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Virgin Media subscriber numbers

24567

Comments

  • #52
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,659 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    UPC Q3 2014 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/LG-Earnings-Release-Q3-14-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 409,800 (-5,000)
    --- Analogue Cable - 42,100 (-2,400)
    --- Digital Cable - 335,800 (-900)
    --- MMDS - 31,900 (-1,700)
    Internet - 359,100 (+6,800)
    Telephone - 336,300 (+13,600)

    Total Subscribers - 1,105,200 (+7,600)

    Premises - 522,100 (-1,800)


  • #53
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    They could inject a couple of DVB-T unencrypted multiplexes in place of the analogue TV, giving viewers maybe 16+ channels in digital format without a set top box


  • #54
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    Thanks for posting the numbers The Crush.

    Trends are easiest to spot with YoY comparisons.

    YoY TV 'video' subs are down 5%. It is clear that there is a small growing trend towards cutting the TV cable cord towards TV over the internet. I can see the downward trend continue for the foreseeable future.

    Analogue cable TV subs are down a massive 22%. The day analogue TV gets pulled gets closer the more these numbers decline although they mask the multi room analogue subs.

    Digital cable TV subs are down 1%.

    MMDS TV subs are down a massive 21%. Not long till the MMDS plug is pulled.

    Broadband subs are up 8%. Growth but not the explosive growth of prior years.

    Landlines subs are up 21% purely thanks to bundling sales practices.


  • #55
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,659 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    JTMan wrote: »
    MMDS TV subs are down a massive 21%. Not long till the MMDS plug is pulled.

    MMDS licences expire in April 2016 and won't be renewed by Comreg.


  • #56
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,659 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    UPC Q4 2014 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/Liberty-Global-Earnings-Q4-14-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 403,500 (-6,300)
    --- Analogue Cable - 40,100 (-2,000)
    --- Digital Cable - 333,200 (-2,600)
    --- MMDS - 30,200 (-1,700)
    Internet - 363,400 (+4,300)
    Telephone - 344,300 (+8,000)

    Total Subscribers - 1,111,200 (+6,000)

    Premises - 519,000 (-3,100)


  • #57
    pippip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭pippip


    The Cush wrote: »
    UPC Q4 2014 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/Liberty-Global-Earnings-Q4-14-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 403,500 (-6,300)
    --- Analogue Cable - 40,100 (-2,000)
    --- Digital Cable - 333,200 (-2,600)
    --- MMDS - 30,200 (-1,700)
    Internet - 363,400 (+4,300)
    Telephone - 344,300 (+8,000)

    Total Subscribers - 1,111,200 (+6,000)

    Premises - 519,000 (-3,100)

    Would I be right in reading that as being that since the phone was automatically made part of the upgrade to horizon which includes the service whether you take the phone or not, that the +8000 there is really nothing and as such they overall lost 2000 individual subscribers?

    EDIT - I see others above had the same idea. Can't wait to see 2015 Q1 figures, they'll be interesting.


  • #58
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    The Cush wrote: »
    UPC Q4 2014 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/Liberty-Global-Earnings-Q4-14-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 403,500 (-6,300)
    --- Analogue Cable - 40,100 (-2,000)
    --- Digital Cable - 333,200 (-2,600)
    --- MMDS - 30,200 (-1,700)
    Internet - 363,400 (+4,300)
    Telephone - 344,300 (+8,000)

    Total Subscribers - 1,111,200 (+6,000)

    Premises - 519,000 (-3,100)

    Very interesting. Thanks for posting.

    The main trends, that have been evident for some time now, continue:

    (1) TV cord cutting. Again, less people subscribing to TV packages.
    (2) Reasonably fast analogue and MMDS declines.
    (3) Continued broadband internet growth.
    (4) 'Rigged' landline and subscriber growth through forced landline bundles.
    (5) Declines in overall premises numbers.

    It won't be long until broadband subs outstrip TV subs. TV subs seem to be on a slow paced terminal decline curve rather than cyclical decline.


  • #59
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,986 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    JTMan wrote: »
    It won't be long until broadband subs outstrip TV subs. TV subs seem to be on a slow paced terminal decline curve rather than cyclical decline.

    Which is why I think UPC is more focused on broadband now then TV services and why UPC is more of a broadband company now.

