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World Cup 2015 General Chat

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    #32
    mrkiscool2
    Registered Users Posts: 5,159 ✭✭✭mrkiscool2


    Cricket fan wrote: »
    Apparently Andy Flower is in the mix.

    Thoughts??
    I would take him. Not too many coaches around who have coached test nations so to have him would be a good choice

    Also, lol at Cook saying that if he had been selected they would have made the quarters. You had no form mate, never going to do anything.


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    #33
    Rjd2
    Registered Users Posts: 12,016 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2


    tumblr_lltzgnHi5F1qzib3wo1_400.jpg

    https://twitter.com/mattmachan/status/578132609613574144

    Flower would be an immense signing, although think he still has a role at the ECB and I dunno if we would have the money for him.

    .


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    #34
    BarryD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,917 ✭✭✭BarryD


    Interesting piece on the changing landscape of languages in international cricket.

    http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/854255.html

    Will Eamon O'Cuiv become a new convert, I wonder ;)


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    #35
    endabob1
    Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭endabob1


    Cricket fan wrote: »
    Apparently Andy Flower is in the mix.

    Thoughts??



    Reading KP at the moment, it is not very complimentary


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    #36
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    endabob1 wrote: »
    Reading KP at the moment, it is not very complimentary

    Reading KP about anyone other than KP and you won't find too many compliments. :D


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    #37
    endabob1
    Registered Users Posts: 911 ✭✭✭endabob1


    Dozen Wicked Words wrote: »
    Reading KP about anyone other than KP and you won't find too many compliments. :D

    Its not that bad, he clearly has issues with some people but he is complimentary about a lot of others. Flowers swann and Prior particularly are on the receiving end of his ire but its an entertaining read.
    There's no doubt in my mind he was a scapegoat but you pays your money and take your choice, he wanted to be treated differently and certainly thought he was better than a lot of his team mates, but then again his record suggests that he was better....


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    #38
    feargale
    Registered Users Posts: 8,636 ✭✭✭feargale


    Why is it said that NZL beat RSA by four wickets. It conveys the impression that NZL thrashed them, while the reality is that they made it by the skin of their teeth. Would it not be more accurate to record that NZL won by one delivery?


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    #39
    Gillespy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,220 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    That is given too. It's how the score is given when the chasing teams wins. Wickets left and balls left. Four wicket win with 1 ball remaining suggests a close game.


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    #40
    Jacovs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭Jacovs


    Quick question regarding the Duckworth/Lewis method. After SA's loss, their coach said they thought 25 runs would be added to their total to determine NZ's target. But only 17 or 18 runs were added. Now I dont think the extra 7 or 8 runs wouldve made a big difference, NZ probably wouldve put the foot down sooner if they knew they had a higher score to reach, but who knows.

    My question though, why arent the public or even the teams playing allowed to know how this revised target is calculated? For something like this there shouldnt be any speculation, should there?


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    #41
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    Jacovs wrote: »

    My question though, why arent the public or even the teams playing allowed to know how this revised target is calculated? For something like this there shouldnt be any speculation, should there?

    I'd have thought their team statistician would have known the formula. The DLM isn't a state secret either is it? If you wanted to, you probably could worked out why they reached that total, right or wrong. DLM is imperfect, nothing new there.


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    #42
    tmq
    Registered Users Posts: 145 ✭✭tmq


    out of curiosity i googled "duckworth lewis calculator" and there are quite a few strange looking calculators, some of which seem wrong.

    Perhaps thats what the SA coach did too!?


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    #43
    Jacovs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭Jacovs


    I had a google myself and one of the calculators said this:

    "This calculator is accurate for games with first innings scores of less than 235. The professional edition of this calculator is used to calculate the revised target for games with a first innings score greater than 235 but is only available to cricket authorities.

    We will update the calculator accordingly if/when the ICC release the Duckworth Lewis Method professional edition calculations and tables to the public domain."

    So if this is correct, then by cricket authorities I assume they dont include anyone working for any of the teams. Seems to be an easy way to manipulate a game's outcome. Not saying it happened with this game though.

    edit: this is from the website duckworth-lewis.com


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    #44
    pistol_75
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,682 ✭✭✭pistol_75


    Jacovs wrote: »
    My question though, why aren't the public or even the teams playing allowed to know how this revised target is calculated? For something like this there shouldn't be any speculation, should there?

    It is calculated by computer so there is no ambiguity to the whole process. Obviously some formula has been devised to calculate this.

    I know for example even at tea in local games here, based on the first innings score the d/l permutations are printed out should they be needed for the second innings.


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    #45
    Jacovs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭Jacovs


    pistol_75 wrote: »
    It is calculated by computer so there is no ambiguity to the whole process. Obviously some formula has been devised to calculate this.

