Moved back to Ireland and questioning it!

catbear · 24-02-2015 11:41am

For what it's worth Manchester is a good destination for work, visited last year as a potential next move after Australia, plenty of work and with my wife planning on retraining there's plenty of options there.

I'd been to Australia before and only came back for the work so haven't really struggled with the decision to leave although if it had been new Zealand I would have conflicted feelings.

Loads of Irish friends planning on heading off in the near future, plenty gone already.

The big difference between emigration now and 20 years ago is communications, now you don't have to dive in as much as you did in past. I was talking with a English couple who came here 15 years ago who swore that for the first two years they wouldn't talk about home but try to make friends asap, join clubs etc.. They love it here now and won't go back.

That was a conscious decision to move to Australia whereas for many here it was where the work was at. I'm happy with a potential move to the UK in the near future and have zero reservations about leaving OZ.

Besides the way things have gone recently in WA I won't be surprised if tougher job conditions make some peoples decision to quit OZ a lot easier.

Middle Man · 24-02-2015 2:19pm

acb wrote: »

As the title says...we moved home 4 weeks ago yday after being in Australia 2.5 years and while its great seeing everyone, I think Id rather have stayed. We were in Mornington , Melbourne and I loved it...husband didn't though. I had really settled , made great friends, knew the schools the kids would start next year etc

Back now and finding it grime here. Go for a walk and you have to keep watching out for Dog crap everywhere..really annoys me. I have a poo brush for the pram- how gross is that! Grown men discard litter without a second thought. It make me question why am I telling my 3 yo to put his rubbish in his pocket until he finds a bin.
What strikes me is everywhere looks like it needs money spent on it. I guess thats the recession.
Maybe its the time of year or me projecting my feelings, but people seem like they're having a hard tough life.
Since we got back its a struggle. I don't do anything- stuck inside with the kids. In Oz I was always out. I dint think twice about heading out with the 2 kids for a walk someplace.

Probably should say what brought us back..well husband got 2 job offers in the same week, a job in Melbourne CBD and another one- a permanent job in Ireland so we came back. We left in the first place because of 'natural wastage', husband lost his job so we applied for skilled visa for Australia.

Its so hard to know, Sorry I know my post is a long whingy ramble.
Im just feeling unsettled...people don't understand unless they've gone through it themselves.

The system here is rotten - this country no longer serves its people - if it ever did that is. What we need is that get that right wing waste of space in Leinster House out - that's FF, FG & Lab. They put business interests first and the people can go to hell. What we also need is a second republic with a new constitution centered on social decencies.

1. Housing - Our property system is IMO a recreation of the landlord system run by cold hearted individuals - we need a new efficient delivery mechanism for housing administered by a central state body. We also need baseline price regulation where for example, the price of a basic 3 bed house is strictly regulated and subject to stringent standards and quotas. The market forces can kick in for properties beyond the basic specs - it should act as a benchmarking mechanism.

2. Health - Our health system seems corrupted by arrogant professionals who frequently screw up and get away with it (the taxpayer pays when they don't) - these individuals IMO should be rendered personally liable for any willful neglect of patients - I think that would change attitudes a bit. Paperwork also needs to be curtailed so that staff at hospitals are not excessively tied up. We still don't have a proper children's hospital.

3. Social Well Being - Politicians frequently boast about how well they're doing and relentlessly spiel off economic statistics. However, there's this Asian country called Bhutan where there is a performance indicator known as 'Gross National Happiness' - I seriously doubt that our politicians would do too well there! :rolleyes: I propose a similar indicator for this country: National Social Well Being Index (NSWI). I guess such a move would lead to a major reappraisal of policies in many areas - many of today's policies are greatly exacerbating the level of stress and anger in our society. The latest is of course the proposed withdrawal of bus services from rural areas on top of the closure of post offices and garda stations.

4. Freedom of Expression - A mature society should tolerate individual choice. No man or woman should be subject to negative comments on the street relating to their expression, appearance, gender, religion or orientation. Also, I think we should do away with fashion and fads and completely modernize retail practice by way of comprehensive product choice for people. TV programmes that dictate how people should act, think and present themselves should be banned on the grounds of freedom of expression.

5. Freedom of Movement - There needs to be an end to the relentless attack on the movement of people - of course, I'm referring to wide sweeping anti-car policies instead of proper planning and regulation of transport. Politicians here are so keen to get people out of their cars (autocracy I'd call that) and force them to cycle etc. Long promised rail projects are on the back burner yet again (Dublin still has no Metro) while many bus services are being pulled. Frequent and reliable transport services do attract a lot of people - look at the LUAS for example. Also, if we're to reduce CO2, then politicians need to get a lot smarter and start with the simpler things like discouraging the purchase of gas guzzlers, the provision of more park and ride facilities, changing of pricing structure to encourage more public transport usage during the day etc. Current transport policy in urban areas is nothing more than a hammer and six inch nail job - it won't work!

...need to go now

catbear · 24-02-2015 5:04pm

Middle Man wrote: »

TV programmes that dictate how people should act, think and present themselves should be banned on the grounds of freedom of expression.

Isn't the act of banning perpetuating that? Given the freedom of choice the first thing people do is imitate eachother.

