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GAA Ace arrested for being AWOL British soldier

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    #2
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    This is where hes highly likely going on holiday.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NotqDCjQQ3U


    Hes lucky this law was not passed.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5006638.stm

    Proposals for British soldiers to get life sentences for desertion have been criticised as "inhuman and barbaric".


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    #3
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    That law, even it had been passed, would not have applied.

    There's a qualitative difference between being absent without leave and desertion.


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    #4
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Jawgap wrote: »
    That law, even it had been passed, would not have applied.

    There's a qualitative difference between being absent without leave and desertion.


    Not sure, hes unit could have been going to Iraq or Afghanistan 10 years ago.


    Quote The bill was "really about the war in Iraq", he added, saying the number of "abscondees" in the military had trebled since the invasion. Unquote


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    #5
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    QUOTE - "He joined the army when he was 18 and paid his way out and now because of some paperwork technicality he's paying the price," Mr Culloty said. END QUOTE

    IF he did in fact buy his way out, then he is completely in the clear. However, if he did not, then he is actually absent without leave. If this absence 'just happens' to be contemporary with a deployment on active service in a war zone, then the gentleman is in a world of nastiness.

    HE signed up for whatever happens - that's why it is called the Armed SERVICE, and not the Armed Option-that-if-you-don't-want-to-go somewhere-nasty-you-can-go-home-to-your-mammy-instead.

    It will be very interesting to see how this pans out, but whateve else happens, you'll recall that we managed pretty well without his help.

    tac, totally unsympathetic.


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    #6
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Queens regulations state there are options for premature voluntary release on payment, he would have been interviewed by his CO. He would also have been issued with discharge papers.

    His mixed up paperwork story sounds like rubbish.


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    #7
    Manach
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,664 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manach


    Perhaps Mr Shatter could issue a pardon (even if in UK), as he seems to be fond of those.


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    #8
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    Manach wrote: »
    Perhaps Mr Shatter could issue a pardon (even if in UK), as he seems to be fond of those.

    I doubt he'd qualify given he didn't participate in the defeat of the Third Reich....


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    #9
    delta-boy
    Registered Users Posts: 281 ✭✭delta-boy


    Before you know the ins and outs of it I'd say nothing... Strangely enough I met the bloke in question while I was on guard last week haha, he came up in a suit and asked where the court room was hahahahahaah


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    #10
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Re post #1 - he was in the British Army, but he was NOT a British soldier. He retained his Irish nationality throughout the duration of his service.

    tac


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    #11
    time lord
    Registered Users Posts: 606 ✭✭✭time lord


    Off topic I know but just doing a house clearance tonight and found an old restricted army book with every member of the Irish Army that deserted during the 'Emergency', every name, rank, unit and serial no. I didn't count them but its a fairly thick book. Literally half an hour ago!


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    #12
    discus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭discus


    delta-boy wrote: »
    Before you know the ins and outs of it I'd say nothing... Strangely enough I met the bloke in question while I was on guard last week haha, he came up in a suit and asked where the court room was hahahahahaah

    You have to do guard? No mpgs? Stinger!


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    #13
    Morpheus
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    really?

    any chance you can get info on a name for me?!

    is this it?
    http://books.national-army-museum.ac.uk/list-of-personnel-of-the-irish-defence-forces-dismissed-for-des-pr-31799.html
    A secret list of 5,000 Irish soldiers dismissed for deserting and joining the British Forces during the Second World War.
    It may not be widely known but a large number of Irish soldiers deserted their own army during WWII (Eire remained neutral) and crossed the sea to join the British army. Once the war was over these men were officially dismissed the service and their names published in this confidential document. The formal title of the document is “List of personnel of the Defence Forces dismissed for desertion in time of National Emergency pursuant to the terms of Emergency Powers (No 362) Order 1945 (S.R. & O. 1945 No 198) or Section 13 of the Defence Forces (Temporary Provisions) Act, 1946 (No 7/1946).” In it are listed, in alphabetical order, some 5,000 or more names with Army No, last recorded address, date of birth, declared occupation prior to enlistment in Defence Forces, and date of dismissal from Defence Forces. In the latter case the date is amost invariably 8 August 1945. This document was circulated to all civil service departments and state run services, e.g post office, health service, state owned bus , rail, air and shipping companies etc. This was obviously intended to bar them from any form of government employment. It is a fascinating document and one which I have never been aware of before. It would be interesting, with the Naval and Military Press CD of Soldiers Died in WWII, to see how many of them were kiled or died in the war. The number of desertions is surprisingly large for a small army, but it must be an indication of the strength of feeling at the time.


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    #14
    roundymac
    Registered Users Posts: 2,712 ✭✭✭roundymac


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Queens regulations state there are options for premature voluntary release on payment, he would have been interviewed by his CO. He would also have been issued with discharge papers.

    His mixed up paperwork story sounds like rubbish.
    Maybe his cheque bounced.:D


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    #15
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    roundymac wrote: »
    Maybe his cheque bounced.:D

    That, too, is an offence under the Army Act.

