Hurler of the Year 2012

dirtyden · 25-05-2012 7:41pm

Martin567 wrote: »

Yes, you're right. The person who set up this poll and didn't include Richie Power would obviously be a lot more knowledgeable.:rolleyes:

Sorry Vincent, your really great.

dirtyden · 25-05-2012 7:54pm

The poll is a bit early but is reasonable discussion fodder for a forum like this.

For a supposed serious GAA journalist if that is all he can trot out in the run up to the championship, that is just laziness. A typically lazy article from this journalist. Although he is not atypical of GAA journalists. Most seem to work from behind their desks rather than actually going out and finding something interesting.

A 12 year old could have done a similar job to that particular kilkenny are great piece. I think most of us already know that.

premierstone · 28-05-2012 10:19am

Mountainlad wrote: »

Haha what is Conor O'Mahony doing in that list by the way, or Conor McGrath? O'Mahony is decent, but no where near that good and while Conor McGrath is excellent, he plays for Clare.

premierstone wrote: »

COM on the list is hardly that absurd, he is the CB for the second favourites for the AI, has 2 allstars in that position and at 27 should be in he's prime, I dont think he will win it myself but certainly stranger things have happened.

Not so absurd now Mountain

thought Conor was excellent yesterday when all around him was falling apart.

Mountainlad · 28-05-2012 11:34am

premierstone wrote: »

Not so absurd now Mountain thought Conor was excellent yesterday when all around him was falling apart.

Didn't see the game yesterday (conveniently enough), I did smile when I saw the man of the match presentation last night. Still, he was marking a debutant, there'll be stiffer tests ahead I have no doubt. Player of the year, much like the all-ireland was never won in May, you know that much yourself I'm very sure.

premierstone · 28-05-2012 12:15pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Didn't see the game yesterday (conveniently enough), I did smile when I saw the man of the match presentation last night. Still, he was marking a debutant, there'll be stiffer tests ahead I have no doubt. Player of the year, much like the all-ireland was never won in May, you know that much yourself I'm very sure.

Of course I do, but I still couldnt let the occasion pass without comment

Mountainlad · 28-05-2012 12:38pm

premierstone wrote: »

Of course I do, but I still couldnt let the occasion pass without comment

Haha I have no doubt in the same situation I couldn't either....and you can be sure of it now anyway! :pac:

dastardly00 · 22-08-2012 12:36pm

The last post in this thread was nearly 3 months ago at the start of the championship. So I'm wondering who does everyone think will win HOTY now?

In the poll, Eoin Larkin is top, but his form has been quite poor in the championship. Joe Canning is 2nd in the poll. If Galway beat KK in the AI final, I think Joe has HOTY wrapped up. Maher from Tipp is 3rd in the poll and he definitely won't win it.

From a KK point of view, I'm not sure who has been our best performer in the championship this season.

Obviously a player's performance in the AI final has a huge influence on who wins HOTY.

phkk · 22-08-2012 1:00pm

dastardly00 wrote: »

The last post in this thread was nearly 3 months ago at the start of the championship. So I'm wondering who does everyone think will win HOTY now?

In the poll, Eoin Larkin is top, but his form has been quite poor in the championship. Joe Canning is 2nd in the poll. If Galway beat KK in the AI final, I think Joe has HOTY wrapped up. Maher from Tipp is 3rd in the poll and he definitely won't win it.

From a KK point of view, I'm not sure who has been our best performer in the championship this season.

Obviously a player's performance in the AI final has a huge influence on who wins HOTY.

Think from a Kilkenny perspective, it's hard to see who could win it. Taggy has played well the last two games but missed the first two. Tommy Walsh was so poor against Galway in the Leinster final, it would be hard to justify. Apart from the Limerick game, Henry hasn't set the world alight.
For me, I think Joe Canning has been the HOY so far but alot can hinge on All-Ireland day. He has been in brilliant form and nobody would begrudge him if he were to win it. Fergal Moore has played great and was MoM against Cork but I've been really impressed with Johnny Coen. He should definitely claim YHOY but in truth should go hard on the senior accolade. He has been instrumental all year in snuffing out key players and sweeping across both lines of defence, I love watching him hurl!

Pighead · 22-08-2012 1:08pm

If Kilkenny win All Ireland Hogan will get Player of the Year and if Galway win it Cannings bags the prize. And that's not an 'in my opinion' either. That's fact.