Middle Man wrote:

However, there's this Asian country called Bhutan where there is a performance indicator known as 'Gross National Happiness' - I seriously doubt that our politicians would do too well there!

Bhutanese sound soooo happy... (from a wiki)

In 1989 the government elevated the status of the dress code from recommended to mandatory. Afterward, all citizens were required to observe the dress code in public during business hours. This decree was resented by Lhotshampas in the southern lowlands who voiced complaints about being forced to wear the clothing of the Ngalop people. 80,000 Bhutanese refugees now reside in refugee camps in Nepal.

It's like how North Korea is a workers paradise as unemployment is illegal.

Traveling and working abroad can if you're inclined amplify the negatives over the positives of where you're from but perspective works both ways.

Some of the points you've raised Middle Man happen here too, especially in housing. Landlords can divert income tax towards shortfalls in rental income, the last estimate I saw from the ATO had 1.2million australian PAYG workers divert tax under Negative Gearing. (Australian population is just over 22m!)

That's a lot of non performing property investments being accommodated by everyone else, including first time buyers trying to save while renting property form landlords that they're subsidising! It's been going on since the mid 80s but no one here seems too upset about it, they don't see any problem with it!!!! Insane.

However Middle Man where you would love Australia, especially Perth, is for its car culture where taking public transport can be viewed as some sort of punishment! It's hilarious to hear some Aussie talk about how dangerous taking the train is when really they're some of safest I've ever been on anywhere!

The world is wide and we have a lot more options these days than decades ago when the emigrant masses would assemble in social clubs reminiscing about the auld sod as their lives became more rooted to their new countries.

Now emigration is easier, work for a while, get bored, move home, get bored, move elsewhere, get bored, move again.....

Middle Man · 24-02-2015 7:14pm

catbear wrote: »

<snip> However Middle Man where you would love Australia, especially Perth, is for its car culture where taking public transport can be viewed as some sort of punishment! It's hilarious to hear some Aussie talk about how dangerous taking the train is when really they're some of safest I've ever been on anywhere! <snip>

Where did I say that public transport was a bad thing???

What's funny is that I take the train to work!

Middle Man · 24-02-2015 7:38pm

catbear wrote: »

Isn't the act of banning perpetuating that? Given the freedom of choice the first thing people do is imitate each other.

Well, you could say that banning content that promotes gay bashing, genocide, and other fascism like euthanizing people with disability etc is a denial of the right to express an opinion etc. Of course, people do have a right to express themselves, but not to an extent that threaten or undermine other groups of people. That's called bullying!

Of course, that's the wide end of the wedge, but what I'm really saying is that fashion programmes that tell people what not to wear for example is interfering with the rights of any person to go out and express him/herself as he/she sees fit. Given that there's people like me who don't like being told what to wear coupled with the fact that the fashion industry seems to enforce their desires through ridicule on the street, that is bullying - there's no other word for it!

People only have as many rights as they can assume without interfering with the rights of others!

As for people imitating each other, it's a case of social indoctrination - that 1970's song by Pink Floyd - The Wall (Part 2) Another Brick in the Wall - raises a lot of valid points about the social homogenizing process in education systems (some videos of that song really makes this clear) and how individuality is beaten out of people. People should try and think for themselves rather than taking what's fed to them by the system - sure that's how the Church controlled this country for so long.

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:02pm

6ix wrote: »

I guess this thread resonates with anyone who's moved this far from home, but I think in particular there was a spike in Irish moving to Australia in 2009-2011. Those who stayed are at the 4/5/6 year mark and probably considering their options.

I'm one of those, although not planning any move just yet. I'm eligible for citizenship later this year,so I'm definitely getting that and I'll consider my options after that. I know that my girlfriend and I de

With regards to super, I never get that argument of 'losing' it if you're PR or a citizen. Yes, you can't access it straight away, but you'll need a pension for retirement anyway and you can just access it at your preservation age like everyone else in Australia.

Good luck to those making decisions!

Its important to cancel any extra charges attached to you super... insurance, assurance etc. And monitor it to see how much tax is taken each year. And you can always keep paying into it too!

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:17pm

Undertow wrote: »

That's an interesting point, and maybe you're right! I think people will always have the question hanging over them after a few years abroad though, and maybe just need confirmation that Ireland is no longer the country it once was, and you're better off in this part of the world! Deep down we probably suspect this, but to satisfy ourselves that we give things a go back there.

How about England? Surely the economy is doing better there, much more of a buzz about the place, better career prospects and money, and still close enough to head home for an odd weekend here and there? I think its the distance away from home that bugs people the most about Oz & NZ. If we could get home a bit more often, there would be a lot more people willing to set up camp here for good I reckon!

Well I have definitely got the confirmation I need but i'm still going to give it a fair go. Will stay at least a year to make sure. Would you believe my original plan was to move to london "not home but close enough and ive close family there" was my reasoning. I spent a month there and to be honest after living Melbourne for so long i couldnt justify the wages vs the rent! Suppose Melbourne doesnt win most livable city in the world every year for no reason! Being used to having a brand new apartment on the beach 10 mins from city with amazing views and lots of space for half the price of a really old apartment in some subarb in london was sort of a deal breaker! Of course its not all about money either but adding a 3rd country into the mix was just not good for me! In my line of work im much better off financially in ireland. Its just melbourne... it takes your heart!!