    Anything that would get you in the doo-doo as a civilian gets you FAR more trouble in the in the British Armed Forces.

    1. Committing a civil offence.

    2. Committing a civil offence whilst being a member of H M Forces.

    3. Committing a civil offence is, in itself, an offence in the British Armed Forces.

    4. Committing the military offence of bringing the Armed forces into disrepute.

    5. P!ssing off the others in the British Armed Forces by items 1 through 4 - Conduct Prejudicial to the maintenance of good order and military discipline - good ol' Section 69 of the AA.

    In any case, intentionally absenting yourself from duty when warned for operational duty has a special name reserved for those who take such action -

    Cowardice in the face of the enemy.

    The British Army stopped executing its soldiers in 1928, BTW, but sliding off home to the Emerald Isle when things are about to get sharp and pointy for your mates won't win him any friends and supporters.

    tac, waiting for the boot to drop.


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    #16
    time lord
    Registered Users Posts: 606 ✭✭✭time lord


    Morpheus wrote: »
    really?

    any chance you can get info on a name for me?!

    is this it?
    http://books.national-army-museum.ac.uk/list-of-personnel-of-the-irish-defence-forces-dismissed-for-des-pr-31799.html
    Yes that's it. Ah common as muck :( thought I had a find. It runs alphabetically so surnames are the quickest way of checking. I was checking out all the family names last night, no adventurers found yet.


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    #17
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    tac foley wrote: »
    That, too, is an offence under the Army Act.

    Anything that would get you in the doo-doo as a civilian gets you FAR more trouble in the in the British Armed Forces.

    1. Committing a civil offence.

    2. Committing a civil offence whilst being a member of H M Forces.

    3. Committing a civil offence is, in itself, an offence in the British Armed Forces.

    4. Committing the military offence of bringing the Armed forces into disrepute.

    5. P!ssing off the others in the British Armed Forces by items 1 through 4 - Conduct Prejudicial to the maintenance of good order and military discipline - good ol' Section 69 of the AA.

    In any case, intentionally absenting yourself from duty when warned for operational duty has a special name reserved for those who take such action -

    Cowardice in the face of the enemy.

    The British Army stopped executing its soldiers in 1928, BTW, but sliding off home to the Emerald Isle when things are about to get sharp and pointy for your mates won't win him any friends and supporters.

    tac, waiting for the boot to drop.

    If I was a betting man (I'm not) I reckon this will turn out to be some bureaucratic screw up......either paperwork gone astray or he skipped / skimped on some element of the discharge procedure.

    Purely on the basis of the fact that no one would be stupid enough to go AWOL and / or be potentially tagged as a deserter and then flit back back and forward between here and the UK.......however, I could be completely wrong, maybe he was that stupid.......


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    #18
    ChicagoJoe
    Registered Users Posts: 372 ✭✭ChicagoJoe


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Obviously not the brightest spark deserting then returning to Britain for a stag do.

    Lets hope he enjoys his stay in Colchester military corrective centre.


    http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/gaa-ace-on-uk-stag-trip-told-by-police-he-was-an-awol-british-soldier-30154308.html


    A Gaelic footballer is to face a hearing before British Army officers to explain why he went absent without leave (AWOL) from the British Army 10 years ago.
    " not the brightest spark " - that's why he joined the British army in the first place :D


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    #19
    ChicagoJoe
    Registered Users Posts: 372 ✭✭ChicagoJoe


    Hope this makes the headlines over here, will do wonders for British army recruitment in Ireland :D


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    #20
    OS119
    Registered Users Posts: 2,518 ✭✭✭OS119


    Jawgap wrote: »
    If I was a betting man (I'm not) I reckon this will turn out to be some bureaucratic screw up......either paperwork gone astray or he skipped / skimped on some element of the discharge procedure.

    Purely on the basis of the fact that no one would be stupid enough to go AWOL and / or be potentially tagged as a deserter and then flit back back and forward between here and the UK.......however, I could be completely wrong, maybe he was that stupid.......

    you'd be amazed at the spectacular examples of mind-blowing fcukwittery it has been my joy to witness...

    i too wouldn't be that surprised if its a screw up, though its unusual to have a prosecution - when we 'lose' someone we just get rid, we don't want them blocking a place, and we don't want the hassle of a prosecution. i've got much more important and interesting things to spend my time doing than chase someone i probably don't think much of and who holds a similar opinion of me.


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    #21
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    ChicagoJoe wrote: »
    " not the brightest spark " - that's why he joined the British army in the first place :D

    That's not my experience of Irishmen in the British Army. They seemed to me to be very bright, and were all, to a man excellent soldiers in every respect. One of them, a Warrant Officer Class 2, was awarded a well-deserved MBE a few years back for his voluntary work with children. Like me, his is also a linguist and has a degree to his name. When he leaves the Army next year, he told me, he intends to become a doctor as there seems to be a shortage of them in RoI. His Irish wife already is.

