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Band & Gigging Advice

  • 11-07-2006 12:02pm
    #1
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭


    Good ol' Doc J has made a good suggestion to start a band / gigging advice thread , for all the uninitiated out there in light of this chancer / bottom feeder

    So if you've got any questions about:
    • How to run gigs
    • How to promote gigs
    • How to promote your band online / offline
    • Good promoters / Bad Promoters
    • Anything else you can think of to do with your band
    Then ask away on this thread and I'm sure the more experienced users on boards will be only too happy to answer questions and in time hopefull turn this thread into a nice quick and dirty guide filled with advice for the younger bands out there.


«1

Comments

  • #2
    Doctor J
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,848 ✭✭✭✭Doctor J


    To all bands and musicians out there, feel free to ask anything, no matter how stupid or insignificant you might think it is, and somebody here will try to help you out. The music industry is a filthy business and there are plenty of leeches out there looking to rip off bands in one way or another. Never be afraid to look for opinions or advice on anything.


  • #3
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    This is a great idea and I'd like to put forward one thing to start the ball rolling.


    If you are putting on a gig night, print out a list of times of soundchecks and performing times. If there's 3 acts on with soundcheck from 5 try this:

    17.00: Soundcheck band A (including soundcheck of drums and all backline amps)
    18.30: Soundcheck band B (most of backlie will be done so it's just a matter of getting vocal levels right)
    19.00: Soundcheck band C (most of backlie will be done so it's just a matter of getting vocal levels right again)
    19.30: All soundchecks finished

    20.00: Doors

    20.45/21.00-21.25: Act C. Leave this til 9 if the punters haven't arrived yet
    21.25-21.40: Turnaround time
    21.40-22.15: Act B
    22.15-22.30: Turnaround time
    22.30-23.00: Act A
    End

    While this might seem militaristic, I have found it nothing but helpful as all bands know what time to be there etc.


  • #4
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    miju's gig / general tip #1:

    Have a look at the attachment i use when running gigs and why I use it, it contains:
    • Guestlist
    • Reduced Entry List
    • E-Mail Subscribe List

    Some Problems You Face
    • People who say yes on the internet does not neccesarily translate into bums on seats.
    • Trying to build and maintain a regular active fanbase.

    Why I Like To Use These Pages

    Guestlist
    Obviously to help get people into the gig. It's tempting to bang half of your friends on the guestlist but you really should be comping people who haven't seen your band / can help your band in some way.

    Of course you can always put one or two on the guestlist at each gig and "rotate" them to make em all feel happy :-)

    Reduced Entry List
    Alot of bands websites have forums with quite a few members but alot of them don't really interact. What I like to do is to list all the forum usernames and then send out one nice big email to them all inviting them to the gig.

    And of course because they've taken an interest in the band by signing up to the forum they'll be put on a list for reduced entry. This is VERY helpful is identifying who is an active fan even if their not active on your website.

    E-Mail Subscribe List
    If someone is not on your forum username list or on your guestlist then chances are they may not have been to see you / heard of you before.

    So offer anyone who doesn't have a concessional flyer the chance for reduced entry by signing up / scribbling down their email address and OBVIOUSLY check that it's not askmebollix@yer-ma.com :-)

    This helps you to keep in contact with people who may not have been on your website / who may not have heard of you before and who YOU KNOW has been definitely to see at least one of your gigs.

    If the person likes you and you send out a "gig update" for your next gig chances are they may well pop along with a few friends.

    Back in my band management days this worked a charm and over the course of about 2 months was able to raise a crowd pretty damn quickly / easily of about 90 people that didn't consist of friends and family. Not bad for 2 months work eh?

    It's all simple basic common sense stuff but effective non the less


  • #5
    jimidalliance
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 79 ✭✭jimidalliance


    Hey would anyone have any advice on how to promote our band on the net? We have a myspace page ( http://www.myspace.com/dalliancemusic ) already. We are also looking for a new singer/frontman, where is the best place to look? I have posted up a few threads before but all forums are usually full of bands searching for singers!!
    We are basically trying to get some interest and a wee fan base before we get into regular gigging!
    Any help or advice is much appreciated!
    Cheers
    Jimmy


  • #6
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    [** start cheap plug **]

    have a look at the link my siggie www.cpu.ie for a good start (and there's TON'S of things that'll be happening with it soon enough ;-)

    [** end cheap plug **}

    asking how to promote your band on the net is a bit like asking "how longs a piece of string?" but firstly before anything else you need your own website

    secondly, what do you want to promote on the net your band in general / gigs / your music / your achievements ?


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  • #7
    Fidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4 ✭Fidge


    absolutely agree with everything you said ... we used a mail-list and got out fan-base up to 300 in about 8 months - then we couldn't manage to get above that - then the band broke up ... but it shows can be done. I think once you're filling the likes of whelans it's time to get someone that knows about management on board - something we should have done!