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:28pm

seachto7 wrote: »

@CB19135. I have been to Aus and NZ, and while there are many advantages, the distance, I think, could eventually cause problems.

I'm only basing it on cousins of mine who have had to make the lonely trip home for funerals and the likes.

I know one person in particular who moved over for work (or the dole queue here), but the distance often gets to them.
It's all about what you make it as well.

I know other people over there for work who give out about the Aussies every other day. I know other people there who have embraced the lifestyle, and won't be coming back.

I even emailed someone recently I know in Perth, and based on their FB updates and photos, life looked to be progressing nicely for them. Kids, a new house etc, but when they emailed, they said they had no firm plans to settle there. They weren't totally 100% sold on it.

I know, if I was there, I'd do my best to surround myself with like minded people most of the time.

While I may well be able to go to the UK, Aus has crossed my mind too. But I tend to think ahead. it's all hypothetical, but I often think of things like "What if I met someone and got married in Australia?" Relations getting old etc. Those kind of things. I suppose you have to live life for yourself, and not for others eventually.

It's interesting to read people's thoughts on this, as it's something I have thought about over and over.

I suppose my loose plan was to look for jobs close to home, then start casting the net further afield. Aus has to be on that radar now.

If I were 22, I'd go. Nothing to lose. I wouldn't be thinking of distance, family, deaths, relatives, at that age. I'd just want the craic. Maybe it gets harder as you get older?

You don't tend to meet many Irish who have done long stints down under, who have come back to Ireland to settle. I don't anyway.

Its only a day away!
Ya everyone has their own lives.

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:33pm

Dunno how I'd handle the weather and the notorious pessimistic attitude of the Irish after being so long away though, I think it could crack me up

Ha ha the weather is a breeze here in comparison to the pessimism!

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:37pm

Undertow wrote: »

Christ on a bike- $60-70K AFTER travelling?? Good on you. I'd be hoping to have between $20K & $30K put aside for job-hunting, but I'm a bit nervous about that figure as I know how quickly it can slip through your fingers. I'm also in the Construction industry and work is scarce in that field also! The last thing I want is to be heading back to Mammy's with my tail between my legs penniless after travelling the globe and job hunting to no avail after 6 months. My worst nightmare haha!

Especially if your there.more than 2 years and even your car insurance is over 2k!

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:44pm

kilo6 wrote: »

Well after spending 5 months in Ireland it only confirms our decision to emigrate to America 20 years ago. A point running through this thread seems to be the loss of family by being away. Well modern internet service makes communication easy that is if you are lucky enough to have it in rural Ireland where it is a joke. I and my irish friends speak fondly of the one or two telephone calls from ireland from said loving family a year. When questioned about this they say oh sure the cost of it and sure you were the ones that left.
The oppurtunities that my wife and kids have availed themselves would never in a million years be available here in ireland. Im back tending to things now for a little while and cannot wait to get back to my home in the USA. I did look into maybe trying to settle back here and my god the roadblocks put in front of you is amazing. Try getting an irish driving licence for one. Makes me laugh these gombeen politicans acting like beggars trundling around the US looking for companies to setup in Ireland. Then when you arrive here. Interne non existent or unusable. Roads in ****e. Taxes out of control. Dole ques out the door on a tuesday by people too lazy to emigrate and get a decent life but then why should they when all you need do is put out your hand and beg.
A overbloated civil service whos main job is to protect their cushy existence. Goverment departments run amuck with rules and regulations. Unions who protect their members regardless of what cost to the common good.
Then we have the weather here pure ****e again. Ive met accountants here whos first advice to new clients is if you can emigrate.
So yes i love America and thank god that we made the decision to leave 20 years ago. As they say over there Ireland a nice place to visit but by god you wouldnt want to live there.
Another thing that riles my whiskers is from now till StPatricks day we will have to listen to gombeen politicians who have destroyed Ireland and ruined a whole generation of young people running around America blowing about how good it is here all paid by the Irish tax payer the poor ould sod.
I am in rare form here this morning as i look out at the pissing down rain. I must ckeck my return ticket. iI generally am a cheerful guy but i need to get out of here before my head expoldes.

Im laughing at that ha ha... i feel the exact same. I dont want to feel like that but every single thing you said is true! I wasnt even gone that long... 6 years. You just see it so differently when you get back.

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 10:53pm

Middle Man wrote: »

The system here is rotten - this country no longer serves its people - if it ever did that is. What we need is that get that right wing waste of space in Leinster House out - that's FF, FG & Lab. They put business interests first and the people can go to hell. What we also need is a second republic with a new constitution centered on social decencies.

1. Housing - Our property system is IMO a recreation of the landlord system run by cold hearted individuals - we need a new efficient delivery mechanism for housing administered by a central state body. We also need baseline price regulation where for example, the price of a basic 3 bed house is strictly regulated and subject to stringent standards and quotas. The market forces can kick in for properties beyond the basic specs - it should act as a benchmarking mechanism.

2. Health - Our health system seems corrupted by arrogant professionals who frequently screw up and get away with it (the taxpayer pays when they don't) - these individuals IMO should be rendered personally liable for any willful neglect of patients - I think that would change attitudes a bit. Paperwork also needs to be curtailed so that staff at hospitals are not excessively tied up. We still don't have a proper children's hospital.