    TV in the end will just be another service carried over broadband, like phone, etc.

    Sure most of the money selling TV services end up going to Sky anyway, so I expect UPC aren't to worried about this trend as long as they continue to grow broadband customers.


  • #60
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    bk wrote: »
    TV in the end will just be another service carried over broadband, like phone, etc.

    Absolutely, TV is trending away from bundled TV packages towards unbundled streaming solutions. Specifically, TV is trending towards online piracy solutions and OTT solutions such as NetFlix. UPC looses on both counts.


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  • #61
    7upfree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭7upfree


    JTMan wrote: »
    Absolutely, TV is trending away from bundled TV packages towards unbundled streaming solutions. Specifically, TV is trending towards online piracy solutions and OTT solutions such as NetFlix. UPC looses on both counts.

    And Sky also.


  • #62
    Damien360
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,599 ✭✭✭Damien360


    JTMan wrote: »
    Absolutely, TV is trending away from bundled TV packages towards unbundled streaming solutions. Specifically, TV is trending towards online piracy solutions and OTT solutions such as NetFlix. UPC looses on both counts.

    Is that true. What are the figures for sky new subscriptions in that same period. The Upc TV box is awful. If they changed the box then they would have a winning combo.


  • #63
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    I suspect they could possibly change the box, especially if it's proving to be problematic. Or, it might be due a major software overhaul.

    As of February 2015, UPC Broadband Ltd (UPC Ireland) was 'extracted' from the UPC NL BV credit pool and put into the Virgin Media UK credit pool.

    So, effectively UPC Ireland is now part of Virgin Media.

    Operationally speaking, they might start to move UPC Ireland over to whatever Virgin Media UK is moved over to in the coming months. This could mean 'bye bye horizon' and 'hello TiVo.'

    Or, it could mean 'bye-bye TiVo' in the UK and 'hello Horizon 2.0' in both markets...

    I suspect they are likely to ditch the Virgin Media brand as it's something they're paying a royalty to Branson to use rather than a brand they own outright.

    I wouldn't be surprised if they just rebrand as "Liberty Media" using a version of the UPC branding (see: www.libertyglobal.com ) and you'll get an idea of how the brand might look - basically freshened up version of UPC.

    UPC NL is now gone too. They purchased Ziggo (another major Dutch provider with a stronger brand) and they've decided to extract UPC NL out of the UPC Holding BV group and create a new Ziggo Group.

    That just leave Telenet (Belgium) and KableBV in Germany as the only non-UPC bits left in Europe.

    I'd say they might do something like focus UPC on their Eastern European markets where it's a strong trademark.


  • #64
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    Damien360 wrote: »
    Is that true. What are the figures for sky new subscriptions in that same period. The Upc TV box is awful. If they changed the box then they would have a winning combo.

    Sky added a 760,000 broadband subs and 46,000 TV subs in the last reporting quarter in the UK and Ireland. TV is still growing for Sky, albeit at a significantly slower rate than it once did. Also, like with UPC, broadband subs are now the engine of growth.

    One can not look at Sky TV subs in isolation to put forward a counter argument that OTT and piracy are not killing TV subs. The rapid growth in Netflix subs, the rapid growth of XBMC/Kodi and other forms of piracy, the ongoing trend towards cord cutting in the US and other developed markets are bigger picture drivers of the clear trend away from TV subs.


  • #65
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,986 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    JTMan wrote: »
    Sky added a 760,000 broadband subs and 46,000 TV subs in the last reporting quarter in the UK and Ireland. TV is still growing for Sky, albeit at a significantly slower rate than it once did. Also, like with UPC, broadband subs are now the engine of growth.

    Yup, you also see that Sky is desperately trying to hold onto TV subs by giving significant discounts and even completely free TV for a few months to cord cutters.

    They might be keeping up their sub numbers, but it is cost them a great deal to do so and I don't see it getting anything but worse.

    While Sky's broadband subs are also increasing, it should be kept in mind that they are simply reselling BT (in the UK) and Eircoms (here in Ireland) ADSL and VDSL services.

    They don't actually have their own last mile network. That makes this a pretty low margin business. MUCH lower margin then their TV business. So this doesn't really help make up for the lose of TV services, like it does for UPC.

