Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2011/2012

Fuzzy_Dunlop · 18-02-2012 4:42pm

Video here of the goal. Very nice
http://goonertalk.com/2012/02/18/video-ryo-nets-his-first-bolton-goal-in-style/

batistuta9 · 18-02-2012 5:19pm

greendom wrote: »

A bit of perspective required, perhaps ?

www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/arsenal/9089965/Arsenal-fans-spare-us-the-tears-and-remember-how-fortunate-you-really-are-to-be-supporting-one-of-the-elite.html

He's making some good points in that article, but...

obviously enough only one team can win a trophy, but you would hope that arsenal aren't allowed to fall away like the teams he mentioned bar l'pool and still be in the mix for trophies, although that probably comes across as a sense of entitlement; arsenal & l'pool have been successful over the majority of their histories whereas leeds had around a decade of success mid 60's - mid 70's.

tayto lover wrote: »

We could do without this lad trying to unsettle our good players too
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2102951/Robin-Van-Persie-urged-quit-Arsenal.html

our only good player you mean :pac:

batistuta9 · 18-02-2012 5:23pm

wenger's haunted by milan game, and up for the cup

Arsene Wenger: Arsenal thrashing in San Siro will haunt me forever
Feb 18 2012 by Carl Askew
ARSENAL manager Arsene Wenger last night admitted his side’s 4-0 Champions League thrashing at AC Milan will haunt him forever.
The furious Frenchman ripped his sloppy stars to shreds in a training-ground rollicking after the embarrassing midweek thumping at the San Siro.
But Wenger is confident his squad will respond in the correct manner when they battle with Sunderland today for a place in the FA Cup quarter-finals.
He has warned his flops that they must now prove they are fit to wear their Arsenal shirts.
Wenger’s demanding a “committed” reaction after the worst European defeat in the club’s history and has promised to field a full-strength side at the Stadium of Light.
He said: “It never gets out of your system because you take it with you until the last day of your life.
“But when you love competition you always strive for the next one, to prove that you are ready for a new fight. That is what competition is all about.
“The reflection is that you can find 100 explanations that we had a poor performance and an off day.
“We lost against a good AC Milan team, not an exceptional one. And unfortunately we were punished severely.
“So I believe for us, for the rest of the season, it is important not to dwell on that too much. We must focus on the next performance, respond in a positive way and ensure we have the mental qualities to be at this club.
“We have to ensure straight away that we can respond, that is where the real test is.
“What happened we can’t change now but for the rest of the season we have an influence on it.
“We had put together a good series of results before and we can consider that night in Milan was just where we had an off-day.
“We go into a new battle now where we need confidence, belief and great commitment.”
Wenger was considering resting and rotating players in his squad for the fifth-round tie.
But after effectively crashing out of Europe in Italy, he has revised his plans and will field his strongest line-up, boosted by the return of forward Gervinho from the African Nations Cup.
Per Mertesacker won’t feature, however, after the German defender underwent surgery on the ankle injury suffered in the 2-1 League win on Sunderland’s heavy pitch last weekend. He is expected to be out for the rest of the season.
Wenger insists there is a lot to play for and is adamant Arsenal can still finish fourth and win the FA Cup – which he concedes has now taken on a new importance.
He added: “We are in fourth and we have an opportunity to qualify for the quarter-finals. It’s important we are up for that challenge and do not feel sorry for ourselves.
“The Cup was always important, but it’s even more important now.It is the next game and because we had a big disappointment in the last game it is more important.
“But the FA Cup was always one of my priorities and therefore, coming off the Milan game, it becomes even more important.
“After what happened it is important for us to have a great performance. The team will be full strength. I’ll refresh it because some players have played many games recently but we will do the maximum to win this game.”

link to dailyrecord

greendom · 18-02-2012 5:28pm

Team for today:

Fabianski Sagna, Djourou, Vermaelen, Coquelin Song, Arteta Chamberlain, Ramsey, Gervinho Van Persie

Subs Rosicky, Szczesny, Walcott, Squillaci, Arshavin, Chamakh, Benayoun.

Walcott dropped to the bench replaced by Gervinho. Coq at full back.

Need both Verm and Djourou to improve performance compared to Wednesday.

wandatowell · 18-02-2012 5:32pm

We certainly have plenty of pace up forward today

gnfnrhead · 18-02-2012 5:33pm

I assume Szczesny is being rested as apposed to dropped?

