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Ongoing religious scandals

PeterIanStaker · 2010-03-13 15:43:35

MODS NOTE: Post any stories or commentary on church scandals in this thread only. This is primarily in order to stop the antics of the catholic church clogging up the forum. Any new threads will be closed or moved here. No suprises here really: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article7060406.ece

Comments

#102 28-03-2010 7:48pm

Spacedog

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Will he resign? won't he resign? lets all talk about that, lets debate resignations. they all belong behind bars as long as I'm concerned.

ever since the publication of the report into clerical abuse. bishops immeadiatly spoke to the press saying "I'm not going to resign". then after a few weeks of public reaction they resign bacause it's "for the good of the church".

If they aided child abuse to the extent that they feel they should resign, perhaps a trial, legal process, and some prison time are in order?

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#103 28-03-2010 9:56pm

Ghost Buster

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axer wrote: »

Anyone else here delighted that brady isn't resigning straight away?

I think it is causing positive outrage pushing people away from the catholic church which in my opinion is great. The same can be said for pope benedick [sic].

I know what you mean. There is, under the anger and revulsion , a sense of self satisfaction and 'I TOLD YA SO" as each scandal breaks and another blow is delivered to the church. A very guilty pleasure derived from seeing a bully getting its comeuppance!

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#104 29-03-2010 12:42am

Irlandese

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recedite wrote: »

I wonder if its one of those obsolete jobs, so when the old guy dies they don't replace him.
Or do they still take this stuff seriously? Surely they would have some video footage of the possessed people spewing out nails, to put up on U-tube?

Thank you, friend, for this evidence.
We have a lively discussion on the poòpes letter on another thread, but this one is very enlightening too.

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#105 29-03-2010 12:50am

Irlandese

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Jaysus, a man or woman after my own heart. Sorry I didn't see this before.
If you are still interested, I can assure you that you can send a letter to your local chief supt. copied to the DPP simply referring to what has been reported in the press and asking for a proper investigation and that criminal charges be made if seen to be justified by such a proper investigation. You do not have to define the legal points involved. That is their job.
I would also visibly copy to your local papers and to the indo and times to put pressure on and to have a journalist or two follow up for you.
You are at no risk if you do as stated above.

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#106 29-03-2010 10:52am

mewso

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Interesting blog post on Sinead O'Connor - http://www.eoinbutler.com/home/isnt-sinead-oconnor-overdue-a-massive-grovelling-apology-from-absolutely-everybody/. Now I'm not really a fan but if you watch what she did 18 years ago:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYw8JR1N90o

followed by the abuse she got for it:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCk2YQS8vaw

It's difficult not to admire her. Shes right about the Vatican though. These guys can't believe in God or they'd be expecting to go to hell for keeping all this quiet over the years.

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#107 30-03-2010 3:31pm

Flamed Diving

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qu-BvGAeb94

"Fair & balanced"

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#108 30-03-2010 4:28pm

Irlandese

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Flamed Diving wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qu-BvGAeb94

"Fair & balanced"

This is interesting.
Now we have Fox News weighing in with media-bias blaming the "liberals" in the US for bashing the church unfairly about paedofile rape by priests and promoting a "hard-line republican approach" to the whole issue, (whatever that means, especially when we recall the republican senator trying to seduce young male interns by e-mail, while they were working in his office.)
I can just hear God to Ratty on this one:

God: Hey Ratty, you there? Have you seen that stuff on Fox News ? Who in christs name have we co-ordinating our PR? Judas? Feck, it's a balls of a game using republicans as models. I don't mind using Bush to burn half the world, but, Fox News as our representatives on the airwaves? Feck, feck, feck.....

ratzinger: Ok, OK, we are on it. No-one pays them any attention anyway. It might go un-noticed. Maybe we can try another tac. I heard Jerry Springer is getting a new programme. Maybe we can get him to front for us?

God; Ratty, hav

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#109 30-03-2010 4:42pm

robindch

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Irlandese wrote: »

No-one pays them any attention anyway.

Most opinion polls have Fox as the "most trusted" news source in the USA:

http://publicpolicypolling.blogspot.com/2010/01/fox-leads-for-trust.html

<facepalm>

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#110 30-03-2010 4:44pm

pts

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robindch wrote: »

Most opinion polls have Fox as the "most trusted" news source in the USA:

http://publicpolicypolling.blogspot.com/2010/01/fox-leads-for-trust.html

<facepalm>

Time for?

