Scientist wrote: »

This is probably the only poker tourney ill actually travel to Dublin all year for so i hope its not students only.
Why not called it the Irish Youth Championships or something?

We're not going to call it anything else mate, sorry.....We do just want to cater to students here, as stated many times.....It just depends now on how students vote now as to how we approach registration rules......

By the way I will be really strict on what we are saying here, if players don't have a valid student card they won't be playing, it could reduce the field considerably as most student players will only play when one or two of their non-student/ recently left college/ recently left school and are taking a year out/ have lost their student card mates are playing too......

connie147 · 15-02-2008 02:06PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

Oops, sorry Steven,I voted before reading that you didnt want non students voting. I think a National Students Championship is a great idea,but honestly,it just has to be kept as student only to deserve that title. Colleges football is played between college sudents just like a National students championship should be played amongst students.

If you want to involve both students and non students,then change the name of the event. If your tourney gets the media attention it deserves, how do you explain to the press that the National student champion for 2008 is (say for instance) Neil Kelly,Poker tour operator and casino owner. Or maybe this years champion is HJ,professional poker player.

I wouldn't have voted if I'd seen your request for a student only vote.But once I did,I felt I should air my views.

Connie

carfax · 15-02-2008 02:09PM

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Students only. Makes more sense. Plus, there are definately more student players out there than any other demographic. You just gotta convince 'em to break out of their fishy homegames and play in a "real" tourney.

We just want to do what the majority think is fair so its all good.

I have a fair bit of experience of organising student tournaments and I am just going to say one thing; students players are the laziest demographic....Its really hard to convince them to do just about anything over staying in bed all day.

AdMMM · 15-02-2008 02:21PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

Check that every player has a valid student ID (smaller prize-pool very likely

I don't think it's fair to word an option like that.

My own views are that this is the National Student Poker Championship and as such should be purely aimed at students with valid ID. It almost seems as if you're taking advantage of the students by allowing in non-students purely to ensure you have a full event that you can add to your portfolio.

TommyGunne · 15-02-2008 02:37PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

I say it should be students only. Why call it the NSPC if anyone who likes play it? It just makes no sense to me. Otherwise it is just an average run of the mill tourney.

I wouldn't refuse anybody showing up on the day though, but for example if Jeff entered and took it down, I could imagine some grumblings from your typical naysayer about the fact that a non-student took it down. Obviously not from me! I'd enjoy a wider tourney as much as a restricted one, and would definitely not begrudge anyone, especially Jeff! It just seems to me that a student chaps that isn't that just makes a bit of a mockery of the name tbh.

Edit: Obv Jeff is the value, I vote that he can be a student for that day for prize pool purposes!

carfax · 15-02-2008 02:41PM

|.Murderer.| wrote: »

I don't think it's fair to word an option like that.

My own views are that this is the National Student Poker Championship and as such should be purely aimed at students with valid ID. It almost seems as if you're taking advantage of the students by allowing in non-students purely to ensure you have a full event that you can add to your portfolio.

How would you word it?....As I said I have no problem and am not biased either way (its less work for me if option A is voted for)......I simply want to see the best possible National Student Poker Champs take place.

I didn't realise I had a portfolio of anything other than art work.....How can it possibly seem like I am almost doing anything?

A full event benefits the players far more (bigger prize-pool) than the organiser here mate, as I said before in the main thread the more players we have the more our staff costs will be. How can this possibly be taking advantage of students especially when we have been and always will be completely upfront and open about our rules, terms, regulations etc etc etc.

How are the preparations going for the W.I.T. Open? Let me know if I can help in any way mate.

carfax · 15-02-2008 02:42PM

TommyGunne wrote: »

I say it should be students only. Why call it the NSPC if anyone who likes play it? It just makes no sense to me. Otherwise it is just an average run of the mill tourney.

I wouldn't refuse anybody showing up on the day though, but for example if Jeff entered and took it down, I could imagine some grumblings from your typical naysayer about the fact that a non-student took it down. Obviously not from me! I'd enjoy a wider tourney as much as a restricted one, and would definitely not begrudge anyone, especially Jeff! It just seems to me that a student chaps that isn't that just makes a bit of a mockery of the name tbh.

Edit: Obv Jeff is the value, I vote that he can be a student for that day for prize pool purposes!

I think you may not have read any of the posts that I have written up with regard to what you are talking about here.....I'm done talking about this now.

Pharell_st · 15-02-2008 02:52PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

|.Murderer.| wrote: »

I don't think it's fair to word an option like that.