3. Social Well Being - Politicians frequently boast about how well they're doing and relentlessly spiel off economic statistics. However, there's this Asian country called Bhutan where there is a performance indicator known as 'Gross National Happiness' - I seriously doubt that our politicians would do too well there! :rolleyes: I propose a similar indicator for this country: National Social Well Being Index (NSWI). I guess such a move would lead to a major reappraisal of policies in many areas - many of today's policies are greatly exacerbating the level of stress and anger in our society. The latest is of course the proposed withdrawal of bus services from rural areas on top of the closure of post offices and garda stations.

4. Freedom of Expression - A mature society should tolerate individual choice. No man or woman should be subject to negative comments on the street relating to their expression, appearance, gender, religion or orientation. Also, I think we should do away with fashion and fads and completely modernize retail practice by way of comprehensive product choice for people. TV programmes that dictate how people should act, think and present themselves should be banned on the grounds of freedom of expression.

5. Freedom of Movement - There needs to be an end to the relentless attack on the movement of people - of course, I'm referring to wide sweeping anti-car policies instead of proper planning and regulation of transport. Politicians here are so keen to get people out of their cars (autocracy I'd call that) and force them to cycle etc. Long promised rail projects are on the back burner yet again (Dublin still has no Metro) while many bus services are being pulled. Frequent and reliable transport services do attract a lot of people - look at the LUAS for example. Also, if we're to reduce CO2, then politicians need to get a lot smarter and start with the simpler things like discouraging the purchase of gas guzzlers, the provision of more park and ride facilities, changing of pricing structure to encourage more public transport usage during the day etc. Current transport policy in urban areas is nothing more than a hammer and six inch nail job - it won't work!

...need to go now

Then tv here alone would make you want to get out I'm not sure if it was always like this or more noticable when you've lived away. Documentaries on abuse, mother and baby homes, abortion, homelessness, the banking crisis, the recession, water charges, the hardship in rural ireland... but if you get bored with that sure you can always switch over to At home with the Healy Reas ha ha

mikom · 24-02-2015 11:02pm

CB19135 wrote: »

Then tv here alone would make you want to get out I'm not sure if it was always like this or more noticable when you've lived away. Documentaries on abuse, mother and baby homes, abortion, homelessness, the banking crisis, the recession, water charges, the hardship in rural ireland... but if you get bored with that sure you can always switch over to At home with the Healy Reas ha ha

If it's TV you are travelling for then Oz is not the place to visit.

CB19135 · 24-02-2015 11:04pm

mikom wrote: »

If it's TV you are travelling for then Oz is not the place to visit.

You dont need to watch it in Oz coz there is so much else to do ha ha

Electric Sheep · 24-02-2015 11:37pm

kilo6 wrote: »

I and my irish friends speak fondly of the one or two telephone calls from ireland from said loving family a year. When questioned about this they say oh sure the cost of it and sure you were the ones that left.
.

So true - I think my mother called me 5 times in 20 years. The phone is a one way instrument with my family, but if you went a week without calling them you were the worst in the world.

Undertow · 24-02-2015 11:47pm

CB19135 wrote: »

You dont need to watch it in Oz coz there is so much else to do ha ha

That's so true! The only reason I watched TV in Oz was to catch the Premiership at stupid o'clock... Since I've been in NZ I haven't even bothered with a Sky box! I can watch all my football online now. But yeah, people back home tend to watch soooooo much TV compared to over here, but that's just down to the weather really I guess. Thats the one thing that I'd miss the most when I make the move I think- the outdoor lifestyle!

So has Ireland got anything going for it I wonder? It appears not after going through this thread!!

AngryHippie · 25-02-2015 12:04am

CB19135 wrote: »

Im laughing at that ha ha... i feel the exact same. I dont want to feel like that but every single thing you said is true! I wasnt even gone that long... 6 years. You just see it so differently when you get back.

I was already wound up about all of that shite when I left in '08. I don't think any of it has improved. I'm not sure if I have the patience for it.

Traumadoc · 25-02-2015 12:18am

acb wrote: »

As the title says...we moved home 4 weeks ago yday after being in Australia 2.5 years and while its great seeing everyone, I think Id rather have stayed. We were in Mornington , Melbourne and I loved it...husband didn't though. I had really settled , made great friends, knew the schools the kids would start next year etc

Back now and finding it grime here. Go for a walk and you have to keep watching out for Dog crap everywhere..really annoys me. I have a poo brush for the pram- how gross is that! Grown men discard litter without a second thought. It make me question why am I telling my 3 yo to put his rubbish in his pocket until he finds a bin.
What strikes me is everywhere looks like it needs money spent on it. I guess thats the recession.
Maybe its the time of year or me projecting my feelings, but people seem like they're having a hard tough life.
Since we got back its a struggle. I don't do anything- stuck inside with the kids. In Oz I was always out. I dint think twice about heading out with the 2 kids for a walk someplace.

Probably should say what brought us back..well husband got 2 job offers in the same week, a job in Melbourne CBD and another one- a permanent job in Ireland so we came back. We left in the first place because of 'natural wastage', husband lost his job so we applied for skilled visa for Australia.

Its so hard to know, Sorry I know my post is a long whingy ramble.
Im just feeling unsettled...people don't understand unless they've gone through it themselves.

