New Mark IV's now in service

Navan Junction · 22-05-2006 1:10pm #1

'New' end

201 Loco end

Taken 22.05.2006 in Kildare station

drdre · 22-05-2006 1:14pm

very nice trains, hope they donot get spray paint behind the seats as they usually do.:mad:

Alun · 22-05-2006 1:22pm

Not being a train anorak, or even a locosexual for that matter, can someone explain to me (in simple non-nerdy language) why both ends aren't "pointy"" Looks pretty stupid to me.

अधिनायक · 22-05-2006 1:47pm

I have some basic questions:

Do they have an engine at each end?
Are they those trains with an engine in every carriage?
Do they go faster than the old trains?
Have they sorted out the bit of the journey where the train slows down to 30-40 mph for some reason?

Navan Junction · 22-05-2006 1:48pm

Alun wrote:

Not being a train anorak, or even a locosexual for that matter, can someone explain to me (in simple non-nerdy language) why both ends aren't "pointy"" Looks pretty stupid to me.

Because they didn't buy the engines. They are using the 201 locos to pull/push the carriages and the engineless 'pointy end'.

There is only a loco at one end in effect..

IÉ say they will buy the 'loco' part at some point in the future.

No engines in carriages

No, they won't be any faster because it's the same loco as before (201s). But they do have wifi apparently..;)

popebenny16 · 22-05-2006 1:58pm

have some basic questions:

Do they have an engine at each end?
Are they those trains with an engine in every carriage?
Do they go faster than the old trains?
Have they sorted out the bit of the journey where the train slows down to 30-40 mph for some reason?

They dont.
No, just the same auld on at the front
No, as its the same engine
No, Portarlington, Lisduff and the rest are as bad as ever.

अधिनायक · 22-05-2006 2:24pm

So did they buy them because they'd run out of trains or because the old ones were being scrapped?

MarkoP11 · 22-05-2006 3:06pm

No cash to buy new locomotives, the DoT had paid for 32 new locomotives only 5 years before IE were authorised to seek tenders for further stock.

Main reason for purchase was to eliminate the older stock which is 75mph limited, you won't see any reduction in Dublin Cork times but Dublin Limerick and Galway should see big improvements as a result of the elimination of the older stock.

To be honest a new supped up set of locomotives won't do much given the track condition which is horrible in places. The whole 200kph thing came from an over enthusiastic journalist who found out the coaches are capable of 200kph, pity she didn't do her homework since the 1984 batch are good for 200kph and infact hold the Irish rail speed record at 200kph achieved in testing Summer 1984

Is it a nice passenger friendly train, it sure is, is it perfect not quite but it is a serious attempt to bring some style and comfort back to the long distance rail business

अधिनायक · 22-05-2006 3:32pm

MarkoP11 wrote:

Main reason for purchase was to eliminate the older stock which is 75mph limited, you won't see any reduction in Dublin Cork times but Dublin Limerick and Galway should see big improvements as a result of the elimination of the older stock.

Makes sense.

Is it a nice passenger friendly train, it sure is, is it perfect not quite but it is a serious attempt to bring some style and comfort back to the long distance rail business

It would be enough to make me try the train the next time I'm off to Cork. The old Citygold service was great, I wonder if these trains have a nice first class, if I can get someone else to pay.

I'll be bringing my own food though unless I hear that they've outsourced catering away from that workshy shower, hiding behind their closed shutters with their club milks and stale sangers.

MarkoP11 · 22-05-2006 3:42pm

All 8 of the new trains have a full 44 seat first class coach with the table lamp and the wider seats. Full citygold service is provided, the logo is carried outside, but at the moment its normal first class unless the train is running one of the timetabled citygold services which it isnt yet.

Catering has is thankfully been outsourced and tenders issued for a third party to run it, that said on return to Dublin (we got out at Thurles) one of the Platform 11 crew tucked into a full Irish breakfast for €11 on the 9:30 Cork Dublin, no complaints here, either we got lucky or they knew we was coming. You won't be getting that anymore as the on train cooked fry is on the way out, last country in Europe to provide it was Ireland its all reheat now

We got free tea and coffee in steerage class today, with 2 catering trolleys on board, new trolleys and all

popebenny16 · 22-05-2006 3:59pm

€11 for a full Irish!!!! If you'd have walked down the road a bit a bit you'd have got it for a lot less.

