Help -is this buyer genuine or a fraud??

jayjay2010 · 10-05-2010 6:09pm #1

Hi guys, I will make this as simple as I can:

Basically, I'm selling my car on carsireland.ie.

Last week, someone emailed me interested in viewing the car. This person seems genuinely interested.

However, some things he says in his emails seem a bit odd to me (perhaps Im paranoid?), he says things like: ''I'm sure we will close this deal'' and ''I will more than likely buy the car off you upon seing it'' etc etc...

Now this person hasnt seen the car in real life as we havent met up yet. He hasnt tried any kind of haggling and he is happy to take the car at asking price.

We are meeting this week. However today he sent me an email saying he will pay me by BANK DRAFT. Naturally, I would prefer cash. I havent emailed him back yet.

How do I know if this is a genuine buyer?

What is the best method of payment I should ask for?

Any other concerns at all?

Please help as Im meeting him this week (im bringing a friend of course)

Thanks, help is much appreciated

Max Power1 · 10-05-2010 6:15pm

jayjay2010 wrote: »

Hi guys, I will make this as simple as I can:

Basically, I'm selling my car on carsireland.ie.

Last week, someone emailed me interested in viewing the car. This person seems genuinely interested.

However, some things he says in his emails seem a bit odd to me (perhaps Im paranoid?), he says things like: ''I'm sure we will close this deal'' and ''I will more than likely buy the car off you upon seing it'' etc etc...

Now this person hasnt seen the car in real life as we havent met up yet. He hasnt tried any kind of haggling and he is happy to take the car at asking price.

We are meeting this week. However today he sent me an email saying he will pay me by BANK DRAFT. Naturally, I would prefer cash. I havent emailed him back yet.

How do I know if this is a genuine buyer?

What is the best method of payment I should ask for?

Any other concerns at all?

Please help as Im meeting him this week (im bringing a friend of course)

Thanks, help is much appreciated

SCAM alert for sure.

Get your nigerian lotto tickets ready!

wildefalcon · 10-05-2010 6:16pm

Be very careful! if you take a bank draft then ask the guy what branch it was issued from, and tell him that you will be phoning the bank to check the amount and recipient.

If cash then make sure it is real money.

It does sound unwholesome.

If he offers MORE than you want then RUN AWAY.

FAST.

G.

Vertakill · 10-05-2010 6:19pm

Cash is obviously the best way but bank draft is probably a close second.
But if it were me, once you've shook hands on the deal... I would take 2 cars down to the bank and cash it. Once the draft is proven legit, you give the guy the keys/logbook and the car and go home in the other car.

I think there may ways of scamming people with drafts. Not sure if it's related to fake drafts or doing something between the time it takes to clear.

If they offer you a bank draft (or anything similar) exceeding the amount for the car (Draft for 2000 and car is 1800) and ask you for 200 euro change... then you know it's a scam.

BigEejit · 10-05-2010 6:20pm

wildefalcon wrote: »

If he offers MORE than you want then RUN AWAY.

FAST.

G.

Or maybe drive away keeping to the speed limit, that would likely be faster than running away.

But yes OP, sounds pretty dodgy ..... I remember several years ago some bank heist made off with a load of bank drafts, surely some of these are still out there.

Blazer · 10-05-2010 6:21pm

Paying by bank draft is not a sign of a con job.
I paid for my first card by bank draft as I didn't fancy lugging €6500 in my wallet around the place and the guy was happy to accept my bank draft.
Of course as was said above always ring the bank it's drawn on and verify it's real.

Absurdum · 10-05-2010 6:21pm

tell him that you will only accept a bank draft if you both go to the bank where it is to be issued

edit: I'd probably do the same with cash as I wouldn't want a large amount of it in the house

Atlantic Dawn · 10-05-2010 6:26pm

Cash isn't a problem if you meet him at your bank and have him lodge it in your account, that verifies the notes are not duds and takes care of the security problem.

Also are you selling some super rare car? Sounds dodgy that anyone would make any offer at all on a car they have not seen, normally these are scammers or people with not much else to do with their day except bid on cars.

jayjay2010 · 10-05-2010 7:19pm

Ive emailed him saying that I will only accept a bank draft if we both go to the bank where it is to be issued and/or if he rather pay cash and we can close the deal in the bank.

I know this may sound very amateurish but I want to be sure I am not been scammed.

Thank you all SO much for your quick answers, much appreciated. I will let you know of any updates and if I end up closing the deal!

Drummerboy08 · 10-05-2010 7:22pm

If it sounds like a fish, and smells like a fish then its usually a.....;)

bonzodog2 · 10-05-2010 7:34pm

What do fish sound like? Does it walk like one?

But seriously, these days, with any substantial transaction with an unknown person, I'd want to take the cash/draft to a bank and get it verified before handing over the other half of the deal

colm_mcm · 10-05-2010 7:36pm

I'd usually look at the car before telling the seller how I'd be paying.

spideog7 · 10-05-2010 7:42pm

I thought the scam that used to be going around with Bank Drafts is that the bank would accept the fake (but very good fake maybe even a 'real' fake) bank draft and put the money in your account. Then a few days later when they were processing it, it would turn out to be fake (ie the bank has no record of receiving the money to back it up) and they'd take the money back off you. So the fact that you get the money initially isn't a sign that the bank draft was actually real.
Look for ID too, a drivers licence or something, so you can track them down if anything goes pear shaped.

SV · 10-05-2010 7:42pm

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

If it sounds like a fish, and smells like a fish then its usually a.....;)

scam?