I spent 5 years in Australia, and loved the life there, when I got back to Ireland , I hated it , a lot had to do with being stuck indoors the whole time . I got quite down about the return.
However when Summer came I realized what a great place Ireland is. The long evenings here are fantastic and there is a lot to do if you make an effort.

I have no regrets about returning.

Electric Sheep · 25-02-2015 12:54am

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

What part of America are you living in? Florida or Cali I hope

Well, I am guessing he is not in Massachusets:pac:

cerastes · 25-02-2015 1:38am

bladebrew wrote: »

The insurance is so high because after 2 years your NCB is basically gone, those prices are with no NCB, your 5 years might be intact but they are not taken into account, this problem seems to be mentioned a lot as people move home after years away,

Any excuse to screw people is all they need.

kilo6 wrote: »

Well after spending 5 months in Ireland it only confirms our decision to emigrate to America 20 years ago. A point running through this thread seems to be the loss of family by being away. Well modern internet service makes communication easy that is if you are lucky enough to have it in rural Ireland where it is a joke. I and my irish friends speak fondly of the one or two telephone calls from ireland from said loving family a year. When questioned about this they say oh sure the cost of it and sure you were the ones that left.
The oppurtunities that my wife and kids have availed themselves would never in a million years be available here in ireland. Im back tending to things now for a little while and cannot wait to get back to my home in the USA. I did look into maybe trying to settle back here and my god the roadblocks put in front of you is amazing. Try getting an irish driving licence for one. Makes me laugh these gombeen politicans acting like beggars trundling around the US looking for companies to setup in Ireland. Then when you arrive here. Interne non existent or unusable. Roads in ****e. Taxes out of control. Dole ques out the door on a tuesday by people too lazy to emigrate and get a decent life but then why should they when all you need do is put out your hand and beg.
A overbloated civil service whos main job is to protect their cushy existence. Goverment departments run amuck with rules and regulations. Unions who protect their members regardless of what cost to the common good.
Then we have the weather here pure ****e again. Ive met accountants here whos first advice to new clients is if you can emigrate.
So yes i love America and thank god that we made the decision to leave 20 years ago. As they say over there Ireland a nice place to visit but by god you wouldnt want to live there.
Another thing that riles my whiskers is from now till StPatricks day we will have to listen to gombeen politicians who have destroyed Ireland and ruined a whole generation of young people running around America blowing about how good it is here all paid by the Irish tax payer the poor ould sod.
I am in rare form here this morning as i look out at the pissing down rain. I must ckeck my return ticket. iI generally am a cheerful guy but i need to get out of here before my head expoldes.

I agree with a lot of what you say there, except the bolded part, its isnt necessarily easy or possible to up sticks for a number of reasons. Negative equity for one, lack of jobs is hardly the fault of the people that are unemployed, but I agree I wasnt happy to be in those ques with some of the sorts there. Reading this thread I wish Id jumped ship but I never realised it was going down the swany, at this point, Id nearly say Im too old hitting the 4-0 but without a degree, Im not sure Id have much more luck away than here.
Always did think Id end up moving to the US, but in ways Im glad I didnt for the fearful things you hear about healthcare, but do consider Id prefer the lifestyle in those places than the Irish one, and of course theres the gombeen men and women and those that vote for them.

Noo · 25-02-2015 4:18am

Traumadoc wrote: »

I spent 5 years in Australia, and loved the life there, when I got back to Ireland , I hated it , a lot had to do with being stuck indoors the whole time . I got quite down about the return.
However when Summer came I realized what a great place Ireland is. The long evenings here are fantastic and there is a lot to do if you make an effort.

I have no regrets about returning.

This I think will be me upon my return. After doing little trips or going for nature walks at weekends here in Australia, it has actually made me realise how much Ireland also has to offer...if you made the effort. Living there you're just not bothered and don't appreciate it but when I go back i'll definitely be hitting up some of irelands scenic places at the weekends, driving across ireland just for a day is childs play now!

seachto7 · 25-02-2015 12:43pm

Often wonder if Ireland had better weather, would people take Australia over it?
I also wonder what people in London or Manchester or Brighton's experiences are like? Is it the same as someone from Tralee, or Galway, or Sligo who is in Australia?
I would also imagine that possibly Australia makes people appreciate the outdoors more? There is a lot to do outdoors in Ireland if you can get over the weather. Good waterproof clothing will sort that out.
You could be surfing in the Atlantic every other weekend on empty beaches in a wetsuit if you wanted to. It might be cold and raining, but that's what a wetsuit is for, and a shark won't get you either!
Pros and cons.....
Was there a time in the recent past where the money was really good in Australia, but the cost of living increased in the meantime.
I have relatives there in WA, who have done very well since they went over there 30+ years ago. I don't think they could have ended up with the same lifestyle if they had stayed in Ireland.

catbear · 25-02-2015 1:21pm

It's worthy of a pros and cons list.

Weather is a major con for Australia although a good summer in Ireland is heaven.

seachto7 · 25-02-2015 1:36pm

Extreme weather conditions is a con though. I wonder too, how someone from Spain, or the South of France, or Italy would compare the two countries. Obviously, Aus would be economically a better choice right now for many Italians!

