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A very convincing evolutionary explanation for men dying younger than women

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  • 30-11-2010 12:26am
    #1
    Bottle_of_Smoke
    Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭


    Just watched a brilliant interview with a medical doctor who is hugely knowledgeable about natural selection.

    For every 100 females that die at 20, 300 males die in that same age group. As shocking as that sounds this guy gives a great explanation for what causes it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PP7JqS2EqZs


    Worth watching the whole thing - he explains what evolution has done ''wrong'' in the body. Though thought this part would be of particular interest to posters here.

    Perhaps if everyone knew about this there would be more effort put into increasing male lifespan or perhaps the opposite; the attitude may be that its genetics and theres not much we can do about it without discriminating against women.


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    #2
    Rycn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 722 ✭✭✭Rycn


    <3 Richard Dawkins


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    #3
    Nevyn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 43,045 ✭✭✭✭Nevyn


    How much of it is down to men not going to the dr early enough or not going to a dr on a regular bases like women who have to see a dr regular for contraceptive reasons.


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    #4
    Bottle_of_Smoke
    Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    Thaedydal wrote: »
    How much of it is down to men not going to the dr early enough or not going to a dr on a regular bases like women who have to see a dr regular for contraceptive reasons.

    I'd say the former could well be a factor and included in what he described as behavioral factors. The latter I'm not so sure about because the pattern holds up in populations where women don't get to see a doctor either. Also it wouldn't be very signficant in the case of 20 year olds, where in london where there's 3 male deaths for every female.

    Thanks for offering your insight. I'm pretty surprised at the lack of interest considering a few months ago there was a massive thread of people arguing about why men die younger than women


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    #5
    28064212
    Registered Users Posts: 10,494 ✭✭✭✭28064212


    Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »
    Thanks for offering your insight. I'm pretty surprised at the lack of interest considering a few months ago there was a massive thread of people arguing about why men die younger than women
    Video instead of an article will do that (IMO). I'd much rather read a wall of text than watch an 8 minute video.

    Without having stats to back it up, I would say there are two major contributions to the stark gender divide of 20-year-old deaths: road deaths, and suicide. Both have a much higher male mortality rate than female.

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    #6
    Robxxx7
    Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭Robxxx7


    Thaedydal wrote: »
    How much of it is down to men not going to the dr early enough or not going to a dr on a regular bases like women who have to see a dr regular for contraceptive reasons.

    Maybe its the complete lack of screening programs for men aswell ....


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    #7
    Hazys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    I just presumed that men were nagged into an early death.


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    #8
    Bottle_of_Smoke
    Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    28064212 wrote: »
    Video instead of an article will do that (IMO). I'd much rather read a wall of text than watch an 8 minute video.

    Aye didn't think of that.
    Without having stats to back it up, I would say there are two major contributions to the stark gender divide of 20-year-old deaths: road deaths, and suicide. Both have a much higher male mortality rate than female.

    Apparently for the 20 leading causes of death 19 of them men 'score' higher all the same. Would be good to look at the data he's referring to all the same.


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    #9
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    And there was I thinking we we were all getting poisoned :D


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    #10
    SugarHigh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,265 ✭✭✭SugarHigh


    If men die earlier than women shouldn't they be able to get there pension earlier?

    Yet in the uk women get it 5 years earlier than men. I think it should be life expectancy minus 10 years.

    Maybe even have health checks and actuarial table so everyone gets there own personal retirement age.


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    #11
    whatdoicare
    Registered Users Posts: 2,398 ✭✭✭whatdoicare


    Men don't look after themselves at all! Every single man in my family from my Brother to my Dad to my OH simply have to be bullied into going to a doctor - every single time.
    My OH is sitting next to me right now and two of his fingers are swollen like balloons from a thorn and he won't so much as put savlon on it to disinfect it. If it was me I'd be booking in with my doctor and covering the area in Savlon until then.
    My Dad had heart palpitations for months before he told anyone and barely escaped a heart attack!:eek:
    My own uncle was peeing blood and told noone - he died from liver failure and noone knew until he suddenly died.
    My male friend ignored his diabetes so long he actually lost the sight in one of his eyes before he decided to find out what was wrong with him!
    Men just have this thing where they think they are invincible and ignore 95% of the signs that indicate a serious illness.
    Women in general are much more aware of what's going on with their bodies and are more in the thoughts of catching things early.


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    #12
    yawnstretch
    Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭yawnstretch


    SugarHigh wrote: »
    If men die earlier than women shouldn't they be able to get there pension earlier?

    Yet in the uk women get it 5 years earlier than men. I think it should be life expectancy minus 10 years.

    Maybe even have health checks and actuarial table so everyone gets there own personal retirement age.

    Sugarhigh for president. Of the world.


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    #13
    Bottle_of_Smoke
    Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    SugarHigh wrote: »
    If men die earlier than women shouldn't they be able to get there pension earlier?

