Passport controls planned between Ireland and the UK

gurramok · 24-10-2007 11:16am

cornbb wrote: »

"It is best to" does not equate to "must".

'Best' really means is to avoid any problems of hassle when a check is carried out to identify oneself.
Bank cards/drivers license can be faked, they are quite strict on the continent on what can be taken as sufficient ID hence the advice of a passport/ID card when crossing borders.

Funny thing is the UK and Ireland(as well as Denmark) are the only old EU countries don't have any national ID cards(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_identity_card_policies_by_country#Countries_with_compulsory_identity_cards)
so a passport would be advised to carry around while in Schengen countries.

mise_me_fein · 24-10-2007 11:31am

The title needs to be changed from the UK to Britain.

I'm ok with this. We need tighter border controls ourselves. The Brits have very enticing rules for so called asylum seekers once they've been their for more than 6 months so I can totally understand why they;re doing this.

We should get something like this ourselves.

robinph · 24-10-2007 11:47am

cornbb wrote: »

As far as I can tell, people from non-Schengen countries just need their passport checked when entering the Schengen area. I can't see any requirement to carry a passport when travelling withing the area.

Except you do need to have some form of national ID on you whilst then travelling within some of the Schengen countries, as Ireland and the UK have no such thing that then defaults to being your passport.

In the same way that we can fly between Dublin and London on just a driving licenses a French national could fly from Paris to Berlin on their ID card though, we could not though as the continental border controls would not recognise the UK, and especially the Irish, driving licenses as suitable forms of ID.

Fratton Fred · 24-10-2007 12:59pm

blindman wrote: »

I had an incident some years ago when I couldn't identify myself at the border to a nervous young british soldier. At one stage I had a gun to my head eventhough I had more right to be there than him. My car was searched and eventualy they came across my cheque book, the only thing they could find with my name on it. The car wasn't even registered to me as I had only just bought it.
I always carry my passport when travelling now.

I thought that was worth highlighting. I doubt if he cared too much who had more right to be there, probably cared that you may have a car load of semtex! The system/situation would be to blame, not the poor sod on duty.:)

Dub13 wrote: »

It may also effect Irish people using Heathrow airport (nobody from Shannon..:))for a connection to the US etc,I can see a lot of people missing flights while this beds in.

Arrivals from Ireland into Heathrow are considered "domestic" which is why at Terminal one there is no customs or passport control for Irish flights. I always thought that if you are a transit passenger you have to go landside and back through security etc to continue your journey. I wonder if this means they will have to move the Irish flights to another terminal or into the international part of T1.

daveirl · 24-10-2007 1:39pm

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DonJose · 24-10-2007 1:59pm

I'm 100% for this, I've nothing to hide and even I have to show my Irish passport at Dublin airport when returning home.

Would anybody like to hazard a guess at the number of illegal immigrants currently in Ireland. I'm sure the 100,000+ Chinese walking the streets of Dublin are not all holders of student visas.

robinph · 24-10-2007 2:10pm

DonJose wrote: »

I'm 100% for this, I've nothing to hide and even I have to show my Irish passport at Dublin airport when returning home.

No you don't.

You just happen to have your passport on you as the form of photo ID that you used to board the plane in the UK so you wave it as them as you speed past the Garda sat looking bored in the box. I open mine up now though as the crest on the front has worn off so they cannot tell what country it is from anymore, but have just gone through with it closed and showing them the front cover many times without slowing down as I walk past them.

purple'n'gold · 24-10-2007 2:19pm

I was listening to the one ‘o clock news and heard the Taoiseach say that most of our illegal immigrants come through Northern Ireland. Surely this means that there should be more scrutiny of, trains, buses etc coming across the border.

mise_me_fein · 24-10-2007 2:31pm

purplengold wrote: »

I was listening to the one ‘o clock news and heard the Taoiseach say that most of our illegal immigrants come through Northern Ireland. Surely this means that there should be more scrutiny of, trains, buses etc coming across the border.

I don't think this will be a problem once the Brits bring in this new ID thing.

I think most people would agree that having any kinds of checks on the border is a bad thing.

Latchy · 24-10-2007 3:31pm

I live in UK but have being taking my irish passport with me back and forth to ireland last 20 years , just in case anybody has any doubts .....

mise_me_fein · 24-10-2007 3:36pm

latchyco wrote: »

I live in UK but have being taking my irish passport with me back and forth to ireland last 20 years , just in case anybody has any doubts .....

Good thinking....if only everyone thought like that.

Latchy · 24-10-2007 3:45pm

Quote =mise_me_fein;Good thinking....if only everyone thought like that.

Funny enough it's usualy British people over the years who ask me if they need their passport when visting ireland .It seems the way it's going they soon will .

robinph · 24-10-2007 4:24pm

latchyco wrote: »

I live in UK but have being taking my irish passport with me back and forth to ireland last 20 years , just in case anybody has any doubts .....

But at the moment you don't need to and only need photo ID due to airport security. Get the ferry and you need anything other than a slightly convincing Irish or British accent on the off chance that you might get stopped.

The actors in series two of Heroes would clearly not get away with that though.