    I expect UPC actually makes more money from it's broadband only customers, then it does from TV only customers at this stage. That is why they are so focused on broadband now.

    While Sky has a powerful brand and is an expert marketing firm. I think they actually look like they are in a pretty weak position in the market, given the way things are going. I think they could be left out in this game of musical chairs and could become significantly less important over the coming years.


  • #66
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    UPC's main problem is their set top box. Horizon seems to be pretty but very difficult to use.

    Hopefully the Virgin Media connection might bring something new to the table as Tivo or Horizon 2


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  • #67
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,659 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    UPC Q1 2015 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/Liberty-Global-Earnings-Release-Q1-15-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 386,500 (-17,000)
    --- Analogue Cable - 37,500 (-2,600)
    --- Digital Cable - 321,500 (-11,700)
    --- MMDS - 27,500 (-2,700)
    Internet - 365,800 (+2,400)
    Telephone - 349,600 (+3,500)

    Total Subscribers - 1,101,900 (-9,300)

    Premises - 511,800 (-7,200)

    From the report
    - Underperformance in Germany, the Netherlands and Ireland drove majority of variance
    - Our 9,000 RGU loss in Ireland was due in part to increased competition.


  • #68
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    The Cush wrote: »
    UPC Q1 2015 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/Liberty-Global-Earnings-Release-Q1-15-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 386,500 (-17,000)
    --- Analogue Cable - 37,500 (-2,600)
    --- Digital Cable - 321,500 (-11,700)
    --- MMDS - 27,500 (-2,700)
    Internet - 365,800 (+2,400)
    Telephone - 349,600 (+3,500)

    Total Subscribers - 1,101,900 (-9,300)

    Premises - 511,800 (-7,200)

    From the report
    - Underperformance in Germany, the Netherlands and Ireland drove majority of variance
    - Our 9,000 RGU loss in Ireland was due in part to increased competition.

    In part?! Lol
    Their TV offering is being hamstrung by Horizon. It's all bells and whistles but it's less usable than Sky.

    This is a much tougher TV market because Sky is probably the world's most successful direct to home satellite operator.

    Upc also treated customers to a price increase in January. Seems kind of strange given the market.


  • #69
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    The Cush wrote: »
    UPC Q1 2015 numbers published today (in brackets, quarter on quarter +/-)
    http://www.libertyglobal.com/pdf/press-release/Liberty-Global-Earnings-Release-Q1-15-FINAL.pdf

    Video Subscribers - 386,500 (-17,000)
    --- Analogue Cable - 37,500 (-2,600)
    --- Digital Cable - 321,500 (-11,700)
    --- MMDS - 27,500 (-2,700)
    Internet - 365,800 (+2,400)
    Telephone - 349,600 (+3,500)

    Total Subscribers - 1,101,900 (-9,300)

    Premises - 511,800 (-7,200)

    From the report
    - Underperformance in Germany, the Netherlands and Ireland drove majority of variance
    - Our 9,000 RGU loss in Ireland was due in part to increased competition.

    Thanks for posting.

    Some thoughts:
    • Analogue Cable declining rapidly on a percentage basis YoY.
    • Digital Cable has been hit badly too. More evidence of cord cutting on streaming starting to effect cable TV. The price increase has no doubt cost UPC subscribers too.
    • MMDS rapidly declining.
    • Internet showing slow growth. Very poor for UPC's core product.
    • Landlines showing growth thanks to forced bundles.

    Overall a dreadful set of results for UPC. UPC might think twice before increasing prices again.


  • #70
    Joo0
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 417 ✭✭Joo0


    When MMDS is cut off next year that's a loss of another 28,000 customers


  • #71
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,659 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Joo0 wrote: »
    When MMDS is cut off next year that's a loss of another 28,000 customers

    By that time there should be less than 20,000 MMDS subscribers, based on that rate of decline. That figure may also include MMDS fed cable systems.

    I see UPC are upgrading Ashbourne, Donabate, Lusk and Ratoath this month, I wonder if any of these were MMDS fed areas?

    Also there was a question on the ending of MMDS on the UPC talk to forum a day or 2 ago which the reps appeared to ignore - http://www.boards.ie/ttfthread/2057425931. Are they still selling MMDS subs?


