Persistent culinary myths

Loire · 31-08-2015 4:11pm

Minder wrote: »

No, you must brown the meat to get that malliard reaction and develop the flavour. But it doesn't seal in juices.

Gotcha!

duploelabs · 31-08-2015 4:20pm

Loire wrote: »

Hi Minder,

Anytime I cook a stew or lasagne etc, I'll brown the meat in a pan first. Are you saying not to bother?

Thanks,
Loire.

Just don't throw all the mince in to the pan at once. By doing that you lower the temperature of the pan and the meat will boil and not brown . just do it in small batches

The Bishop Basher · 31-08-2015 4:21pm

duploelabs wrote: »

Other than if you're coeliac, reducing gluten has a health benefit

I'm not coeliac but have immediate and significant health improvements when I reduce Gluten.

I'm intrigued that this would be considered a myth.

I've googled and read plenty on this but would be interested to know how you came to a definitive answer

L1011 · 31-08-2015 4:28pm

Swanner wrote: »

I'm not coeliac but have immediate and significant health improvements when I reduce Gluten.

I'm intrigued that this would be considered a myth.

I've googled and read plenty on this but would be interested to know how you came to a definitive answer

Huge range of potential answers from "its psychological" through to reactions to the other elements involved in heavily processed white bread products which are what most people eat here.

I've had the interesting experience of someone telling me they had severe reactions to gluten (but not cealiac) while downing a Heineken. And another Heineken after that. Further talking turned out they felt bloated after eating generic white sliced pan sandwiches. That's not the gluten...

Faith · 31-08-2015 4:43pm

Swanner wrote: »

I'm not coeliac but have immediate and significant health improvements when I reduce Gluten.

I'm intrigued that this would be considered a myth.

I've googled and read plenty on this but would be interested to know how you came to a definitive answer

Researchers (including the guy who first identified the idea of 'non-coeliac gluten sensitivity') have now found compelling evidence that gluten isn't the problem at all, but FODMAPs. There's a good article about it here (I can't find the exact original paper right now).

37 subjects took part, all confirmed not to have celiac disease but whose gastrointestinal symptoms improved on a gluten-free diet, thus fulfilling the diagnostic criteria for non-celiac gluten sensitivity ... Analyzing the data, Gibson found that each treatment diet, whether it included gluten or not, prompted subjects to report a worsening of gastrointestinal symptoms to similar degrees.

Toto Wolfcastle · 31-08-2015 4:54pm

I've been keeping a food diary for the last few weeks to see which of the high FODMAP foods trigger my suspected IBS and the one thing that has stood out has been wheat. Since removing it as much as possible from my diet the uncomfortable bloating has disappeared. I don't really care whether it's the gluten or something else as long as I feel better. There was a dietician on the radio last week that said that new research has found that it's not the gluten, but something else.

I'd kill for a bowl of pasta though, with or without oil in the water.

BaZmO* · 31-08-2015 8:54pm

duploelabs wrote: »

Well what happens with the sticking pasta is due to the starch being leeched during the cooking process, an acid in the water will help to dissolve this but is not commonly employed as it affect the flavour of the pasta. Oil will not homogenize with the water and hence will not adhere to the pasta thus will not affect any frictional qualities of the pasta.

I know the reason why it sticks but it's the adding of the oil that stops the pasta from initially sticking together.

It's funny you reference that book from Harold McGee because in the section about cooking pasta he says the following;

"Sticking can be minimized by constantly stirring the noodles for the ﬁrst few minutes of cooking, or by adding a spoonful or two of oil to the pot and then lifting the noodles through the water surface a few times to lubricate them."

That's exactly what I do when cooking spaghetti, and as I've said, it works....for me anyway.

duploelabs wrote: »

If you feel you'd like to address your concerns about my professional knowledge in person, please come and attend my talk in the theatre of food at the Electric Picnic where I will be speaking alongside the likes of Kevin thornton, JP McMahon, Martin Shanahan, and Kwanghi Chang. What will I be speaking about??
The Science of Food and Cooking!

It's a bit pointless naming off a load of chefs because it's normally the chefs that are giving the contradicting info in the first place. I always listen to what someone has to say on the matter and then try it out myself and decide whether or not it works in practice.

duploelabs wrote: »

P.s the simpsons sums up how anecdotal evidence works, tiger-proof rocks!

That's not the same as the anecdotal evidence that I'm providing. I've tried both methods and decided to do the one that works for me.