My own views are that this is the National Student Poker Championship and as such should be purely aimed at students with valid ID. It almost seems as if you're taking advantage of the students by allowing in non-students purely to ensure you have a full event that you can add to your portfolio.

I agree, why word it like you did i.e. (smaller prize pool likely, and option B ...be pernickety) its obviously a loaded vote. I see that option A is winning and rightly so.
I think connie makes a good point, loads of people would like to play in the intervarsities but they are not students and hence NOT ALLOWED.

TommyGunne wrote: »

I say it should be students only. Why call it the NSPC if anyone who likes play it? It just seems to me that a student chaps that isn't that just makes a bit of a mockery of the name tbh.

Absolutely agree

carfax wrote: »

How would you word it?....As I said I have no problem and am not biased either way (its less work for me if option A is voted for)......I simply want to see the best possible National Student Poker Champs take place.

I didn't realise I had a portfolio of anything other than art work.....How can it possibly seem like I am almost doing anything?

A full event benefits the players far more (bigger prize-pool) than the organiser here mate, as I said before in the main thread the more players we have the more our staff costs will be. How can this possibly be taking advantage of students especially when we have been and always will be completely upfront and open about our rules, terms, regulations etc etc etc.

Im pretty sure more players mean a higher profile tournament for you and your reputation, a large amount of reg fees, more scope for bargaining with the sponsors and => more money, otherwise you wouldnt run one at all, so don`t beat around the bush, you arent doing this for the good of our health.

carfax wrote: »

I think you may not have read any of the posts that I have written up with regard to what you are talking about here.....I'm done talking about this now.

In essence he is right, a mate of a student is pretty much anyone you like...

carfax · 15-02-2008 05:25PM

connie147 wrote: »

Oops, sorry Steven,I voted before reading that you didnt want non students voting. I think a National Students Championship is a great idea,but honestly,it just has to be kept as student only to deserve that title. Colleges football is played between college sudents just like a National students championship should be played amongst students.

If you want to involve both students and non students,then change the name of the event. If your tourney gets the media attention it deserves, how do you explain to the press that the National student champion for 2008 is (say for instance) Neil Kelly,Poker tour operator and casino owner. Or maybe this years champion is HJ,professional poker player.

I wouldn't have voted if I'd seen your request for a student only vote.But once I did,I felt I should air my views.

Connie

Hi Connie,

I can see the logic behind what you are saying alright but I think you've kind of missed the point (or at least a lot of my posts on the matter)....There is no way Kelly would stand a chance of winning this tournament, ha ha.....Seriously though the only reason that this has come about is because this is what lots of students have asked for and of course any pro or serious player would be given the boot before it started.

The fact that the votes are so close shows that there are a lot of mixed opinions on this.....It is a Student Championships that we are putting on. We are asking students what kind of tournament they want. At the moment the majority is for a strict policy, no non-students whatsoever allowed, if at the end of the poll that is the result we will happily and diligently put the tournament together with that format and I'm sure we can still make it a success (a full house).

If the vote goes for option two then we will be able to allow for some special cases; i.e. 6 students are studying together and one of their non-student friends (who plays in their home game all the time or whatever) wants to play...Hey happy days you can play.

Mr Minraise · 15-02-2008 06:20PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

carfax wrote: »

How would you word it?....As I said I have no problem and am not biased either way (its less work for me if option A is voted for)......I simply want to see the best possible National Student Poker Champs take place.
.

This couldnt be futher from the truth. From reading your replies to requests that this should remain a student only tourny, its clear have a preference for option B, you even voted for it for some strange reason! (not exactly the way to run an open poll)

I think the tournement should be for current students only, Otherwise nothing will distungush it ,besides size, from your average weekly freezeout.

How would you propose to run the team event if you decide to go ahead with option B?

Would this be resevered for current students as an intervarsity competion or will we have a team of plumbers pipping UCD/UCC etc to the tittle.

Theresalwaysone · 15-02-2008 07:14PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

carfax wrote: »

I have a fair bit of experience of organising student tournaments and I am just going to say one thing; students players are the laziest demographic....Its really hard to convince them to do just about anything over staying in bed all day.

Whamo. Nail on head. I couldnt agree more. BUT we are also the demographic with possibly the biggest disposable income, if you can market in a way that convinces most students to get out of their home games and play this then you can't but win.

Get online micro stakes satellites. Give info to student players on how to run their own satellites.