MrJoeSoap · 22-08-2012 1:15pm

phkk wrote: »

Think from a Kilkenny perspective, it's hard to see who could win it. Taggy has played well the last two games but missed the first two. Tommy Walsh was so poor against Galway in the Leinster final, it would be hard to justify. Apart from the Limerick game, Henry hasn't set the world alight.
For me, I think Joe Canning has been the HOY so far but alot can hinge on All-Ireland day. He has been in brilliant form and nobody would begrudge him if he were to win it. Fergal Moore has played great and was MoM against Cork but I've been really impressed with Johnny Coen. He should definitely claim YHOY but in truth should go hard on the senior accolade. He has been instrumental all year in snuffing out key players and sweeping across both lines of defence, I love watching him hurl!

+1 for Johnny Coen as young hurler of the year. Arguably their best player on the field for the Kilkenny and Cork games. Fantastic defender to watch, as Ollie Canning was for many years.

For the senior accolade, once Joe Canning puts in a good performance in the final I feel that it's all his. Nobody from Kilkenny has stood out head and shoulders above the rest, though Tommy Walsh has been fantastic in every game bar the Leinster Final and should probably be a good shout if he has a good final. Cyril Donnellan could be a good outside bet given how impressive he was in the Leinster Final, has 1-10 from play in three and a bit matches. Very unlucky to have missed most of the semi-final through injury. I'm very surprised to see Brian Hogan in second in the betting, though that he was very lucky not to be sent off in the Leinster Final. Has been solid otherwise though.

David Burke had a fantastic year also, has scored from play in every game so far, and the Cork game was the only one he didn't score a goal in. 4-6 from play by my count. Honourable mentions to the youngsters Conor Lehane, Luke O'Farrell and Darren Sweetnam from Cork, Tony Kelly from Clare, Danny Sutcliffe from Dublin (in an otherwise awful year) and quite a few more I'm sure.

(PS - I realise the Kilkenny panel has a wealth of young players worthy of mention, but everyone will know them by the end of September 9th anyway I'm sure)

premierstone · 22-08-2012 1:18pm

Pighead wrote: »

If Kilkenny win All Ireland Hogan will get Player of the Year and if Galway win it Cannings bags the prize. And that's not an 'in my opinion' either. That's fact.

Brian Hogan??? Missed the Limerick match and was anilated by Cyrill Donnellan and Niall Burke in the Leinster final and Tipperary choose not to play a centre forward against him he has done nothing to merit the award tbh, picking the top two in the betting is'nt exactly insightfull

AGC · 22-08-2012 1:18pm

Canning at 5/2 is a great bet.

MrJoeSoap · 22-08-2012 1:19pm

Pighead wrote: »

If Kilkenny win All Ireland Hogan will get Player of the Year and if Galway win it Cannings bags the prize. And that's not an 'in my opinion' either. That's fact.

I don't know, if Kilkenny win it and Canning puts in a classic Canning performance (as against Cork in 2008) I could see him being given it. Hogan hasn't stuck out that much to warrant being second favourite, in my opinion.

MrJoeSoap · 22-08-2012 1:20pm

AGC wrote: »

Canning at 5/2 is a great bet.

He was 3/1 before the second semi-final, and has since come in to 5/2. That says a lot to me.

Also, he's 13/8 with Boyles.

AGC · 22-08-2012 1:21pm

MrJoeSoap wrote: »

He was 3/1 before the second semi-final, and has since come in to 5/2. That says a lot to me.

If you compare the hurler of the year prices to the footballer of the year prices youcan see they don't have a clue who will get the football one.

Bernard Brogan is fav at 11/2

MrJoeSoap · 22-08-2012 1:22pm

AGC wrote: »

If you compare the hurler of the year prices to the footballer of the year prices youcan see they don't have a clue who will get the football one.

Bernard Brogan is fav at 11/2

And Bernard Brogan has had possibly his worst year to date in a Dublin jersey...

Though in fairness, the football championship has the semi-finals still to come, so you can't expect the betting to be that clear at the moment.

jacko · 22-08-2012 1:37pm

Cant believe how Tommy Walsh is even considered for HOTY panel. He's had poor year. Roasted against Galway in Leinster final (well the entire KK team was in the first half) and wasn't up to much against Dublin in the league either. Did well against Limerick but then I wouldn't have considered Limerick up to much.

The Semi final Lar Corbett debacle meant he didn't do any hurling there either.

Tommy's been a great player for years, maybe people are just taking it for granted he's always one of the main men when kk play but baring a MOTM performance in the final he shouldn't be anywhere near an allstar candidate let alone HOTY

premierstone · 22-08-2012 1:40pm

jacko wrote: »

Cant believe how Tommy Walsh is even considered for HOTY panel. He's had poor year. Roasted against Galway in Leinster final (well the entire KK team was in the first half) and wasn't up to much against Dublin in the league either. Did well against Limerick but then I wouldn't have considered Limerick up to much.

