BESS Thread

i'm sure the other 3 jeff bessheads on this board are having the same problem

That would require me to be a) a lot more motivated, and b) a lot better informed. I know I'm picking Business and Economics courses, and doing them in such a way that I can go with a joint honour if I can overcome my antipathy towards macroeconomics (my love for micro is keeping me in there for now). I know I want to do psychology on a broad curriculum. I know I want to keep up French. I'll work out the specifics somewhere around May 12th.

BBS = whore to the financial world...I mean you'll be doing a business job, shaking hands and inventing words like shoppertainment and craptastic

That sounds pretty damn good to me. Actualise your business potential, max to the envelope, and such.

Economic Analysis
Monetary and Welfare Economics
Industrial Economics
Economics of Less Developed Countries
Econometrics.

The bits in bold are heavier than the rest of the text.

To begin, I'd like to point ou that I had an absolutely perfect reply to this thread written, and, then, I accidentally closed the window I was working in, only to lose it all. Stupid right-click mouse button... So, here is its less than perfect sequel.

Bartronilic wrote:

Where can I get help on this, my problem is and i'm sure the other 3 jeff bessheads on this board are having the same problem - is a BBS or BA degree better?

This really depends on what you want. The BBS is, of course, a pure Business course, whereas the BA (Mod.) combines other subjects too, either collectively (with each other or with Business) or on their own. The BBS is really the one, for which to opt, if you're dying to get a job in Merrill Lynch, Goldman Sachs or Ernst and Young. It's also the course to do, if you're thinking of becoming a chartered accountant. Business and Economics is a popular combination, with substantial economies of scale between the subjects, notably in industrial organisation, market structure and company forms. Business and Sociology is usually chosen by people who want to do Buisness, but feel ethically challenged by that, so pick Sociology as well. Again, there are certain economies of scale in the social area of Business and certain industry theories. Business and Politics has no real cross-over, so I'd only recommend this, if you're really interested in Politics. Politics and Sociology is a course, to which I never gave any thought, so I'm not going to start now. Of course, there are also single honours courses in Economics (yay!), Sociology and Political Science.

And another problem is that I don't know whther I should keep on maths/stats and economic, maths is unbelievably easy this year but only cos of the lecturers (apart from signing into lectures so annoying, do they even check?)

Thankfully, second year spells the end of having to sign an attendance sheet in lectures. You will still be signing them in some tutorials though. Senior Freshman Statistics is nothing much more than what you'll have done in first year, with regression analysis being the only significant new area of study. Senior Freshamn Maths isn't too bad either, especially if you find this year's course "unbelievably easy"!

Black_Couch wrote:

The other 1, I'm not sure. No idea what the Economy, Enviornment, and Space course is like. Complete lack of information on it and also on the Non-Profit Organising which I'll prob do.

The BESS people, who take the Geography course, to whom I've spoken about it, all speak of it very positively. In fact, they all enjoy it immensely. Isn't "Non-Profit Organising" a Senior Sophister Business course with Dr. Gemma Donnelly-Cox?

Bartronilic wrote:

Ye i was thinking of doing the geography one u mentioned and a random sociology one jut for the hell of it.

This is not a good idea. Remember that your sixth course will take up a sixth of your time and effort, and that it will count for a sixth of your grade. It's not a good idea to pick just any old thing and say it will be all right. Speaking to those, who do Sociology in my year, they say it becomes very difficult and tedious, with hours upon hours of reading to be completed every week.

Angry Banana wrote:

Personally, I have come to despise business and all its buzzwordy nonsense. The business school is, essentially, a glorified technical school which teaches you how to do a trade. If that's your thing, you're well set for that.

This is unfortunate but true. Many Senior Freshman Business students complain of an overload of buzzwords. Seemingly, it gets on their nerves.

myself, europerson and our third muskateer are all doing single honour economics. Europerson, being the mathematical whizz he is, is gearing towards a quantitive bent (hehe I love that phrase) of the subject; whereas I'll take a more general route.

If you're good at Maths and found Maths & Stats enjoyable this year you should contemplate keeping on economics at the very least. It is the most (read only) mathematical subject in the course and mathematical economists can demand significant salaries when they get out. Then again, so do Finance whores.

