Coming home? Are you thinking about it?

I'm not in the UAE.

But yes, I would have to be very careful about what I say.

We are excited, but I think it's more a case we are done here, time to move on.

Wompa1 wrote: »

Well, congrats! I'm looking forward to the day that I can get back to Ireland and take my foot off the pedal a bit.

Ironically, for me it will be the opposite.

I'm aiming for relatively senior positions back home.

Yeah, I am in the fortunate position of already having a house in Ireland, so Dublin and the surrounding area would be where I would be looking.

The bugger is that I have to give six months notice. So I'll probably do that after Christmas.

Then I start the clock and start looking for a job.

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Six months notice! Must be really senior What field do you work in?

Education.

Suaimhneach wrote: »

We agreed on a date but the OH is really struggling with the decision and it's causing all sorts of issues

You know what, we are the same. I can honestly say that both myself and herself are in an odd place right now, psychologically. We've made the decision and we just want to be back home right now and not have to wait. Balancing that, with the lifestyle, the weather and all the good things that we will miss, it does take its toll.

Just an update from me - I have finally handed in my notice in work and leaving Oceania for home next month after 5+ years here!

Its a weird feeling really. I know I'll miss it here, but I suppose it gets to the stage where you start thinking long-term and realistically I was never going to stay here for good. I'm excited about moving a bit closer to home, having Europe on my doorstep again, and no mental time differences to deal with! It'll be interesting to see how Ireland has changed since 2010 too. Onwards!

Suaimhneach wrote: »

Oh wow, congrats Undertow.

A lot of what my friend and I talked about before she moved back was setting our expectations. It's so easy to make home seem perfect, but it's definitely flawed. We agreed to be 'cautiously optimistic'! She's been back for two months now, just found the most perfect apartment and loves her job so she's thrilled. Hope it works out that way for us too!

Keep us updated on how it works out for you

Thanks Suaimhneach- sound advice there! I have no real expectations of back home to be honest, it can't be in any worse state than when I left it 5 years ago! I'm taking a few months out to travel first before "settling down" so looking forward to that.

It will probably be April/May by the time I do which could be a good time of the year for job hunting and the likes. I've also taken your advice from before and started the ground work in relation to job hunting and although its 6 months away before I could start, I've been getting very positive feedback so far, especially for work in the UK! I'm open to moving there too, but that might as well be home when you've been in this part of the world for so long ha!

Suaimhneach wrote: »

That's fantastic. I really wanted to take time out to travel but my OH doesnt want to take so much time off, so we're compromising and doing a bunch of small trips before we leave. A few months off after five years of hard work sounds great. I'm considering taking time off when I get back, though he'll go right to work. Where are you off to?

Are you in NZ? I visited for three weeks two christmases ago, absolutely adored the place. I'd be there in a heartbeat if it wasnt for the distance. It's the antipode of ireland (almost)!

On early job-hunting, I am feeling really good about it (win), but also seeing some great jobs go by (frustrating), but overall am just excited I can definitely continue my career at home. I cant wait until I hand in my notice so I can post about it to LinkedIn/FB and ask friends to keep an eye out.

I know what you mean! Handing in your notice is daunting. I mean initially I couldn't wait to do it, but then when the time gets closer it gets more... real I guess!! Yeah I've pretty much split my time here between Oz & NZ. Much preferred NZ to tell you the truth! Its an amazing part of the world and I've loved my time here. its remarkable how similar the North Island is to back home.... but the South Island, well that just feels like another planet! I have one more road trip planned down there before I leave... it could be emotional! The only downside to living here (and its a big one!) is that it's so bloomin' far away from any other country though, nevermind Ireland! I've often said if NZ was based in Europe I'd be here for life.

Good on you taking time off! Where do you plan on travelling to? I think its as good a time as any when leaving for the other side... I don't know about you but I feel I'm not getting any younger- it's very easy when cementing down a new job back home to kind of get "back in the swing of things" again and you might never jump ship again for a long time. I'm heading through SEA & Japan before heading home for Christmas, and then off to Africa for 3 months! Its going to be pretty full-on!

Suaimhneach wrote: »

When you're feeling emosh on the South Island, just think of the adventure you have ahead of you! Sounds really incredible. What a great trip! And you're right, pre-career, pre-mortgage, pre-(potential)-children and (maybe) pre-finding-OH/with-Oh, is the best time to do this.

We're planning to travel around parts of the US we havent seen yet. Portland, DC, NY (with my mam who hasnt been before). Oh and Vancouver. Hoping to do it all via miles I've built up from work / travel home (Aer Lingus shares points with United).

Do you have long left before you make the journey?

