Episode 5x04 - Sons of the Harpy - HAVE read the books [ Spoilers ]

razorblunt · 05-05-2015 11:31am

MrWalsh wrote: »

Yeah, the delivery was all wrong. A whisper definitely would have been better. The actress who plays Melisandre has messed up her lips with some cosmetic procedure since last season, I keep noticing it onscreen.

I think you're right, though not just her lips maybe the whole face. My OH pointed it out at the beginning of the series.

FWIW I liked the line, couldn't recall it being whispered so I have to concede a whisper would have had a greater effect.

MrWalsh · 05-05-2015 11:33am

razorblunt wrote: »

I think you're right, though not just her lips maybe the whole face. My OH pointed it out at the beginning of the series.

Yeah it might be more than the lips, but the lips struck me as a bit "duck" like - Ill have another look, she has been looking strangely expressionless of late (thinking about the stone faced delivery of that line).

Sleepy · 05-05-2015 11:50am

MrWalsh wrote: »

@Sleepy - Thats a good point about Lancel.

I may also be guilty of mixing up book Loras (who has even beaten Jaime Lannister) and show Loras. I wouldnt take being beaten by Brienne to indicate you are not a good fighter though, she made mince meat of the Hound who was a total badass.

Again, Loras beat Jaime in a joust, not a sword-fight. Jousting is as much, if not more so, a test of one's horsemanship than one's skill at arms.

I think it's a bit unfair to say Brienne made mince-meat of the Hound. It was a close fought thing and he was already weakened from his various wounds at the time. She's a great fighter but either Jaime or the Hound in the full of their health would beat her.

I think they should have toughened Loras up a bit in the show, although I do like Finn Jones portrayal generally speaking.

My husband (non book reader) said when I exclaimed out loud that the Faith Militant could never take Loras so easily that because Loras is so polite he wouldnt make a fuss while under someone elses roof and would go quietly and have it sorted out later (always interesting to get the non book readers pov in my house!).

I think they've made Loras into far too much of a twink in the show tbh. He's supposed to be a dandy who very much espouses the ideal of knightly valour and chivalry not just a fop who has a powerful family name.

MrWalsh · 05-05-2015 11:53am

Sleepy wrote: »

I think it's a bit unfair to say Brienne made mince-meat of the Hound. It was a close fought thing and he was already weakened from his various wounds at the time. She's a great fighter but either Jaime or the Hound in the full of their health would beat her.

Whatever about book Brienne, she is certainly being portrayed as the greatest fighter of them all in the show.

Sleepy · 05-05-2015 12:12pm

I think she's being portrayed as one of the best, Jaime was certainly impressed with her and she dispatched a weakened hound but I don't think the show is going so far as to portray her as the "greatest fighter of them all" other than in Pod's eyes?

Honestly, I rather like it that there's no "unbeatable" fighter in the show. Even Bronn who's rarely shown as having a weakness backed away from a fight with the Mountain. Jaime was legendary in his day but held his own with Brienne after being shackled for a few months. She only beat the Hound because he was weakened who in turn, only held off the Mountain because the king intervened, the Mountain in turn was bested by Oberyn (until he slipped up) etc.

Chaos may be a ladder but violence is a toss of the dice. I like that about the show.

rawn · 05-05-2015 3:25pm

The Unsullied used to drink nightshade(?) which prevented them from feeling pain. They don't drink it anymore, so maybe their fighting skills have taken a downturn? This, plus the fact that their training now vs their training in Astapor is hugely different, they're weaker fighters now that they have a weak (compared to their masters in Astapor) Queen.

Also, I'm not surprised that the holy militants have been winning with ease now, as I would assume people, especially high-born's like Loras, would be reluctant to fight back against holy men, for now anyways.

The Sand Snakes sucked. I liked them in the books but the scene was badly written. Hopefully they'll improve.

MrWalsh · 05-05-2015 3:30pm

I saw the Sand Snakes described as "B movie bad girls" somewhere.

I havent seen enough of them to make a call on it. I did like the outfit on the one who threw the spear through the buried guys head.

Hans Bricks · 05-05-2015 3:33pm

rawn wrote: »

The Sand Snakes sucked. I liked them in the books but the scene was badly written. Hopefully they'll improve.

Never really felt them in the books. The purpose of Dorne in asoiaf really is to get revenge on the Lannisters. It's kind of way overdue or evena little late now.