Fabianski and Ramsey are the only differences from the team I predicted yesterday

I'd much rather Miquel on the bench ahead of Squillaci

djan · 18-02-2012 6:01pm

Fuzzy_Dunlop wrote: »

Video here of the goal. Very nice
http://goonertalk.com/2012/02/18/video-ryo-nets-his-first-bolton-goal-in-style/

What I love about Ryo, he is the type of player that just runs his socks off every match (I watched him closely in the Eredivisie) which we severely lack now. And he is nearly as fast as Theo but with some brains

Raskolnikov · 18-02-2012 6:22pm

Walcott being hauled off at half time against Milan and now dropped today suggests Wenger may have lost patience?

Gringo180 · 18-02-2012 7:58pm

This is painful to watch

the realpigiron · 18-02-2012 8:07pm

This must be the beginning of the end for Wenger. He had great success and introduced a great style of play to the EPL, but that will be 6 years? is it since they've won anything.

Redzer7 · 18-02-2012 8:10pm

Fcuking hate this! Ruins the week ahead of me!

dvemail · 18-02-2012 8:12pm

Serious changes need to be made in the board room. Enough of this trying to make money craic if this is the results we are to be expecting each week.
Best way to make money is to win trophies and drum up more interest in the club, and if that means forking out top dollar in the summer for players to make this team what it needs to be to compete again then just do it.

Minstrel27 · 18-02-2012 8:12pm

I didn't think a performance like that would be possible after the criticism they got after midweek

Galvasean · 18-02-2012 8:15pm

DOOOOOMED!!!!!!!!!!!

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 8:21pm

Just such a sad performance and time.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 8:28pm

Song disgusted me today.

He was an absolute disgrace. He did it in a relatively subtle way so some of you mightn't have noticed, but I specifically watched him closely today and in both halves, in both positions, he was woeful.

In the first half when he was playing in defensive midfield, had you not known Arsenal FC's players or lineup, you probably would have assumed we was playing as a right wing forward. His positioning left me gobsmacked. The amount of times he went walkabout was astonishing. I said before the game that I thought he should be dropped for several games and I reiterate that now with greater emphasis.

There are obvious scapegoats in this team like Walcott, but Song's as bad. His poor performances have been hidden somewhat.

When he moved to CB, he was just as bad. I know this isn't his natural position but it wasn't even stuff like marking or positioning that annoyed me when he played here. I drew this (below) out to illustrate what pissed me off about him:

Red is Song Yellow is Chamberlain

I know that's crudely drawn but listen: This is from their second goal. Song, despite starting quite a margin ahead of Oxo finished over 20 yards behind him when tracking back. I know Chamberlain is quick but if you rewatch the goal you'll see pace is not what I'm talking about.

Song jogged.

Chamberlain ran his heart out.

The obvious contrast here is that Song is a ****ing centreback while chamberlain is a right winger!!!!

N.B. Bare in mind Chamberlain stopped and fumbled about on the line for a few seconds. So when you look at the above picture, note how Song's finishing position isn't even inside the box, despite Chamberlain being held up in the box for several seconds. And Chamberlain began this from on the ground.

Despicable.

Drexel · 18-02-2012 8:28pm

KeithAFC wrote: »

Just such a sad performance and time.

The performance wasnt the worst. Wasnt great either but was by no means another Milan. You have to give credit to Sunderland today. They were brilliant. They worked their fu*kin socks off.

Edited to say great diagram Duck!! Dunno what the story with song is. Is he just nackered? I dont buy that tbh. This could be complete bollox but I think one of the reasons he seems to go walk abouts is, he seems to be the only player able to pick a pass through a defense these days and he knows it, so he is tryin to get himself into a position where he can thread one through cause he knows no one else will and then gets caught out of position. As I said, could be just bollox from me tho!

No excuse for not trackin back tho

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 8:31pm

jonny666 wrote: »

The performance wasnt the worst. Wasnt great either but was by no means another Milan. You have to give credit to Sunderland today. They were brilliant. They worked their fu*kin socks off.

You kidding me? No passion, no quality, no work rate, crap tactics. It was dreadful.

amacachi · 18-02-2012 8:32pm

I've been saying for quite a while that Song has been awful.

