Cannabis should be legalized in Ireland To pull Our country out of ression

pueblo · 02-12-2009 2:26pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

I'm afraid that isn't quite the same question.

Fine, but what's your response to the 'rephrased' question?

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:33pm

RedPlanet wrote: »

There's no need for shipments when folks are permitted to grow it in their own homes and gardens.

Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general? Cannabis is freely available in shops in Amsterdam, yet I had shady dealers constantly coming up to me offering coke, pills and... cannabis! I'm a tad skeptical after that.

pueblo wrote: »

Fine, but what's your response to the 'rephrased' question?

Sure, if people want to do that to themselves, then fine.

NOGMaxpower · 02-12-2009 2:39pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general? Cannabis is freely available in shops in Amsterdam, yet I had shady dealers constantly coming up to me offering coke, pills and... cannabis! I'm a tad skeptical after that.

Sure, if people want to do that to themselves, then fine.

legaised cannabis has nothing to do with the drug dealers in Amsterdam. What attacts them is the red light, who's attracted to the red light? Piss heads and stags nights who want...... coke, e's and heroin. You will only get approached for hard drugs in, near or around the red light. Plus most of the "good" coffee shops are away from the red light.

Any smoker who goes to Amdam will usually stick to their fav coffee shops. Only for the craic will they venture into the red light and frequent the nasty bull dog coffee shops. Personally i avoid the red light at all costs and if i am ever confronted with a "drug dealer" i speak to him in Irish = they have no idea who we are and they move on.

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:43pm

Ok, so just provide some evidence and maybe you will turn me. A natural experiment. Surely somebody has conducted one.

NOGMaxpower · 02-12-2009 2:44pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general? Cannabis is freely available in shops in Amsterdam, yet I had shady dealers constantly coming up to me offering coke, pills and... cannabis! I'm a tad skeptical after that.

Sure, if people want to do that to themselves, then fine.

damit forgot to reply to your other post about legalising cannabis = 0 crime.

what utter crap, there's no way on earth that legalising blow would cause 0 crime. it would however take the bread and butter away from criminals. Its much harder to sell class A's than it is a bit hash or grass.

Also think for 1 second, marijuana is the gateway drug. the vast majority of people who try it are exposed to harder drugs and the dealers who sell them. by removing the dealer from those who want to try it, experiment with it can do so safe in the knowledge that the drug they are buying is clean, not too full of THC and controlled by the government. Instead, they buy ****e gear off dealers that is full of, fibre glass, glass, tar, plastic, rubber, petrol.

It wouldn't cure our criminal problems but it would take away millions from dealers and cut a large supply of money they use to fund buying harder more profitable durgs like coke.

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:45pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

damit forgot to reply to your other post about legalising cannabis = 0 crime.

I stopped reading here. I didn't say that. Try again.

Pace2008 · 02-12-2009 2:48pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general?

Decriminalisation in Portugal led to a decline in use of 'harder' drugs amongst teens, as well as a marked decrease in heroin-related deaths , though it has led to a slight increase in cannabis use - a fair trade-off, I'd say.

http://www.cato.org/pubs/wtpapers/greenwald_whitepaper.pdf
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

EDIT: I should have mentioned that they decriminalised all drugs, not just cannabis.

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:50pm

Pace2008 wrote: »

Decriminalisation in Portugal led to a decline in use of 'harder' drugs amongst teens, as well as a marked decrease in heroin-related deaths , though it has led to a slight increase in cannabis use - a fair trade-off, I'd say.

http://www.cato.org/pubs/wtpapers/greenwald_whitepaper.pdf
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

I will have a read later, thanks.

NOGMaxpower · 02-12-2009 2:50pm

erm you said this "Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general?"

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:51pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

damit forgot to reply to your other post about legalising cannabis = 0 crime.

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

erm you said this "Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general?"

:rolleyes:

NOGMaxpower · 02-12-2009 2:56pm

your point is?

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 4:49pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

your point is?

I never said that legalising cannabis = 0 crime.

This is getting tiresome, you are contributing nothing. Pace went and delivered an article for people to read. Perhaps you should follow his example.

NOGMaxpower · 02-12-2009 4:57pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

I never said that legalising cannabis = 0 crime.