Between pressure from the Iron Bank, Aegon Targaryen invading the Stormlands, ineffective leadership for the Lannisters (Kevan dead and all), Margaery Tyrell wielding the Queen's power now and the Faith Militant, Cersei is fucked either way at this stage. Even Jaime has abandoned her. IMO the Martells aren't really that significant for the rest of the series, unless they join with the Targaryens for an invasion of King's Landing.

celica00 · 06-05-2015 10:19am

I finally catched up on this episode as well and must say:

Im really disappointed by the fight scene of grey worm and the others of the army.
The fight was poorly done (movements etc, why did all of the sullied die????), Ser Barristan moved very well (considering the age), but in the end somehow did too quickly as well..

just didnt like how it was made, could have been way more nicer.

That bothered me the most really :S

Mr Velo · 06-05-2015 10:59am

Anyone watch Thronecast on Monday night?

Ian McElhinney was on it and confirmed that Barristan dies

Tom.D.BJJ · 06-05-2015 11:15am

MrWalsh wrote: »

I said it here somewhere before - he should have a short sword hand attachment made. A long sword would be no good as he wouldnt have any wrist twisting ability but a short stabby weapon would work great strapped onto his stump - a la Merle in the Walking Dead. They could even make it retractable.

All i can think of is James Bond villians when i read this, but yes a hook or something stabby might be useful here.

All in all, it was a fcking sh1te episode which has put a dampener or what started as a decent season.

Tom.D.BJJ · 06-05-2015 11:58am

There's no way Wardeness is a word, she would be Warden of the North

The Gibzilla · 06-05-2015 12:05pm

Tom.D.BJJ wrote: »

There's no way Wardeness is a word, she would be Warden of the North

I know, that's completely unpossible to say...

MrWalsh · 06-05-2015 12:08pm

Tom.D.BJJ wrote: »

All i can think of is James Bond villians when i read this, but yes a hook or something stabby might be useful here.

Something stabby that can be folded or retracted along with a heavy ended part for punching. Stabby pummelling.

They should so have me designing warrior amputee attachments in Kings Landing.......

Duckworth_Luas · 06-05-2015 1:14pm

Tom.D.BJJ wrote: »

There's no way Wardeness is a word, she would be Warden of the North

The Gibzilla wrote: »

I know, that's completely unpossible to say...

It's a perfectly cromulent word!

duploelabs · 06-05-2015 1:25pm

Mr Velo wrote: »

Anyone watch Thronecast on Monday night?
Ian McElhinney was on it and confirmed that Barristan dies

not Obi-Wan!!!!!!

Sleepy · 06-05-2015 1:33pm

MrWalsh wrote: »

Something stabby that can be folded or retracted along with a heavy ended part for punching. Stabby pummelling.

They should so have me designing warrior amputee attachments in Kings Landing.......

He did make a comment about a hook being more practical...

Digital Solitude · 06-05-2015 4:24pm

Don't normally post in these threads, but Grey Worm rolling in pain really annoyed me. Can see myself dropping the show altogether until the books are finished (I know).

As mentioned before the Unsullied and Sand Snakes were terrible, the casting on them was bad IMO too. Iirc, they're supposed to be beautiful, but savage warriors? One of them would have looked at home on Amazonia, I thought it was very poorly handled.

Tyrion was showed unnecessarily too, though I think an update on him would be needed, it could have been left until next week.

Enjoying Sansa in the show, think its a mixture between Sophie Turner, and not having to listen to her depressing monologues going on and on, her story didn't go anywhere in the books, so at least for that I'm thankful.

While Tommen is a useless King, I think he's very well played by the actor, comes off as meek and shy when he tries to exercise power, and it does fit his character, that and being so easily manipulated by both Cersei and Margery. In fairness, he has no real father figure and no one to guide him so I can see how he's so lost. Maybe with the reintroduction of a Hand to the King he will take on a more powerful figure.

bur · 06-05-2015 4:41pm

Stannis: Are you lonely?

Shireen: Just bored.

St: My father used to tell me that boredom indicates a lack of inner resources.

Sh: Were you bored a lot too?

Think they are both great characters, that whole scene is one of my favourites.

connemara man · 06-05-2015 4:45pm

bur wrote: »

Stannis: Are you lonely?

Shireen: Just bored.

St: My father used to tell that boredom indicates a lack of inner resources.

Sh: Were you bored a lot too?

Think they are both great characters, that whole scene is one of my favourites.

Something nearly flew into my eye during that scene

Jofspring · 06-05-2015 5:02pm

Ya not a huge fan of the deviations from the books. I am currently re-reading the last 3 books and really enjoying them on a re-read. Fair enough some chapters are still boring but most are more enjoyable than the first read so it just feels criminal to be changing so much.

