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"If I'm not out there training, someone else is."

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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,370 ✭✭✭pconn062


    Good luck tonight, will be interesting to see how you get on over 800m. Can't make it myself tonight but hope to be at the one on the 15th.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    First track race of the year and first proper 800m as a senior (or junior for that matter as juveniles was the last time raced them) and was feeling good.

    It was also great to see first competitive senior race on the home track and the buzz around the place. Good number of boardsies around the place as well as old college team mates and number of friends from the track world. Completely different atmosphere to road racing and I was buzzing.

    Decided to go for Grade B simply because I though I would be able to just hang in at the back and try get pulled around and have to dig deep just to not get blown out of the water. A few of the club mates were doing C (including the house mate) so there would have been a bit of banter but as it stood I had Timmaay, Oregano State and one of the club runners who has started doing sessions with me in the race.

    Wore no watch as I didn't wanna either sandbag it out of panick with a pace or get disheartened if I had a slow split. Gun went and I was off coming round the bend felt fairly good and relaxed.
    Over the last few months I have managed to get up on my toes and get a bit of speed into the legs and I was up in a back near the back of the field. Heard someone call the first split "27-28". This was either go one of two ways, either I had magically become an 800m in 2 min shape or this was not going to end pretty. I slowed a bit the next 200m probably to make sure I didnt blow up and came through in 62-63 which would have been ideal if ran a bit more evenly. At this stage I was hanging on to the back of the field for dear life

    The next 200m I had been telling myself all day would be the making or breaking of the race so I duck in and kept moving. There was a new sensation hitting the legs one which I hadn't really factored into training with the speed development and one that I had long since forgotten - The sea of lactic which envelops the body, and is a very cruel mistress. I was later informed that some people clocked me at 600 in 1.35 region and I was hurting.

    Coming down the home stretch the wheels were coming off big time. I was no adrift of the back of the field slightly and it was more a case of just trying to get over the line.

    With no watch I was going on reports from people who said I finished in the 2.10s which ideally not a great result however I can take a few things from it.

    1) Season opener
    2) Opening two hundred shows that the speed development from early season has been beneficial
    3) Leg turnover does not equal lactic tolerance
    4) This 800 was taking me completely out of the comfort zone but will stand to me with 1500s and 3ks in the coming weeks and months

    Waiting on results last night there was a bit of suspense in waiting on results to see who out of me and the house mate had the faster time (running grade C it was just comparing times). I was informed last night he beat me by .01 seconds which was gonna be hard to swallow, however finally able to access the results myself today I see that he was focusing on the small picture as the results see me 1.99 seconds ahead in

    2.10.43

    Its the little victories in life:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭TRR


    ecoli wrote: »
    Heard someone call the first split "27-28". This was either go one of two ways, either I had magically become an 800m in 2 min shape or this was not going to end pretty. I slowed a bit the next 200m probably to make sure I didnt blow up and came through in 62-63 which would have been ideal if ran a bit more evenly. At this stage I was hanging on to the back of the field for dear life

    I said it to you last night but I thought you should have been 5 seconds up on the time you ran based on recent training etc. Looking at your race and reading your report I reckon the bit highlighted above may have been a problem. Very hard to drop from an initial 28 split to 35 seconds for 200 then expect to run two 31s back to back for example. Beforehand you were considering wearing a watch and I told you to leave it off, might have been better if you hadn't heard that 200 split? Just thought I'd wade in here and piss you off ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    TRR wrote: »
    I said it to you last night but I thought you should have been 5 seconds up on the time you ran based on recent training etc. Looking at your race and reading your report I reckon the bit highlighted above may have been a problem. Very hard to drop from an initial 28 split to 35 seconds for 200 then expect to run two 31s back to back for example. Beforehand you were considering wearing a watch and I told you to leave it off, might have been better if you hadn't heard that 200 split? Just thought I'd wade in here and piss you off ;)