Pistachios & cream · 01-09-2015 12:22pm

Toto Wolfcastle wrote: »

I've been keeping a food diary for the last few weeks to see which of the high FODMAP foods trigger my suspected IBS and the one thing that has stood out has been wheat. Since removing it as much as possible from my diet the uncomfortable bloating has disappeared. I don't really care whether it's the gluten or something else as long as I feel better. There was a dietician on the radio last week that said that new research has found that it's not the gluten, but something else.

I'd kill for a bowl of pasta though, with or without oil in the water.

My mother is allergic to wheat but not gluten.S o she can eat rye bread etc that doesn't include wheat flour. However she finds that most gluten free breads don't suit her.

duploelabs · 01-09-2015 12:57pm

BaZmO* wrote: »

That's not the same as the anecdotal evidence that I'm providing. I've tried both methods and decided to do the one that works for me.

see you at EP so

Dolbert · 01-09-2015 1:04pm

Toto Wolfcastle wrote: »

I've been keeping a food diary for the last few weeks to see which of the high FODMAP foods trigger my suspected IBS and the one thing that has stood out has been wheat. Since removing it as much as possible from my diet the uncomfortable bloating has disappeared. I don't really care whether it's the gluten or something else as long as I feel better. There was a dietician on the radio last week that said that new research has found that it's not the gluten, but something else.

I'd kill for a bowl of pasta though, with or without oil in the water.

Funnily enough, my husband finds that pasta etc doesn't affect his suspected IBS much at all. The worst possible FODMAP foods for him are garlic and onion, they affect him instantly. It took ages to discover that as garlic is normally renowned for its health benefits. This makes cooking our former favourites a challenge

Mellor · 02-09-2015 8:17am

the beer revolu wrote: »

OK, mostly just my pedantic opinions rather than myth busting but I like the thread idea.

Maybe mostly opinion rather myth, but this one deserves seconded from me

Pork must be cooked until it's dry and tasteless.

+1
The idea that pork must be fully cooked is a myth.
It was encouraged in the past as a means to kill parasitic worms (Trichinella spiralis) found in pigs (and other animals). Pork itself is fine to eat medium-rare, If the worms aren't present there's no need to overcook it. With modern farming, the Trichinella spiralis parasite is extremely rare. They've tracked the occurrence of the parasite in the US for 60+ years. Number have fallen form 400/year (1950) to 12/year (2001). That's about 1 case for every 10 million pigs.

Even here in Australia the myth of persists, dispite the fact Trichinellosis Spiralis has never been present here. But people simply brought the myth with them when they arrived - admittedly, me included.

Subcomandante Marcos wrote: »

Myth: Steaks shouldn't have much fat on them and should be almost completely lean.

I don't think I've ever heard anyone suggest that tbh.
I'd assume that the idea that marbling/fat = flavour is widely accepted.

rubadub wrote: »

That boiling stuff with alcohol for a few minutes magically boils or "burns" off ALL the alcohol.

I used to think the same about lighting shots. That it's wasting alcohol.
Until I seen the label for a liqueur called GletscherEis. It gave estimated alcohol content based on time alight. I've was shocked at how long it took to have a significant impact.

You determine the strength – the original is 50% vol.

After 3 minutes on fire – 45% vol.
After 5 minutes on fire – 42% vol.
After 10 minutes on fire – 33% vol.

stmol32 · 03-09-2015 12:25pm

the beer revolu wrote: »

Cornflour is a suitable thickener for a stew. Nope.

Surely it does!?!
Can you explain a bit please (if only to get the thread off the pasta war:)).

the beer revolu · 03-09-2015 1:18pm

stmol32 wrote: »

Surely it does!?!
Can you explain a bit please (if only to get the thread off the pasta war:)).

It gives a gloopy texture like that of a bad Chinese take away. I really dislike it.
Stews should be thickened with flour at the beginning or a roux later on or just by reducing to the required consistency.
I think that thickening a stew with cornflour is a lazy shortcut that gives poor results.

I also think that a lot of people add too much liquid to their stews and then over thicken them.

Thud · 03-09-2015 1:49pm

Mellor wrote: »

I used to think the same about lighting shots. That it's wasting alcohol.
Until I seen the label for a liqueur called GletscherEis. It gave estimated alcohol content based on time alight. I've was shocked at how long it took to have a significant impact.