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  • #72
    Joo0
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 417 ✭✭Joo0


    Yeh indeed, does anyone know how Sky are doing TV subscriber wise?


  • #73
    swoofer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,565 ✭✭✭swoofer


    this from the indo

    http://www.independent.ie/business/technology/news/upc-sees-big-switchoff-in-its-irish-tv-business-31207478.html


  • #74
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    swoofer wrote: »
    this from the indo

    http://www.independent.ie/business/technology/news/upc-sees-big-switchoff-in-its-irish-tv-business-31207478.html

    Very interesting that 9% of UPC's TV customers have deserted in the last year. 36,000 customers ditched UPC TV. A whopping loss. UPC are blaming "increased competition" for the "under-performance" of UPC Ireland and "negative impact on the accounts".


  • #75
    7upfree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭7upfree


    Nobody talking about the elephant in the room, which is also decimating numbers. And can't be discussed here.


  • #76
    JTMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,542 ✭✭✭JTMan


    Yeah, piracy is often an unreported factor.

    Difficult to tell which of the following is the biggest factor in the UPC decline: the UPC price increase, piracy, Sky competition, Eircom competition, free-to-air satellite competition or online streaming competition. All these factors are playing a role in the UPC TV decline.


  • #77
    onform
    Registered Users Posts: 481 ✭✭onform


    Oh piracy is the issue that can't be discussed... I thought it was the Craig Doyle TV ads... ;-)


  • #78
    Infoanon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,705 ✭✭✭Infoanon


    onform wrote: »
    Oh piracy is the issue that can't be discussed... I thought it was the Craig Doyle TV ads... ;-)

    I thought it was the Horizon box....

    Price increases and increasing customer dissatisfaction are two of the main reasons for the fall in numbers,it will be interesting to see how many of these viewers are been picked up by Sky.


  • #79
    onform
    Registered Users Posts: 481 ✭✭onform


    Infoanon wrote: »
    I thought it was the Horizon box....

    Price increases and increasing customer dissatisfaction are two of the main reasons for the fall in numbers,it will be interesting to see how many of these viewers are been picked up by Sky.

    I'm one of the UPC customers gone to Sky. Comparing the too, It's plain to see that Sky have invested much more money in their TV product. UPCs future must lie in developing a TV service aimed at the UK and Ireland, even if that means scrapping Horizon and offering eg. the Tivo box. I hope this loss of customers gives UPC a bit of a kick in the ar$e as it would be better to have a competitive market, instead of Sky becoming a monopoly.


  • #80
    aphex™
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭aphex™


    I believe UPC internet is inferior to other offerings as other ISPs have better connectivity to AKAMI, Google, Youtube, Amazon AWS, Netflix etc., Twitch.tv etc.

    In that, they have elected not to connect directly to these offerings.

    You can see people complain on their forum about connectivity to these types of services every week.

    I would prefer to sign up to an ISP like Vodafone on 100mb than UPC 240mb for the above reasons.

    So, net neutrality is another issue you can't mention


  • #81
    Joo0
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 417 ✭✭Joo0


    I'd say Horizon and price increases would be the main reason for the drop in subscribers. The amount of people I know who have been driven away because of Horizon/price increases is staggering


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  • #82
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    Horizon seems to be a bigger factor than they're prepared to admit.

    Part of the "problem" is that UPC is actually up against quite weak competition in a lot of its other markets. Sky's a really tough platform to beat.

    If they'd any sense they'd ditch Horizon and go with their sister-company, Virgin Media's platform as that's designed to compete with Sky.

    UPC in a lot of other markets is only really up against DVB-T services.

    UPC's previous sister-companies were very heavily invested in Horizon. That's no longer really a factor for UPC Ireland anymore.


  • #83
    7upfree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭7upfree


    onform wrote: »
    I hope this loss of customers gives UPC a bit of a kick in the ar$e as it would be better to have a competitive market, instead of Sky becoming a monopoly.

    Nail hit on the head. Saw someone commenting on another forum the other day that they hoped UPC would "go under".

    What an incredibly stupid and childish post. If that ever happened Sky would have free rein and prices would skyrocket (no pun intended).

    Whatever they are or aren't, they've driven broadband speeds up and prices down. Imagine what we'd be stuck with now if they hadn't.


  • #84
    7upfree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭7upfree


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    Horizon seems to be a bigger factor than they're prepared to admit.