The Semi final Lar Corbett debacle meant he didn't do any hurling there either.

Tommy's been a great player for years, maybe people are just taking it for granted he's always one of the main men when kk play but baring a MOTM performance in the final he shouldn't be anywhere near an allstar candidate let alone HOTY

Joe Canning, Henry Shefflin and Eoin Kelly have all received very 'soft' all stars in recent years and there's no reason why teh same wont happen with Tommy, media darling's I think is the term, not the players themselves fault of course but highly annoying.

Badabing · 22-08-2012 1:42pm

He had a 8/10 v Cork in League final, good game v Dublin in Leinster Semi final. So he'll surely get an All Star nomination at least.

Mr. Boo · 22-08-2012 1:56pm

+1 Johnny Coen for YHOY. He had a massive game in Leinster final, and the secon half against Cork imo.

dastardly00 · 22-08-2012 2:04pm

Pighead wrote: »

If Kilkenny win All Ireland Hogan will get Player of the Year and if Galway win it Cannings bags the prize. And that's not an 'in my opinion' either. That's fact.

Do you know this weekend's Lotto numbers as well?

phkk · 22-08-2012 2:04pm

Joe Canning, Henry Shefflin and Eoin Kelly have all received very 'soft' all stars in recent years and there's no reason why teh same wont happen with Tommy, media darling's I think is the term, not the players themselves fault of course but highly annoying.[/Quote]

Agree with you 100% re soft All-Stars. Henry has definitely benefitted from this, particularly last year when I didn't think he deserved one to be honest. As regards Tommy HoY, I think he'll be doing very very well to get an All-Star.

Fireball07 · 22-08-2012 2:24pm

Nobody thinks Coen could win HotY outright? Canning's been good but Coen has been Galway's best performer imo. Obvously depending on the final.

Kojak · 22-08-2012 2:39pm

Fireball07 wrote: »

Nobody thinks Coen could win HotY outright? Canning's been good but Coen has been Galway's best performer imo. Obvously depending on the final.

NO way Coen will will HOTY - the powers that be wouldn't give the 2 awards (HOTY and YHOTY) to the same lad. At the moment, Canning is in pole position to win HOTY, and Coen is almost guaraneteed it as there are very few (if any) U-21's on KK's starting 15, and even if there is, none are as prominent for KK as Coen is for Galway imo.

premierstone · 22-08-2012 2:45pm

Fireball07 wrote: »

Nobody thinks Coen could win HotY outright? Canning's been good but Coen has been Galway's best performer imo. Obvously depending on the final.

Brendan Maher should have got both awards in 2010, but had to settle for the YHOTY, its just the done thing you won't win both in the same year.

Fireball07 · 22-08-2012 4:09pm

premierstone wrote: »

Brendan Maher should have got both awards in 2010, but had to settle for the YHOTY, its just the done thing you won't win both in the same year.

Yeah but they could just give YHOTY to someone else...Niall Donohue or someone.

cgpg5 · 22-08-2012 5:10pm

Fireball07 wrote: »

Yeah but they could just give YHOTY to someone else...Niall Donohue or someone.

Think you have to be under 21? Although I could be wrong.

Is it just judged on senior championship? Or do they take under 21 into account?

Mountainlad · 22-08-2012 5:12pm

Fireball07 wrote: »

Yeah but they could just give YHOTY to someone else...Niall Donohue or someone.

They could have given young hurler of the year to Noel McGrath.

I agree he probably has been Galway's outstanding player, but then Joe Canning has been immense too.

And Brendan Maher's performances in 2010 were up there with the best I've seen from a player in an individual year, and he was only 20!

Mountainlad · 22-08-2012 5:13pm

cgpg5 wrote: »

Think you have to be under 21? Although I could be wrong.

Is it just judged on senior championship? Or do they take under 21 into account?

Just on Senior Championship, but you do have to be u21

premierstone · 22-08-2012 5:13pm

Fireball07 wrote: »

Yeah but they could just give YHOTY to someone else...Niall Donohue or someone.

How can you get hurler of the year and not be young hurler of the year, that makes about as much sense as a tactic's seminar with Tommy Dunne and Declan Ryan

cgpg5 · 22-08-2012 5:15pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Just on Senior Championship, but you do have to be u21

In that case Johnny Coen will walk it. Dunno who'd be second Buckley maybe if he plays final?

Fireball07 · 22-08-2012 5:29pm

premierstone wrote: »

How can you get hurler of the year and not be young hurler of the year, that makes about as much sense as a tactic's seminar with Tommy Dunne and Declan Ryan

Well you're right, it is stupid. It doesn't make sense to not give a player the award based on age.