Not at all- 5 weeks!! My parents get here in 3 weeks (havent seen them in 2 years!) so they will do the North Island on their own before I team up and do the South Island with them for 10 days! Then mid-Nov I jet off to SEA & Japan for a month. Its so exciting but I have so much to sort out in the meantime! I really don't think its sunk in at all yet. I plan on ditching pretty much everything and leaving with half a rugsack full of clothes. A scary thought when I think about it now haha!

Btw that US trip sounds really cool. I spent a month up around British Columbia earlier this year and Van is well cool. Make sure to try and get to Vancouver Island if you get a chance!

My move back is looking a bit more doubtful. For over a year now I have talked with my fiancé about wanting to move to Ireland. At first she was apprehensive but then seemed to get on board BUT I also got the feeling that she was just trying to make me shut up.

Anyways. I started asking her about the future. We have a child on the way and she's only engaged very passively about where we will settle. Anyways, one thing she has been dead set on since we found out she's pregnant is that her mother take care of the child when we're at work...I had a job opportunity in Seattle and agreed to stay here. The cost of childcare and rent up there together, along with less in pay would have been a serious adjustment.

Last night she made a comment with some venom in her voice. "He's going to get very attached to my parents. So, you'll need to explain to him that we'll be leaving them"...so, rather than we or us. It's on me. I pushed her on it. She said, I was a -3 on Ireland, now I'm about a 7. I need time. It's a real kicker...she doesn't want to leave her parents. Which is fair enough....

I don't want to live anywhere near my parents. I don't really care about moving to be by my family.

It's a tough position to be in. Because I truly believe my child would have a clearer future and be safer in Ireland than here. Even aside from my own selfish reasons (just the fact I don't like where we are now or some of the cultural differences in the US) I do believe it's a better life waiting for us in Ireland

CelticRambler wrote: »

That's rough for you.

Does your fiancée's mother know she's been signed up (indefinitely) as a childminder?

It sounds like the important decisions have already been made for you (I know that feeling :mad: ) but it might be worth pointing out that once the baby's born, you'll have three to five years when it won't care where it is as long as it has it's own parents around, and if you (both) don't take that time to look at alternatives, you'll never know what might be on offer ...

Yeah, I'm not sure I'll stand for it. It's not like being in Donegal and her wanting to stay in Kerry.

There was a guy shooting into the freeway here a few weeks ago. There was a guy that went on a shooting spree close to where we live. There's been multiple homicides within a half mile of where we're living now. The air quality here is one of the worst in the country. I've been having stomach problems here...when I got back to Ireland, the problems go away. I'm under a lot of stress and I'm the main bread winner.

For my kid. I don't know about primary school and secondary school vs elementary and high school here. It seems from a distance that elementary and high school are likely a bit better than what we have. BUT at least my kids wouldn't be subjected to common core in primary school like they've just brought in here for elementary. They also wouldn't be subjected to going through active shooter drills.

I moved to a place last year and was working from home in a new job. This was one of the nicest areas in the Metro area. My first week working from there, I saw a news alert that the police were searching a nearby neighborhood (2 blocks from my apartment) for a man seen walking around with a rifle. A school in the area was put on lockdown, just as the kids were out for their lunch break.

I looked on the news sites for more. The comments were filled with negative comments about the police and media coverage and that there's nothing wrong with somebody walking around with a gun. It's his right yada yada.

About 2 hours later there was a follow up that the guy got in a shootout with the police and was killed.

I don't think I'll ever get use to the extremists that are all over the place here. I had some lady telling me that I should move out to the west coast, that Arizona is a special kind of crazy...this was the day before the Oregon shootings!! I had told her, I had been all over the West Coast. I found Oregon to be a little strange. I then told her California has been the site of most of the worlds infamous serial killers....I didn't even mention the guy that went on a shooting spree and then got burned alive by the police! Or the kid that shot up Santa Barbara..

Surely it's common sense that this isn't a good place to raise a child. I'd also be worried that my kid would end up in the military in order to get an education or out of brainwashing through propaganda...

I was ready to leave a year ago...my compromise and sacrifice was meant to be to hold out for 3-6 years to save up money to buy a home (all my own sacrifice since she has significant debt due to the stupid cost of college here and the fact she works a state job with damn all pay)

iusedtoknow wrote: »

Think you're being a bit dramatic overall. In the town I grew up in Ireland a woman was killed by a guy in a year below me. There were all manner of things going on in Cork, in Limerick, in Waterford and all.

Things have changed a lot in Ireland, it's the same place that we grew up in. Last time I was at my parents, i dropped someone off to their office by the school..every single child was being dropped off - i didn't see one walking down the street. I was only ever dropped off if it was raining.

Sure California had a serial killer, but seriously - it's a safe place. I've lived here going on 4 years and have yet to see a gun being pulled. I've not once been mugged, my car was broken into once (my own stupidity)You read a lot of crap in the paper, but the media here blows EVERYTHING out of proportion. Hell even a day of rain is called a "storm".