This is getting tiresome, you are contributing nothing. Pace went and delivered an article for people to read. Perhaps you should follow his example.

you just like arguing over symantecs, i took you statement as your own whats the problem? shall i pen you an apology?

If you knew anyhting about the subject you'd already know whats been happening in places like, Portugal, Belgum, Amsterdam and Australia when it comes to legalising cannabis.

Clearly you dont so perhaps you should read up on the pressing global issues and what countries are already trying to do about it before expressing mute points on forums.

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 5:31pm

NOGMaxpower wrote: »

you just like arguing over symantecs, i took you statement as your own whats the problem? shall i pen you an apology?

If you knew anyhting about the subject you'd already know whats been happening in places like, Portugal, Belgum, Amsterdam and Australia when it comes to legalising cannabis.

Clearly you dont so perhaps you should read up on the pressing global issues and what countries are already trying to do about it before expressing mute points on forums.

Semantics. Moot. Anyway, I am open to being educated by you fine people. Lift the veil of ignorance that clearly surrounds me! Turn off the red light!

:pac:

Mossticles · 03-12-2009 9:34am

Come on lads, this is the one topic I was sure there wouldn't be any of the usual nit-picking and boring petty arguments aside of the topic...it's seen on YouTube all the time. :mad:
I think it's clear that the two of ye should just settle in one of these rainy days, close to the radiator, kick back and roll up a big ol Fat One. Then pop online again and openly say to hell with the pettiness, and back to getting it done with at least decriminalising a recreational drug that countless numbers of your friends use on regular occasions.
My reason for trips to Amsterdam is to wander from CoffeeShop to CoffeeShop, away from the RedLight District, and away from the Stag Parties. The people who go to Amsterdam for the RedLight are people who like to get langers drunk...they're not people who have any interest in chillin out and smoking cannabis.
A previous point about Ecstacy being in the same barrel, I'm gonna have to disagree. I can't imagine someone driving a car on the stuff, whereas stoned-driving is a routine job for most.
I believe the world would be a better place, because it would be a more relaxed and less cut-throat. The unstoppable machine of man mind grind to a halt, and we could go back to looking out for each other rather than looking to make a personal million. Alleleuia....or however it's spelt

the_syco · 03-12-2009 10:18am

Legalise it, but just not in Ireland.

If the Irish took to the Weed, like we do to the drink, we'd be f**ked. The stuff that we get sold, and the legal stuff in Amsterdam are totally different. The "legal" stuff is way better. Whereas the people in the 'Dam took it when it came out, and the same percentage of people who took it hardcore, are the same amount of people who do it on a hardcore basis now. On the other hand, in Ireland, when people get hold of alcohol here, they tend to drink too much, and f**k up their own lives. Because of this, the introduction of weed here would probably be a very bad idea, unless it was limited to people over 21. It may then have less of a bad effect.

Although cannabis doesn't cause as much damage to youer lungs as tobacco does, that's only if you held it in your lungs for the same amount of time, but many cannabis smokers will "hold" it in their lungs for longer, and thus cause more damage.

=-=

NOGMaxpower: learn how to read questions. Flamed Diving asked "Is there any evidence to suggest that decriminalising cannabis leads to zero drug crime or lower crime in general?", and you took it as a statement of fact.

Bottle_of_Smoke · 04-12-2009 12:11pm

the_syco wrote: »

Legalise it, but just not in Ireland.

If the Irish took to the Weed, like we do to the drink, we'd be f**ked. The stuff that we get sold, and the legal stuff in Amsterdam are totally different. The "legal" stuff is way better. Whereas the people in the 'Dam took it when it came out, and the same percentage of people who took it hardcore, are the same amount of people who do it on a hardcore basis now. On the other hand, in Ireland, when people get hold of alcohol here, they tend to drink too much, and f**k up their own lives. Because of this, the introduction of weed here would probably be a very bad idea, unless it was limited to people over 21. It may then have less of a bad effect.

I guess there's no way of proving it but I just really don't think people would binge like they do on alcohol. Its a completely different drug. Cannabis doesn't give you the same confidence buzz alcohol will. Cannabis doesn't make dancing fun. It wouldn't sit well with the Irish pub scene because of its effects. These are the reasons people drink, I don't think cannabis would work for them.

