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New Luas lines or extensions after BXD

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124

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    #92
    Aard
    Registered Users Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    Light rail works best (in fact any form of public transport does) when there is an anchor at both ends. The city centre is an obvious anchor, but the outer ends of our current light rail lines work well as anchors too: Sandyford Industrial estate and Tallaght/Citywest. Of course, this isn't always necessary but it's good for avoiding empty trams going outbound in the morning and inbound in the evening.

    Any new light rail lines should, imo, incorporate a landuse plan for any vacant/brownfield sites along the route. The Cherrywood SDZ is a good example of incorporating transport and landuse plans. For example, I really wish that the whole Broombridge area (Dublin Industrial Estate?) had been SDZ'ed or at least LAP'ed so as to make best use of the land around what is going to be a major interchange. There will be amazing pressure to rezone the land in the wake of BXD, and this can either be done from the get-go in a planned manner, or as is usually done here we can wait until somebody submits an application for planning permission until the whole area is redeveloped ad-hoc.


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    #93
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,285 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Aard wrote: »
    Light rail works best (in fact any form of public transport does) when there is an anchor at both ends. The city centre is an obvious anchor, but the outer ends of our current light rail lines work well as anchors too: Sandyford Industrial estate and Tallaght/Citywest. Of course, this isn't always necessary but it's good for avoiding empty trams going outbound in the morning and inbound in the evening.
    Not quite. Ideally, it should go slightly / a few stops beyond each anchor.


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    #94
    Aard
    Registered Users Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    OK fair enough. I suppose my comment was in relation to the idea of light rail to Ashbourne.


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    #95
    loyatemu
    Registered Users Posts: 14,790 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    Cherrywood - Dun Laoghaire would seem a better bet than Cherrywood - Bray. You could certainly fit a tram line along Wyattville Road, its the rest of the way into DL that could be tricky.


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    #96
    petronius
    Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭petronius


    I havent seen any possible route from Cherrywood to Dun Laoghaire, but it would have to link with a DART station.
    I think there key is always to have connectivity with transport systems
    and an extension to bray would have to link to the DART station, and similarly if there was a link to D.L. instead.

    I think it is a shame that the BXD line is not planned to cross the north western commuter rail line and tolka valley and actually servicing population areas in Finglas.

    similarly there is 2 rail lines from broom bridge to Connolly the concept of using the line south of croke park to for luas since i seldom see any freight trains on it, should be investigated


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    #97
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,997 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    petronius wrote: »
    the concept of using the line south of croke park to for luas since i seldom see any freight trains on it, should be investigated

    i think its used for diversions though when 1 line is down

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #98
    Julius Seizure
    Closed Accounts Posts: 459 ✭✭Julius Seizure


    Also used for M3 Parkway - Docklands in peak times, and the freight that was mentioned (Ballina to Dublin Port). Not possible really.


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    #99
    loyatemu
    Registered Users Posts: 14,790 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    petronius wrote: »
    I havent seen any possible route from Cherrywood to Dun Laoghaire, but it would have to link with a DART station.
    I think there key is always to have connectivity with transport systems
    and an extension to bray would have to link to the DART station, and similarly if there was a link to D.L. instead.

    the planned Bray extension includes a Luas station just to the north of the Dart station in Bray (where the smaller of the 2 Dart carparks is currently).

    A link at Dun Laoghaire would be more useful for commuters seeking to connect to Cherrywood and Sandyford from elsewhere on the Dart line (rather than having to go all the way out to Bray and then come back in on the Luas) but getting the line into Dun Laoghaire itself would be tricky.


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    #100
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,410 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Why not go into Shankill?


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    #101
    loyatemu
    Registered Users Posts: 14,790 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    Why not go into Shankill?

    it goes through the northern bit of Bray with several stops, doesn't connect to the Dart line until just north of the Dargle


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    #102
    smellmepower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 829 ✭✭✭smellmepower


    Interesting video about LUAS security and their control room.Not threadworthy so not sure where else to put it, apologies if this is the wrong place.


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    #103
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    Light rail works best (in fact any form of public transport does) when there is an anchor at both ends. The city centre is an obvious anchor, but the outer ends of our current light rail lines work well as anchors too: Sandyford Industrial estate and Tallaght/Citywest. Of course, this isn't always necessary but it's good for avoiding empty trams going outbound in the morning and inbound in the evening.

    Wholeheartedly agree about about having an anchor both ends. Spurs that go off to seemingly nowhere are a poor investment. I type this as I lookout the window at the Cherrywood luas stop, with its cows in the field next to it.

    The Cherrywood/Brides Glen extension was poorly timed because a lot of the infrastructure it was to be supporting didnt get finished as a result of the downturn, and thats why I can see cows and not a Pizza Hut.

    A connection to either Dun Laoighre or Bray is really needed because it would connect this spur with the rest of the light rail network. It would mean that to get from here to Connolly station or even Heuston, it would be Cherrywood -> Dunlaoighre/Bray, Dart to Connolly, Luas to Heuston. It would be a bit long-winded but it would be an integrated rail network and at peak times may well be the quickest, cost effective way of getting where I might need to go.