What I'm saying is...the problem really may be AZ. Kids for the most part grow up all over the US with no problems and emerge from school as good members of society

I have scouted other states to live in. There's still massive disparity between classes in all states. Including California. The serial killer thing was just to make a point to that lady...she was suggesting that California was somehow not crazy. I've spent a lot of time in California as I work in the Tech field and pretty much every major company has a presence out there which means going there often for customers\vendors. My current employers also have our HQ in California.

San Bernadino is one of the craziest places I've seen. Parts of Los Angeles (most parts!) are just awful. San Francisco is very nice, as are parts of Northern California but I'm not too interested in living there. I also don't believe it's the better place to raise kids when compared to Ireland, in my opinion. There's some troubling aspects for me with California. I'm not overly fond of the people there. Event the guys I've worked with in the Tech companies that I have something in common with are just kind of d*cks. I've presented at conferences that people from Russia, China, Japan, UAE etc. attended and found I could hold a conversation better with them than somebody working for Google or Citrix or whoever in California.

People still walk to school where I grew up. But I grew up in a small village. I wouldn't be looking to live in Dublin. Dublin isn't any different to any other major city...I wouldn't want to settle in any major city. Including the one I'm in..but the one I'm in is a huge sprawling metro area so there's no real escaping it if you want to work.

This is what happened this weekend where I live (that was reported):

-A woman was stabbed in the neck in Mesa
-Shooting in Mesa
-Another shooting in Mesa (I unfortunately live in Tempe, right on the border with Mesa)
-Shooting in Scottsdale (Wealthy part of the valley)
-A guy was shot in a road rage incident on the 101
-Two shot in North Phoenix. 1 injured, 1 dead
-A woman shot in the face

That list is actually small when compared with the likes of Chicago. Phoenix population wise isn't all that much bigger than Dublin or at least Dublin before things took a dump. If all of that happened in one weekend in Dublin..There'd probably be a feckin' day of mourning....

In Dublin, you get shootings involving gang members often enough. You get shootings and stabbings for the same reason in Limerick....You wouldn't be getting people shot in road rage incidents. Which happens all the time here! All.The.Time! There's so many women that get shot by husbands or boyfriends too. That's not to mention the people working in gas stations or fast food places that get shot...or the worse place on earth..WalMart!

You wouldn't get much in the likes of Castlebar, Galway, Westport, Letterkenny, Sligo etc.

keithclancy wrote: »

Of all the people I know living in the U.S. and people from the U.S. living in Europe.

Every single one of them at some point or another has said "Hey at least if you drive like an asshole here (Europe) you probably won't get shot"

By that they mean either the Police or someone with Road Rage.

I have yet to use the horn on my car here. Within my first few weeks here there was multiple instances of road rage that resulted in both pick up truck driving arseholes pulling off into a parking lot to have it out like men and then one pulls a gun and bang, bang...gone.

I'm less worried about the police. As sad as it is to say, I have less to be worried about because I'm white....

I've only been pulled over once so far.

There's been quite a few dubious police shootings here..

CelticRambler wrote: »

Not really, not when you think of the gnashing of teeth that accompanies the tiny rise in road accident fatalities here in Europe, then see that there are as many people fatally shot every year in the US as killed in RTAs in Britain, France or Germany. And there are more than twice as many fatal RTAs despite their 50mph speed limits ...



Funny you should say that. I have an acquaintance (French country girl) who's just moved to Louisiana for a few years. Before she left, she told me she'd had it drummed into her by her host family to keep her mouth shut (not easy for a Frenchwoman :pac: ) and stay off the neighbour's lawn. :eek:

However ... there's no easy way to define a "good environment" and you've always got to find a balance. I have no time for guns or heavy weaponry, but it's pretty "normal" for me now to barely notice a gang of lads in camo jackets legging it across a field when I'm on my way to Mass on a Sunday. They're (mad) hunters and rarely shoot anyone other than themselves.

Regardless of my feelings on the subject, my eldest son developed an unquenchable interest in all things military anyway, which I treated as a teenage fad until his class was informed of the date for "national service". :mad: Being told your child has to take up arms for their country does put a different slant on things for you as a parent. We talked it through (over several months) and eventually my son decided to demonstrate his independence by not accepting the automatic French citizenship that would become his right at 18 years of age. Instead, he signed up for the Irish reserves where (in both our eyes) there's less risk of him getting involved in a dirty war ...

In the meantime, he has to deal with an aspect of Irish culture that's completely foreign to him - drinking, drinking, drinking. Even for me, having grown up with it in the background, social events in Ireland come across as appalling boozefests. I'm not teetotal or anti-alcohol (I'm a volunteer barman at a different festivals) but the difference between the zero-Irish events here and anything "back home" is ... staggering. SonNo.1 sees it the same way, and has found himself more at ease with his non-drinking muslim student friends than his Irish classmates. If he'd grown up in Ireland, I'm not sure he'd have the same attitude.

