€500 gift voucher

irishguy · 28-11-2015 11:46am #1

Was going to to buy a €500 for myself through my company, but lidl don't do them that big. Anyone know if the revenue would have an issue with 10 €50, but given as one gift.

DmanDmythDledge · 28-11-2015 5:34pm

Revenue allow a total amount of vouchers worth €250 to be given to an employee tax free in any one tax year (Jan-Dec). It is expected that the legislation to increase this to €500 will be passed before the end of this year.

barneystinson · 28-11-2015 5:47pm

DmanDmythDledge wrote: »

Revenue allow a total amount of vouchers worth €250 to be given to an employee tax free in any one tax year (Jan-Dec). It is expected that the legislation to increase this to €500 will be passed before the end of this year.

The €500 limit is being applied by Revenue with effect from 22/10/2015... http://www.finance.gov.ie/ga/news-centre/press-releases/minister-finance-%E2%80%93-update-finance-bill-2015-small-benefits-exemption

BOHSBOHS · 29-11-2015 5:51pm

DmanDmythDledge, its ONE voucher up to the exemption limit

...every voucher after the first will be taxable even if total value of vouchers is less than limit

CIARAN_BOYLE · 29-11-2015 6:06pm

BOHSBOHS wrote: »

DmanDmythDledge, its ONE voucher up to the exemption limit

...every voucher after the first will be taxable even if total value of vouchers is less than limit

A single benefit would an envelope with multiple vouchers amounting to €500 be non taxable?

irishguy · 29-11-2015 6:48pm

BOHSBOHS wrote: »

DmanDmythDledge, its ONE voucher up to the exemption limit

...every voucher after the first will be taxable even if total value of vouchers is less than limit

It does say that on the revenue site. Which is a bit stupid as lots of places dont do a €500 voucher. Ill ask my accountant anyway thanks

barneystinson · 29-11-2015 8:18pm

BOHSBOHS wrote: »

DmanDmythDledge, its ONE voucher up to the exemption limit

...every voucher after the first will be taxable even if total value of vouchers is less than limit

You're reading that way too literally. A bundle of 10 x €50 vouchers in one go to one person is fine.

irishguy · 29-11-2015 8:26pm

barneystinson wrote: »

You're reading that way too literally. A bundle of 10 x €50 vouchers in one go to one person is fine.

That would make more sense, but you cant trust those feckers

L1011 · 29-11-2015 8:38pm

When this was introduced, One4All were almost the only game in town and were on paper only. You got a bundle of 20s and 10s for your 250.

Into The Blue · 29-11-2015 8:42pm

Can you not just buy the 10 €50 vouchers in the one transaction so it'd show as one €500 transaction on your business account?

irishguy · 29-11-2015 8:54pm

Into The Blue wrote: »

Can you not just buy the 10 €50 vouchers in the one transaction so it'd show as one €500 transaction on your business account?

Receipt would show 10 vouchers. Ill ask the accountant next week and let you guys know.

worded · 29-11-2015 9:01pm

That's interesting. So as a self employed person can I give myself a 500 Euro voucher tax free?

irishguy · 29-11-2015 9:02pm

worded wrote: »

That's interesting. So as a self employed person can I give myself a 500 Euro voucher tax free?

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/benefit-in-kind/faqs/miscellaneous.html#misc15

barneystinson · 29-11-2015 10:04pm

irishguy wrote: »

That would make more sense, but you cant trust those feckers

Oh, I can

Stheno · 29-11-2015 10:07pm

worded wrote: »

That's interesting. So as a self employed person can I give myself a 500 Euro voucher tax free?

Yup, it's something I look forward to every year, used to be 250 but doubled this year

nompere · 29-11-2015 10:58pm

worded wrote: »

That's interesting. So as a self employed person can I give myself a 500 Euro voucher tax free?

No - because you're not an employee.

dbran · 30-11-2015 10:25am

Proprietary directors of limited companys are entitled to the exemption too, but not sole traders.

dbran

BOHSBOHS · 30-11-2015 6:22pm

qualifying voucher’ means a voucher that is given to an employee by
his or her employer in a year of assessment where the following
conditions are satisfied:
(a) the voucher does not form part of a salary sacrifice arrangement;
(b) the voucher can only be used to purchase goods or services and
cannot be redeemed, in full or in part, for cash;
(c) the voucher cannot exceed €500 in value;
(d) not more than one voucher can be given to that employee in any
year of assessment

so sole traders need not apply - but propr directors and their gainfully employed spouses ;-) are ok

a voucher/ the voucher/ not more than one voucher =>
seems pretty clear to me that a "bundle of vouchers" would not qualify?