Run, some student friendly satellites in the jackpot or whatnot. I know most students will have the income for this but if you start running "NSPC Satellites " if nothing else it gets the name out there and also students are very sheep like in that, if they see their mates qualify or buy in they are likely to do it themselves.

carfax · 15-02-2008 08:27PM

Theresalwaysone wrote: »

Whamo. Nail on head. I couldnt agree more. BUT we are also the demographic with possibly the biggest disposable income, if you can market in a way that convinces most students to get out of their home games and play this then you can't but win.

Get online micro stakes satellites. Give info to student players on how to run their own satellites.

Run, some student friendly satellites in the jackpot or whatnot. I know most students will have the income for this but if you start running "NSPC Satellites " if nothing else it gets the name out there and also students are very sheep like in that, if they see their mates qualify or buy in they are likely to do it themselves.

lol,

yeah absolutely....We're planning all of the above whether we go with option A or option B.

Rossibaby · 15-02-2008 11:35PM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

carfax its simple in my eyes,what maes this tourny unique is its a student championship,if it wasnt then why would students care about it.therefore if some fourty year old non-student wins or gets down to the big money it takes the piss of the whole thing.this tourny should be just for the students.in galway here teh ''student'' rebuy is riddled with idiots and the inevitable joke of ''what are you studying'' is said every 20 mins to the 'mature' lads nd lassies...im not saying id essential but i would prefer a student only tourny[including mature ones] but all must be legitimate and if they are found not to be they give up all prize money one.not trying to be harsh but its a student championship!!

connie147 · 16-02-2008 12:34AM

Aim advertising primarily at students but don't be too pernickerty.

carfax wrote: »

Hi Connie,

I can see the logic behind what you are saying alright but I think you've kind of missed the point (or at least a lot of my posts on the matter)....There is no way Kelly would stand a chance of winning this tournament, ha ha.....Seriously though the only reason that this has come about is because this is what lots of students have asked for and of course any pro or serious player would be given the boot before it started.

The fact that the votes are so close shows that there are a lot of mixed opinions on this.....It is a Student Championships that we are putting on. We are asking students what kind of tournament they want. At the moment the majority is for a strict policy, no non-students whatsoever allowed, if at the end of the poll that is the result we will happily and diligently put the tournament together with that format and I'm sure we can still make it a success (a full house).

If the vote goes for option two then we will be able to allow for some special cases; i.e. 6 students are studying together and one of their non-student friends (who plays in their home game all the time or whatever) wants to play...Hey happy days you can play.

Hi Steven,
I did read all your posts and I dont think I missed any points you made. I understand that you want to have a successfull tournament with large numbers,but quantity alone is not a recipe for success.

With the National Student Poker Championships,you have a unique oppertunity to host a tournament than any student that plays the game would give their eye teeth to win. Its an excellent chance for a Poker site to get involved with sponsoring a prestigous national tournament. By opening it up to non students, your playing with fire IMHO. A final table of non students and you can kiss goodbye to future runnings of this event.

I'm trying to think of an example of a tournament (in any sport) where what you want to do would be all-right, but I cant.
GAA-football u-21 c/ship--can my friend play as well.He's only 22 and he loves the game? Ans: definately not.
Snooker--National amatuer c/ship- Can Davy Morris play in the c/ship,he's a great friend of ours and he was an amatuer last year.I mean,he only turned pro 6 months ago? Ans: definately not.
Golf--Pierce purcell shield for clubs, can my friend play on the team,I know he's not a club member but he's a fantastic golfer and he'd be a big asset to the team? Ans: definately not.

I could go on and on.Maybe you'll say these are all totally different scenarios,and maybe they are. But my message is one of good faith. A national studant c/ship should be a huge tournament, fought out by students and won by a student. The tournament has the capacity to grow enormously over the next number of years. If you decide to allow non students participate,your doing the name of the tourney a dis-service.If you dont want to run a National Students (only) c/ship,then you shouldn't put the name to it that you are. And asking students to vote whether or not to allow non students to play in their "National Championship" so as to build a bigger prize-pool is not the way forward.The choice shouldn't be on the table.

Finally I'm gonna quote you from your 2nd paragraph in the above highlighted quote:
"It is a student championship we are putting on"
Do it.And prosper.

Connie

PS; Please don't take offence from this post Steven.I think your tournament has the makings of a huge event.(I started the National Snooker Club C/ships 20 years ago and its still going from strength to strength,but if it was opened up to allow clubs use non club members to play because x is friendly with y,the tournament would lose its appeal that it has). I do wish you luck with it.Think about it as a long term thing.

Student Players Vote Please

Which would you prefer? 52 votes

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