I don't think I'm a mathematical whizz somehow. Being greedy for a moment, in order to command a good salary once you leave College, you need to take as many Maths-related courses as possible. People of a "quantitative bent", as Enda (and Dr. Somerville) call them, are the most sought-after Economics graduates, but if one can't handle the maths, then one can't handle it, so there's no point in sacrificing one's degree over it. Maths reallly is very important though, especially if you want a successful career in economics. People like Ian, who study pure Maths, are definitely going to using the 42% ratio more than the 20% one, if you get my drift.

As well as this, if you're contemplating postgraduate work in Economics, then a selection of mathematical courses is necessary. It is important to note too that a degree in Business probably won't get you into an Economics postgrad, while an Economics degree would easily get you onto an MBA programme (with scientists and engineers).

It's worth noting too that, in third year, Politics courses become rather Maths-based, with mathematical models to explain voter behaviour, etc.

I'd suggest you keep your options open and do BU2510 (Operations + Marketing), BU2520 (Accounting, by a fancier name), EC2010 (Intermediate Economics), EC2020 (Economy of Ireland), EC2040 (Mathematical and Statistical Methods) and A.N. Other.

A very good combination to keep one's options open.

Personally, I loved the Introduction to Law course, and found it quite easy.

Law is an excellent course, if you're into that kind of thing. It comes highly recommended by all who study it.

Europerson loved Economics of Public Policy with our beloved Dr. Barrett (mentioned in great detail in another thread), but be warned, he will make you want to eat unemployed people.

He's not that bad: he just wants to kill off old people, because they cost us money and contribute nothing to the economy! The Economics of Public Policy is another good course, especially if you're into forming your own opinions on issues of political economy and public policy. You won't be spoon-fed anything in this course, so it's up to yourself to develop your own style. The lectures are hilariously funny, and Dr. Barrett is friendly and approachable.

Angry Banana wrote:

I mean you'll be doing a business job, shaking hands and inventing words like shoppertainment and craptastic.

Two classic examples of the contents of a Business student's vocabulary!

shay_562 wrote:

I know I'm picking Business and Economics courses, and doing them in such a way that I can go with a joint honour if I can overcome my antipathy towards macroeconomics (my love for micro is keeping me in there for now). I know I want to do psychology on a broad curriculum. I know I want to keep up French.

This combination is possible by picking: BU2510, BU2520, EC2010, EC2020, EC2040 and French, and by doing Psychology as an optional subject. The only thing is your Psychology grade won't count towards your overall grade in this instance. If you're sitting Schols, Psychology won't count either.

I'll work out the specifics somewhere around May 12th.

Don't leave it that late! Make sure to think carefully and coherently about your course choices.

europerson wrote:

This really depends on what you want. The BBS is, of course, a pure Business course, whereas the BA (Mod.) combines other subjects too, either collectively (with each other or with Business) or on their own. The BBS is really the one, for which to opt, if you're dying to get a job in Merrill Lynch, Goldman Sachs or Ernst and Young. It's also the course to do, if you're thinking of becoming a chartered accountant. Business and Economics is a popular combination, with substantial economies of scale between the subjects, notably in industrial organisation, market structure and company forms. Business and Sociology is usually chosen by people who want to do Buisness, but feel ethically challenged by that, so pick Sociology as well. Again, there are certain economies of scale in the social area of Business and certain industry theories. Business and Politics has no real cross-over, so I'd only recommend this, if you're really interested in Politics. Politics and Sociology is a course, to which I never gave any thought, so I'm not going to start now. Of course, there are also single honours courses in Economics (yay!), Sociology and Political Science.

well to be the last jf BESS person here to get my say in on course choices, the only combination which wasnt mentioned by europerson well aside from contemporary european intergration which sounds a bit like ES for peoeel who ended up in BESS, and i have no choice basically my six subjects are predefined so that at the end of 2nd year i can do single honours Economcis, single honours Politics or a joint honours, and im the only one not doing business which shocks me as it is already more than clear that business is a load of BS filled with buzz words and theories which have been proven not to work in reality. and its very anicdotal.

Black_Couch wrote:

The economy of Ireland - can anybody give me an outline of this course?

The course is delivered in two modules, each by two different lecturers: Dr. Carol Newman and Prof. John O'Hagan. This is the key text-book: it's edited by the lecturers, so it's all relevant and useful.

The first part of the course (with Dr. Newman) is basically an historical account of the Irish economy from about the seventeenth century to the present day. Thereafter, this section moves on to cover issues such as the government share in the economy, taxation, social partnership, equity, price stability, competiveness, and full employment of resources.