Wrt YPOTY- people expected a lot from Lehane, Hannon, Dowling, Sutcliffe...none really got going. Dowling was good against Tipp, and scored a lot in the qualifiers but failed to really shine against Clare or Kilkenny. Might be in with a shout of a nomination. Hannon was injured all year, Sutcliffe was knocked out early on, Lehane had a lot of injury problems and was never as brilliant as he was in the league.

Does Conor McGrath qualify? Could get a nomination too if that's the case.

As for HOTY...the final will decide it too, I suppose. If Canning fails to shine and some Kilkenny players has a very good game, they could take it. David Burke should have a chance too.

Mountainlad · 22-08-2012 6:20pm

cgpg5 wrote: »

In that case Johnny Coen will walk it. Dunno who'd be second Buckley maybe if he plays final?

He probably will win it provided he's not decimated in the final.

As Fireball has mentioned, a lot of players that were expected to deliver didn't. Niall Burke is also a contender.

I know it probably sounds biased, but I think Stephen O'Keeffe was excellent this year and given your hard pushed to find three, he could get a nomination. Should be in contention for the all-star too. I would rate him to have had a better season than Nash, but Nash will probably get it as the Cork token all-star.

Fireball07 · 22-08-2012 9:31pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

He probably will win it provided he's not decimated in the final.

As Fireball has mentioned, a lot of players that were expected to deliver didn't. Niall Burke is also a contender.

I know it probably sounds biased, but I think Stephen O'Keeffe was excellent this year and given your hard pushed to find three, he could get a nomination. Should be in contention for the all-star too. I would rate him to have had a better season than Nash, but Nash will probably get it as the Cork token all-star.

I didn't realise that SOK was that young. Good keeper alright, could easily get 2nd or 3rd in YHOTY...I'd agree Nash will probably get the all-star.

I don't think Niall Burke has produced enough to be a real contender, unless he has a big final. I was expecting so much more from him, because he has the ability.

dirtyden · 22-08-2012 9:44pm

premierstone wrote: »

How can you get hurler of the year and not be young hurler of the year, that makes about as much sense as a tactic's seminar with Tommy Dunne and Declan Ryan

It would not make sense but the poster is correct. Logic has no part in the allstar/HOTY/YHOTY process.

daddydick · 22-08-2012 10:09pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

Just on Senior Championship, but you do have to be u21

That is incorrect - you have to be either in your debut season OR under 21

cgpg5 · 22-08-2012 10:26pm

dirtyden wrote: »

It would not make sense but the poster is correct. Logic has no part in the allstar/HOTY/YHOTY process.

This is correct. It is a strange award. A lot of the time a stand out performance in one solitary game (AI final) can be enough. Then you look at the likes of John Mullane who does it in every game for waterford, about 4/5 games last season and the year before for example but when you're knocked out before the final it seems that you don't qualify.

The only time I remember a non-finallist player getting it was Bernard Brogan in football.

Fireball07 · 22-08-2012 10:30pm

cgpg5 wrote: »

This is correct. It is a strange award. A lot of the time a stand out performance in one solitary game (AI final) can be enough. Then you look at the likes of John Mullane who does it in every game for waterford, about 4/5 games last season and the year before for example but when you're knocked out before the final it seems that you don't qualify.

The only time I remember a non-finallist player getting it was Bernard Brogan in football.

Dan Shanahan in 2007.

cgpg5 · 22-08-2012 10:32pm

Fireball07 wrote: »

Dan Shanahan in 2007.

You're right. But in fairness Waterford had a great year then winning Munster if I'm correct after a replay (extra game) or have I the wrong year?

Mountainlad · 22-08-2012 10:51pm

daddydick wrote: »

That is incorrect - you have to be either in your debut season OR under 21

What if you were 27? You'd hardly be young player of the year then?

cgpg5 wrote: »

You're right. But in fairness Waterford had a great year then winning Munster if I'm correct after a replay (extra game) or have I the wrong year?

Nah, 2007 we won the league and bet Limerick by 9 points in Munster Final, before losing to them in the All-Ireland semi by 5 points.

2010 we beat Cork in the Munster Final after a replay.

cgpg5 · 22-08-2012 10:54pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

What if you were 27? You'd hardly be young player of the year then?

Nah, 2007 we won the league and bet Limerick by 9 points in Munster Final, before losing to them in the All-Ireland semi by 5 points.

2010 we beat Cork in the Munster Final after a replay.