    I dunno if the pacing would have saved me 5 seconds however I think you are right regarding tactical naivety.I think its just about distance mindset in that I would be more focused on 400m splits in any race and normally no 200 would be so far out that a slight adjustment would be possible to salvage things. Again I suppose first proper race of the season is where to make that mistake. Be more in comfort zone with 1500s and 3ks I think.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Friday|Easy Run|6.25 miles|7.02 mile pace| 43.59

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Saturday|Easy Run|8 miles|7.12 mile pace|58.36

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Sunday|OFF| miles| mile pace|

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Monday|OFF| miles| mile pace|

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Tuesday|OFF| miles| mile pace|

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Wednesday|Easy run|5.55 miles|7.12 mile pace| 39.57

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Thursday|Session| 6.5 miles| mile pace|

    Session: 1600, 1200, 800, 400 w/ 2 min rec

    Splits: 5.26, 4.09, 2.45, 78

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Friday|Easy Run| 6.25 miles| 6.47 mile pace| 42.23

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Saturday|Recovery Run| 2 miles|8.55 mile pace| 17.50

    This update was long over due for few reasons

    a) been swamped
    b) doesn't make for good reading

    Beautiful day last Saturday and I was working at the cycle4life event most of the day so I was fairly flaked by the time I got home so was (very easily) persuaded into a few relaxing beers out the back garden with the house mates. This quickly escalated to a long boozy night and with working the next 5 days straight and a full schedule of massages booked for the week I never had a chance to catch up on the sleep so one hang over day rolled over to three.

    Eventually however thankfully tRR dragged me out for a short run to get me back on track and resumed training albeit a bit lighter than I should be doing. He also roped me into racing at the weekend as extra incentive to keep on the straight and narrow for the team

    Session was a bit half backed as was a light one with the race but also got stopped mid session with someone looking for a treatment which put me under pressure to finish session ASAP and as such mind kinda went off it

    Friday I had a day off and finally caught up on much needed sleep and the results were amazing, I was straining at the leash to keep the pace slow as I started seeing miles in the 6.30s-6.40s

    Just made me realise I am going to tackle sleep over the next month in an attempt to keep training on track (minus the hiccup of a lads holiday the first week in june)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    Decent nights sleep and was feeling good for this race. I knew not in PB shape though all the same I just wanted a good run as it had been a while since I was properly happy with a race.

    Once again the wind has reared its ugly head for a race day (at this stage it almost goes hand in hand with racing) Met up with a number of the club mates including drquirky for the warm up (I presumed tRR was feeling his bit violent pre-race mentality so he was probably off punching kids somewhere getting pumped)

    Legs not that loose but there was a nervous sort of energy so I was happy lining up. Gun went and we were off. The first half km was into the wind so I was sensible went out quite easy and tucked in. Given my recent race history (going out in a 10k in 5.07 pace, a 1500m in 63 and an 800m in 27) I needed to get back to running smart. Hit the first km quite relaxed in 3.17 just off drquirky and tucked in behind two lads.

    Next km the lads were wilting a bit and I had let quirky get a sizeable gap so I decided I needed to push on. There were a number of twists and turns so I only had the wind in my face for a very small amount of time. I was still running quite relaxed and came through in 3.21.

    At this point was kinda on my own. I came up on Sarah Mulligan and thought the bit of company might drive her on to work together however was not to be. At this stage we were also coming into a stretch into the wind. Next km 3.28.

    Coming to the end of Grifeen park and the wind was taking its toll. Looking at the watch I was seeing 6m pace popping up which was a bit alarming and I thought it was going to be another one of those days. Turned out of the wind though and dug in and pushed on to regain a bit of time on this km (3.34)

    Next half km I had I guy come back on my shoulder as dr quirky was coming back to us a little. I didnt look back but I convinced myself it was someone who would affect the team standings and given tRRs violent tendencies I could see a swift kick up the back side coming if I didnt get the lead out :D

    Hit the track for the last three hundred and felt more at home and started winding it up with your man hot on my heels. Came around with 100m to go and had pulled away slightly but at this point I still saw the clocking ticking in the late 16s. While a sub 10 second last hundred wasn't gonna be possible I was gonna do my damnest to get there.