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#111 31-03-2010 10:29pm

Blueboyd

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All this talk - why don't they just get loads of Priest Off

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#112 02-04-2010 10:16pm

robindch

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Raniero Cantalamessa, a close friend of Ratzinger, has, in broad terms, compared criticism of the pontiff and Church over child abuse to the Holocaust:

Raniero Cantalamessa wrote:

following with disgust the violent and concentric attacks against the Church, the Pope... [...] The use of stereotypes, the shifting of personal responsibility and guilt to a collective guilt remind me of the most shameful aspects of anti-Semitism.

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#113 02-04-2010 10:35pm

legspin

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robindch wrote: »

Raniero Cantalamessa, a close friend of Ratzinger, has, in broad terms, compared criticism of the pontiff and Church over child abuse to the Holocaust:

I was watching the news earlier and I heard this. I had to ask my wife if I had heard it correctly.

This feels like a corollary of Godwin's law at this point.

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#114 02-04-2010 10:50pm

robindch

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legspin wrote: »

I was watching the news earlier and I heard this. I had to ask my wife if I had heard it correctly.

Just when you think that things couldn't be handled any worse, some Vatican guy comes out with this...!

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#115 02-04-2010 11:27pm

PDN

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robindch wrote: »

Raniero Cantalamessa, a close friend of Ratzinger, has, in broad terms, compared criticism of the pontiff and Church over child abuse to the Holocaust:

He actually read a letter from 'a Jewish friend' and the Holocaust wasn't mentioned. But why let the facts get in the way of a good story.

However, I imagine the Vatican's PR advisors just feel like putting a bullet in their own heads by this stage.

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#116 02-04-2010 11:31pm

Blackhorse Slim

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The holocaust was certainly alluded to, although not mentioned by name.
Personally I think it's more like the Nuremburg trials.

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#117 02-04-2010 11:36pm

PDN

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Blackhorse Slim wrote: »

The holocaust was certainly alluded to, although not mentioned by name.

You need to remember that, over the last 1500 years, the Catholic Church has caused many notable examples of 'collective violence' against the Jews to which they can allude.

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#118 03-04-2010 12:33am

rovert

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Anyone watch the late late with Sinead? I’ve been really impressed with how level headed she has been in doing the media rounds on RTE, BBC & CNN. Unfortunately I’ve absolutely appalled by some of the US right wing blog posts about her just awful, awful stuff.

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#119 03-04-2010 10:21am

robindch

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PDN wrote: »

However, I imagine the Vatican's PR advisors just feel like putting a bullet in their own heads by this stage.

They have PR advisors? :eek:

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#120 03-04-2010 2:25pm

axer

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robindch wrote: »

They have PR advisors? :eek:

I wouldn't think it is surprising since they also own a very successful bank, a palace and alot of priceless art etc. God bless the poor and the homeless, eh!

I would imagine the PR meeting would go something like this:

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#121 03-04-2010 3:17pm

Flamed Diving

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BpmeX6lwZc

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#122 03-04-2010 7:11pm

pork99

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Ireland should turn Protestant. That would learn them

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#123 05-04-2010 1:41am

Galvasean

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Our good source of comedic gold - in a 'it would be funny if it werent so goddamn serious' sort of way friend Cardinal Sean Brady says there is no longer anywhere for abusers to hide in the Catholic Church. Not quite sure if this means he's turning himself in (as someone who aided said abusers)...
One stand out quote for me is:

CSB wrote:

By destroying all arrogance, pride and corruption in the church, by becoming the humble, just and caring community of disciples that Christ intended us to be, we may look back at this historic moment and see in it God’s life-giving and transforming grace.

Won't be much RCC if you do that now will there?

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#124 05-04-2010 1:53am

Galvasean

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Flamed Diving wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qu-BvGAeb94

"Fair & balanced"

The Catholic Church should be a model for dealing with this kind of thing? What the flying fook is he on about??!?!?

PS: spittiing image of Dick Cheney

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#125 05-04-2010 12:13pm

robindch

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PDN wrote: »

He actually read a letter from 'a Jewish friend' and the Holocaust wasn't mentioned. But why let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Cantalamessa apologises, kind of.