Morlar · 10-05-2010 7:48pm

spideog7 wrote: »

I thought the scam that used to be going around with Bank Drafts is that the bank would accept the fake (but very good fake maybe even a 'real' fake) bank draft and put the money in your account. Then a few days later when they were processing it, it would turn out to be fake (ie the bank has no record of receiving the money to back it up) and they'd take the money back off you. So the fact that you get the money initially isn't a sign that the bank draft was actually real.
Look for ID too, a drivers licence or something, so you can track them down if anything goes pear shaped.

I thought that was the scam too - you lodge it to your account, your bank tells you it's good then 2 weeks later say it's bad and that money is then removed form your account. Unless you can cash it (presumably the bank where it's issued) then I wouldn't accept it.

Eoin · 10-05-2010 7:58pm

jayjay2010 - have a good read through the Scam thread; it's stickied at the top of the motors forum. You'll most likely read some similar emails there.

knifey_spoonie · 10-05-2010 7:58pm

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

If it sounds like a fish, and smells like a fish then its usually a.....;)

FRONT BOTTOM

colm_mcm · 10-05-2010 8:03pm

-Corkie- · 10-05-2010 8:16pm

Sounds like a scam but as eoin said read the thread on car scams, although normally it all email communication but this op is meeting the seller in person. Maybe its a new type of scam but beware op. Btw i cant find the picture of the black fella on the beach on the phone laughing. It normally appears on threads of this nature...

Thoie · 10-05-2010 8:32pm

SARASON wrote: »

Sounds like a scam but as eoin said read the thread on car scams, although normally it all email communication but this op is meeting the seller in person.

I wouldn't be suprised if the guy can't come himself but his "agent, who is authorised to act on my behalf" is sent instead.

In answer to someone's earlier point, yes, genuine people do use bank drafts, but so do scammers. Anyone offering me a bank draft before they'd seen the car, heard any details, would make set off my spider senses.

jayjay2010 · 10-05-2010 8:36pm

Another thing,

Ive spoken to this person on the phone once for about 10 minutes. He was definitely a well spoken Irishman.

However his emails are rather poorly written and uses words such as: ''ungodly'', ''meet this week is OK'', and some other strange vocabulary habits.

Im very cautious now....

Thoie · 10-05-2010 8:57pm

jayjay2010 wrote: »

He was definitely a well spoken Irishman.

Wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him

cml387 · 10-05-2010 9:03pm

jayjay2010 wrote: »

Another thing,

Ive spoken to this person on the phone once for about 10 minutes. He was definitely a well spoken Irishman.

However his emails are rather poorly written and uses words such as: ''ungodly'', ''meet this week is OK'', and some other strange vocabulary habits.

Im very cautious now....

You are selling your car to Kevin Myers.

Fallon2304 · 10-05-2010 9:05pm

I was in a similar boat. Got offered the same saying I'll pay by draft, really keen and all the same.

Told him flat out NO - Cash only. Gave him the option of either coming with me to the bank where it was issued and lodge it there. OR, let it clear for 7 days.

His answer was "If I have a draft it proves I have money in the a/c" Which is all well and good, doesn't tell me if it's stolen though!

Cash is king. Not worth the risk, anyone serious and genuine about buying a car will understand this, and will be willing to meet your requirements.

Funnily enough I never heard from my potential buyer once I had declined the Bank Draft.

cml387 · 10-05-2010 9:07pm

Why not hang on to the car until the draft clears?

jayjay2010 · 10-05-2010 9:54pm

cml387 wrote: »

You are selling your car to Kevin Myers.

how would you come to such conclusion?

ERR! · 10-05-2010 10:23pm

what car you selling?? im looking to buy one :P

Gophur · 11-05-2010 9:46am

Vertakill wrote: »

............
But if it were me, once you've shook hands on the deal... I would take 2 cars down to the bank and cash it. ..............

That is no longer possible. Banks will now insist on waiting a number of days, until the Draft clears, i.e. is proven to be genuine.

Should you cash a Bank draft which is subsequently found to be bogus, the Bank will follow you for the money.

voxpop · 11-05-2010 10:50am

Just be aware that this whole thread is starting to sound very paranoid. There is a certain amount of trust on both sides when selling a car. A draft is a pretty standard way to pay - i know you can get fake drafts, but you can get fakes 50s as well.

If you can, probably the best solution is to meet at his bank, he can get the draft there (with you watching) and you can lodge it into your account. Otherwise get the draft serial number and issuing bank branch - afaik you can ring the branch to confirm they issued the draft.

Obviously dont send off the vlc until cash/draft has cleared - if it doesn't clear then the car has been stolen - so keep vlc, and report to guards,etc

Morlar · 11-05-2010 11:51am

Can anyone confirm, this is mentioned but people seem to be unsure or avoiding it or perhaps know more about it than I do.

Isn't there a risk that if you accept a bank draft as payment your bank will say 'it has cleared' believing it has. Your account gets credited by X amount. All seems good.

Then at a later date your bank tell you that in fact it turned out to be bogus in some way and your account is debited.

The original funds were not there or were illegally there or in some other way the draft they said was OK - was in fact not ok and now you are screwed ?

If you are meeting this guy in his bank, why the hell not just get CASH there and then. Lodge it directly or transfer it into your own account.

Max Power1 · 11-05-2010 11:53am

voxpop wrote: »

Just be aware that this whole thread is starting to sound very paranoid. There is a certain amount of trust on both sides when selling a car. A draft is a pretty standard way to pay - i know you can get fake drafts, but you can get fakes 50s as well.

If you can, probably the best solution is to meet at his bank, he can get the draft there (with you watching) and you can lodge it into your account. Otherwise get the draft serial number and issuing bank branch - afaik you can ring the branch to confirm they issued the draft.

Obviously dont send off the vlc until cash/draft has cleared - if it doesn't clear then the car has been stolen - so keep vlc, and report to guards,etc

+1 once you are covered by insurance that is

Help -is this buyer genuine or a fraud??

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