25-02-2015 3:59pm

Just a wondering how in general in the Australian Economy ?

catbear · 25-02-2015 4:19pm

6541 wrote: »

Just a wondering how in general in the Australian Economy ?

Can only speak for Western Australia, things are slowing down here. I read a few weeks that the amount of properties on the market had increased by over 40% in one year. Rents have dropped a lot too.

A lot of people leaving, was talking to a shipping company recently and they said they were as busy exporting peoples belongings as they had been importing them back when the mining boom was at full tilt between 08-12.

There's an Australian economy thread too.

CB19135 · 25-02-2015 6:20pm

Undertow wrote: »

That's so true! The only reason I watched TV in Oz was to catch the Premiership at stupid o'clock... Since I've been in NZ I haven't even bothered with a Sky box! I can watch all my football online now. But yeah, people back home tend to watch soooooo much TV compared to over here, but that's just down to the weather really I guess. Thats the one thing that I'd miss the most when I make the move I think- the outdoor lifestyle!

So has Ireland got anything going for it I wonder? It appears not after going through this thread!!

I actually dont mean to be negative i moved home 6 months ago full of positivity! Penneys!

CB19135 · 25-02-2015 6:21pm

Undertow wrote: »

That's so true! The only reason I watched TV in Oz was to catch the Premiership at stupid o'clock... Since I've been in NZ I haven't even bothered with a Sky box! I can watch all my football online now. But yeah, people back home tend to watch soooooo much TV compared to over here, but that's just down to the weather really I guess. Thats the one thing that I'd miss the most when I make the move I think- the outdoor lifestyle!

So has Ireland got anything going for it I wonder? It appears not after going through this thread!!

I actually dont mean to be negative i moved home 6 months ago full of positivity! Was just going to make a lis.of positives and all i could think of was Penneys! Ha ha this is not good. I really want to make it work here... guess ill have to stop watching tv and go to penneys more ha ha

CB19135 · 25-02-2015 6:25pm

Traumadoc wrote: »

I spent 5 years in Australia, and loved the life there, when I got back to Ireland , I hated it , a lot had to do with being stuck indoors the whole time . I got quite down about the return.
However when Summer came I realized what a great place Ireland is. The long evenings here are fantastic and there is a lot to do if you make an effort.

I have no regrets about returning.

I hope that happens me!

CB19135 · 25-02-2015 6:29pm

cerastes wrote: »

Any excuse to screw people is all they need.

I agree with a lot of what you say there, except the bolded part, its isnt necessarily easy or possible to up sticks for a number of reasons. Negative equity for one, lack of jobs is hardly the fault of the people that are unemployed, but I agree I wasnt happy to be in those ques with some of the sorts there. Reading this thread I wish Id jumped ship but I never realised it was going down the swany, at this point, Id nearly say Im too old hitting the 4-0 but without a degree, Im not sure Id have much more luck away than here.
Always did think Id end up moving to the US, but in ways Im glad I didnt for the fearful things you hear about healthcare, but do consider Id prefer the lifestyle in those places than the Irish one, and of course theres the gombeen men and women and those that vote for them.

Its much easier to get out of negative equity when you move to a country where the government dont take every last penny from you and you can actually save... thats for sure

CB19135 · 25-02-2015 6:37pm

catbear wrote: »

Can only speak for Western Australia, things are slowing down here. I read a few weeks that the amount of properties on the market had increased by over 40% in one year. Rents have dropped a lot too.

A lot of people leaving, was talking to a shipping company recently and they said they were as busy exporting peoples belongings as they had been importing them back when the mining boom was at full tilt between 08-12.

There's an Australian economy thread too.

East Coast is much better to live. Perth is so boring, isolated and over priced.(in my opinion) I spent a year in Sydney, 3 years in Melbourne and 2 years in perth!

acb · 26-02-2015 10:08am

Traumadoc wrote: »

I spent 5 years in Australia, and loved the life there, when I got back to Ireland , I hated it , a lot had to do with being stuck indoors the whole time . I got quite down about the return.
However when Summer came I realized what a great place Ireland is. The long evenings here are fantastic and there is a lot to do if you make an effort.

I have no regrets about returning.

Really hoping this is the case!:D

In Exile · 27-02-2015 12:29am

New television series called The Returners - based on six people who return to Ireland this year from far flung places. Do you know of an Irish person that is contemplating returning home.? The program will mentor them, fix problems, find a job...

Just got sent through this on Linkedin.

Not sure if it would appeal to anyone but might be of interest to people considering going home soon

TheNewSmoo · 27-02-2015 3:36pm

Moved back to Ireland 2 years ago from having lived in Oz for 5 years and can honestly say it has been a big fat mistake. Talk about reverse culture shock! The thing is I needed to get it out of my system. I didn't want to harbour any regrets or wonder should I have come back to Ireland. I've done it now and I can clearly see that there is very little I am missing. I'm heading back to Oz in a few months time with a new found appreciation.
For a start I cannot get reused to lousy Irish weather for a start. Being stuck indoors during winter has felt like a jail sentence. Also, The fantasy of being surrounded by old friends and family is an illusion. People get bogged down in their own struggles of living in Ireland. I'd rather have a few weeks of quality time a year in Ireland than 12 months of drudgery. When you add in the high taxes, cost of living and lack of career opportunities then options and quality of life in Ireland diminish.
So it's back to Oz I go with no regrets. At least I can say I gave it another go.