    Part of the "problem" is that UPC is actually up against quite weak competition in a lot of its other markets. Sky's a really tough platform to beat.

    If they'd any sense they'd ditch Horizon and go with their sister-company, Virgin Media's platform as that's designed to compete with Sky.

    UPC in a lot of other markets is only really up against DVB-T services.

    UPC's previous sister-companies were very heavily invested in Horizon. That's no longer really a factor for UPC Ireland anymore.

    Sky is the top platform on the planet. No two ways about it. But doesn't TiVo only record two channels when you're watching a recording - like Sky?

    The folks have Horizon (we have Sky) and it (to me anyway) is fantastic. Record four channels and they watch a fifth?! WTF?


  • #85
    pippip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭pippip


    7upfree wrote: »
    Sky is the top platform on the planet. No two ways about it. But doesn't TiVo only record two channels when you're watching a recording - like Sky?

    The folks have Horizon (we have Sky) and it (to me anyway) is fantastic. Record four channels and they watch a fifth?! WTF?

    I've just gone UPC to Sky and you don't need to record as much, as the SKY Catchup service is much better along with their Boxsets. You also have alot more +1 channels compared to UPC. Anything I used to record on Channel 4 I now download off the catchup as I can download it in HD compared to recording in SD.

    As others have said Horizon is UPC's downfall. Used to have to unplug the box at least once a week, nearly three months and not once have I touched the SKY box.


  • #86
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    It's not the specs of th box that are the problem it's the software and UI.

    People seem to find it hard to use.

    TiVo on Virgin has 3 tuners.


  • #87
    SMC92Ian
    Registered Users Posts: 2,015 ✭✭✭SMC92Ian


    UPC service has been ugh lately, I tried out a 2 week trial with Sky (have them for TV) but internet with UPC since 2005ish, when they were Chorus... wow Sky is **** for broadband, half way through downloading a PS3 game they told me I've downloaded to much... 25gb.... hahaha wow, a PS4 is 45-50gb... how's that work then for people who have consoles and Sky?


  • #88
    pippip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭pippip


    SMC92Ian wrote: »
    UPC service has been ugh lately, I tried out a 2 week trial with Sky (have them for TV) but internet with UPC since 2005ish, when they were Chorus... wow Sky is **** for broadband, half way through downloading a PS3 game they told me I've downloaded to much... 25gb.... hahaha wow, a PS4 is 45-50gb... how's that work then for people who have consoles and Sky?

    I've SKY fibre and no download limits, clocks 60-70mb. Limits on two of the packages.

    http://www.sky.com/products/broadband-talk/broadband/facts/index-roi.html


  • #89
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    It's not the specs of th box that are the problem it's the software and UI.

    People seem to find it hard to use.

    TiVo on Virgin has 3 tuners.

    I disagree. The hardware is underpowered. It can't reliably use all it's tuners. The WiFi signal is poor. Dump a buggy bloated UI on top and the worlds slowest remote. The horizon system works ok about 30% of the time.

    The phrase less is more has never been so true.


  • #90
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    7upfree wrote: »
    Record four channels and they watch a fifth?! WTF?

    I find the box isn't reliable doing that. On mine it slows to a crawl and the recordings are often messed up.


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  • #91
    aphex™
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭aphex™


    UPC hardware/software has always been poor compared to SKY.

    I put this down to zero user testing and interaction design. Once the feature 'sort of' works the developers let it out. Even their tablet apps pale in comparison and are more buggy.

    With Sky, they constantly improve things. For example in their latest update the newest recordings show at the top of your screen so you don't have to scroll all the way down the end.

    So Sky obviously have a process of reviewing their design and taking feedback from users which UPC don't.


  • #92
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    The series link and recording scheduler are the worst though. So buggy.

    All these problems have been there since I got it a year ago. None of them have been fixed.


  • #93
    Skerries
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,556 ✭✭✭✭Skerries


    what are the speeds for the Sky broadband packages as they worryingly don't list them?
    Untitled Image




  • #94
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,551 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Skerries wrote: »
    what are the speeds for the Sky broadband packages as they worryingly don't list them?

    Absolutely max is 100mbit as the technology caps out at that.


  • #95
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    Skerries wrote: »
    what are the speeds for the Sky broadband packages as they worryingly don't list them?