I remember seeing a test to see how good a poteen was, was to light a spoonful of it, if it left any residue or coloured residue it was bad, a clean spoon was good. That stuff burned off quickly but it would have had a much higher % alcohol than normal spirits

Mellor · 03-09-2015 2:51pm

Thud wrote: »

I remember seeing a test to see how good a poteen was, was to light a spoonful of it, if it left any residue or coloured residue it was bad, a clean spoon was good. That stuff burned off quickly but it would have had a much higher % alcohol than normal spirits

In that case I'd imagine it's burning with a larger, hotter flame. As its higher alcohol.
But alcohol in food is watered down a lot, it could need hours to simmer out.

the beer revolu · 03-09-2015 3:25pm

Food that has been defrosted cannot be refrozen.

garbeth · 03-09-2015 4:05pm

Have never need to thicken an irish stew. I do a one pot stew, cook meat onions and one potatoe cubed for 40 minutes add the potatoes and then after ten minutes add the veg 20 minutes later remove the potatoes reduce the heat and add oxtail soup

Have never added cornflour to stew. Have added it to sauces but would slake it first take a few tablespoons of water or juice and dissolve the cornflour in it.

Other receipes Ive used has the nested dusted in flour to thicken the sauce

duploelabs · 03-09-2015 6:40pm

Best before and Use by are the same thing

BaZmO* · 03-09-2015 7:59pm

duploelabs wrote: »

Best before and Use by are the same thing

Is that a myth though?

L1011 · 03-09-2015 8:06pm

BaZmO* wrote: »

Is that a myth though?

Lots of people do seem to assume that Best Before, Use By and Sell By are identical. When they're vastly different.

kylith · 03-09-2015 8:11pm

BaZmO* wrote: »

Is that a myth though?

Best before means that it's at its best before that date; you can get up to a week after that date when it's fine.

Use by means that you must use it by that date.

StonyIron · 03-09-2015 8:30pm

Minder wrote: »

Adding oil to pasta water to prevent sticking. Debunked. A waste of good oil.

It does however act as defoamer that prevents the foamy water from boiling out of the pot.

Koptain Liverpool · 03-09-2015 8:39pm

The whole argument about oil in pasta water has not addressed the most important point!!!!!!!

Adding oil to the water can help avoid pasta sticking together but no more so than using a pan with enough water and stirring it properly.

The main drawback of adding oil to water is that it means the sauce will not bind properly to the pasta afterwards.

That´s why Italians don´t do it......

SpaceRocket · 03-09-2015 8:49pm

kenco wrote: »

Where to start! So much nonsense prescribed around meat and fish and the healthiest way to cook them....

My fav however is washing the bejaysus out of Mushrooms....

Is this not the done thing anymore? I always wash the mud off my mushrooms, I'm afraid of eating some sort of parasite or worm...

BaZmO* · 03-09-2015 9:44pm

kylith wrote: »

Best before means that it's at its best before that date; you can get up to a week after that date when it's fine.

Use by means that you must use it by that date.

I know the difference, I was just questioning the idea that it was a myth.

Spanish Eyes · 03-09-2015 10:10pm

Sweating the veg is mandatory for a bog standard vegetable soup.

kylith · 03-09-2015 11:51pm

BaZmO* wrote: »

I know the difference, I was just questioning the idea that it was a myth.

The myth is that they're the same thing, I know people who do believe that.

StonyIron · 04-09-2015 12:02am

Koptain Liverpool wrote: »

The whole argument about oil in pasta water has not addressed the most important point!!!!!!!

Adding oil to the water can help avoid pasta sticking together but no more so than using a pan with enough water and stirring it properly.

The main drawback of adding oil to water is that it means the sauce will not bind properly to the pasta afterwards.

That´s why Italians don´t do it......

You can add a few drops of oil to strained pasta to prevent it sticking though. Adding it to the water won't so much though other than kill the bubbles.

StonyIron · 04-09-2015 12:03am

There's a myth out there that you don't need to preheat fan ovens too!

You absolutely do, unless you want half cooked food. They can take 15 Mins to reach temperature on some models!

TheChizler · 04-09-2015 12:23am

That leaving open food cans in the fridge will give you botulism.

And the MSG is bad one that someone else mentioned. It can actually help you reduce your salt intake if used as an alternative flavoring.

The best by/use by one is a favourite of mine.

Oh, and that if there's any she'll or dirt in egg whites that they won't foam when you whip them. Maybe before electric whisks it was harder but these days people rarely whisk egg whites by hand.

Mellor · 04-09-2015 12:53am

the beer revolu wrote: »

Food that has been defrosted cannot be refrozen.