DmanDmythDledge · 30-11-2015 6:54pm

I don't think that rule is applied in practise. However, it was always possible to obtain a voucher for €250 anywhere so it was never really an issue. I can't imagine there would be a problem with a voucher for €500 and, if there is more demand for such amount because of the new legislation, places will start producing vouchers of that amount to avoid losing sales to competitors.

toadfly · 30-11-2015 6:56pm

Me2You vouchers are a good alternative to One4All and are accepted in a lot of stores.

Into The Blue · 30-11-2015 7:16pm

toadfly wrote: »

Me2You vouchers are a good alternative to One4All

In what way? I thought one4all were fairly universally accepted?

titan18 · 30-11-2015 7:25pm

So, just from what I gather, since they're talking about doing this in work for us, this is a 500 euro one4all voucher?

Into The Blue · 30-11-2015 7:36pm

titan18 wrote: »

So, just from what I gather, since they're talking about doing this in work for us, this is a 500 euro one4all voucher?

Yes.

titan18 · 30-11-2015 7:39pm

Into The Blue wrote: »

Yes.

Feck. Hopefully they give me the choice to opt out then.

DavyD_83 · 30-11-2015 7:41pm

titan18 wrote: »

So, just from what I gather, since they're talking about doing this in work for us, this is a 500 euro one4all voucher?

Our place has changed to Gift Card,
Giftcards.eu
The case you get is a prepaid MasterCard, so can be used anywhere you could use MC

titan18 · 30-11-2015 7:46pm

DavyD_83 wrote: »

Our place has changed to Gift Card,
Giftcards.eu
The case you get is a prepaid MasterCard, so can be used anywhere you could use MC

That would be better tbf. I'd prefer to just get it into my bank account even if I have lose money to tax, at least I can do what I want with it. Being limited to certain stores would suck though.

Into The Blue · 30-11-2015 7:57pm

titan18 wrote: »

Feck. Hopefully they give me the choice to opt out then.

Apologies, that's just in my experience.

barneystinson · 30-11-2015 8:26pm

BOHSBOHS wrote: »

qualifying voucher’ means a voucher that is given to an employee by
his or her employer in a year of assessment where the following
conditions are satisfied:
(a) the voucher does not form part of a salary sacrifice arrangement;
(b) the voucher can only be used to purchase goods or services and
cannot be redeemed, in full or in part, for cash;
(c) the voucher cannot exceed €500 in value;
(d) not more than one voucher can be given to that employee in any
year of assessment
so sole traders need not apply - but propr directors and their gainfully employed spouses ;-) are ok

a voucher/ the voucher/ not more than one voucher =>
seems pretty clear to me that a "bundle of vouchers" would not qualify?

Jaysus. Stop trying to make this complicated, it really isn't - Revenue apply this thing in a reasonable way. If you can show you paid over the €500 and the employee can confirm they received it, nobody actually cares about whether it was 10 x €50 or 5 x €100. They'll really be stuck for something to argue about if it comes down to that!

digzy · 01-12-2015 12:10am

titan18 wrote: »

So, just from what I gather, since they're talking about doing this in work for us, this is a 500 euro one4all voucher?

I'd be a bit wary of the one4all vouchers. They're not accepted as widely as one may think.

Personally, I give my employees Dunnes vouchers. Whatever about hotels and phone shops, everyone has to get groceries. Best to be practical.

Contrary to some inaccurate info from another poster.....

For those thinking about giving a token or bonus to staff in the run up to Christmas, the Small Benefits Exemption Scheme represents the most efficient way of rewarding staff and can be both a tax saver and an effective employee incentive.