MarkoP11 · 22-05-2006 4:02pm

For what you get, on a moving train its not bad value. You would pay 10-15 euro in a hotel if breakfast wasn't in the room price

Red Alert · 22-05-2006 8:17pm

i don't really see why they should bother buying the loco's. The 201's or 071's are suitable, of sufficient horsepower and can do the max speed allowed. Plus they've spent money getting the 201 cab into the Pointy End (which in theory will operate 071's since 201's and 071's are supposed to be operable in multiple, although i've never seen a setup like that). and they've learned the lessons from the enterprise so the pointy end is in fact a DVT and Heating Van in one.

great to see it in service finally! does the PIS system or WiFi work on it?

MarkoP11 · 22-05-2006 8:42pm

071 can haul the train but can't push it, its complicated

The PIS works perfectly, it could do with a few tweaks but the side displays worked and the internal displays worked as expected. The auto announcement even happen as gaeilge

All in all quite an impressive train, few minor issues to sort out but for day one it was impressive

Downside, no wifi, no power sockets, no in seat entertainment

Navan Junction · 22-05-2006 8:59pm

darkman2 · 22-05-2006 9:22pm

Navan Junction wrote:

Any pictures of inside the train?:rolleyes:

Navan Junction · 22-05-2006 9:48pm

darkman2 wrote:

Any pictures of inside the train?:rolleyes:

Only have 2. I don't have permission of those in the photos so are photoshopped out.

darkman2 · 22-05-2006 10:06pm

Navan Junction wrote:

Only have 2. I don't have permission of those in the photos so are photoshopped out.

Thanks, Looks very smart:D (because its hard to judge on those pictures) Whats it like compared to the drogheda commuter trains? Also can you even compare them to the old trains (the ones you had to stick your hand out to open the door!):)

MarkoP11 · 22-05-2006 10:10pm

If you want to get technical

The ride is good, not quite MK3 standard but better than everything else
Seat spacing is on par with other trains, but the table is a little small
Windows don't line up with the seats
The lighting is defused so its soft
It comes with curtains
Its really really quiet even at 90mph
The AC actually works

Navan Junction · 22-05-2006 10:22pm

darkman2 wrote:

Whats it like compared to the drogheda commuter trains?

We got a commuter train back. Way better than that. Really quiet, can't hear the boom of other trains passing, tinted windows (kind of greenish) controlled climate.

Grand as far as I could tell. Not an expert though, but much more comfortable that the return leg on the commuter..

Cerdito · 22-05-2006 10:26pm

If I wanted to take a journey on one of the new trains, what would be the best times/routes to go for, to be assured of travelling on one?

Zhane · 22-05-2006 10:46pm

Anyone know what lines will be getting these new Mark IVs Intercities? Will the Rosslare line get one cos on the timetable it says its an intercity service but its a commuter train. We had an old intercity train before we got a commuter. And the commuter trains are not very comfortable for a 2 and a half hour journey!

John R · 22-05-2006 10:58pm

Zhane wrote:

Anyone know what lines will be getting these new Mark IVs Intercities? Will the Rosslare line get one cos on the timetable it says its an intercity service but its a commuter train. We had an old intercity train before we got a commuter. And the commuter trains are not very comfortable for a 2 and a half hour journey!

They are only for Dublin-Cork services.

There are new intercity railcars on order, not sure if they will be on Rosslare services though.

SeanW · 22-05-2006 11:29pm

Zhane wrote:

Anyone know what lines will be getting these new Mark IVs Intercities? Will the Rosslare line get one cos on the timetable it says its an intercity service but its a commuter train. We had an old intercity train before we got a commuter. And the commuter trains are not very comfortable for a 2 and a half hour journey!

Rosslare line end-to-end timings are in the 3 hour range.