Hmm there was indeed a year ye bet Cork maybe 05/06 was abroad for it I remember. May not even have been a replay am a bit asleep today :P

adrian522 · 22-08-2012 10:58pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

What if you were 27? You'd hardly be young player of the year then?

Nah, 2007 we won the league and bet Limerick by 9 points in Munster Final, before losing to them in the All-Ireland semi by 5 points.

2010 we beat Cork in the Munster Final after a replay.

Pretty sure in 07 Waterford beat cork in the AI quarter final after a replay. The year where donal og was penalised for lying on the ball and the free resulted in the equalising score late on.

Mountainlad · 22-08-2012 11:05pm

adrian522 wrote: »

Pretty sure in 07 Waterford beat cork in the AI quarter final after a replay. The year where donal og was penalised for lying on the ball and the free resulted in the equalising score late on.

You are indeed correct, that's probably what he was thinking of. I thought he meant 2010 because he said Munster Final.

cgpg5 · 22-08-2012 11:35pm

Mountainlad wrote: »

You are indeed correct, that's probably what he was thinking of. I thought he meant 2010 because he said Munster Final.

Yeah meant that. Sorry was completely thinking from the top of my head so didn't remember which game/ if it was right year

Mountainlad · 22-08-2012 11:44pm

cgpg5 wrote: »

Yeah meant that. Sorry was completely thinking from the top of my head so didn't remember which game/ if it was right year

No worries, hard to keep track of us beating Cork, happens so often

Fireball07 · 23-08-2012 1:00am

Mountainlad wrote: »

Nah, 2007 we won the league and bet Limerick by 9 points in Munster Final, before losing to them in the All-Ireland semi by 5 points.

2010 we beat Cork in the Munster Final after a replay.

I don't want to go off-topic but looking back on it, I think both sides would have been happier if those results had been swapped. Don't get me wrong, that win over Waterford is probably the best game I've ever been at from a Limerick pov, it was unbelievable. But...the last Munster we won was 96...I don't even remember that properly. Waterford have won loads of Munsters (well a good few). Realistically we were never going to beat KK...Waterford felt that was their year to do it.

There's always next year though. And at the moment when the final whistle went, I'd never have swapped that feeling of elation for anything (bar an all-ireland victory).

But back on topic...so technically someone like Paudie O'Brien could win YHOTY even though he's 22? I'm quite disappointed Hannon didn't get a proper run at it, I really thought this would be his year to shine.

Mountainlad · 23-08-2012 1:10am

Fireball07 wrote: »

I don't want to go off-topic but looking back on it, I think both sides would have been happier if those results had been swapped. Don't get me wrong, that win over Waterford is probably the best game I've ever been at from a Limerick pov, it was unbelievable. But...the last Munster we won was 96...I don't even remember that properly. Waterford have won loads of Munsters (well a good few). Realistically we were never going to beat KK...Waterford felt that was their year to do it.

There's always next year though. And at the moment when the final whistle went, I'd never have swapped that feeling of elation for anything (bar an all-ireland victory).

But back on topic...so technically someone like Paudie O'Brien could win YHOTY even though he's 22? I'm quite disappointed Hannon didn't get a proper run at it, I really thought this would be his year to shine.

But sure Hannon could still win it next year!

Agree about 2007, but only if we'd won the all-ireland. To me, a victory in Munster still means a lot.

Kojak · 23-08-2012 2:01am

Fireball07 wrote: »

Dan Shanahan in 2007.

Also, if I'm not mistaken, Tony Browne won Hurler of the Year in 1998, despite the fact that Waterford didn't make the final.

MrJoeSoap · 23-08-2012 2:05am

Kojak wrote: »

Also, if I'm not mistaken, Tony Browne won Hurler of the Year in 1998, despite the fact that Waterford didn't make the final.

He did indeed. Some very scant consolation for Waterford in recent years.

MrJoeSoap · 23-08-2012 2:08am

Fireball07 wrote: »

I don't want to go off-topic but looking back on it, I think both sides would have been happier if those results had been swapped. Don't get me wrong, that win over Waterford is probably the best game I've ever been at from a Limerick pov, it was unbelievable. But...the last Munster we won was 96...I don't even remember that properly. Waterford have won loads of Munsters (well a good few). Realistically we were never going to beat KK...Waterford felt that was their year to do it.

I was in Australia for the 2007 championship, and after the epic games vs Cork, a win against Limerick felt like a formality to a certain extent. I'm not saying that is how the county felt at all, but it just felt like it was meant to be. Fair play to Limerick, the semi-final was a blitz, but the following years win against Tipp more than made up for it. If only the finals were decided on the flip of a coin...

Hurler of the Year 2012

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