We're short at least 5 players to have a shot at winning the league.

Soups123 · 18-02-2012 8:32pm

KeithAFC wrote: »

jonny666 wrote: »

The performance wasnt the worst. Wasnt great either but was by no means another Milan. You have to give credit to Sunderland today. They were brilliant. They worked their fu*kin socks off.

You kidding me? No passion, no quality, no work rate, crap tactics. It was dreadful.

You've had ur two teams piss you off the same way today so! I struggle to handle one team piss me off!

gnfnrhead · 18-02-2012 8:33pm

Didnt watch again, I'm beginning to wonder if my curse is only in the League. We'll find out next week.

Out of curiousity. If Milan was a 0, and Blackburn a 10. What would we be at today? From most reactions here I'd guess about a four but then some would have me believe it was a -50.

greendom · 18-02-2012 8:33pm

What's really worrying is that as an attacking force, bar Wilshere we were at full strength. And yet we only had one shot on target and very rarely threatened.

18-02-2012 8:33pm

the realpigiron wrote: »

This must be the beginning of the end for Wenger. He had great success and introduced a great style of play to the EPL, but that will be 6 years? is it since they've won anything.

The beginning of the end imho was the last season we won a trophy.

The 2 goals conceded today were criminal to concede but sadly its the way Arsenal have been defending ever since the invincible back 4 left the club. It would be a very sad way for Wenger to bow out, but i really dont see how Arsenal are going to improve in these next few years under him given that he seems blind to our defensive frailties and in the general style that we play.

Missing out on the Champions league, or even the Europa league might prove to be the smelling salts for all concerned to wake up, though after 7 years and counting of this mediocrity i wont hold my breath.

We are almost like a club version of the French 2010 World cup team in the way they play on the pitch.

Soups123 · 18-02-2012 8:36pm

gnfnrhead wrote: »

Didnt watch again, I'm beginning to wonder if my curse is only in the League. We'll find out next week.

Out of curiousity. If Milan was a 0, and Blackburn a 10. What would we be at today? From most reactions here I'd guess about a four but then some would have me believe it was a -50.

5 maybe, injuries were unlucky might have been diff, just nothing going 4ward 1 shot on target

18-02-2012 8:40pm

During these last few years a lot of things barring the team's ineptitude have been blamed.

The refs
The pitches
The money other clubs can spend on players and wages by comparison
The stadium cost
The injuries
The other team's bully boy tactics

Well the time for excuses is over AW. What's the real reason Arsenal have been sh*te?

Drexel · 18-02-2012 8:40pm

KeithAFC wrote: »

No passion, no quality, no work rate, crap tactics. It was dreadful.

Its been like that all season. All im sayin is it wasnt as bad as the Milan performance and Sunderland played very very well also.

greendom · 18-02-2012 8:41pm

it's very easy to throw the 7 year thing around. But 5 of those years were while the stadium was being built and paid for. Wenger did a remarkable job to keep the team in contention during that period. That excuse is beginning to wear out though now.

So many of the players are just not good enough at the moment and it comes back to that question again. Are the board not releasing funds or are they available and Arsene doesn't want to spend. If it's the latter then its time for him to leave.

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 8:41pm

jonny666 wrote: »

Its been like that all season. All im sayin is it wasnt as bad as the Milan performance and Sunderland played very very well also.

It was probably worse because this competition was more realistic for us and we played like that!

emergingstar · 18-02-2012 8:44pm

Twinge of sadness for prob the end of wengers era

18-02-2012 8:45pm

greendom wrote: »

it's very easy to throw the 7 year thing around. But 5 of those years were while the stadium was being built and paid for. Wenger did a remarkable job to keep the team in contention during that period. That excuse is beginning to wear out though now.

So many of the players are just not good enough at the moment and it comes back to that question again. Are the board not releasing funds or are they available and Arsene doesn't want to spend. If it's the latter then its time for him to leave.

Another prong to that argument is that while we could splash out megabucks on players, will it actually make a difference given the way the team is set up to defend?

18-02-2012 8:49pm

Honestly, I feel like I am f*cking done with this team.

It's one thing supporting the team through rough patches, it's quite another supporting a team that looks like it couldn't give a sh*t and a manager that won't change the tactics when it's needed.

F*ck that, life is too short.