    Exactly the same as eircom's as they're using eircom's access infrastructure. In the UK they use BT - so, similar / slower fibre there too.


  • #96
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    I moved from 30mb to 120mb, not sure I notice the difference in day to day stuff. Even Netflix HD performs the same.
    I don't know if Sky/Eircom is any more reliable, or less reliable than the UPC offering though. Most of my issues with BB are not speed its patchy Wifi, or the BB dropping completely, or lag in games. I went with the Horizon to get a one box solutions, and I've ended up with three, the Horizon box, Modem, and my own Wifi router.


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  • #97
    Joo0
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 417 ✭✭Joo0


    aphex™ wrote: »
    UPC hardware/software has always been poor compared to SKY.

    I put this down to zero user testing and interaction design. Once the feature 'sort of' works the developers let it out. Even their tablet apps pale in comparison and are more buggy.

    With Sky, they constantly improve things. For example in their latest update the newest recordings show at the top of your screen so you don't have to scroll all the way down the end.

    So Sky obviously have a process of reviewing their design and taking feedback from users which UPC don't.

    The Horizon box does look sleek but its anything but when you try and use it. On the other hand the sky box works but doesnt look great.


  • #98
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    Joo0 wrote: »
    The Horizon box does look sleek but its anything but when you try and use it. On the other hand the sky box works but doesnt look great.

    Some older Sky boxes (the ones many people actually have) are horrendous though. Slow and crash-prone.
    I'd suspect there are still quite a lot of boxes out there that do not fully support on-demand.

    I had terrible difficulty getting a discount on an upgrade from an old box until I actually told them I was cancelling.
    This is after years and years of customer loyalty which clearly means nothing to them.

    I also find Sky's On-Demand services confusing. They're extremely hard to search, the menus are clunky and often they seem to mix up scheduled programmes for broadcast together with On Demand items in the serarch results making the whole process just drive me over to Netflix.

    I actually find rather than attempt to navigate Sky's menus most of the time, I Google what's on on my phone and then find the channel number!

    Sky's FAR from perfect. It's just the de facto standard.

    On the UPC side of things, the Horizon box to me looks like it's been optimised for use in a small apartment.
    A lot of Irish homes are quite sprawling and the built-in WiFi is very poor.

    The boxes I've seen used with Numericable in France are way nicer, and even include a BlueRay DVD player and really good hook ups for home theatre and all that.

    There's actually huge competition over there between the IPTV providers, Numericable (Cable) and CanalSat (Sky's counterpart).

    This might be a bit tough if you don't speak French, but it's worth seeing from the point of view of what happens when you start opening up a lot more IPTV options:

    https://youtu.be/C_uf6qerZO8 (From 2013). Skip a couple of mins in where their tech expert appears and she starts to discuss each of the boxes in detail with images behind.

    Bear in mind, France has a lot of areas where this stuff isn't possible too as there are plenty of houses stuck on ADSL and Orange (Eircom of France) initially resisted using VDSL2 cabinets and then didn't get FTTH out to enough people quickly enough. That's now changed a bit and there is now increasingly extensive FTTH rollout in urban areas.

    Still worth a flick past though as I think the French market's quite a bit more advanced than the UK or here, especially for TV providers.

    The products are basically sold by the capabilities of their particular "box" and these have become basically consumer products, much like game consoles.

    Orange and SFR actually offer cloud-based gaming where the processor power is in their servers.

    Numericable Box : http://offres.numericable.fr/labox

    Modem: Broadcom 3383 500Mhz, 128Mb Ram, EuroDOCSIS 3.0, two frequency ranges, gigabit ethernet.
    TV decoder: Intel Groveland 4235, Intel Atom CE4256, 1GB RAM, 2GB Flash, supports 4 TVs from one box.
    WiFi: 802.11n - ultra wide range antennae (a selling point)
    Connectivity: 4 X Gigabit Ethernet, 2 X RJ11 phone, 1 HDMI, 1 SCART, 3 USB, 2 RCA
    Built-in BlueRay 3D ready DVD player.
    160 GB removable HD - expandable to 1TB with self-install modular HD that slides into a slot.
    Full media centre software which connects to other devices using DLNA standards as well as serving up video to iPads and Android pads.
    You can even take a 15 second screen grab from any tv show and upload to Facebook ...

