Metallica Superthread -All Metallica discussion goes in here

bnt · 23-10-2014 1:33am

Just happened to notice: today (23/10) is Robert Trujillo's 50th birthday. Here's to the Golden Years! :pac:

Lithium93_ · 25-10-2014 4:47pm

Metallica are playing at this year's Blizzcon

http://www.metallica.com/news/blizzcon.asp

briany · 26-10-2014 1:08pm

hidinginthebush wrote: »

True that, in a similar vein I'd have never picked up the guitar if not for Kirk, sloppiness and all. Listening to the likes of Paul Gilbert or Steve Vai to name but a few, it's night and day on their technique, and how they can play very clean, yet very fast at the same time, but I'll always hold a special place for Kirk for inspiring me to take up guitar in the first place.

Let's be honest - most of what the likes of Vai and Gilbert put out is wanky pretentious faff. It's the culmination of rock taking itself far too seriously. They put the time and dedication in to become that good and then write a lot of boring music (to listen to) as far as I can tell. They missed the memo while they were in their rooms practicing that the song is king. Steve 'I had to spend two days meditating to record For the Love of God' Vai. Ha! You can just imagine him sitting in some room filled with candles, Lotus legged, eyes closed, thinking - 'yes this how you prepare to play some licks over looping backing'.

*looks around to check for angry instrumental guitar rock fans*

The reason why Kirk's been an inspiration - he was never the best, but he is part of a
band who've written some damn good songs.

hidinginthebush · 26-10-2014 1:39pm

briany wrote: »

Let's be honest - most of what the likes of Vai and Gilbert put out is wanky pretentious faff. It's the culmination of rock taking itself far too seriously. They put the time and dedication in to become that good and then write a lot of boring music (to listen to) as far as I can tell. They missed the memo while they were in their rooms practicing that the song is king. Steve 'I had to spend two days meditating to record For the Love of God' Vai. Ha! You can just imagine him sitting in some room filled with candles, Lotus legged, eyes closed, thinking - 'yes this how you prepare to play some licks over looping backing'.

*looks around to check for angry instrumental guitar rock fans*

The reason why Kirk's been an inspiration - he was never the best, but he is part of a
band who've written some damn good songs.

Don't forget the fan blowing in his face!

jack presley · 29-10-2014 5:14pm

More procrastination I see

@Metallica: We'll be playing on @LateLateShowCBS for an entire week starting Monday, November 17th! #LateLateShow http://t.co/p1N3YO146v

At least it's not our late late show. I wouldn't think Tubs and the blue rinse brigade could take it.

Lithium93_ · 29-10-2014 5:21pm

A friend asked me this about a week ago, would i prefer a 32 song (Similar to how Load & Reload were released, but a year apart) double album from Metallica or a 10/12 song album. Still haven't figured out my response.... So i'll throw it out here for discussion

Who would be in favor of a double album? Or should Metallica just stick to a regular 10/12 song album & an E.P release a few years after the album.

Lithium93_ · 29-10-2014 5:22pm

jack presley wrote: »

More procrastination I see

@Metallica: We'll be playing on @LateLateShowCBS for an entire week starting Monday, November 17th! #LateLateShow http://t.co/p1N3YO146v

At least it's not our late late show. I wouldn't think Tubs and the blue rinse brigade could take it.

Seriously, who keeps suggesting these ideas to Metallica, and if it's their management, damn them for causing the procrastination.

jack presley · 29-10-2014 5:25pm

All well and good recording 2 albums worth of material but only release the best 70 minutes or so on the album. The rest should be kept for b-sides of singles.

It's what they should have done with Load/ReLoad. Songs like Attitude, Poor Twisted Me and a few others should never have been viewed as being good enough to be on an album.

hidinginthebush · 29-10-2014 5:55pm

Single album, it'll mean more work went into that album. A single album of the load era would have been epic. Case in point: Use Your Illusion I / II. Could have been one incredible album, instead there's a ridiculous amount of filler on both.

jack presley · 29-10-2014 6:17pm

Lithium93_ wrote: »

Seriously, who keeps suggesting these ideas to Metallica, and if it's their management, damn them for causing the procrastination.

A residency at a Las Vegas hotel is about the only thing they haven't done yet so probably expect one of them before we see a new album.

If it's good enough for Celine Dion and Guns n Roses, surely it's on their list of ways to make money.

KH25 · 29-10-2014 7:54pm

hidinginthebush wrote: »

Single album, it'll mean more work went into that album. A single album of the load era would have been epic. Case in point: Use Your Illusion I / II. Could have been one incredible album, instead there's a ridiculous amount of filler on both.

Id take Load/Reload over Use your Illusion 1 and 2 all day.

lord lucan · 29-10-2014 8:15pm

jack presley wrote: »

A residency at a Las Vegas hotel is about the only thing they haven't done yet so probably expect one of them before we see a new album.

If it's good enough for Celine Dion and Guns n Roses, surely it's on their list of ways to make money.

It's definitely a possibility given that def leppard already done it and they both share the same management,q prime. I really hope they don't though,i'll lose a bit more respect for them if they do.