The second part of the course (with Prof. O'Hagan) examines the attainment of economic objectives and Ireland and the resultant policy problems surrounding them. Topics covered here include: population, employment and unemployment, economic growth, inequality, trade, the open economy, Irish markets and monopolies, competition policy, education, agriculture, food safety and rural development.

There is a term test at the end of both Michaelmas Term and Hilary Term. These are each worth 25% of your overall grade. The annual examination accounts for the remaining 50%. The exams aren't easy, both in terms of time and content.

The tutorials for the course are a bit boring, and the teaching assistants are woeful. I really don't know where they were found. There are two lectures and one tutorial a week. There are no tutorials in Trinity Term.

I do remember hearing somewhere that the Economics faculty/school? was better recognised than any of the other schools.

It's the Department of Economics, and, yes, it is better recognised than the other departments in the faculty.

Regarding Economy of Ireland, I did it back in the day, but not way back in the day (2003/2004), when it was just Dr. Newman. Thought it was a very interesting course, it has something in it for everyone. It's an economics subject which can be quite descriptive, if you want it to be. Prof. O'Hagan is a fairly interesting person, and while I have never had him as a lecturer, I have heard great things about him. I think that possibly Professor O'Hagan will be teaching the whole course next year.

I did Economics and Politics, with a little law thrown in. While there have been some changes in the course, I would also agree with those who encourage taking the law option. Does anyone know if International Law is still available in 3rd year? I loved that course, by far the most interesting subject I've taken in my four years.

Regarding life after college, I would suggest that four years has a long enough discount rate. If you really don't like economics, don't do it because you think you'll get a better job using it for the rest of your life. Try and choose what interests you, with at most an eye on the subject choices for next year. For grad options in economics, Econometrics is definitely almost certainly required. I didn't take Maths (3rd year) or Quants (4th), but I believe I'd be ok for entry into most courses. (As in I know I'd be ok for any courses that I am aware of). Entry is not the same as surviving a course. For the more MSc rather than MA/MLit types of courses, I think that these courses would certainly stand to you. That said, why do something just because it will stand to you, even if you don't like it?

Select what you feel will interest you the most, and try and run with it. A good final result may well be the goal, but the best way to achieve this is to try and find the issues that you're passionate about (not bored senseless by).

shay_562 wrote:

I know I'm picking Business and Economics courses, and doing them in such a way that I can go with a joint honour if I can overcome my antipathy towards macroeconomics (my love for micro is keeping me in there for now).

Seriously stick with it. I was in the exact same situation. after the micro secti
on I was sure I wanted to do economics then when I started Macro I absolutely hated it (Im sure Begg is actually a pseudynom(sp?) for satan:) ). Anyway I was almost all but done with the economics idea as macro is half the subject and if you hate it theres no point. eventually I decided to stick it out and it is one of the best decisions i ever made. I am now 100% sure I want to do economics (In sf many actually find macro better then micro:p ). I have also grown to absolutely hate business, Accountancy aint too bad but that bloody marketing course has been one of the worse experiences of my life. And ops management was just as bad, strategic service vison, service system design yadda yadda yadda (although the lecturer is pretty good for ops)

what I did in sf is I kept my options open for single honours economics, single hon business or a joint honor bus and ec and Id advise anyone to do this (unless you like sociology or pol sci). I dont think your really equipped to make a decision after jf bess so I wouldnt do anything to hasty, keep as many options open as possible.

As for my js choices:
1. Economic analysis
2. Econometrics
3. Applied finance
4. Investment analysis
5. Mathemathical economics

The only one im not 100% on is mathematical economics. Im worried it will be a very difficult subject and although I am good at maths and actually find it interesting and enjoy it(NERD!) I am by no means a whizz at it. Anyone wish to offer their thoughts on it?

europerson wrote:

The tutorials for the course are a bit boring, and the teaching assistants are woeful. I really don't know where they were found.

Kevin uses his DIT email address, so that explains a lot.

I'm having second thoughts about Industrial Economics now. Maybe I ought to do Investment Analysis: it looks like fun. No, wait, I want to do Industrial: it looks like fun... Oh...

Right_Side and Babybing, what made you pick Investment Analysis?

Angry Banana wrote:

Kevin uses his DIT email address, so that explains a lot.

I was trying to be subtle.