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#126 08-04-2010 8:38am

Erren Music

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Today's shoot yourself in the foot again quote from the church.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2010/0408/1224267896125.html

“What we are dealing with now is a cultural battle: the pope embodies moral truths which people don’t accept and for that reason the shortcomings and errors of priests are used as arms against the church,” he told the Vatican daily L’Osservatore Romano.
Cardinal Sodano, who at the weekend said the church would not be distracted by “idle gossip”, in an apparent reference to the child abuse scandal, again defended the record of the pope and bishops on the issue.
“It was not the fault of Jesus if he was betrayed by Judas. Nor is it the fault of a bishop if one of his priests sullies himself with grave crimes. And certainly, it is not the responsibility of the pontiff,” he said.

Stop supporting these lunatics

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#127 08-04-2010 9:17am

The Mad Hatter

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The Provincial of the Oregon Province in the US sent several pedophile priests to Alaska, where they could abuse children in secret. There's a lot of horror in this article, but for me the worst was that the Jesuits suggested not paying more than €10k in compensation because they would just use it to "get drunk" and it would lead to more abuse claims.

There's also the claim that Benedict asked for (and, naturally, received) immunity from arrest for sex crimes from President Bush.

Link

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#128 08-04-2010 10:53am

Dades

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Cardinal Angelo Sodano wrote:

“It was not the fault of Jesus if he was betrayed by Judas. Nor is it the fault of a bishop if one of his priests sullies himself with grave crimes. And certainly, it is not the responsibility of the pontiff,” he said.

There's an interesting comparison to be made there, alright.

Jesus knew full well he was about be betrayed by Judas, and did nothing to prevent it.

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#129 08-04-2010 11:10am

legspin

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Dades wrote: »

There's an interesting comparison to be made there, alright.

Jesus knew full well he was about be betrayed by Judas, and did nothing to prevent it.

I'm beginning to think this sounds like suicide by cop.

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#130 08-04-2010 11:28am

axer

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legspin wrote: »

I'm beginning to think this sounds like suicide by cop.

Had that argument over on the christian forum but they refused to accept that jesus was a hypocritical sinner for committing suicide (by cop). Maybe the catholic hierarchy are just following jesus' lead in the whole sinning department.

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#131 10-04-2010 2:42pm

rovert

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Pretty daring Private Eye cover

Mods move or delete if this isnt the right place

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#132 10-04-2010 4:21pm

sionnach

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Finally Benedict is stepping up to the plate:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/pope-vows-to-get-church-pedophilia-down-to-accepta,17201/

"This is absolutely unacceptable," Pope Benedict said. "It seems a weakening of faith in God has prevented our priests from exercising moderation when sexually abusing helpless minors."

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#133 10-04-2010 5:04pm

Dades

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Oddly enough, I don't have any faith whatsoever and I don't abuse children.

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#134 11-04-2010 12:10pm

PeterIanStaker

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Would love it if this happened:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article7094310.ece

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#135 11-04-2010 2:06pm

Erren Music

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axer wrote: »

Had that argument over on the christian forum but they refused to accept that jesus was a hypocritical sinner for committing suicide (by cop). Maybe the catholic hierarchy are just following jesus' lead in the whole sinning department.

Anyone who really believes what the church says or the bible is factual needs their heads examined.

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#136 11-04-2010 3:28pm

PeterIanStaker

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In fairness, trying to knock sense into them over on the christian forum must be like p*ssing up against a forest fire.

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#137 11-04-2010 6:37pm

robindch

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Erren Music wrote: »

Anyone who really believes what the church says or the bible is factual needs their heads examined.

And anybody who thinks that something as beguiling, complex and subtle as religion is as dumb as this comment would suggest, should themselves consider having their head examined.

Do try to be a bit more understanding.

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#138 12-04-2010 1:17pm

rovert

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/11/catholic-bishop-blames-jews

WTF!

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#139 12-04-2010 1:24pm

Flamed Diving

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rovert wrote: »

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/11/catholic-bishop-blames-jews

WTF!

When in doubt...

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#140 12-04-2010 2:00pm

Sam Vimes

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Flamed Diving wrote: »

When in doubt...

They brought it on themselves for inventing the word scapegoat!

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#141 12-04-2010 2:24pm

eoin5

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rovert wrote: »

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/11/catholic-bishop-blames-jews

WTF!

"They do not want the church, they are its natural enemies. Deep down, historically speaking, the Jews are God killers."

Awesome , some proper old-man well stewed blinding hatred on display there.

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#142 12-04-2010 2:49pm

axer

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I just hope they keep talking because every time someone talks from the catholic church they dig a deeper hole. Surely catholics should be leaving in droves from the catholic church by now.