AllGunsBlazing · 29-10-2014 11:15pm

The constant stalling is due to the band themselves imo.

I'd question their confidence in being able to turn out another ten or twelve songs required for an album - and then stand over those songs and say this is our best possible work. In short, the self belief is gone.

Expect more of these novelty performances/tours and then watch them hang it up for good.

I've stated this before but I'll repeat it here again; At best, one more studio album is all we're gonna hear from these guys....

nyarlothothep · 30-10-2014 12:05pm

briany wrote: »

Let's be honest - most of what the likes of Vai and Gilbert put out is wanky pretentious faff. It's the culmination of rock taking itself far too seriously. They put the time and dedication in to become that good and then write a lot of boring music (to listen to) as far as I can tell. They missed the memo while they were in their rooms practicing that the song is king. Steve 'I had to spend two days meditating to record For the Love of God' Vai. Ha! You can just imagine him sitting in some room filled with candles, Lotus legged, eyes closed, thinking - 'yes this how you prepare to play some licks over looping backing'.

*looks around to check for angry instrumental guitar rock fans*

The reason why Kirk's been an inspiration - he was never the best, but he is part of a
band who've written some damn good songs.

Kirk is a good guitarist, put him up against most 70s guitar virtuosos and he's at the same level if not slightly better. The problem is that he plays in metal which has a huge propensity for dick waving competitions in guitar playing, drumming etc. Then of course he will always come up short because he's not a technician. But his solos are incredibly melodic and memorable, that's x100 more important than superfast, incredibly accurate alternate picking, sweep picking and so on.

Motley Crue · 30-10-2014 2:42pm

Anybody else see that Craig Ferguson has asked them to join him during his last week on TV? It means they'll essentially be the "House Band" every night. 2014 has really been the year for getting the brand out there, maybe they're trying to replace KISS as the generic media known Metal band!

ush · 30-10-2014 4:34pm

Motley Crue wrote: »

maybe they're trying to replace KISS as the generic media known Metal band!

...they achieved that years ago.

lord lucan · 31-10-2014 12:41am

Seems they're going to remaster KEA & RTL according to the news story on Metallica.com. I'm a bit surprised at that as i figured they would wait until they call it a day before going down that road. I'll reserve judgement until i hear it,at least it sounds like it won't just be a straight up remaster of the album but will include a lot of extras too.

http://www.metallica.com/news/kill-ride-snapshots.asp

Lithium93_ · 31-10-2014 12:48am

Call me cynical but remastering seems like a bit of a cash grab at this point in time, especially seeing as Metallica still have a good few years in the tank.

hidinginthebush · 31-10-2014 12:48am

lord lucan wrote: »

Seems they're going to remaster KEA & RTL according to the news story on Metallica.com. I'm a bit surprised at that as i figured they would wait until they call it a day before going down that road. I'll reserve judgement until i hear it,at least it sounds like it won't just be a straight up remaster of the album but will include a lot of extras too.

http://www.metallica.com/news/kill-ride-snapshots.asp

It'll be interesting, but I don't think KEA needs any work. It's fantastic as it is. RTL sounds dated on the other hand, but that's a product of the time it was made. My only worry is they do what Pearl jam did on the ten remaster, in that they made it less 90's sounding, reduced the reverb, but brickwalled it at the same time.

I think we can all agree the album that needs a remaster is AJFA. I reckon though they'll go the route of seeing how well the first two sell before spending the money on getting any subsequent albums done.

Edit. Read the article, there could be some cool goodies / early recordings in these!

Lithium93_ · 31-10-2014 12:55am

hidinginthebush wrote: »

It'll be interesting, but I don't think KEA needs any work. It's fantastic as it is. RTL sounds dated on the other hand, but that's a product of the time it was made. My only worry is they do what Pearl jam did on the ten remaster, in that they made it less 90's sounding, reduced the reverb, but brickwalled it at the same time.

I think we can all agree the album that needs a remaster is AJFA. I reckon though they'll go the route of seeing how well the first two sell before spending the money on getting any subsequent albums done.

Edit. Read the article, there could be some cool goodies / early recordings in these!

That's definitely the album that should be looked at in terms of a remaster, only question is, would they bring back Jason to do the bass or just have Robert add the bass. Or could they add Rob's bass playing to the master tapes.

hidinginthebush · 31-10-2014 1:00am

Lithium93_ wrote: »

That's definitely the album that should be looked at in terms of a remaster, only question is, would they bring back Jason to do the bass or just have Robert add the bass. Or could they add Rob's bass playing to the master tapes.

I'd say they'd use Jason's parts. It's a remaster, so once they have the original tapes, there should be no issue with bringing him into the mix more. (Unless I've mistaken what happens during the remastering process, very possible!).

AllGunsBlazing · 31-10-2014 5:48am

A remaster can't make any single instrument sound louder on it's own. That would require a full remix using the multi-track master tape. Although they could equalize the stereo master tape in such a way as to accentuate the bass. But that would have a knock on effect making the other instruments less clear.