Flamed Diving · 05-12-2009 7:23pm

http://www.drugfreeworld.org/

starbelgrade · 05-12-2009 7:33pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

http://www.drugfreeworld.org/

Where's the fun in that?

Flamed Diving · 05-12-2009 7:39pm

starbelgrade wrote: »

Where's the fun in that?

hehehe...

terenc · 05-12-2009 8:05pm

Cannabis might not kill you but most people I know who have taken cannabis over a long and short period are not the cool people they think they are. They cant get through the day without a joint and are pretty much brain dead and behave in a zombie like fashion. They tend too move onto harder drugs when cannabis doesn't meet their needs anymore and then the death rate is significant.
I really don't see why we should legalize it in this country has we have enough legalized
drugs to worry about and how to control them.

thebman · 05-12-2009 8:18pm

terenc wrote: »

Cannabis might not kill you but most people I know who have taken cannabis over a long and short period are not the cool people they think they are. They cant get through the day without a joint and are pretty much brain dead and behave in a zombie like fashion. They tend too move onto harder drugs when cannabis doesn't meet their needs anymore and then the death rate is significant.
I really don't see why we should legalize it in this country has we have enough legalized
drugs to worry about and how to control them.

lol I don't know anybody like that who takes Cannabis.

I did when I was in secondary school but they were just drug users and didn't care what it was they were taking and only started on Cannabis because it was easiest to get. If they could have jumped straight to Cocaine they would have.

They were the same guys sneaking Whiskey into school with them and dropping out early.

After college most people taking Cannabis are just normal people, the rest were always just fooked up to begin with. Its not the Cannabis, its their generally I'm going to do everything I'm not supposed to no matter how retarded it is attitude toward life in general.

Flamed Diving · 05-12-2009 8:54pm

Seriously, I do know a few people who smoke every day and they appear to be a little sluggish, both physically and cognitively. I suppose they are only harming themselves, but its a shame to see. I know one fella who has a joint first thing in the morning and then goes driving lorries. I don't know how he hasn't killed someone yet. Do they have drug testers yet for Traffic Garda?

Nick_oliveri · 05-12-2009 9:47pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

I know one fella who has a joint first thing in the morning and then goes driving lorries. I don't know how he hasn't killed someone yet. Do they have drug testers yet for Traffic Garda?

Yes I am sure they have testers for traffic Corps. How do you make out that you don't know "how he hasn't killed anyone yet"? Does cannabis make you inebriated while driving? Or does it make you more careful?

Flamed Diving · 05-12-2009 9:55pm

Nick_oliveri wrote: »

Yes I am sure they have testers for traffic Corps. How do you make out that you don't know "how he hasn't killed anyone yet"? Does cannabis make you inebriated while driving? Or does it make you more careful?

Well, I have seen the effects that weed has on people. It doesn't seem to make them the sharpest tools in the box...

One stoner I know said that the biggest danger comes from concentrating on little bits of dirt on the window and stuff like that.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 11:48am

please watch this video ,, it has the answers ,,

there is 6 more vids please watch

Flamed Diving · 06-12-2009 11:50am

Wow a video. Everybody, cancer has been cured!

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 11:51am

terenc wrote: »

Cannabis might not kill you but most people I know who have taken cannabis over a long and short period are not the cool people they think they are. They cant get through the day without a joint and are pretty much brain dead and behave in a zombie like fashion. They tend too move onto harder drugs when cannabis doesn't meet their needs anymore and then the death rate is significant.
I really don't see why we should legalize it in this country has we have enough legalized
drugs to worry about and how to control them.

sorry but your a fool

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 11:52am

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Wow a video. Everybody, cancer has been cured!

you have defo not had time to watch the vid ,, so please do ,

and why comment on something . when you have not at least gave it a chance ...

Flamed Diving · 06-12-2009 12:05pm

weedfreedomtinp wrote: »

you have defo not had time to watch the vid ,, so please do ,

and why comment on something . when you have not at least gave it a chance ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BexJ-1deIv4

Check this video. It has a machine that can heal the world, using the Searl effect. IT IS FACT. Watch the video. OPEN YOUR EYES. Video = Fact.

:rolleyes:

PatrickD32 · 06-12-2009 12:19pm

Everyone seems to be an expert on cannabis.