Drexel · 18-02-2012 8:51pm

KeithAFC wrote: »

It was probably worse because this competition was more realistic for us and we played like that!

Milan for me was the worst performance ive ever seen from Arsenal. Milan werent even that good on Wednesday and scored 4.They just walked past our defense. Sunderland were great today. They defended well, closed us down well and stopped us from playin any sort of game.

I think we can both agree that we need to step up our game massively from both performances or it could well be a 7th place finish with Newcastle,Liverpool and chelsea finishing above us

Sergio · 18-02-2012 8:51pm

Im sick to death of hearing the "We built a new stadium" excuse for our disgraceful performances on the pitch in the past few years.These performances have occured time and time again in the past few yrs 4-0 up against newcastle and end up conceding 4 goals to draw level.Got destroyed up at old trafford last august 8-2.What about the carling cup final last yr and our season imploding as a result.2-0 up against wigan and beaten 3-2.same with the blackburn game this year.
When are some of you so called Arsenal supporters going to wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
We need a new manager and a complete overhaul of our current squad because the players arent good enough!

Galvasean · 18-02-2012 8:53pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Honestly, I feel like I am f*cking done with this team.

It's one thing supporting the team through rough patches, it's quite another supporting a team that looks like it couldn't give a sh*t and a manager that won't change the tactics when it's needed.

F*ck that, life is too short.

My dad said the very same thing to me after the match today.
Worst part is I can't disagree with him.

I'll continue supporting regardless of results but this is one very unlikable Arsenal side.

greendom · 18-02-2012 8:53pm

Sergio wrote: »

Im sick to death of hearing the "We built a new stadium" excuse for our disgraceful performances on the pitch in the past few years.These performances have occured time and time again in the past few yrs 4-0 up against newcastle and end up conceding 4 goals to draw level.Got destroyed up at old trafford last august 8-2.What about the carling cup final last yr and our season imploding as a result.2-0 up against wigan and beaten 3-2.same with the blackburn game this year.
When are some of you so called Arsenal supporters going to wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
We need a new manager and a complete overhaul of our current squad because the players arent good enough!

With the money he's actually spent, i doubt anyone could have done much better.

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 8:55pm

greendom wrote: »

it's very easy to throw the 7 year thing around. But 5 of those years were while the stadium was being built and paid for. Wenger did a remarkable job to keep the team in contention during that period. That excuse is beginning to wear out though now.

So many of the players are just not good enough at the moment and it comes back to that question again. Are the board not releasing funds or are they available and Arsene doesn't want to spend. If it's the latter then its time for him to leave.

I couldn't care less if we played in a meadow full of cow's s*** as long as we played with a bit of fight and passion. Wenger should concentrate on the team and not on the stadium. All fans care about is winning and playing well and we are doing very little of that.

amacachi · 18-02-2012 8:58pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Honestly, I feel like I am f*cking done with this team.

It's one thing supporting the team through rough patches, it's quite another supporting a team that looks like it couldn't give a sh*t and a manager that won't change the tactics when it's needed.

F*ck that, life is too short.

Cool.

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 8:58pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

Song disgusted me today.

He was an absolute disgrace. He did it in a relatively subtle way so some of you mightn't have noticed, but I specifically watched him closely today and in both halves, in both positions, he was woeful.

In the first half when he was playing in defensive midfield, had you not known Arsenal FC's players or lineup, you probably would have assumed we was playing as a right wing forward. His positioning left me gobsmacked. The amount of times he went walkabout was astonishing. I said before the game that I thought he should be dropped for several games and I reiterate that now with greater emphasis.

There are obvious scapegoats in this team like Walcott, but Song's as bad. His poor performances have been hidden somewhat.

When he moved to CB, he was just as bad. I know this isn't his natural position but it wasn't even stuff like marking or positioning that annoyed me when he played here. I drew this (below) out to illustrate what pissed me off about him:

Red is Song Yellow is Chamberlain

I know that's crudely drawn but listen: This is from their second goal. Song, despite starting quite a margin ahead of Oxo finished over 20 yards behind him when tracking back. I know Chamberlain is quick but if you rewatch the goal you'll see pace is not what I'm talking about.

Song jogged.

Chamberlain ran his heart out.

The obvious contrast here is that Song is a ****ing centreback while chamberlain is a right winger!!!!