CB19135 · 28-02-2015 3:11pm

TheNewSmoo wrote: »

Moved back to Ireland 2 years ago from having lived in Oz for 5 years and can honestly say it has been a big fat mistake. Talk about reverse culture shock! The thing is I needed to get it out of my system. I didn't want to harbour any regrets or wonder should I have come back to Ireland. I've done it now and I can clearly see that there is very little I am missing. I'm heading back to Oz in a few months time with a new found appreciation.
For a start I cannot get reused to lousy Irish weather for a start. Being stuck indoors during winter has felt like a jail sentence. Also, The fantasy of being surrounded by old friends and family is an illusion. People get bogged down in their own struggles of living in Ireland. I'd rather have a few weeks of quality time a year in Ireland than 12 months of drudgery. When you add in the high taxes, cost of living and lack of career opportunities then options and quality of life in Ireland diminish.
So it's back to Oz I go with no regrets. At least I can say I gave it another go.

I could have written that! What city are you going back to?

Noo · 28-02-2015 3:25pm

Dammit we need some positive stories here people!

TheNewSmoo · 28-02-2015 6:37pm

CB19135 wrote: »

I could have written that! What city are you going back to?

Spent most of my time in Perth previously but looking to head to Melbourne this time. Perth was great for what it was but it's more sedate family orientated city whereas I'm not married. I think Melbourne has a more cultured and buzzy feel. That's the plan at the mo.

Zambia · 01-03-2015 8:49am

Ireland is an awesome place to live.

I just prefer here.

In the end we all are living on easy street we are just looking for the house with the best view.

ArseBurger · 02-03-2015 12:37am

Noo wrote: »

Dammit we need some positive stories here people!

Sometimes the truth hurts.

Little Sunshine · 02-03-2015 1:05am

Some good posts on this thread - i'm here 2.5 yrs - came on PR on my own - with no family or friends - no problem getting work but the issue is that a lot of people i have met along the way have either moved interstate, overseas (NZ or Canada) or back home to Irel. Feeling pretty lonely now & finding it difficult to make new friends -constantly feel when i meet someone , how long before they leave too. I'm single mid 30's - u would think that it would be easy to make friends but couples tend to b very clicky & families tend to socialise together which i understand. So where do i fit in?
Considering relocating back to irel - have even seen some jobs which is kinda funny cause i was unemployed for a year before I left. I know my friends & family - especially my mam would be delighted if went back.
Someone once said to me that the hardest decision you will make is not leaving Irel but deciding to go back!!!!!

catbear · 02-03-2015 1:28am

Little Sunshine wrote: »

Someone once said to me that the hardest decision you will make is not leaving Irel but deciding to go back!!!!!

I've done it twice! The trick is to not think of it as for ever! So many people do. I've come and gone so many times to my hometown people don't bother asking me if I'm back for good anymore! The world is a much smaller place than when the last great migration wave back in the 80s, pre Ryanair when Aerlingus would f**k you over and expect you to say thanks!

InTheTrees · 02-03-2015 1:33am

Great thread.

I'm 20+ years in America and think about home a lot.

But I'm not sure I could endure Ireland full time.

feargale · 02-03-2015 1:54am

acb wrote: »

Its just insurance companies taking advantage.

I hope I'm not off topic, but compulsory insurance or any other legal requirement operated by private interests will always lead to the customer being screwed. You are required to insure, therefore you have no bargaining power, the insurers have you over a barrel. And in a greedy corrupt country you will be taken for a ride. Motor insurance should be nationalised. Ditto NCT. And don't start me on the privatisation of prisons

Cooperspale · 02-03-2015 6:04am

Little Sunshine wrote: »

Some good posts on this thread - i'm here 2.5 yrs - came on PR on my own - with no family or friends - no problem getting work but the issue is that a lot of people i have met along the way have either moved interstate, overseas (NZ or Canada) or back home to Irel. Feeling pretty lonely now & finding it difficult to make new friends -constantly feel when i meet someone , how long before they leave too. I'm single mid 30's - u would think that it would be easy to make friends but couples tend to b very clicky & families tend to socialise together which i understand. So where do i fit in?

I agree, some great posts here.
I also came out alone on PR, by the end of the year I've just realised, it will be 10 years!
I left Irl late Autumn & arrived for Melbourne Cup. Time of year makes a big difference and I'm not surprised original poster was feeling down leaving Oz in high summer going into Irish winter.

I never really made that many Irish friends here (it wasn't the intention) so there has been less of that loss that I had experienced years earlier as a backpacker. I understand that some of us like that link to home through other Irish people but sometimes it can be a bit of a block to settling here. Almost like a Catch-22. You want someone to understand that black sense of Irish humour sometimes & not have to explain yourself. You want a cup of tea, not Early Grey or English Breakfast or Green Sencha just tea.

I work (with the public) in St Kilda and noticed in the last 6 months there's been a bit of a shift in mindset about Irish returning home, where once it wasn't an attractive option, the shine has now worn off the Aussie life for some & things ( I hear) are picking up somewhat back home. I'm seeing either singles or Irish/Irish and they've been here 2.5-5 years & their plan was never for the long term.