Even on page 1

"Smoking three cannabis joints a day causes the same damage as 20 cigarettes because people tend to inhale the smoke for longer to gain the maximum "hit"."

Nothing annoys me more than people reiterating stories they heard and when they do repeat them they say it as fact with no source.

Annoying.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:23pm

PatrickD32 wrote: »

Everyone seems to be an expert on cannabis.

Even on page 1

"Smoking three cannabis joints a day causes the same damage as 20 cigarettes because people tend to inhale the smoke for longer to gain the maximum "hit"."

Nothing annoys me more than people reiterating stories they heard and when they do repeat them they say it as fact with no source.

Annoying.

wtf u on about rick Simpson will give you personally 100.000 if you prove him wrong

watch the vid .. u all stupid when a cure is in front of you .. you dont believe it .. well typical irish man

proff from the bbc http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7098340.stm

PatrickD32 · 06-12-2009 12:25pm

weedfreedomtinp wrote: »

wtf u on about rick Simpson will give you personally 100.000 if you prove him wrong

watch the vid .. u all stupid when a cure is in front of you .. you dont believe it .. well typical irish man

proff from the bbc http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7098340.stm

wtf u reacting with me for

Wasnt talkin about you

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:31pm

PatrickD32 wrote: »

wtf u reacting with me for

Wasnt talkin about you

sorry bout that , just people annoy me when they wont listen .. please watch the vid if ur intrested in knowing the truth ,,
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7331006790306000271#

proof

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7098340.stm

Flamed Diving · 06-12-2009 12:31pm

Here is a list of the academic literature for the search term "Cannabis cancer cure":

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=cannabis+cancer+cure&btnG=Search&as_sdt=2000&as_ylo=&as_vis=0

Go find the evidence.

Flamed Diving · 06-12-2009 12:32pm

weedfreedomtinp wrote: »

proof

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7098340.stm

a) That isn't proof, it is evidence. There is a BIG difference.

b) That is not a cure, it is a treatment.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:32pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Here is a list of the academic literature for the search term "Cannabis cancer cure":

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=cannabis+cancer+cure&btnG=Search&as_sdt=2000&as_ylo=&as_vis=0

Go find the evidence.

i have my evidence thanks anyway mate

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:34pm

The California Pacific Medical Center Research Institute team are hopeful that cannabidiol or CBD could be a non-toxic alternative to chemotherapy.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:36pm

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:38pm

as it says in the rick simpson video RUN FROM THE CURE ..coz thats what you are doin

also rick simpson will give you 100.000 dollers to prove him wrong ...

http://www.phoenixtears.ca/

Flamed Diving · 06-12-2009 12:41pm

weedfreedomtinp wrote: »

i have my evidence thanks anyway mate

What I linked to is a database of all the academic literature in the world. It is the definitive source of all scientific knowledge... and you say no thanks...

I feel utterly vindicated, enjoy your video shows.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:42pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

What I linked to is a database of all the academic literature in the world. It is the definitive source of all scientific knowledge... and you say no thanks...

I feel utterly vindicated, enjoy your video shows.

sorry i did not understand it .. now i do ,, thanks and it was not my intention to throw it back at you .. sorry again

Landoflemon · 06-12-2009 12:50pm

Weedfreedom, you my friend are a man/woman of ignorant opinion.

Why do criminals and their gangs sell weed? I can guarantee you it is not because they believe in giving people the freedom to chose what they can and cannot smoke. It's because it is an easy way to make money and they don't have to pay anything back to the government.

Corrupt people are corrupt permanently. If you take away their income from the illegal sale of cannibis do you think they are just gonna go "Hey, well it was nice while it lasted, all good things must come to an end..."???

The answer is no. Humans are by nature often selfish, greedy narcissistic beings. Most people can contain these facets of human nature to an extent that remains socially acceptable. If criminals and gangs start losing money because of legalisation of cannabis, do you honestly think they will just accept it? It will merely encourage them to increase their sales of the other (arguably more harmful and dangerous) drugs. Criminals will not standby and watch their income evaporate.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 12:56pm

Landoflemon wrote: »

Weedfreedom, you my friend are a man/woman of ignorant opinion.

Why do criminals and their gangs sell weed? I can guarantee you it is not because they believe in giving people the freedom to chose what they can and cannot smoke. It's because it is an easy way to make money and they don't have to pay anything back to the government.