Under the Scheme, employers and employees can benefit from a reward of up to €500 (increased from €250 from 22 October 2015) in value completely tax free each year.
The reward must be in non-cash form. (Most employers give a voucher).
It must be a once-off reward, for example, if an employer gives each employee one single voucher (up to a value of €500 from 22 October 2015) in the year, the value of the voucher can be disregarded for PAYE/USC/PRSI purposes. However, if the employer gives two vouchers worth €250 each, the value of the first voucher may be disregarded but the value of the second voucher has to be included as notional pay for PAYE/USC/PRSI purposes.
The reward cannot exceed the limit set down, for example, if the employer gives a voucher exceeding €500 then the value of the entire amount of the voucher must be taken as notional pay.
The reward / voucher must be purchased from company funds i.e. from the company bank account or company credit card. The employee cannot purchase a voucher themselves and seek reimbursement from their employer.
It cannot be part of any salary sacrifice arrangement between the employee and employer.

toadfly · 01-12-2015 8:50am

Into The Blue wrote: »

In what way? I thought one4all were fairly universally accepted?

They are at the minute but Me2You are now in the market as competition with a much much lower commission rate so I can't see One4All lasting much longer or else they will have to cut their rates massively.

We are offering a voucher at work for the first year, choice of Me2You or Dunnes vouchers or through payroll as normal.

LandoCalrissian · 01-12-2015 9:19am

Check with a One4All seller if you can purchase €50 X 10 vouchers with your €500 voucher

Problem solved

L1011 · 01-12-2015 6:19pm

Into The Blue wrote: »

In what way? I thought one4all were fairly universally accepted?

One4All charge an obscene retailer commission and are dwindling in acceptance, Me2You charge a lot less

My former employer moved from paper One4alls to cards but then to prepaid Visa cards in the last few years. These were accepted almost everywhere - a few stores like Argos were scared off by the lack of a chip and Tesco required photo ID (despite the card not having a name on it!); and were universally taken online. I always emptied the shrapnel off them in to a specific value Amazon voucher as you can buy those in any amount.

irishguy · 01-12-2015 8:51pm

L1011 wrote: »

One4All charge an obscene retailer commission and are dwindling in acceptance, Me2You charge a lot less

My former employer moved from paper One4alls to cards but then to prepaid Visa cards in the last few years. These were accepted almost everywhere - a few stores like Argos were scared off by the lack of a chip and Tesco required photo ID (despite the card not having a name on it!); and were universally taken online. I always emptied the shrapnel off them in to a specific value Amazon voucher as you can buy those in any amount.

So the Me2You ones are just Visa cards that i can use anywhere?

Also the accountant said it had to be one voucher and get the full tax benefit. Thanks for the help

barneystinson · 01-12-2015 11:45pm

digzy wrote: »

I'd be a bit wary of the one4all vouchers. They're not accepted as widely as one may think.

Personally, I give my employees Dunnes vouchers. Whatever about hotels and phone shops, everyone has to get groceries. Best to be practical.

Contrary to some inaccurate info from another poster.....

For those thinking about giving a token or bonus to staff in the run up to Christmas, the Small Benefits Exemption Scheme represents the most efficient way of rewarding staff and can be both a tax saver and an effective employee incentive.

Under the Scheme, employers and employees can benefit from a reward of up to €500 (increased from €250 from 22 October 2015) in value completely tax free each year.
The reward must be in non-cash form. (Most employers give a voucher).
It must be a once-off reward, for example, if an employer gives each employee one single voucher (up to a value of €500 from 22 October 2015) in the year, the value of the voucher can be disregarded for PAYE/USC/PRSI purposes. However, if the employer gives two vouchers worth €250 each, the value of the first voucher may be disregarded but the value of the second voucher has to be included as notional pay for PAYE/USC/PRSI purposes.
The reward cannot exceed the limit set down, for example, if the employer gives a voucher exceeding €500 then the value of the entire amount of the voucher must be taken as notional pay.
The reward / voucher must be purchased from company funds i.e. from the company bank account or company credit card. The employee cannot purchase a voucher themselves and seek reimbursement from their employer.
It cannot be part of any salary sacrifice arrangement between the employee and employer.

can you explain how in practice it would be possible after the fact for Revenue to ascertain whether a €500 debit transaction on a company bank account to (say) Dunne's stores was for a single €500 voucher or for 10 x €50?