    Put the after burners on and had a strong finish to finish in

    17.06 (Precision didnt add nothing to my time thankfully)

    While I am still not at the times I have ran in previous years it is a season improvement and the first race in a while I have been happy with and the team prize was a nice touch to

    In terms of where I am at the moment still feel there might be a decent performance to come at the 1500-3000 range yet this summer but I do have to get the finger out. I was in 17.30 shape this time last year and went on to hit a few PBs so I suppose it is possible to still turn it around


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭TRR


    ecoli wrote: »
    Just made me realise I am going to tackle sleep over the next month in an attempt to keep training on track (minus the hiccup of a lads holiday the first week in june)

    I hope you are bringing your runners on holidays!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    TRR wrote: »
    I hope you are bringing your runners on holidays!

    The first thing I am packing. There maybe a few messy hang over miles but they will be done. The weather should make them tolerable (I managed a 95 mile week in Spain including session while in the pub every night so hope to draw inspiration from that haha:P)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭TRR


    ecoli wrote: »
    The first thing I am packing. There maybe a few messy hang over miles but they will be done. The weather should make them tolerable (I managed a 95 mile week in Spain including session while in the pub every night so hope to draw inspiration from that haha:P)

    You sneaky bastard. One week before the beer mile you head off for warm weather beer mile training. Definitely the favourite now.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    TRR wrote: »
    You sneaky bastard. One week before the beer mile you head off for warm weather beer mile training. Definitely the favourite now.

    Sick of losing to you have do something. All my runs from here on in will have to involve a camelback full of Leffe Blonde just to compensate for my lack of fitness :D


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Monday|"Easy" Run|9.5 miles|6.41 mile pace|1.03.32

    This was one that had to be planned to perfection and every step of the way had to go according to plan in order to be successful.

    Step 1 - Work
    One of the days with no hiccups and got out in time and just bet the traffic out of the office


    Step 2 - Dinner
    I knew I had to get food in now rather than after the club as I would be too hungry to run if I didnt so I had a half hour to prepare something decent and get ready to head down to the club for treatments. I must have been the image of the hindu god Ganesh as I prepped the chicked diced the veg and managed to get changed and ready

    Step 3 - Treatments

    Had four people in tonight and while the first one was a full treatment of about 50 min the rest were relatively short ones for various reasons which meant I was done by about 8.45. It was at the club that meno reminded me of the infamous child hating thread which basically lit a fire under me about making any excuses for missing training:D

    Step 4 - Run

    Home and out the door without a moments hesitation. The first few miles were on the quick side but I figured this was just down to the wind on my back. Next few miles even faster. "Don't worry its an out and back loop wind gonna hit you like a tonne of bricks on the way back". Wind hit my face and made it a bit tougher alright looked at the watch and the pace was still increasing. Was in such a good rhythm that I just said to hell with it and went with it.

    All in all today's lesson was a success and shows that I can do it and can't be making any excuses


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,370 ✭✭✭pconn062


    Are you running Graded Meets on Wednesday ecoli?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    pconn062 wrote: »
    Are you running Graded Meets on Wednesday ecoli?

    I am indeed popping into a 1500m probably C grade depending on the fields (will make the decision on the night when I see who signs up)

    Will take tomorrow handy but the race at the weekend has somewhat restored the confidence a bit even though it wasn't a fast time it was a step in the right direction


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    ecoli wrote: »
    It was at the club that meno reminded me of the infamous child hating thread which basically lit a fire under me about making any excuses for missing training:D


    All in all today's lesson was a success and shows that I can do it and can't be making any excuses

    May as well throw it up there in case any busy working parents ever think about slacking again ;). What's been your excuse lately?