    Our two providers are still not in this league of STB.

    €41.99 / month 280 channels (55 HD), unlimited calls in France and 100 countries, unlimited mobile calls, TV on your tablet, access to 30,000 Video-on-demand programmes and .... 400Mbit/s ineternet!!


  • #99
    7upfree
    Registered Users Posts: 2,124 ✭✭✭7upfree


    beauf wrote: »
    I find the box isn't reliable doing that. On mine it slows to a crawl and the recordings are often messed up.
    Works perfectly at home?


  • #100
    Joo0
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 417 ✭✭Joo0


    SpaceTime wrote: »
    Some older Sky boxes (the ones many people actually have) are horrendous though. Slow and crash-prone.
    I'd suspect there are still quite a lot of boxes out there that do not fully support on-demand.

    I had terrible difficulty getting a discount on an upgrade from an old box until I actually told them I was cancelling.
    This is after years and years of customer loyalty which clearly means nothing to them.

    I also find Sky's On-Demand services confusing. They're extremely hard to search, the menus are clunky and often they seem to mix up scheduled programmes for broadcast together with On Demand items in the serarch results making the whole process just drive me over to Netflix.

    I actually find rather than attempt to navigate Sky's menus most of the time, I Google what's on on my phone and then find the channel number!

    Sky's FAR from perfect. It's just the de facto standard.

    On the UPC side of things, the Horizon box to me looks like it's been optimised for use in a small apartment.
    A lot of Irish homes are quite sprawling and the built-in WiFi is very poor.

    The boxes I've seen used with Numericable in France are way nicer, and even include a BlueRay DVD player and really good hook ups for home theatre and all that.

    There's actually huge competition over there between the IPTV providers, Numericable (Cable) and CanalSat (Sky's counterpart).

    This might be a bit tough if you don't speak French, but it's worth seeing from the point of view of what happens when you start opening up a lot more IPTV options:

    https://youtu.be/C_uf6qerZO8 (From 2013). Skip a couple of mins in where their tech expert appears and she starts to discuss each of the boxes in detail with images behind.

    Bear in mind, France has a lot of areas where this stuff isn't possible too as there are plenty of houses stuck on ADSL and Orange (Eircom of France) initially resisted using VDSL2 cabinets and then didn't get FTTH out to enough people quickly enough. That's now changed a bit and there is now increasingly extensive FTTH rollout in urban areas.

    Still worth a flick past though as I think the French market's quite a bit more advanced than the UK or here, especially for TV providers.

    The products are basically sold by the capabilities of their particular "box" and these have become basically consumer products, much like game consoles.

    Orange and SFR actually offer cloud-based gaming where the processor power is in their servers.

    Numericable Box : http://offres.numericable.fr/labox

    Modem: Broadcom 3383 500Mhz, 128Mb Ram, EuroDOCSIS 3.0, two frequency ranges, gigabit ethernet.
    TV decoder: Intel Groveland 4235, Intel Atom CE4256, 1GB RAM, 2GB Flash, supports 4 TVs from one box.
    WiFi: 802.11n - ultra wide range antennae (a selling point)
    Connectivity: 4 X Gigabit Ethernet, 2 X RJ11 phone, 1 HDMI, 1 SCART, 3 USB, 2 RCA
    Built-in BlueRay 3D ready DVD player.
    160 GB removable HD - expandable to 1TB with self-install modular HD that slides into a slot.
    Full media centre software which connects to other devices using DLNA standards as well as serving up video to iPads and Android pads.
    You can even take a 15 second screen grab from any tv show and upload to Facebook ...

    Our two providers are still not in this league of STB.

    €41.99 / month 280 channels (55 HD), unlimited calls in France and 100 countries, unlimited mobile calls, TV on your tablet, access to 30,000 Video-on-demand programmes and .... 400Mbit/s ineternet!!
    You pay that for just TV here! No wonder Sky don't operate in France not the place for easy profits


  • #101
    icdg
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 11,855 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    I wouldn't say that, Canal+ were utterly dominant in that market until relatively recently, having had a massive head start on cable due to their terrestrial pay-TV channel (the only one of its kind in Europe before DTT came along). They had a market share of 70% at one stage.


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