Little sunshine, single mid 30's is definitely not the easiest age to find long term friends, between couples and those with young families, (either here or in Ireland) I'd think it could be the toughest time. Try dating an Aussie/non Irish if you're not already on it try meetup.com, a sports club in your area &/or consider volunteering in a local group. You have to put yourself out there which can seem like a real chore some days, to get an idea of where you'd like to fit in.

William F · 02-03-2015 7:55am

feargale wrote: »

I hope I'm not off topic, but compulsory insurance or any other legal requirement operated by private interests will always lead to the customer being screwed. You are required to insure, therefore you have no bargaining power, the insurers have you over a barrel. And in a greedy corrupt country you will be taken for a ride. Motor insurance should be nationalised. Ditto NCT. And don't start me on the privatisation of prisons

I'm in nz at the moment, a country about equal size as Ireland in terms of population, but a country far higher in terms of road fatalities and car accidents.

Yet irish insurance companies are unable to give me a genuine reason as to why I pay almost 4 times more motorcycle insurance in ire than in nz.

scumbags is right and this is a country where vehicle insurance isnt compulsory

Little Sunshine · 02-03-2015 8:47am

Meetup is great - have met some non Irish through that and to be honest I would be completely lost without it. I don't want to surround myself with all Irish - I live with an Aussie & a Kiwi, & work with Aussie's and English people. I am actively involved in volunteering and have just joined a sports club - definitely putting myself out there. In relation to dating well that's even a chore - Aussies definitely don't get the Irish sense of humour & guys don't seem to approach girls these days - I'm a 21st century girl and have approached guys on nites out just to chat but they seem to be non receptive!

bruschi · 02-03-2015 10:29am

Everything is relative, and everything is individual. There can be no one solution for all, nor does every decision mean people will agree with it or think the same way.

For myself, I'm back living in Ireland a good while and married to an Australian. I moved back here just before everything went bad (mid to late noughties) so I've been right in the middle of the downturn. Maybe we were lucky, maybe we fell on our feet, but we have always been employed or found work when jobs were lost. My wife has a job now that she would never have got or been so highly ranked in Australia. My own work life has been fine here, and I'm going out on my own soon enough.

The biggest thing though has been able to set up our lives here easier than we would have in Australia. We built a house on family land, for a lot less than an equivalent house in Australia. I live by the coast, so the scenery and uniqueness of the area I am in is as good as you would get anywhere. And most of all, we have family and friends close by to support us. We have a young family, and having people around to help out with babysitting or minding them, or just being there to help out we wouldnt have the same level of support in Australia.

There is no dount, the weather here is crap in Winter, but the long evenings here, and being able to walk out in the countryside, or go out by the beach and cliffs in summertime is unmatched IMO. My wife has family and firends who come here and cant believe our luck in where we live, and they are the ones envious of our home. It's all relative. There are times when its miserable here, and the kids want to go out and play, and you'd wonder why dont we go over there, but at this moment in time it really wouldnt suit us, and our lives are far better in Ireland right now for us.

We've been back a few times, and the holidays can be great and make you think what could have been, but more often than not we are at the end of them waiting to come back home and get back to where we live.

universe777 · 02-03-2015 2:23pm

Little Sunshine wrote: »

Some good posts on this thread - i'm here 2.5 yrs - came on PR on my own - with no family or friends - no problem getting work but the issue is that a lot of people i have met along the way have either moved interstate, overseas (NZ or Canada) or back home to Irel. Feeling pretty lonely now & finding it difficult to make new friends -constantly feel when i meet someone , how long before they leave too. I'm single mid 30's - u would think that it would be easy to make friends but couples tend to b very clicky & families tend to socialise together which i understand. So where do i fit in?
Considering relocating back to irel - have even seen some jobs which is kinda funny cause i was unemployed for a year before I left. I know my friends & family - especially my mam would be delighted if went back.
Someone once said to me that the hardest decision you will make is not leaving Irel but deciding to go back!!!!!

Here 5 years and similar age, it's tough! People don't stick around longer than a year generally

massdebater · 02-03-2015 9:19pm

Little Sunshine wrote: »

Some good posts on this thread - i'm here 2.5 yrs - came on PR on my own - with no family or friends - no problem getting work but the issue is that a lot of people i have met along the way have either moved interstate, overseas (NZ or Canada) or back home to Irel. Feeling pretty lonely now & finding it difficult to make new friends -constantly feel when i meet someone , how long before they leave too. I'm single mid 30's - u would think that it would be easy to make friends but couples tend to b very clicky & families tend to socialise together which i understand. So where do i fit in?

Your problem seems to be that you keep making friends with only irish people. I moved here solo too and my first group of friends were irish. Of course, they left after about 8 months which sucked so I decided to make a group of aussie friends instead of going through the same heartache again. Was more difficult breaking into an 'established' group of aussies but now I have a great core group of friends who I know will be here for the long term. It's made my decision to stay here much easier and I don't have to go through the pain of watching all my friends leave.

Alt J · 04-03-2015 12:50am

OP, moved back too Ireland after two years in Melbourne, my whv ran out. Im home a month and finding it difficult too, I thought it would be the weather etc but its the little things like jumping on a tram, going to the city for a coffee on my days off etc etc. Like you I left a lot of friends there too, and also a girlfriend, trying my best to get back

. Best of luck

Moved back to Ireland and questioning it!

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