Latchy · 24-10-2007 4:40pm

Quote =robinph;But at the moment you don't need to and only need photo ID due to airport security. Get the ferry and you need anything other than a slightly convincing Irish or British accent on the off chance that you might get stopped.

Saw a quite few Africans being refused entry and returned to UK on my travels on the UK/IRE ferrys ....

purple'n'gold · 24-10-2007 4:48pm

latchyco wrote: »

Saw a quite few Africans being refused entry and returned to UK on my travels on the UK/IRE ferrys ....

If their travel documents were not in order, then they should be sent back to the UK. Thats they way its supposed to be.

Latchy · 24-10-2007 5:39pm

purplengold wrote: »

If their travel documents were not in order, then they should be sent back to the UK. Thats they way its supposed to be.

Yes,and thats they way it is .Remember seeing one guy sitting rigid with fear on the ferry back to liverpool because he knew the cops would be waiting for him on return.

robinph · 24-10-2007 5:58pm

latchyco wrote: »

Saw a quite few Africans being refused entry and returned to UK on my travels on the UK/IRE ferrys ....

...and if they have no way of proving their residency/ citizenship of either state then that is as it should be.

It would be relatively easy for me to prove both beyond reasonable doubt to the police on either side without me having my passport or driving license on me though. Neither state currently has any law regarding the need to carry a form of ID on you at any time, or for crossing any border between the two states unless you are a citizen of a third country. I'm guessing that the people you saw being refused entry were not UK or Irish citizens?

daveirl · 24-10-2007 6:02pm

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Latchy · 24-10-2007 6:10pm

robinph wrote: »

... I'm guessing that the people you saw being refused entry were not UK or Irish citizens?

That is correct ,but unsure of their status as to why they were entering the republic .They may have had short term uk visas or illigal immigrants trying to enter republic ,if so how would they have got on ferry in first place ?

robinph · 24-10-2007 6:24pm

latchyco wrote: »

That is correct ,but unsure of their status as to why they were entering the republic .They may have had short term uk visas or illigal immigrants trying to enter republic ,if so how would they have got on ferry in first place ?

You only need a ticket in order to get on the ferry.

If the police at either side have reason to suspect that there might be people who are not entitled to make use of the free travel area on board then they might show up though, otherwise there is no reason for them to be there.

SimpleSam06 · 24-10-2007 6:58pm

daveirl wrote: »

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Thats a pity. Among other things, it would allow us to divorce our immigration policy from the UK; as things stand, with an open border if they allow in half a million immigrants, theres nothing to stop them coming over here. Oh wait, that already happened.

Terry · 24-10-2007 7:49pm

Ulster says no!

I can see this being a problem with some people up North.
However, I think it's a good thing and will help to stem the flow of illegal immigrants and criminals.

daveirl · 24-10-2007 8:21pm

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curiousxxx1 · 24-10-2007 8:47pm

I have never had the pleasure of travelling without my passport except in America travelling between States... Am black, every bloody person wants to check if I have the right visa and if i am legal.... It sucks as I fly between England, Wales and Scotland very often. Before I get to the desk or gates they say "Can we see your visa madam" not even my passport photograph/main page :mad:
It's good about the passport controls as it’s needed to reduce the immigrant influx here but I think the EU should have a general identity card just so there would be no need for the long queues and delays that would probably be 2020:D

Capt'n Midnight · 24-10-2007 9:26pm

Can someone edit the tread title please.

We will NOT need passports to go to the North, kinda hard to flash your passport open on the picture page while through at 100Km/hr

Both ourselves and the nordies will need passports to go to the Island of Grate Britain.

We are supposed to be getting some sort of system ourselves, but since the UK of GB and NI will be outside Schengen we will still have to stay outside. UNLESS we try to get the whole Island into Schengen

after all you should need a passport to enter possibly even from the UK.

dlofnep · 24-10-2007 9:31pm

Good idea. Should of been implemented years ago on both sides. They wouldn't dare implement a passport policy to go to the North and have no plans to do so.

Persius · 24-10-2007 10:42pm

No harm in formalising things. The "Common Travel Area" as it now stands is a joke anyway. It basically means that you don't need a passport going between the UK and (Repubic of) Ireland IF you are either an Irish or British citizen.

However, a passport is practically the only way of proving that you're an Irish or British citizen. EU Driving licences just state your place of birth, which is not the same thing at all. So it's catch 22 anyway. Up till now imigration at Dublin airport generally accept an Irish of UK driving licence, but anyone can get one of these.

Aparantly it was never actually legislated for in Ireland either. Typical governments down through the ages - don't bother implementing required legislation.

jimmycrackcorm · 24-10-2007 11:26pm

Dub13 wrote: »

This will not apply to trips into the North as it would be to hard to police.

But if the uk had mad cow disease then it would become completely practical. The only time we secured our borders was for BSE. Also, I haven't seen what is proposed for people driving up north and onto the ferry at Larne.

daveirl · 25-10-2007 9:18am

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biko · 25-10-2007 10:36am

Already being done.

Just back from a round trip Shannon - Heathrow.
Had to produce passport on entering UK and then again entering Ireland.

Passport controls planned between Ireland and the UK

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