People have praised the two lads for their interpretations of the books and converting them to TV but to be honest the more they deviate from the book it looks like the worse the show could get. The first few seasons were fairly bang on with the books with only minor changes but now it's gone the opposite way.

bur · 06-05-2015 6:10pm

Jofspring wrote: »

Ya not a huge fan of the deviations from the books. I am currently re-reading the last 3 books and really enjoying them on a re-read. Fair enough some chapters are still boring but most are more enjoyable than the first read so it just feels criminal to be changing so much.

People have praised the two lads for their interpretations of the books and converting them to TV but to be honest the more they deviate from the book it looks like the worse the show could get. The first few seasons were fairly bang on with the books with only minor changes but now it's gone the opposite way.

I've taken out your show spoiler...

Only change that still annoys me is no Lady Stoneheart.

What can the writers do? If they followed the books to the letter it would take twenty seasons. The story has to start contracting at some point. And who knows how much GRRM has actually given them, they would have no idea of the plans for a number of characters i bet.
GRRM is probably deluded enough to think he can still finish his books before them so has held plenty back.

Liam O · 06-05-2015 8:05pm

bur wrote: »

I've taken out your show spoiler...

Only change that still annoys me is no Lady Stoneheart.

What can the writers do? If they followed the books to the letter it would take twenty seasons. The story has to start contracting at some point. And who knows how much GRRM has actually given them, they would have no idea of the plans for a number of characters i bet.
GRRM is probably deluded enough to think he can still finish his books before them so has held plenty back.

It could still have stayed a bit more true to the books. The problem us they are getting name actors for every role and the non name actors they had at the start are probably commanding a lot more money than in season 1. This makes adding the requisite amount of characters quite difficult budget wise. On any other Network there would be minimum 15 episode seasons by now, 10 isn't nearly enough to get to everyone and stop it just becoming an elongated montage which is what it's creeping towards.

missmaw · 07-05-2015 1:47pm

celica00 wrote: »

I finally catched up on this episode as well and must say:

Im really disappointed by the fight scene of grey worm and the others of the army.
The fight was poorly done (movements etc, why did all of the sullied die????), Ser Barristan moved very well (considering the age), but in the end somehow did too quickly as well..

just didnt like how it was made, could have been way more nicer.

That bothered me the most really :S

Reminded me of the fight scene in the Life of Brian between the Peoples front of Judea and the Campaign for Free Galilee. It was really cringy.

Michael D Not Higgins · 07-05-2015 3:25pm

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Game-Thrones-Continues-Swords-Dragons-ebook/dp/B007B5EDEG/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1431008727&sr=1-1&keywords=a+song+of+ice+and+fire

Hans Bricks · 08-05-2015 5:31pm

Rumor has it and according to IMBD, episode 9 is titled

The Dance of Dragons. Anyone else think we can expect a surprise appearance of Jon Con and Aegon Targaryen ?

I hope so.

MrWalsh · 08-05-2015 6:53pm

Hans Bricks wrote: »

Rumor has it and according to IMBD, episode 9 is titled
The Dance of Dragons. Anyone else think we can expect a surprise appearance of Jon Con and Aegon Targaryen ?
I hope so.

God I really hope so!!

Hans Bricks · 08-05-2015 7:32pm

MrWalsh wrote: »

God I really hope so!!

I'm starting to reckon this could be the big reveal / cliffhanger to end the season on. I think Varys has replaced Tyrion in this regard to the books in order to introduce and influence the Griffs to head for Westeros.

http://winteriscoming.net/2015/03/30/game-of-thrones-season-5-rumors-to-griff-or-not-to-griff/

MrWalsh · 08-05-2015 7:52pm

Yeah I saw that article a while ago. Haven't seen anything else about it. Really want this to stay in it though!

Mr Freeze · 08-05-2015 8:31pm

Hans Bricks wrote: »

I'm starting to reckon this could be the big reveal / cliffhanger to end the season on. I think Varys has replaced Tyrion in this regard to the books in order to introduce and influence the Griffs to head for Westeros.

http://winteriscoming.net/2015/03/30/game-of-thrones-season-5-rumors-to-griff-or-not-to-griff/

Here's hoping.

Episode 5x04 - Sons of the Harpy - *HAVE* read the books [** Spoilers **]

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Episode 5x04 - Sons of the Harpy - HAVE read the books [ Spoilers ]