    Yet in the uk women get it 5 years earlier than men. I think it should be life expectancy minus 10 years.

    Maybe even have health checks and actuarial table so everyone gets there own personal retirement age.

    That's actually completely fair considering men contribute just as much with taxes.

    Though if any politician ever supported it his career would be over. Democracy's a sham:pac:


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    #14
    vibe666
    Registered Users Posts: 13,016 ✭✭✭✭vibe666


    Q: why do men die before their wives?
    A: because they want to!

    :D


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    #15
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    whatdoicare wrote: »
    Men just have this thing where they think they are invincible and ignore 95% of the signs that indicate a serious illness.
    Along the lines from the saying "boys don't cry" comes the saying "why the f**k are you going to the doctor because of X symptom? Man the f**k up, and take it like a man!". No, seriously. I know people who think like this.

    It's not evolution, it's a mindset some men happen to have, IMO.


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    #16
    amacachi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,316 ✭✭✭✭amacachi


    Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »
    Though if any politician ever supported it his career would be over. Democracy's a sham:pac:

    More. :pac:


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    #17
    CDfm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    Last year a bunch of us were talking about the whole issue of prostate cancer and testicicular cancer cos I was getting girlified by my OH and sent to the doctor.

    Anyway, a bunch of us lads said right we are off to get blood tests blah blah over 40 fcek as you do. Anyway,this was general chitchat for a few weeks and everyone toddled off to get tested and we generally yapped to others etc.

    One guy a colleague and friend of one of the lads who was in the fringes of the group didnt do anything and around 2 or 3 months back was diagnosed with testicular cancer stage III which had spread and the guy has since died.

    One of the other guys had an early prostate thing and had an overnight hospital stay. Very early and no cancer.

    A colleagues dad died of prostate related complications. Apparently too embarressed to seek medical help.

    Earlier in the year I posted about going off for blood tests etc and I am glad it wasnt me -but in the past year I have learnt loads. I had a second lot done a few months back after a check up and no probs.

    But it makes you think when Thaedydal posts about getting medical check ups how right she is. I talked to my 20 year old son about it cos back in the day I knew nothing.

    Off to bed now and a quick check of the testicles.


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    #18
    iptba
    Registered Users Posts: 4,876 ✭✭✭iptba


    Working long hours is bad for your health. And there's more pressure on men to do it.

    http://www.webmd.com/heart-disease/news/20100513/working-overtime-may-hurt-your-heart
    Working Overtime May Hurt Your Heart

    Logging Long Hours on the Job May Increase Risk for Heart Attack, Angina, Heart-Related Death, Study Finds
    By Salynn Boyles

    WebMD Health NewsReviewed by Laura J. Martin, MD May 13, 2010 -- Working a lot of overtime may be good for your wallet, but it may be bad for your heart.

    In a study of about 6,000 British civil servants followed for about a decade, working three or more hours of overtime a day was associated with a 60% increased risk of heart-related health issues, including heart attack, angina, and death from heart disease.

    The association was seen even after researchers considered the impact of well-established heart disease risk factors like smoking, obesity, and high cholesterol.


    [..]

    Men were six times more likely than women to work three or more hours of overtime a day, and married workers were almost nine times more likely than single workers to spend this much time at work.


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    #19
    Bottle_of_Smoke
    Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    Just be wary of reading the newspaper article rather than the scientific one backing it up.

    If out of that study 16 of the men who did overtime got heart related problems and 10 men who didn't do overtime got heart related problems they could say men doing overtime are 60% more likely to get heart problems.

    Like in a study where they look at 1000 cannabis users and 1000 non-cannabis users. 14 cannabis users developed schizophrenia and 10 non-cannabis users develop it. Then the headlines read "Cannabis users 40% more likely to get schizophrenia.

    There are liars, damned liars, and statisticians!


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    #20
    Reesy
    Registered Users Posts: 716 ✭✭✭Reesy


    For me, one factor in men not looking after their health as much as women is that women talk about their health, & care for each other, & let other women care for them, health-wise. Just compare the Ladies' Lounge to this forum or BGRH.


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    #21
    yawnstretch
    Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭yawnstretch


    Reesy wrote: »
    For me, one factor in men not looking after their health as much as women is that women talk about their health, & care for each other, & let other women care for them, health-wise. Just compare the Ladies' Lounge to this forum or BGRH.

    Why bother if your life is all about being a work slave?


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    #22
    Zulu
    Registered Users Posts: 10,965 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    I don't think society encourages men to seek out medical help.
    Take "manflu" for example: while there is little evidence (or at best conflicting) to suggest that men are more likely to exagurate an illness (namely a cold claiming its flu), the perception is that men will feign a more serious illness to get attention. The impact of this then is a reaction against that, that is to say, wanting to appear "tough", and wanting to "man up", some men will carry on without seeing a doctor.

    Which is never a good thing.


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