No invoice for decorating job

Big Cheese · 28-08-2014 9:31am

Regardless of whether the decorator is registered for VAT or not, he did agree to provide a receipt for the works carried out. This receipt does mot necessarily need to be a VAT receipt but a receipt for the transaction none the less.

If there were issues with the work down the line (paint peeling or discolouring) then the customer would need a receipt to prove the work was carried out by that decorator, for an agreed price, which was paid in full.

Finally, peopl need to wake up a little bit. It seems to be a theme running through most of these replies that avoiding paying tax is acceptable if he gave a good price ( which you are assuming). Does your company wave your PRSI, Income Tax, Pension Levy, USC if you do a good job? I doubt it very much!!!!

A lot of decent, honest tradesmen are trying to make a living and are competing with people who pay no tax, have no insurance and as a resukt can offer better prices. On the surface this may seem great for consumers, but wait until one falls off your roof!!

If he agreed on a receipt. Get the receipt! If he did not specify VAT then it will not have it on it.

mrcheez · 28-08-2014 10:45am

davo10 wrote: »

I know OP will argue that the price paid was the agreed price, but somewhere along the line he was more than likely asked "how will you be paying?" To which he probably replied "cash" and then the price was given, this is the way these types of quotes/transactions work.

No the exact wording of the text message is: "Receipt will be no problem and please pay in cash" (I was going to pay via cheque).

So no matter how you look at it, whether they want to charge VAT or not, I am due to receive a receipt that was promised to me.

Normally I am very careful about the tradesmen I go for, in particular for sensitive jobs that could affect my home insurance (like plumbers etc), but thought I'd take a chance on a decorator.

Interestingly enough, I've only had such problems with Irish tradesmen, the foreign ones have been very honest and forthcoming. But that's another story.

mrcheez · 28-08-2014 10:47am

GrumpyMe wrote: »

I don’t know why he can’t just issue you with a piece of paper to say “Received on 31/07/2014 from MrCheez - €xxx.xx Signed Dec O’Rator” as promised...

That would actually suit me fine if he isn't registered for VAT.

I've made this clear to him.

If needs be I'll just create my own invoice and put in their details, and try to get them to sign it (perhaps they are dyslexic? No joke.)

mrcheez · 28-08-2014 10:50am

Big Cheese wrote: »

If there were issues with the work down the line (paint peeling or discolouring) then the customer would need a receipt to prove the work was carried out by that decorator, for an agreed price, which was paid in full.

That's primarily the reason I want the receipt.

JimsAlterEgo · 28-08-2014 1:48pm

mrcheez wrote: »

That's primarily the reason I want the receipt.

perhaps tell him that you ar not looking for a VAT receipt

mrcheez · 28-08-2014 4:00pm

JimsAlterEgo wrote: »

perhaps tell him that you ar not looking for a VAT receipt

Post #34

mrcheez wrote: »

That would actually suit me fine if he isn't registered for VAT.

I've made this clear to him.

Sunny Dayz · 28-08-2014 4:07pm

mrcheez wrote: »

No the exact wording of the text message is: "Receipt will be no problem and please pay in cash" (I was going to pay via cheque).

If you were going to pay him a cheque, why didn't you insist on pay him the cheque so. Make up some excuse about not paying in cash (security, atm out of order, limit on atm withdrawls etc).

In relation to the receipt - you could have handed him a piece of paper and a pen and got him to write "received with thanks €xxx from Mr. Cheez on date, signed Tradesman".

sconhome · 28-08-2014 5:07pm

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

If you were going to pay him a cheque, why didn't you insist on pay him the cheque so. Make up some excuse about not paying in cash (security, atm out of order, limit on atm withdrawls etc).

Interesting comments across the board.

OP you are entitled to a receipt whether the contractor is VAT registered or not. Some people like receipts to keep track of household expenses, not necessarily to claim VAT for private work through business or messing like that.

Re the comment above, how you pay him is up to you but it is also possible that the contractor asked for cash inorder to avoid a cheque being tied up in the bank for clearing. It is not beyond the realms of possiblities that they have been burned by bounced cheques in the past which is why they insist on cash.

Also may have needed cash to pay wages etc.

No excuse for not scribbling out "Received with thanks...€x, Joe Bloggs"

Company have been in done the job, can you email them? Put your request in writing whilst also idnetifying the snags that a revisit was promised and requesting details on 'defects liability period' if any.

dudara · 28-08-2014 5:13pm

OK - it's clear that this is not about having a VAT receipt. The OP is simply seeking a receipt.

No further off-topic comments. Please address the actual request.

dudara

mrcheez · 28-08-2014 8:12pm

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

If you were going to pay him a cheque, why didn't you insist on pay him the cheque so. Make up some excuse about not paying in cash (security, atm out of order, limit on atm withdrawls etc).

because...

AKW wrote: »

Also may have needed cash to pay wages etc.

as above.