If the bank record and the payroll record both show a single €500 (or lower) transaction, and there's nothing to suggest an element of salary sacrifice/substitution, then there's no issue. If possible, obviously one should get a single €500 voucher, but if for some reason that isn't feasible then on a practical level it makes no difference.

dudara · 02-12-2015 4:11am

@barneystinson - please do not make allegations against other posters. It is not tolerated in this forum. Moderator action will be taken if you continue

dudara

Legend100 · 02-12-2015 5:11am

barneystinson wrote: »

Jaysus. Stop trying to make this complicated, it really isn't - Revenue apply this thing in a reasonable way. If you can show you paid over the €500 and the employee can confirm they received it, nobody actually cares about whether it was 10 x €50 or 5 x €100. They'll really be stuck for something to argue about if it comes down to that!

Actually came across this in a revenue audit a few years back. Strict letter of the law was applied by auditor in that more than one voucher adding up to 250 was disallowed and taxed. From memory client had given 5 x 50 so 200 was taxable.

.....it didn't help that that was the least of their problems so I wasn't worried about fighting it!

L1011 · 02-12-2015 10:57am

irishguy wrote: »

So the Me2You ones are just Visa cards that i can use anywhere?

As far as I know, they're still limited to certain stores just a far bigger list than One4All

bungaro79 · 02-12-2015 11:20am

i did a online tutoring work over the summer and basically got taxed over 60% on the gross amount (contract was for around 2.5k, came out with just under 1k). dcu were the ones paying us. the fact that it is contract work for the summer (i work full time in another job normally) would i be in a position to ask dcu to consider this to get less of a hit on the tax??
thanks

L1011 · 02-12-2015 11:32am

bungaro79 wrote: »

i did a online tutoring work over the summer and basically got taxed over 60% on the gross amount (contract was for around 2.5k, came out with just under 1k). dcu were the ones paying us. the fact that it is contract work for the summer (i work full time in another job normally) would i be in a position to ask dcu to consider this to get less of a hit on the tax??
thanks

No, as salary sacrifice for this is specifically prohibited.

ibarelycare · 03-12-2015 1:38pm

Regarding the increase in the small benefits exemption, I run payroll for a company who pays peer rewards (which fall under this exemption - have Revenue approval) throughout the year for employees.

Previously an employee would have the exemption on their first award of the year that was under €250.

However now that it has changed since 22nd October, how will it work? if someone has already received a benefit of €250 in 2015 is their exemption seen as used now, even though the threshold has increased? It means that a lot of employees will be losing out.

toadfly · 03-12-2015 2:27pm

Revenue have confirmed if the benefit has already been used in 2015, it cannot be used again to reach the new threshold.

ibarelycare · 03-12-2015 2:33pm

toadfly wrote: »

Revenue have confirmed if the benefit has already been used in 2015, it cannot be used again to reach the new threshold.

Thanks. Do you have a link to that confirmation? Sorry, can't seem to find it myself

I want to circulate the information but would like to have the backup information.

barneystinson · 03-12-2015 3:03pm

ibarelycare wrote: »

Thanks. Do you have a link to that confirmation? Sorry, can't seem to find it myself I want to circulate the information but would like to have the backup information.

Well the increased exemption only relates to awards after a date in October 2015, and it very strictly applies to only one award per annum, so if it's already been used it's already been used...

ibarelycare · 03-12-2015 3:08pm

barneystinson wrote: »

Well the increased exemption only relates to awards after a date in October 2015, and it very strictly applies to only one award per annum, so if it's already been used it's already been used...

Yes I understand that, but I have clients querying it and I want to be able to point them to the legislation.

BOHSBOHS · 03-12-2015 3:36pm

see earlier info re "qualifying voucher"

also see Revenue's BIK miscellaneous FAQ on the matter

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/benefit-in-kind/faqs/miscellaneous.html#misc15

ibarelycare · 03-12-2015 3:39pm

BOHSBOHS wrote: »

see earlier info re "qualifying voucher"

also see Revenue's BIK miscellaneous FAQ on the matter

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/benefit-in-kind/faqs/miscellaneous.html#misc15

Cheers.

loopymum · 31-12-2016 3:35pm

Hi, bumping this as need to buy an employee a gift card today, is it ok to buy them a print at home amazon voucher?

€500 gift voucher

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