Dog Dilemma

kildara wrote: »

Agree with above who suggest neutering. It calmed our dog down. A little bit!

The FDA in the US did an extensive study into the effects of neutering on aggressive dogs and it showed that there is absolutely no difference in "dog on human" aggression after neutering. If the dog has established a pattern of aggression neutering will not make a difference as the problem has become behavioural rather than hormonal. Even the reduction of dog on dog aggression is limited once the dog has formed the habit of aggression. I've seen plenty of lazy owners who can't control their dog get it neutered in order to curb aggression, hyperactivity or disobedience and it never works. The problem is their approach to dog ownership not the dogs hormones.

There are two possible reasons for this dog to be aggressive. Either it has a mental problem such as Rage or something is wrong in it's living arrangements. As common as Rage is in golden cockers it is more common that dog aggression is a result of a lack of defined role for the dog in the family.

DEEMAR wrote:

I understand that we need to be more vigilant with training and excercise, but it not that easy sometimes with work etc.

Sorry OP but it doesn't really work like that, if you get a dog you have to commit to meeting it's needs. And along with food and shelter the dog needs training and exercise, you have to make time. Get the dog a crate or set aside a part of your house as his own space. If he goes to the crate/utility room/bed in the corner he is not to disturbed by your daughter. I won't let a toddler annoy my dogs when they blatantly want to be left alone, your daughter must learn to give him space when he needs it.

Even though golden cockers are show dogs rather than working strain, they still come from a dog that needs lots of exercise. As you are in Limerick there are some great places to walk him. Along the canal from Rhebogue to the Shannon is good. All along the Shannon from the Mulcair in Annacotty, through the university and right into Corbally has great walks where the dog can be walked off lead if you are confident of his recall. They are lovely walks and you can enjoy it as much as your dog.

It's also possible that the dog may be confused about his place in the "pecking order" of the family. If your daughter is down on the floor playing with him he may be confused as to whether your daughter is one of the people or one of the dogs. Little things can get this clear in his head. Always feed him last, don't feed him scraps from the table while any other person is still eating. When someone enters the house all the humans should visibly greet each other before before acknowledging the dog. You don't need to be angry with him or be harsh but just subtly let him know that people and dogs are different and he is a dog.

kildara wrote: »

But who’s fault is this? Who tells these people that neutering is the solution to their problems?
Vets do! It seems to be common knowledge that neutered dogs are less aggressive than there intact cousions. Two vets, along with numerous other people (breeder included) told me that neutering would have a beneficial effect on aggression, but, to be fair, there were other people who, like you, said it wouldn’t have any effect. We never intended to breed from our lad so the health benefits of neutering were more a factor in our decision than reducing aggression.
Of the first ten pages when “Why neuter your dog” is googled, eight of these cite less likely to be aggressive as a reason to neuter (one of the other two pages is more about micro-chipping than neutering). It seems that most people disagree with the FDA.

Because the FDA research is the first comprehensive study ever done on the effects of neutering on dog aggression and temperament. All of the other pages you read are based on assumption rather than science. The assumption is that neutering reduces testosterone and testosterone causes aggression therefore neutering reduces aggression. But it's bad science, a myth propagated by the pro-neutering lobby. In fact a huge amount of those websites also tell people that they shouldn't be worried, neutering won't change their dog's personality. It can only be one or another, if neutering reduces aggression that is a personality change. It's propaganda, and badly thought out propaganda. And it's quite frankly dangerous, as bad owners are led to believe that neutering will save them from having to take proper ownership of their animal.

It doesn't matter how many people state that something is true, if the science doesn't back it up it's not true. Look at how many people told Gallileo that the sun orbited the earth - you can see why people made that assumption - it looks like it does, but ultimately it was bad science. When it comes to science it's not a case of majority rule. Facts are facts. Aggression is caused mainly by social behaviour, if the neutering happens after 1 year there is no reduction of aggression as it's already an established behavioural pattern.

Neither of my dogs are neutered. They are three year old unrelated males and they never fight. They are constantly snuggled around each other. They share their food, each first eating from one bowl and swapping halfway through their meal. They never, ever fight with other dogs. If another dog is aggressive they either return to me, or stand together give a warning bark to let the aggressive dog know they are a unit and then the walk back to me - without me needing to call them. Quite a few of the dogs who have been aggressive toward them have been neutered.

The amount of people, vets and dogs trainers included, who have told me that I would never be able to have two identically aged, same size entire males without them fighting is astonishing. And they have had to re-assess their opinion as time has gone on. My dogs have never, ever had a fight with each other or another dog. Neither is alpha, Dougal leads in certain things, Toby in others, they each know what the other is better at and they let the other take the lead when they know the results will be best for them as a unit. They are like this because this is how I decided they would be and how I raised them. Whether they have testicles and full testosterone production is completely irrelevant to good training, family life and socialisation.

kildara wrote: »

Are you anti-nuetering? Do you not agree there are health benefits to neutering?

I'm not anti-neutering but I am opposed to the propaganda that either side produces. My general rule of thumb is if a website gives only one side to an issue it is not being fully truthful. The problem with most pro-neutering information is that it makes people see neutering as a magic panacea which will fix their dog's problems. Or some people specifically get a neutered dog expecting to not have to deal with much of the hard work involved in owning a dog. But it won't fix the dog's social problems and six months after a "problem" dog has been neutered and it is still displaying the same problems the owner gets frustrated and often gives up the dog or reduces exercise which makes things worse. I saw that a LOT in the area I used to live in.

There are benefits related to the prostate, but on the otherhand neutering does damage the dog's coat which if not cared for causes pain in long-haired dogs. And it does make the dog more prone to putting on weight so owners actually need to work harder to keep the dog healthy. Neither is a big problem for good owners who put the time and effort into grooming and exercising their dog. But lazy owners who neuter in order to fix a social problem are not likely to keep up with the extra work this requires.

Neutering stops the dog from reproducing and if that's what you want go for it. It won't stop a male dog from being interested in a bitch in heat and it will roam to follow the scent if it's able to. It won't reduce the dog's interest in the outside world, it won't stop the dog from repeating negative behaviours it has learned. It won't make the dog need less exercise. It does have some health benefits but equally it has health drawbacks. I haven't neutered mine because I chose not to, but I don't disagree with anyone who chooses to do so as long as they aren't expecting miracles which won't happen as the dog could suffer when the owner is disappointed.