But it was a little more complicated than just "job finished / pay cash". If that was the case I would have said, yes please write down a receipt, as I normally do for other jobs.

Problem this time is that I paid a portion of the cash, and the balance once the rest of the work was done. One of the labourers finished the rest of the work a few days later and said he had to pick up the balance (he wouldn't have been in the position to write a receipt).

Anyway, I've written both emails and phone contact is non-existent as phone isn't being answered plus I'd rather avoid getting into a vocal fighting match until I knew where I stood after posting here.

So I guess I have enough to go on to pursue it over the phone now. cheers.

fred funk }{ · 01-09-2014 9:42pm

Just to note. Just because he wants to be paid in cash doesn't mean he's avoiding tax.

I know several trades people who got badly burnt with cheques bouncing so unless they know the person extremely well they demand cash as payment.

Hootanany · 03-09-2014 5:54pm

Was it an expensive painting job? Did you not check out his previous work was he recommended, was his the cheapest estimate. Just trying to get some background.?

mrcheez · 03-09-2014 6:18pm

Fairly. Yes I did and yes. Not cheapest, selected them because they appeared the most legitimate company and I didn't fancy a cash job sort of thing.

Go figure.

UPDATE: After some persistence he has relented and promised me the receipt. I think it was after I offered to pop over to their premises to pick up the receipt.

2 stroke · 06-09-2014 7:21pm

mrcheez wrote: »

One of the labourers finished the rest of the work a few days later and said he had to pick up the balance (he wouldn't have been in the position to write a receipt).

I'm a labourer and I often collect the balance due and write receipts. Sometimes issues like this arise. My employer is tax and vat compliant. I'd like to address some of the issues here as apply in my employment.

Thread title refers to no invoice, did the op mistakenly ask for an invoice instead of a reciept? As a labourer I cannot issue an invoice, as I cannot issue credit, they are printed by computer to all credit customers, these have accounts and get 30 days credit. Cash price means no credit, but can be paid by cash, cheque or card, cheques are only refused from families that have previously presented dodgy ones. My employer will supply an invoice to a cash customer on request, only if the balance is paid in full. Credit customers must set up an account and provide bank and trade references. Before adoption of this policy several people in business have taken 30+ days credit on works outside their business.
If anyone feels that a business isnt tax compliant, report them. It won't do a legitimate business any harm, the pain of dealing with the odd audit is compensated by the reduction of competition in the black economy.

mrcheez · 08-09-2014 12:09am

I asked for a receipt, thread title isn't correct.

Incidentally who do you report them to?

mrcheez · 08-09-2014 12:16am

btw I received an email from them saying:

"Receipt"
(Description of job)
(Cost of job)
"Regards (decorator's name)"

It didn't actually say "payment received on (date)" or anything. Is this considered a valid receipt, or does it need to be a physically-signed piece of paper?

WildCardDoW · 08-09-2014 12:37pm

My dad is a plumber and an invoice would normally be a headed piece of paper with his vat number on it and a details of the material cost and job cost. It's been a while since I looked at one though!

i.e.

"WildCardDoW Plumbing"
vat no. 12345678C
Mobile: 08XXXXXXXX

Invoice: Client Name, Address

To supply and fit:

To plumb and fit:

Cost of labour:

So anything along those lines would look OK to my untrained eyes, it would be fairly similar for a decorater, i.e.

To supply and paint:
4 cans of Dulux white paint for Main Bedroom

Cost of labour:

mrcheez · 08-09-2014 12:41pm

Hmm that looks more like an invoice than a receipt I would have thought.

Invoice is saying "here's the price for the job, please pay"

Receipt says "payment received"

Anyway I've since asked for the following which I assume is not being unreasonable...

A physical piece of paper with the following details:

- Full Name
- Business Address
- Phone number
- Job description
- Cost
- Acknowledgement of payment received in full and Date payment received
- Signature

WildCardDoW · 08-09-2014 2:12pm

Yeah, sorry didn't realise you were looking for a receipt not an invoice, not sure if that is common to be honest? My dad would do a lot of work for company buildings and premises and I've never had to help him out with that. He does use a few different accounting type programs though that I've made sure not to get any experience in! Ha

Mountjoy Mugger · 08-09-2014 2:49pm

I'd reply back and ask him to confirm there's no outstanding balance. That should suffice.

mrcheez · 08-09-2014 3:26pm

It really doesn't help things that I have receipts for all expenditure this month, and then for this decorating job I have a few piecemeal emails.

I need a single piece of paper with everything clearly laid out, it's not a big ask.

Melendez · 08-09-2014 3:36pm

This post has been deleted.

mrcheez · 08-09-2014 3:37pm

Melendez wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I'm actually probably going to have to do that. It seems pretty clear they've never written a receipt (or an invoice I imagine) in their lives.

Curious to know how they manage their books :rolleyes:

Might be interesting to use this https://rightsignature.com/

No invoice for decorating job

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