And as for IEs schedule, of course they CALL it an "Intercity" service but put low grade commuter railcars on it.

They did the same with the Sligo line.

This was a strategic decision by IE to slip in these rubbish trains and hope the people of Wicklow, Wexford, Longford, Leitrim and Sligo are too much stupid culchies to know the difference. Either that or they tried to kill both lines. Or they're just plain grossly incompetent.

Says a lot about Irish Rail's "management."

DerekP11 · 23-05-2006 12:25am

SeanW wrote:

Rosslare line end-to-end timings are in the 3 hour range.

And as for IEs schedule, of course they CALL it an "Intercity" service but put low grade commuter railcars on it.

They did the same with the Sligo line.

This was a strategic decision by IE to slip in these rubbish trains and hope the people of Wicklow, Wexford, Longford, Leitrim and Sligo are too much stupid culchies to know the difference. Either that or they tried to kill both lines. Or they're just plain grossly incompetent.

Says a lot about Irish Rail's "management."

Until last Summer, things looked very bleak for the Sligo and Rosslare lines. Sean is right that commuter railcars were put on these lines and passed off as new trains. P11 had a very vocal discussion about this with IE last year. At the time it was anticipated that at least one set of the new Intercity DMU'S on order (not to be confused with new Cork trains) would be deployed on the Sligo line. However things improved drastically, when believe it or not, an underspend by the NRA was realocated to IE and they ordered further Intercity DMU sets for the Sligo and Rosslare lines. So by 2008 every line in the country should have proper trains to suit the journey, that are new or nearly new.

Going back to the new trains, one of which started today. IE originally said that they would operate all Cork services and "key" Galway and Limerick services. I believe they should stick to this policy when all trains are in service until the arrival of the new stock. Galway and Limerick passengers deserve a chance to sample them as they are the next busiest intercity lines out of heuston. But knowing IE as I do, it won't happen and they'll deny they ever said they would do it, even as they look at their original press release.

As for the new trains on order for the Sligo, Westport, Galway, Limerick, Kerry, Waterford and Rosslare lines, they look equally as nice as the train introduced today. But we'll have to wait until they arrive and enter service to make a real judgement.

Regardless of all the new trains being introduced, journey times will be more or less the same as they are now. Meanwhile the road building goes on making the drive time quicker. I fear IE have still missed the boat.

John R · 23-05-2006 1:04am

Those tables are very small indeed.

It is a bit disappointing that there are no power sockets or audio, these are commonplace now in new builds elsewhere.

Victor · 23-05-2006 4:48am

http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0522/rail.html

Train at centre of row makes first trip
22 May 2006 19:48

The Mark 4 train at the centre of the row which left thousands of commuters stranded last week has completed its first run from Dublin to Cork.

The Spanish-built train left Heuston Station in Dublin at 9.00am this morning and arrived into Kent Station, Cork, at 11.50am.

A week ago today, the country's rail network ground to a halt after locomotive drivers in Cork refused to operate the new trains.

The drivers were demanding reduced working hours to operate them, even though the Labour Court had ruled against them last January.

The unofficial action was finally resolved when the unions and management agreed to further talks on core issues.

Although the train has the same passenger capacity as the old ones, Iarnród Éireann says the promised hourly timetable will see more people on the move.

MarkoP11 · 23-05-2006 8:14am

Should be running the 9:00 Dublin Cork (first stop Kildare) and 13:30 Cork Dubllin all this week, but its probably a permanent fixture

Lambsbread · 23-05-2006 12:41pm

What i gather from reading the posts above, is that the trains are not faster than the old trains and have the same passenger capacity. Begs the question, why the drivers want more money with less hours for driving pretty much the same trains?

popebenny16 · 23-05-2006 12:46pm

Yes, it does, dosnt it?

Ah well.................

SeanW · 23-05-2006 1:17pm

Lambsbread wrote:

What i gather from reading the posts above, is that the trains are not faster than the old trains and have the same passenger capacity. Begs the question, why the drivers want more money with less hours for driving pretty much the same trains?

Good question ...

New Mark IV's now in service

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