Corrupt people are corrupt permanently. If you take away their income from the illegal sale of cannibis do you think they are just gonna go "Hey, well it was nice while it lasted, all good things must come to an end..."???

The answer is no. Humans are by nature often selfish, greedy narcissistic beings. Most people can contain these facets of human nature to an extent that remains socially acceptable. If criminals and gangs start losing money because of legalisation of cannabis, do you honestly think they will just accept it? It will merely encourage them to increase their sales of the other (arguably more harmful and dangerous) drugs. Criminals will not standby and watch their income evaporate.

look you have dealers in everything ,, tobacco , alcohol , drugs , guns , and much more .. look if you regulate drugs .. it stops dealers making big profit ,, come on u must see that..

plus drug problem should be a social problem not a criminal problem ,, so what you saying is . if you believe that your cannabis oil is curing you , just because its illegal u should not be allowed to have it ..

Landoflemon · 06-12-2009 1:03pm

"It stops dealers making big profit"

There. Exactly. You just went and said it yourself. Dealers will not stand around and do nothing when they see their profit diminishing. They will begin to rely more on the sale of the other (more) dangerous substances.

Can I ask you what do you stand to gain by the legalisation of Cannabis? It being currently illegal does not affect me in the slightest, please enlighten me.

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 1:13pm

Landoflemon wrote: »

"It stops dealers making big profit"

There. Exactly. You just went and said it yourself. Dealers will not stand around and do nothing when they see their profit diminishing. They will begin to rely more on the sale of the other (more) dangerous substances.

Can I ask you what do you stand to gain by the legalisation of Cannabis? It being currently illegal does not affect me in the slightest, please enlighten me.

We believe that the use of Cannabis ought to be a matter of choice and not of law.
We believe that the prohibition of Cannabis is against the public interest.
We believe that the prohibition of Cannabis contravenes our Human Rights.
We believe that the prohibition of Cannabis inhibits the use of a beneficial source for all mankind.
We believe that the legalisation of Cannabis is a very important step that should be taken to benefit the people and their environment.

Proposals

That Cannabis and Cannabis products should be removed from the Irish Misuse of Drugs Act, thereby being legalised.
That the possession, cultivation and use of pure Cannabis and Cannabis products, be free from prosecution for all people.
That Cannabis be re-introduced into our society.
That high priority be given to the cultivation of Cannabis for the express purpose of the localised production of virtually cost-free fuels through the process of pyrolysis on Cannabis biomass, and as a source of fibre and hurd.
That a license for growing Cannabis be issued to those people who wish to pay the license fee, for either medical use or social use.
That provision be made to enable the setting-up of public establishments where the sale of Cannabis is permitted, under regulations.
That at least the same level of protection be given to the Cannabis consumer as is given to the consumers of other commodities: weights and measures, quality and more.
That all prisoners presently held only on Cannabis convictions or charges be released from custody without delay and that all criminal records for Cannabis offences be expunged.

Anticipated results from our proposals

RESULTS ANTICIATED FROM PUTTING OUR PROPOSALS INTO ACTION
Decrease in general crime rate.
Easing of the drugs problem
Increase in police and court resources to fight and deal with serious crime
Increase in Government revenue through taxation on profits and job creations
Increase in public and social well-being, spirit, health and happiness.
Decrease in pollution.
Decrease in the price of fuel and energy for our homes, businesses, factories etc.
Decease in unemployment.

Landoflemon · 06-12-2009 2:04pm

Man, the amount of your response that is simple copy and paste from websites is actually sickening. Form your own opinions and sentences you braindead goof.

http://www.petitiononline.com/0110/petition.html

Landoflemon · 06-12-2009 2:06pm

Over and out...

weedfreedomtinp · 06-12-2009 7:48pm

Landoflemon wrote: »

Man, the amount of your response that is simple copy and paste from websites is actually sickening. Form your own opinions and sentences you braindead goof.

http://www.petitiononline.com/0110/petition.html

why you even post when ya have nothin to say ya dummy

nesf · 06-12-2009 8:09pm

weedfreedomtinp wrote: »

why you even post when ya have nothin to say ya dummy

Congratulations on winning today's week long ban!

Cannabis should be legalized in Ireland To pull Our country out of ression

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