    It's sad to note that if it had not been for the incredible bottleneck in recruiting for the PDF, he would have been a shining example in the Irish Army, and one that you would probably have been praising him, instead of p1ssing on his head.

    Still, it gives you something to do that could, if exaggerated greatly, be classed as a valid contribution to this thread, since it enabled me to point out the error of your opinion.

    Have a great day.

    tac


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    #22
    pablomakaveli
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    tac foley wrote: »
    That's not my experience of Irishmen in the British Army. They seemed to me to be very bright, and were all, to a man excellent soldiers in every respect. One of them, a Warrant Officer Class 2, was awarded a well-deserved MBE a few years back for his voluntary work with children. Like me, his is also a linguist and has a degree to his name. When he leaves the Army next year, he told me, he intends to become a doctor as there seems to be a shortage of them in RoI. His Irish wife already is.

    It's sad to note that if it had not been for the incredible bottleneck in recruiting for the PDF, he would have been a shining example in the Irish Army, and one that you would probably have been praising him, instead of p1ssing on his head.

    Still, it gives you something to do that could, if exaggerated greatly, be classed as a valid contribution to this thread, since it enabled me to point out the error of your opinion.

    Have a great day.

    tac

    I'd imagine his opinion of British soldiers is one informed only by republican propaganda which isnt too uncommon to see on Boards.


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    #23
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    tac foley wrote: »
    Re post #1 - he was in the British Army, but he was NOT a British soldier. He retained his Irish nationality throughout the duration of his service.

    tac


    Legally he is/was a British soldier.


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    #24
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    pablomakaveli wrote: »
    I'd imagine his opinion of British soldiers is one informed only by republican propaganda which isnt too uncommon to see on Boards.


    Wonder how this guys pals in Kerry GAA are taking all this ?

    Id be amazed if they knew hes an ex squaddie.


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    #25
    WhiteWalls
    Registered Users Posts: 945 ✭✭✭WhiteWalls


    how did this case finish up anybody know?


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    #26
    Hedgemeister
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭Hedgemeister


    Reminds me of the time back in the 80s when a popular Irish TV entertainer (now deceased) went on a gig to the UK only to be arrested for Desertion from Her Majesty's Forces. Ohh...the shock and horror of it all (for about five minutes) but the case was never mentioned again by the Media, and in true Irish fashion we never learned the outcome.


    Why is every GAA player mentioned in the Media described as a 'GAA Star' of GAA 'Ace' ?

    And Tac...we Irish don't do praise when it comes to our own soldiers, let alone members of the BA.


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    #27
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Hedgemeister wrote: »
    And Tac...we Irish don't do praise when it comes to our own soldiers, let alone members of the BA.

    That's a shame.

    But for an accident of location, I would have been wearing the uniform of an Irish soldier.

    I would like to have thought that I would have made Ireland proud of me.

    tac


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    #28
    Hedgemeister
    Closed Accounts Posts: 245 ✭✭Hedgemeister


    tac foley wrote: »
    That's a shame.

    But for an accident of location, I would have been wearing the uniform of an Irish soldier.

    I would like to have thought that I would have made Ireland proud of me.

    tac

    Well, for what its worth Tac, I would have been proud to soldier with you.


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    #29
    tac foley
    Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Much appreciated, Sir.

    tac


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    #30
    folbotcar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 472 ✭✭folbotcar


    Hedgemeister wrote: »
    Reminds me of the time back in the 80s when a popular Irish TV entertainer (now deceased) went on a gig to the UK only to be arrested for Desertion from Her Majesty's Forces. Ohh...the shock and horror of it all (for about five minutes) but the case was never mentioned again by the Media, and in true Irish fashion we never learned the outcome.


    Why is every GAA player mentioned in the Media described as a 'GAA Star' of GAA 'Ace' ?

    And Tac...we Irish don't do praise when it comes to our own soldiers, let alone members of the BA.
    Yes that was Eugene Lambert, Wanderly Wagon and all that. In fact it was reported at the time as a case of mistaken identity. He was hardly the military type anyway.

    As for using the words 'star' or 'ace' when it comes to GAA players. I can't see how you can use the two words in the same sentence with GAA.:p But that's my bias against that particular game!

    Getting yourself a military career in this country is still very hit and miss. I read that 10,000 applied for 400 places. Those are horrendous odds. No wonder many join the BA. Which isn't that easy to get into either anymore. Many people seem to think the modern soldier are still like something out of the Napoleonic wars; cannon fodder. Nothing could be further from the truth.

    Speaking of desertion, that book by time lord interests me. An uncle of mine supposedly went awol from the Irish army during the war. I don't know if he joined the British army though. Although he was nervous coming home in case he was picked up. I wonder if he's listed?


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    #31
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,266 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    tac foley wrote: »
    That's a shame.

    But for an accident of location, I would have been wearing the uniform of an Irish soldier.

    I would like to have thought that I would have made Ireland proud of me.

    tac


    Part of the problem is that Ireland is a proud neutral country, and the BA isn't


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