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=73784106


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,370 ✭✭✭pconn062


    ecoli wrote: »
    I am indeed popping into a 1500m probably C grade depending on the fields (will make the decision on the night when I see who signs up)

    Will take tomorrow handy but the race at the weekend has somewhat restored the confidence a bit even though it wasn't a fast time it was a step in the right direction

    Good stuff, based on your last 1500m time you should be in the C grade at least. I'll be there too, probably in the D grade based off previous times. Looking forward to it, hope the wind dies down, I'll be in a Dunleer AC singlet coming last in the D grade 1500m if you see me! :P


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Tuesday|Recovery Run|3.4 miles|8.20 mile pace|28.17

    Day|Training|Distance|Pace|Time
    Wednesday AM|Recovery Run + strides|2.45 miles|8.57 mile pace|21.57

    Just two handy runs rest up the legs for the race tonight. Legs feel pretty good so hopefully wind not too bad and can have a decent one tonight


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,866 ✭✭✭drquirky


    Good luck tonight dude.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭TRR


    Yeah good luck. Don't fcuk it up, I won't be there today to hold your hand ;) Can't remember the conversation associated with this pic but at a guess I'd say it was "ecoli, don't fcuk this up" :D

    253928.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,290 ✭✭✭Oregano_State


    Yeah, best of luck man. I'm praying for low wind too!


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,888 ✭✭✭Dory Dory


    Gosh, I really hope you didn't fcuk it up tonight. ;):)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    Felt fairly good going into this one, the race at the weekend inspired a bit of confidence even though this year has been one to forget in terms of races I do feel long term the stuff I was doing early season will work when the miles ramp up.

    Lined up in C where I knew there was gonna be a good field including one of the whippersnappers in the club who is rounding into shape nicely. Gun went and I slotted in roughly mid pack feeling quite relaxed....... too relaxed in fact so i went wide and pushed up a bit. Saw the clock at 300 and I was bang on where I wanted to be which was confirmed as I came through 400m hearing 69-70.

    Next lap and a bit of bad positioning on my part got me in a few positions I would have preferred not to be in with people chopping and changing pace pushing me wide to go around people. Coming round the bend and I was on the shoulder of a nice group keeping out of trouble (or so I thought). At this point some guy from AIT decided he was being held back by the guys in front of him and shot out into lane two. The only problem was there wasn't a gap and cut right out across my completely chopping up my stride.

    Hit 800 a little slow (2.23ish) and I knew I had to start working and digging in. I dunno whether it was just the anger of getting cut off or what but I made a move and started working my way up the field. I was feeling good and was gaining alot of ground and moved up a good bit. Hit the 1200m mark at 3.33-3.34 so I knew PB was long gone but I thought I could dig in for a 4.25 coming around the bend though I was no longer making ground on the lads ahead of me and they started to pull away and crossed the line in

    4.28.16

    I didn't have a watch so was unsure what the time was but I figured around 4.26ish which I was relatively happy with, more how I ran it than the time, talking to a few mates who reckoned I was a bit quicker than that and was down around 4.24-4.25 which made me feel a little better but seeing the results last night was pretty gutted. Not a great performance but I just need to take stock and keep plugging away and hopefully these races will stand to me


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    Dory Dory wrote: »
    Gosh, I really hope you didn't fcuk it up tonight. ;):)

    I didnt have tRR there to hold my hand this time :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,866 ✭✭✭drquirky


    Times are coming down Ecoli- good performance....still very early in the season a race like that will stand to you for sure- also you're not exactly doing tons of 1500 specific training....


  • Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭oldrunner


    I was just behind you most of the race last night. Here's my observation. You should forget about times and start racing for a win in Grade C. That means you should have been up on the shoulders of the first three or four of the race not settling in mid pack - you looked too comfortable to me.
    Concentrate on the racing and the times will come.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭TRR


    oldrunner wrote: »
    I was just behind you most of the race last night. Here's my observation. You should forget about times and start racing for a win in Grade C. That means you should have been up on the shoulders of the first three or four of the race not settling in mid pack - you looked too comfortable to me.
    Concentrate on the racing and the times will come.