    I know for example even at tea in local games here, based on the first innings score the d/l permutations are printed out should they be needed for the second innings.

    Fair enough.

    Is this calculator not available to teams and the public then? And if not, why not?


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    #46
    TrueDub
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 2,639 Mod ✭✭✭✭TrueDub


    Jacovs wrote: »
    Quick question regarding the Duckworth/Lewis method. After SA's loss, their coach said they thought 25 runs would be added to their total to determine NZ's target. But only 17 or 18 runs were added. Now I dont think the extra 7 or 8 runs wouldve made a big difference, NZ probably wouldve put the foot down sooner if they knew they had a higher score to reach, but who knows.

    My question though, why arent the public or even the teams playing allowed to know how this revised target is calculated? For something like this there shouldnt be any speculation, should there?

    It's calculated using a statistical analysis computer program, with many variables inputted - things like overs lost, overs remaining, score at the time of interruption and wickets lost.

    It's not a simple calculation, and so it's difficult to predict to any degree of accuracy. The software to calculate it is only available to national organisations (who can distribute it in their territory as they see fit) and so not everyone has access.

    The key, though, is that the score can only be calculated when play is ready to resume, because you need to know how many overs have been lost.


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    #47
    Jacovs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭Jacovs


    TrueDub wrote: »
    It's calculated using a statistical analysis computer program, with many variables inputted - things like overs lost, overs remaining, score at the time of interruption and wickets lost.

    It's not a simple calculation, and so it's difficult to predict to any degree of accuracy. The software to calculate it is only available to national organisations (who can distribute it in their territory as they see fit) and so not everyone has access.

    The key, though, is that the score can only be calculated when play is ready to resume, because you need to know how many overs have been lost.

    I wouldnt argue with this. I would find it strange then that CSA doesnt seem to have shared it with their national team, going by what Domingo said about them expecting 25 runs to have been added to the total. We've let D/L arrange our exit from the tournament before, wouldve hoped they'd have learned and been better prepared.


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    #48
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    Straws being clutched at, by the coach. Its gone.............its gone.


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    #49
    pistol_75
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,682 ✭✭✭pistol_75


    Jacovs wrote: »
    I wouldnt argue with this. I would find it strange then that CSA doesnt seem to have shared it with their national team, going by what Domingo said about them expecting 25 runs to have been added to the total. We've let D/L arrange our exit from the tournament before, wouldve hoped they'd have learned and been better prepared.

    I'm pretty sure they would have access to the required information if needed. Maybe it was just a throwaway comment? I didn't see it directly.

    Also the figure set at the start of the innings would be subject to change through the innings if there was any further time lost.


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    #50
    Jacovs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭Jacovs


    pistol_75 wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure they would have access to the required information if needed. Maybe it was just a throwaway comment? I didn't see it directly.

    Also the figure set at the start of the innings would be subject to change through the innings if there was any further time lost.

    This is what im basing my questions off.

    http://www.sport24.co.za/Cricket/CricketWorldCup2015/Domingo-questions-Duckworth-Lewis-method-20150325


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    #51
    TrueDub
    Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 2,639 Mod ✭✭✭✭TrueDub


    There's absolutely no way they didn't have access to the data - part of the regulations for limited-overs competitions using D/L require each team, and the officials, to be given sheets detailing the figures used to perform the calculations, and giving target scores at the end of each over, or even after each ball.

    So they had the information, but thought D/L didn't do them any favours. That's a frequent comment from losing sides.

    Part of the broader issue, though, is that the D/L calculations use historic data from other matches to do the predictions. I would bet the version being used doesn't have matches where 350 is par and 400 not usual, and might have given a lower total than might be achieved.

    However, this is supposition - if SA hadn't had to come off, they might have ended on more, but they mightn't.


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    #52
    Rjd2
    Registered Users Posts: 12,016 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2


    Not even Dunnes play this badly. :eek::eek:

    http://www.cricket.com.au/news/brendan-taylor-zimbabwe-retirement-county-cricket-money-financial-nottinghamshire/2015-04-16
    Former Test and ODI batsman says he had to look after his financial security after being paid $250 for World Cup campaign

    Zimbabwe World Cup star Brendan Taylor has revealed concerns about his financial future were behind his retirement from international cricket. Taylor reportedly earned around AUD $250 before tax for his World Cup efforts, the equivalent of 58 cents per run. In contrast, established county cricketers could expect to earn between AUD $95,000 and $190,000 according to the Professional Cricketers' Association.


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    #53
    Jacovs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,720 ✭✭✭Jacovs


    Blame game still going around in the SA camp. Alan Donald also quit as bowling coach.

    http://www.sport24.co.za/Cricket/Proteas/Mbalula-rubbishes-Horns-claims-20150416


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