Every change made to an album in the mastering phase affects all the instruments and vocals at the same time. It's not that different to messing around with the graphic equalizer on your stereo when a song is playing.

briany · 31-10-2014 1:49pm

hidinginthebush wrote: »

It'll be interesting, but I don't think KEA needs any work. It's fantastic as it is. RTL sounds dated on the other hand, but that's a product of the time it was made. My only worry is they do what Pearl jam did on the ten remaster, in that they made it less 90's sounding, reduced the reverb, but brickwalled it at the same time.

I think we can all agree the album that needs a remaster is AJFA. I reckon though they'll go the route of seeing how well the first two sell before spending the money on getting any subsequent albums done.

Edit. Read the article, there could be some cool goodies / early recordings in these!

AJFA is a totally different case to KEA or RtL. KEA and RtL were products of their time, but they were mixed properly. AJFA was the product of a protracted grieving process. People try to defend the sound on that album but it's essentially missing one quarter of the sound. I don't care if 'Oh, Jason was only really doubling the rhythm parts anyway.' That's what bassists are doing a lot of the time in the rock/metal field. Sonically, that album was a real case of the band cutting off their nose to spite their face, a wrong that needs rectification, if we're talking about doing remixes/masters, and if the band or their management is trying to gauge demand for it by seeing how remasters/mixes of KEA or RtL sell, then they are sorely mistaken.

asteroids over berlin · 31-10-2014 5:35pm

briany wrote: »

AJFA is a totally different case to KEA or RtL. KEA and RtL were products of their time, but they were mixed properly. AJFA was the product of a protracted grieving process. People try to defend the sound on that album but it's essentially missing one quarter of the sound. I don't care if 'Oh, Jason was only really doubling the rhythm parts anyway.' That's what bassists are doing a lot of the time in the rock/metal field. Sonically, that album was a real case of the band cutting off their nose to spite their face, a wrong that needs rectification, if we're talking about doing remixes/masters, and if the band or their management is trying to gauge demand for it by seeing how remasters/mixes of KEA or RtL sell, then they are sorely mistaken.

ajfa is their best album!

briany · 31-10-2014 6:13pm

asteroids over berlin wrote: »

ajfa is their best album!

Doctor Jimbob · 31-10-2014 6:54pm

asteroids over berlin wrote: »

ajfa is their best album!

It's still mixed like shit though.

Lithium93_ · 31-10-2014 6:59pm

Personally, i think Ride The Lightning is Metallica's best album.

AllGunsBlazing · 31-10-2014 7:08pm

To say it's their best album is that person's perogative. Most would say Puppets, but personally I thought that album rehashed a lot of ideas and themes that had already been covered on RTL. For my money AJFA, for all it's flaws, is Metallica at their most ambitious. I had already heard bits of MOP by 1988 but Justice is the album that made me a real fan.

Also at the time of it's release nobody really noticed the lack of bass in the mix. I suspect that metallica fans would have mostly bought that album on cassette or vinyl. Those two mediums have a tendency to add low end to a recording which would compensated for the lack of Jason's bass. I certainly didn't notice it until I finally bought the CD version a few years later.

briany · 31-10-2014 9:33pm

AllGunsBlazing wrote: »

Also at the time of it's release nobody really noticed the lack of bass in the mix. I suspect that metallica fans would have mostly bought that album on cassette or vinyl. Those two mediums have a tendency to add low end to a recording which would compensated for the lack of Jason's bass. I certainly didn't notice it until I finally bought the CD version a few years later.

Fidelity in subsequent mediums has probably brought the issue more to light, but the fact remains that it was just a really crap, sh*tty thing to do as well, and that's what really bugs me about it. Like, if you were in a band and you went in to record an album and two of your band mates went in to mix it themselves and you got the CD and put it on, and then found you were almost nowhere to be heard, you'd be out for blood. I think if it had been anything less than the (soon to be) biggest heavy band in the world, he'd have thought about leaving on principle, or going in to knock some heads, and I think he'd have been within his rights to do so.

Overall, I don't see what the big deal is about doing a remix on AJFA. I'm beginning to suspect that doing so would be tantamount to admitting they made a mistake. What would be next? Fans demanding they be allowed to trade in their old copies for the 'fixed' version? Think of the money they'd lose! But seriously though they should go in and dig out the master tapes, bump up the slider marked 'bass' and use a bit more of the room mic Ramussen had used to get away from the sterile, papery sound the album has.

AllGunsBlazing · 01-11-2014 1:49am

I remember reading an article where Rasmussen said that he wasn't impressed with the final mix and didn't think much of the studio where it was recorded. In particular he hated the recording console (which would be favoured by Bob Rock during the Black album sessions) as well. He thought it sounded sterile and cold. Apparently the album was mixed down to digital tape, which considering the quality of 80's digital technology, may account as well for the album's cold sound.

Also, and this is quite telling, he went on to say that no one else from the band was present when Jason was recording his bass parts. James and Lars were working on a night schedule and along with Fleming would leave come the morning. Jason would then arrive to find himself working on his own with an assistant engineer! ....How fvcking dysfunctional was (is?) this band?

Metallica Superthread -All Metallica discussion goes in here

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