    Thank you. He won't listen to me.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    oldrunner wrote: »
    I was just behind you most of the race last night. Here's my observation. You should forget about times and start racing for a win in Grade C. That means you should have been up on the shoulders of the first three or four of the race not settling in mid pack - you looked too comfortable to me.
    Concentrate on the racing and the times will come.

    I think it is very much an interesting point and one I probably should listen to but I think it is more a case that I am not confident in my training (or lack of) for a long while coupled with the fact I have taken out some races at stupid paces and paid the price for it

    At the moment it is very much a case of racing myself into proper shape


  • Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭oldrunner


    Racing into shape is important and sensible but you can be too conservative.
    I'm not suggesting you take out the pace. Position yourself on the shoulder of the lead group and track their moves - let them be the pace guide. Aim to be on their shoulder by the the 300m point - no need to be there at 200. If someone goes mad up front, let them off. C grade will probably be won around 4:20 but the final 400 will see a big gap (up to 6 seconds) in the lead group. If you're on the shoulder at the bell you will probably run somewhere between 4:18 and 4:24.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭TRR


    oldrunner wrote: »
    Racing into shape is important and sensible but you can be too conservative.
    I'm not suggesting you take out the pace. Position yourself on the shoulder of the lead group and track their moves - let them be the pace guide. Aim to be on their shoulder by the the 300m point - no need to be there at 200. If someone goes mad up front, let them off. C grade will probably be won around 4:20 but the final 400 will see a big gap (up to 6 seconds) in the lead group. If you're on the shoulder at the bell you will probably run somewhere between 4:18 and 4:24.

    Couldn't agree more with the above, you are in a grade where every runner should be within your level +/- 5 seconds. You shouldn't be worrying about times. As a case in point you've ran a time trial quicker than you ran a race last night, furthermore you finished ahead of the winner of last nights race in that time trial. Position yourself well, once you race to your max you will get a good time. I could understand clock watching if you were thrown into the A grade against guys who will be running 5-7 seconds quicker a lap, in a situation like that it becomes a time trial against yourself as you won't be racing those guys.

    A friend of mine also mentioned to me that in the Raheny 5 you were constantly clock watching and he said he could noticeably see you take the foot off the gas, I witnessed the same myself in your last track race. I get being sensible but maybe try running by feel a bit more? At the moment your recent sessions are significantly better than your race performances. It's definitely a confidence thing in my opinion. Not ganging up on you here it just good to get a few people's perspective.

    Now don't have me to come out of my track retirement to show you a thing or two ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,762 ✭✭✭✭ecoli


    TRR wrote: »
    A friend of mine also mentioned to me that in the Raheny 5 you were constantly clock watching and he said he could noticeably see you take the foot off the gas, I witnessed the same myself in your last track race. I get being sensible but maybe try running by feel a bit more? At the moment your recent sessions are significantly better than your race performances. It's definitely a confidence thing in my opinion. Not ganging up on you here it just good to get a few people's perspective.

    You talk a fair amount of sh!te most of the time but for once you hit the nail on the head. I am holding myself back a bit in races because training has not been crap for so long (as a whole rather than individual sessions)

    I think certainly it is something that I need to address (its always amazing how when you are so close to a situation that you are often blind from the obvious)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,866 ✭✭✭drquirky


    ecoli wrote: »
    You talk a fair amount of sh!te most of the time but for once you hit the nail on the head. I am holding myself back a bit in races because training has not been crap for so long (as a whole rather than individual sessions)

    I think certainly it is something that I need to address (its always amazing how when you are so close to a situation that you are often blind from the obvious)

    Any interest in a "no watch" showdown on Tuesday night? I'm starting to come around to TRR's thinking in this regard (esp for 5k and shorter)


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