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#143 12-04-2010 5:00pm

Dades

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I've just cleaned up some posts here.

The gist of these concerned a moderation query re a thread in Christianity which is addressed in feedback.

As you were.

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#144 12-04-2010 5:06pm

robindch

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Q: How do you know it's bedtime in the Vatican?

A: When the big hand is on the little hand.

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#145 12-04-2010 5:16pm

Erren Music

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robindch wrote: »

And anybody who thinks that something as beguiling, complex and subtle as religion is as dumb as this comment would suggest, should themselves consider having their head examined.

Do try to be a bit more understanding.

Believing in religion nowadays is akin to being a creationist or a scientologist. All the proof is there that it is a load of rubbish.

You of all people should know that after all the futile attempted discussions you have had with those accross the fence.

Then you tell me my comment is dumb and post this

robindch wrote: »

Q: How do you know it's bedtime in the Vatican?

A: When the big hand is on the little hand.

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#146 12-04-2010 5:18pm

robindch

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Erren Music wrote: »

Then you tell me my comment is dumb and post this

I'm posting a joke. You were not.

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#147 12-04-2010 5:30pm

Zillah

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Erren Music wrote: »

Believing in religion nowadays is akin to being a creationist or a scientologist. All the proof is there that it is a load of rubbish.

You can prove that all religions are false? Well then, off to collect your nobel prize young man, I have underestimated you.

You of all people should know that after all the futile attempted discussions you have had with those accross the fence.

Yes, be damned to this discussion of theirs. We should, uh...shoot them instead? Ignore them? Proclaim they are wrong with absolute faith and show no interest in debate? Perfect!

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#148 12-04-2010 7:48pm

Erren Music

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Zillah wrote: »

You can prove that all religions are false? Well then, off to collect your nobel prize young man, I have underestimated you.

Yes, be damned to this discussion of theirs. We should, uh...shoot them instead? Ignore them? Proclaim they are wrong with absolute faith and show no interest in debate? Perfect!

In all fairness zillah religion proves itself false.

You have read most of the threads on this forum. No religious poster can argue with ANY of the points against religion because there are none.

I would have thought that you would understand but I guess you are happiest when you come in with your usual withering comments, and your fans come along with their thanks.

Grow up.

We are at a pivotal time in history where we can rid the world of this delusion, and it is a delusion.

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#149 12-04-2010 10:25pm

Delirium

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Popes 2nd in command says that homosexuality, and not the celibacy vows are to blame for the child abuse scandals:mad:

SANTIAGO, Chile -- The Vatican's second-highest authority says the sex scandals haunting the Catholic Church are linked to homosexuality rather than celibacy vows among priests.

Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone is the Vatican's secretary of state and asserts that "many psychologists and psychiatrists have demonstrated that there is no relation between celibacy and pedophilia."

He says others have shown "that there is a relation between homosexuality and pedophilia," and "that is the problem."

Bertone spoke during a news conference Monday in Chile.

He also asserted that the church had never impeded investigations of pedophilia by priests.

Source

Homosexuals aren't attracted to children, pedophiles are. And pedophiles can be attracted to boys or girls.

And the problem isn't homosexuals, it's that priests were in positions of trust and subsequently abused children.:mad::mad:

If you can read this, you're too close!

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#150 12-04-2010 10:56pm

Ickle Magoo

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Erren Music wrote: »

In all fairness zillah religion proves itself false.

You have read most of the threads on this forum. No religious poster can argue with ANY of the points against religion because there are none.

I would have thought that you would understand but I guess you are happiest when you come in with your usual withering comments, and your fans come along with their thanks.

Grow up.

We are at a pivotal time in history where we can rid the world of this delusion, and it is a delusion.

Would you just stop! Stop telling people to grow up and telling them what the forum should be and telling them what "we" should be doing like you are trying to captain and mobilise some imaginary atheist army. I like debating with theists, it's good fun; there are no proofs - that's why there is debate. This whole heavy handed anti-theist aggression is as rabid and unattractive as the worst arguments for religion.

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#151 12-04-2010 11:26pm

GLaDOS

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koth wrote: »

Popes 2nd in command says that homosexuality, and not the celibacy vows are to blame for the child abuse scandals:mad:

Homosexuals aren't attracted to children, pedophiles are. And pedophiles can be attracted to boys or girls.

And the problem isn't homosexuals, it's that priests were in positions of trust and subsequently abused children.:mad::mad:

Doesn't matter if the tooth fairy caused it, they still covered it up

Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test

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