So maybe, Wompa1, your fiancée can't see how "crazy" things are because that's the only reality she's ever known, but be careful yourself of falling into the nostalgia trap. Maybe you could start by looking for a six-month contract or something like that so that both of you (all three of you :cool: ) could take a reversible first step, with an "option to renew" as things progress? The timing's going to be difficult though ...

Louisiana is f'kin crazy. It was on of the states I really wanted to visit. I love old blues and jazz. I drove around the state. There's a very dark, sinister vibe to that state. It was kind of cool because it was edgy but at the same time, I was happy to get out of there. I saw True Detectives a year after my visit..they did a great job of capturing the eerie feeling you get. Even just the shots driving over the waterways with music playing...yeah, that vibe!

I know I have a slight tint of rose on my glasses at the moment. I know of all of the things I disliked before leaving...English tabloid ****e, people with a sense of entitlement, high taxes. I have made my peace with the high tax thing now. The sense of entitlement will still irritate me a bit...though, I swapped that "I'm entitled to it, give me more" thing for "How dare you forget to hand me my cup after I ordered. I want to speak with your manager."...people working service and retail are treated like dirt here.

I also don't indulge in the drinking culture. When in Ireland I would go 6-9 months without drinking. Over here, I once went 11 months without drinking. I would be a bit worried about the affect that would have on my child but then drugs are rampant over here. Growing up in Ireland, I didn't drink until I was 19 and even then my second drink wasn't for another year. I didn't start drinking regularly until a few months before my 21st. It was fairly crap, alright. It's funny you say that about the Muslim friends...I wonder what way it will go, now that there's more multiculturalism...will people from other backgrounds start drinking at 12 or 13...or might fewer Irish start that young due to the other influences...hopefully the latter.

Do you know where or how your son picked up the military fascination? That's a big concern of mine over here. You can't escape it. Everything is very Veteran focused. I had said it before but my brother in law who was raised Buddhist is in the forces! Broke his parents hearts but he grew up here from the age of 2. He didn't do well enough for a scholarship so he didn't have much choice

I'd like to keep my opinions about things to myself as much as possible around my son. I'd rather see him develop his own personality and views without me influencing him. Which, I suppose there's a danger to that too.

Wompa1 wrote: »

I also don't indulge in the drinking culture. When in Ireland I would go 6-9 months without drinking. Over here, I once went 11 months without drinking. I would be a bit worried about the affect that would have on my child but then drugs are rampant over here. Growing up in Ireland, I didn't drink until I was 19 and even then my second drink wasn't for another year. I didn't start drinking regularly until a few months before my 21st. It was fairly crap, alright. It's funny you say that about the Muslim friends...I wonder what way it will go, now that there's more multiculturalism...will people from other backgrounds start drinking at 12 or 13...or might fewer Irish start that young due to the other influences...hopefully the latter.

Do you know where or how your son picked up the military fascination? That's a big concern of mine over here. You can't escape it.
...
I'd like to keep my opinions about things to myself as much as possible around my son. I'd rather see him develop his own personality and views without me influencing him. Which, I suppose there's a danger to that too.

A lot of what I'd like to say in response to the above would really be advice for the "Parenting" forum, and as we've already had a ticking-off for the automated cars tangent ... :pac:

So all feel I can say is that when you re-locate children aged 5-10(ish) you've pretty much got total control over what they see/hear/experience, but once they get into secondary school - or have any significant involvement in outside activities - you very quickly lose that. I don't think the "good parenting" part changes from one country to another, but your teenagers are going soak up what's normal for the country you're living in (or returning to).

If I had to summarise in one word the worst "normal" for different countries that I've had first or second-hand experience of, it'd be gun-culture for the US, materialism for the UK, sex for France and drink for Ireland, but there are "shades of grey" in all of that. I'm not happy that the French treat marital infidelity as a near-normal behaviour, but I couldn't live in a community where the sight of a nipple in the afternoon provokes an emotional meltdown (unless accompanied by a photo of a gun ) Once again, it's a question of choosing the values on which you're prepared to compromise, and IMO it's perfectly reasonable to include in that assessment the support that'll be available and what influence society has on your parenting objectives.

As a man/father-to-be, you're now at a disadvantage, because your fiancée's immediate future has already been divided up into trimesters that will dictate what you (and she) can and cannot do, not to mention her "I want to be near my mother" argument that you've no hope of negotiating. If you're sure you don't want to stay where you are for the long-term, I think you'd do well to accept that, whether you like it or not, you'll be there for the next year at least, and take that time to come up with several positive reasons for a (temporary/provisional) change of environment once your child is more than six months old.