Can't believe I forgot that one.

garbeth wrote: »

Have never need to thicken an irish stew. I do a one pot stew, cook meat onions and one potatoe cubed for 40 minutes add the potatoes and then after ten minutes add the veg 20 minutes later remove the potatoes reduce the heat and add oxtail soup

You never thicken soup. Are you sure?
Check the ingredient on the oxtail. Most likely the main one is some sort of flour-starch blend.

kylith wrote: »

Best before means that it's at its best before that date; you can get up to a week after that date when it's fine.

Use by means that you must use it by that date.

I'm aware that the two aren't the identical. Best before is generally for pantry items, that will have a long shelf life and a few days/weeks past a 3 year shelf will make no odds.
Use by is generally for fresh items, where they they can be more accurate with when it will go off. meats, milk etc.

That said, I'm sure you can find manufacturers that use them interchangeable. If I see raw chicken from two brands, one using BB and the other using UB, I'm gonna they means the same thing. I wouldn't give BB more time than the other.

(That said, I'll go over the use by date often if the meats stored well and I think it still ok - lean meats keep better)

StonyIron wrote: »

There's a myth out there that you don't need to preheat fan ovens too!

You absolutely do, unless you want half cooked food. They can take 15 Mins to reach temperature on some models!

Not preheating an oven doesn't give you half cooked food. It just means it'll take a bit longer in there. Some foods it'll effect the cooking (roasts, bread etc,) some foods it won't.

Faith · 04-09-2015 1:00am

Some posts on this thread are skating dangerously close to being food safety advice. Please don't do that

.

Minder · 04-09-2015 7:43am

The myth that everyone should drink 8 glasses of water a day to sustain hydration. The colour of what comes out is a far better indicator of hydration than the quantity of what goes in.

Another culinary myth is that adding salt to boiling water reduces the temperature at which the water boils and so speeds up the cooking. Technically, yes, this is true. But the amount of salt required to appreciably reduce the temperature is so large, any food added to the water would be inedible.

Markcheese · 04-09-2015 7:47am

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Sweating the veg is mandatory for a bog standard vegetable soup.

Isn't it ?? I mean yeah you could just boil the veg but I always sweat them down first-

Mellor · 04-09-2015 8:50am

Minder wrote: »

Another culinary myth is that adding salt to boiling water reduces the temperature at which the water boils and so speeds up the cooking. Technically, yes, this is true. But the amount of salt required to appreciably reduce the temperature is so large, any food added to the water would be inedible.

Salt increases the temp. (reducing would mean it takes longer to cook)
But you are right in the rest, you need something like 50g per litre to raise the boiling point by 1 degree Celsius

StonyIron · 04-09-2015 9:07am

Red wine should never be chilled.
You can actually do whatever you like with it!

Jawgap · 04-09-2015 11:13am

StonyIron wrote: »

Red wine should never be chilled.
You can actually do whatever you like with it!

Slightly below room temp was the advice I was always given.

Another tip was to put it outside on the kitchen step for an hour before serving......although I know someone who does the opposite and sits it on the radiator!

rubadub · 04-09-2015 11:33am

kylith wrote: »

Best before means that it's at its best before that date; you can get up to a week after that date when it's fine.

Some products would be grand years after the BB date. People in the beer forum would be drinking 10 year old beers. In the 80's I never saw BB dates on tinned food, it's sterile, some guy ate 50 year old canned chicken a few years back and scientists were confirming its fine.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1509920/Chicken-tastes-supreme-after-50-years-in-a-tin.html

"If the canning is done properly, all the microbes that cause food to deteriorate are removed, so the food could last for ever," said Prof John Mitchell, of Nottingham university.

Canned Food UK, the representative body for manufacturers, also said canned food could be preserved "indefinitely", as long as there were no dents to the tin. "There is no risk that the food is unsuitable for consumption after the sell-by date as long as the container is intact," said Steve Thomas, the organisation's chairman.
"A can was recovered 10 years ago from Captain Scott's travels to Antarctica, and it was still deemed safe."

In cases like this BB dates are really a marketing tool which force retailers to have higher stock turnover, not have old faded labels with old logos etc.

I knew a woman who would throw out tinned food the moment it was past the BB date, as though overnight it magically turned totally toxic.

kylith · 04-09-2015 11:45am

rubadub wrote: »

Some products would be grand years after the BB date. People in the beer forum would be drinking 10 year old beers. In the 80's I never saw BB dates on tinned food, it's sterile, some guy ate 50 year old canned chicken a few years back and scientists were confirming its fine.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1509920/Chicken-tastes-supreme-after-50-years-in-a-tin.html

In cases like this BB dates are really a marketing tool which force retailers to have higher stock turnover, not have old faded labels with old logos etc.