    Started writing this posr 3 hours ago so sorry if its a bit disjointed.


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    #104
    donvito99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    syklops wrote: »
    Started writing this posr 3 hours ago so sorry if its a bit disjointed.

    Did you fall asleep?


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    #105
    petronius
    Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭petronius


    I agree with the anchor at both ends
    the anchor can be a hub bus station dart station airport population centre
    while broombridge is on the north-western commuter rail line, itself I fear is not the optimum anchor that it could have and continuing on going to a high population area like Finglas I think should be reconsidered

    I agree a DL link to the cherrywood line is nice in concept but a route i think is difficult and the proposed link to the bray line is more straightforward


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    #106
    D.L.R.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,283 ✭✭✭D.L.R.


    loyatemu wrote: »
    Cherrywood - Dun Laoghaire would seem a better bet than Cherrywood - Bray. You could certainly fit a tram line along Wyattville Road, its the rest of the way into DL that could be tricky.

    I'd love an E-W suburban connection for DL.

    But I'd route it from DL or Blackrock to Sandyford/Dundrum area. Tough to find an alignment mind!


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    #107
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    D.L.R. wrote: »
    I'd love an E-W suburban connection for DL.

    But I'd route it from DL or Blackrock to Sandyford/Dundrum area. Tough to find an alignment mind!

    Close off a few roads ...simples


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    #108
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,410 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    There is an alignment from Booterstown up through St Helens and onto UCD. Not sure where you go after that.


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    #109
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,560 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Close off a few roads ...simples



    Given every single road in that area has houses built along them I think that suggestion might not happen.


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    #110
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    lxflyer wrote: »
    Given every single road in that area has houses built along them I think that suggestion might not happen.

    CPO some front lawns, enough for a two way luas line and one car lane for one way traffic.


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    #111
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,560 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    AngryLips wrote: »
    CPO some front lawns, enough for a two way luas line and one car lane for one way traffic.



    While I'm all in favour of developing public transport, that simply is a nonsense - it's not going to happen.
    You need to be realistic about this.


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    #112
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    Well you can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs


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    #113
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,560 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    AngryLips wrote: »
    Well you can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs

    Well point out an exact route to me that can be done without costing millions in CPO and I'll believe you.

    None of the LUAS routes to date have even come close to that amount of CPO of peoples' houses/gardens that your idea would require.


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    #114
    D.L.R.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,283 ✭✭✭D.L.R.


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    There is an alignment from Booterstown up through St Helens and onto UCD. Not sure where you go after that.

    Yes thats for the mooted Eastern Bypass motorway. It continues south to Sandyford.

    God forbid we sholud have any preserved public transport corridors in this city!


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    #115
    AngryLips
    Registered Users Posts: 2,681 ✭✭✭AngryLips


    lxflyer wrote: »
    Well point out an exact route to me that can be done without costing millions in CPO and I'll believe you.

    None of the LUAS routes to date have even come close to that amount of CPO of peoples' houses/gardens that your idea would require.

    http://i.imgur.com/Ia1pjZG.jpg


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    #116
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,560 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    AngryLips wrote: »
    http://i.imgur.com/Ia1pjZG.jpg



    Now I know you're not being serious.


    That goes through Deansgrange Cemetery and through housing estates. Not exactly a realistic suggestion.


    Anyone can draw a line with red pen, but coming up with a workable solution is another thing altogether.


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    #117
    petronius
    Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭petronius


    Well any thoughts on putting a luas line joining the red line through the phoenix park and onto blanchardstown serving castleknock (i know there is a ban on public transport in it but...)


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    #118
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,285 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    donvito99 wrote: »
    Did you fall asleep?
    On-topic constructive posts only please.

    Moderator


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    #119
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    petronius wrote: »
    Well any thoughts on putting a luas line joining the red line through the phoenix park and onto blanchardstown serving castleknock (i know there is a ban on public transport in it but...)

    Castleknock is already served by heavy rail.


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    #120
    KungPao
    Registered Users Posts: 4,781 ✭✭✭KungPao


    Fanciful thinking probably, but I'd like the RED line to continue from the Square to Tallaght Village - Old Bawn - Firhouse - Scholartown - Ballboden - and meet up with the GREEN line in the general Dundrum Area.

    No rail in that area and terrible buses (looking at you number 75), would be very convenient and would surely be a money maker - a lot of people in those areas.


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    #121
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,560 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    KungPao wrote: »
    Fanciful thinking probably, but I'd like the RED line to continue from the Square to Tallaght Village - Old Bawn - Firhouse - Scholartown - Ballboden - and meet up with the GREEN line in the general Dundrum Area.

    No rail in that area and terrible buses (looking at you number 75), would be very convenient and would surely be a money maker - a lot of people in those areas.

    How exactly is the 75 "terrible"?

    Since the timetable change in 2009 it has been extremely reliable - perhaps you can outline why that is an issue?


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