N.B. Bare in mind Chamberlain stopped and fumbled about on the line for a few seconds. So when you look at the above picture, note how Song's finishing position isn't even inside the box, despite Chamberlain being held up in the box for several seconds. And Chamberlain began this from on the ground.

Despicable.

You forgot Arteta's part in the goal where he was given a little bump and went down as if hit by an exocet.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 8:59pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Another prong to that argument is that while we could splash out megabucks on players, will it actually make a difference given the way the team is set up to defend?

Now that's unfair I think!

Would you have said this a few weeks ago when we had Koscielny leading the defensive front with some wonderful performances.

Today our defence was jumbled about like crazy. First we have to play a right-footed DM at left back. He get's injured so we have to deploy our centre-back who is changing positions daily (which means its hard for him to adapt) at left back and bring on Squillaci to aid Djourou. These are our 4th and 5th choice centre-backs who might have never even partnered each other at CB afaik (i could be wrong but it probably wasn't more than once). Then we have to bring another CB off due to injury and deploy our only other option, a DM who's having a dreadful game anyway, at CB.

Our right-back and most stable player is only recently back from a horrific leg break and many on this very thread have noted how he doesn't seem to be at full fitness.

Do you really think defensive organisation was even a possibility during that?

And the wind was another factor in defensive uncertainty. (I know that sounds like a lame excuse but just think of the amount of misjudged headers today).

I'm not defending that side, because they were atrocious today. I'm simply saying that that is not the area that needs to be criticised!!

Lack of heart and ambition was a bigger problem today.

I'm asking for a little bit of reason.

Pepe LeFrits · 18-02-2012 9:00pm

Lads, stop kneejerking. Sure, our whole season has collapsed inside the space of a week, but it's only the 5th or 6th year in a row that it's happened. We just need to sort it out in summer and things will turn around.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:01pm

tayto lover wrote: »

You forgot Arteta's part in the goal where he was given a little bump and went down as if hit by an exocet.

Did I say who I blamed for the goal? I think not.

I was pointing out how the goal epitomised Song's pathetic performance today.

I suggest you read my post before replying with something like that.

Sergio · 18-02-2012 9:02pm

greendom wrote: »

With the money he's actually spent, i doubt anyone could have done much better.

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 9:05pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

Did I say who I blamed for the goal? I think not.

I was pointing out how the goal epitomised Song's pathetic performance today.

I suggest you read my post before replying with something like that.

AND my point is that Song is not the only one who is hiding.

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 9:05pm

Why can't our players track back like that James Mclean guy? And work as hard as Sunderland did? I don't understand this Arsenal team and Wenger. I can't understand why we lack such passion and just real balls. Get stuck in ffs.

greendom · 18-02-2012 9:05pm

Sergio wrote: »

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

i agree with that actually. Why he doesn't play with 2 midfielders with strong defensive aspects to their game like he used to with Petit and Vieira is beyond me. The defenders in the main aren't that bad (well there are some exceptions of course); it's just that they get very little protection in front of them

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:07pm

Sergio wrote: »

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

Again, misdirected criticism in my opinion.

He's built a very solid defence in:
Sagna; Mertesacker (Vermaelen); Koscielny; Santos

It's been disrupted massively by injuries.

If you're going to criticise, do so in the needed areas. As I've said, defensive problems weren't the cause of our downfall today. Lack of heart and bottle, and lack of attacking prowess cost us more.

Radharc na Sleibhte · 18-02-2012 9:07pm

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Lads, stop kneejerking. Sure, our whole season has collapsed inside the space of a week, but it's only the 5th or 6th year in a row that it's happened. We just need to sort it out in summer and things will turn around.

yeah, give it one more year

(lather, rinse, REPEAT)

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:08pm

tayto lover wrote: »

AND my point is that Song is not the only one who is hiding.

I agree wholeheartedly.

Name me an Arsenal player today who played better than Arteta.

amacachi · 18-02-2012 9:10pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly.

Name me an Arsenal player today who played better than Arteta.

Ox.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:11pm

amacachi wrote: »

Ox.

The expected answer but I don't think so.

He was kept under wraps today. Couldn't do anything because of how well Sunderland defended.

The only time when he looked like doing anything was just after we'd gone 2 down, but by that time the game was over. Too little, too late.

Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2011/2012

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