I knew a woman who would throw out tinned food the moment it was past the BB date, as though overnight it magically turned totally toxic.

I always go by the sight/smell test: is it mouldy? does it smell ok? If there's nothing growing on it and it smells fine then it's fine.

My ex was one of those people who'd chuck perfectly fine milk down the drain as soon as the BB date was up, used to drive me mad.

TheChizler · 04-09-2015 2:47pm

rubadub wrote: »

I knew a woman who would throw out tinned food the moment it was past the BB date, as though overnight it magically turned totally toxic.

GF's mother does this with food she buys fresh but freezes, still goes by the original BB date. Why she freezes it I don't know...

duploelabs · 04-09-2015 3:09pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Slightly below room temp was the advice I was always given.

Another tip was to put it outside on the kitchen step for an hour before serving......although I know someone who does the opposite and sits it on the radiator!

Also on the same thread, You can taste very little at temperatures of 1 or 2 degrees celsius, hence any beer that claims it should be served ice-cold is masking the taste. But each to their own

Koptain Liverpool · 04-09-2015 10:40pm

StonyIron wrote: »

Red wine should never be chilled.
You can actually do whatever you like with it!

Not sure about other countries but in Spain red wine is often served slightly chilled.

duploelabs · 04-09-2015 10:42pm

Koptain Liverpool wrote: »

Not sure about other countries but in Spain red wine is often served slightly chilled.

there's very little better in the world than a slightly chilled young beaujolais and and oozing brie

Dial Hard · 05-09-2015 4:34pm

SpaceRocket wrote:

Is this not the done thing anymore? I always wash the mud off my mushrooms, I'm afraid of eating some sort of parasite or worm...

Mushrooms absorb water like a mofo, which is why you shouldn't wash them. Wipe with damp kitchen paper instead.

daveville30 · 05-09-2015 9:23pm

Dial Hard wrote: »

Mushrooms absorb water like a mofo, which is why you shouldn't wash them. Wipe with damp kitchen paper instead.

seen a polish lad in aldi eating the large mushrooms raw last week like crisps.

TheChizler · 06-09-2015 10:25am

Dial Hard wrote: »

Mushrooms absorb water like a mofo, which is why you shouldn't wash them. Wipe with damp kitchen paper instead.

Nothing wrong with giving them a quick rinse before using them though. A button mushroom will absorb about a sixteenth of a teaspoon if you SOAK if, which comes right out again when you cook it.

http://www.portlandsculinaryworkshop.com/uncategorized/do-mushroom-soak-up-water-when-you-wash-them-culinary-mythbusters-2/

Day Lewin · 06-09-2015 3:48pm

It is true that mushrooms get soggy if you wash them. They are harder to fry afterwards and sizzle sulkily and soggily in their oozy butter and watery juice.

Day Lewin · 06-09-2015 3:59pm

The Bitter White Pith myth.

Widespread: the warning that you must peel oranges very thinly to avoid the Bitter White Pith. To carefully pick off the clinging little fibrous strands when you peel the fruit, etc.

Well, pick 'em off if you like. But I've always eaten them and they are just not bitter. I bite the pith away from the inside of orange rinds and it isn't bitter either. A bit dry, maybe, but that's all.

I also read somewhere ages ago that citrus pith is a good source of some obscure B vitamin, but maybe that's a myth too.

Day Lewin · 06-09-2015 4:00pm

And no, I am not just taking the pith ;-)

Lord Riverside · 06-09-2015 4:06pm

Koptain Liverpool wrote: »

The whole argument about oil in pasta water has not addressed the most important point!!!!!!!

Adding oil to the water can help avoid pasta sticking together but no more so than using a pan with enough water and stirring it properly.

The main drawback of adding oil to water is that it means the sauce will not bind properly to the pasta afterwards.

That´s why Italians don´t do it......

Actually plenty Italians do it as well, and are as divided on the the opinion as everyone else. It can have a slightly beneficial effect, albeit a marginal one, and only a smallish drop of oil is required, anything else is a waste. It also won't cure using poor quality pasta or a poor cooking technique / preparation. As for olive oil meaning "the sauce won't bind properly with the pasta", that's true for any oil present in the sauce or it's meat, which is about 90 % of pasta sauces.

Persistent culinary myths

Comments