  • #8
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    it is a very effective process that i've found to work now with 4 seperate bands so it's definitely a positive trend , but with that said it's all down to work ethic (which is something some bands severely lack)

    ye have to careful of those management types though there's alot of "have a go heroes" out there who think they're a manager and it just involves booking a venue , emailing a few people and massaging the bands ego


  • #9
    Stinkerbelle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 48 ✭Stinkerbelle


    My mate's band are playing a gig in the Boom Boom Room Saturday week, we've done posters and flyers so am looking for ideas of where in Dublin City to put them? Any idea's greatly appreciated, so we don't waste our time.

    http://www.myspace.com/greenpocketsubway


  • #10
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    cheap , cheerful and best solution without breaking the bank (or the soles of your feet) is a company called micro media


  • #11
    oogieboogie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15 ✭oogieboogie


    Hi, I want to know what the best duplication house in ireland is.

    The band are considering using digipaks,but are concerned about cost.
    The budget is 1500 for 500cds.
    The criteria are: Quality of print on booklet,as some of the cds the bands we know have got badly registered colors on their sleeves.
    Does the dupication house have any effect on the sound quality of the cd's?

    Im also unsure about if its worth the money getting the tracks mastered.

    Any help is much appreciated.
    Conor


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  • #12
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    hi conor , couple of things

    1: its definitely worth getting mastering done

    2: not to be pessimistic but do you intend on selling / getting rid of the full 500 CD's ? the reason i ask is because i've seen many a band duplicate 500 - 1000 CD's in the belief that they'll shift them all when in reality they shift about 50


  • #13
    eamon234
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,924 ✭✭✭eamon234


    I agree with miju - mastering is essential and is worth every penny and get it done by someone who has a good track record and knows what they're doing and not some clapped out sound engineer who thinks he knows it all. Ask a few bands who have had work done and try and listen to the end result.
    Also avoid trying to do it yourself with a PC and some software nicked from the Net - bad idea!


  • #14
    MagnumForce
    Closed Accounts Posts: 630 ✭✭✭MagnumForce


    Does anyone have a list of the general hiring cost of different venues around Dublin city center? Venues like The Hub, Whelans, Eamonn Dorans, all those that hire out for rock events. Cheers!


  • #15
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    theres a list in the resources thread , the cost varies with sun-weds being a bit cheaper than thurs-sat


  • #16
    MagnumForce
    Closed Accounts Posts: 630 ✭✭✭MagnumForce


    As far as i can see theres only contact details for different venues, not any prices for them


  • #17
    The Volt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭The Volt


    Anyone got any idea where I can make my band available for slots? We're only 16 that's the problem


  • #18
    oogieboogie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15 ✭oogieboogie


    Being 16 shouldnt really be a problem if your band is good.

    What i recommend doing is get tight,good songs and save up your money to record a demo/cd,theres plenty of people who have badly done cds,so spend some money on getting it to sound nice if you can. This now gives you something you can hand out to people so they know where you are as a band. Usually you will be contacted and offered a gig by a promoter who you gave your cd to.

    Go to as many local shows as you can,find out who put them on and give them your cd,or tell them that you are looking for a gig to play.

    Or else just find a hall/scout den/whatever and set up your own gig,thats what we did for 5 years! We started a collective called Basta! and began booking larger touring bands like Against Me and This Bike Is a Pipe Bomb.

    Check out.

    www.moshspace.com
    http://punk4it.proboards29.com/index.cgi

    And hopefully you'll find something.

    Conor


  • #19
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    Voltwad wrote:
    Anyone got any idea where I can make my band available for slots? We're only 16 that's the problem

    three words network , network , network :)


  • #20
    The Volt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭The Volt


    We splashed out last week so we'll have a cd to give out soon


  • #21
    Smiley012
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭Smiley012


    Hi there,

    I was wondering if anyone could give me advice on being a support act, I'd like to get a few support slots, but I don't know how to go about it? I don't have the time to organise a full blown gig, but I would like to be on stage!

    Does anyone know what I mean? lol.

    http://www.myspace.com/eilycoghlan

    That's my site, I was preferably looking for a support slot over paddy's weekend, well, not necessarily the actually weekend but between the 15th and the 20th of March, one of those nights!

    Any advice on how I would do this? See, I played in Voodoo Lounge and Eamonn Dorans a few times before but I always knew the bands and they'd asked me to play. However, I've since lost contact or the bands have split, so I don't have the contacts I used to!

    I hope someone can help me out!


    Eily :confused:


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  • #22
    staccato41
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6 ✭staccato41


    eamon234 wrote:
    I agree with miju - mastering is essential and is worth every penny and get it done by someone who has a good track record and knows what they're doing and not some clapped out sound engineer who thinks he knows it all. Ask a few bands who have had work done and try and listen to the end result.
    Also avoid trying to do it yourself with a PC and some software nicked from the Net - bad idea!

    of course when you do eventually get the perfect cd packaged and what not to your wildist dreams, which is the best option...give out freebees at gigs or sell them and for how much...
    anyone got any thoghts on this..
    out of my own experience in my band mannikin
    http://www.myspace.com/mannikinmusic
    we handed out 60 in one gig for free and got diddley squat feed back on our website or anything when manys a time we've sold 10 at a pub in our local town and got gigs and all out of it!


  • #23
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    simple solution is:

    sell the nicely packaged CD AND ONLY give it away to free if its someone of worth promoter , venue , media etc, etc

    do a second CDR with white label printing etc to give away at gigs for free , put only 1 maybe 2 songs on it , make sure they're your best songs to whet the listeners appetite for more

    visit www.mediawrite.ie , they have blue shells cases and 100 CDR's and labels for €60 for the lot. about 2 hours of burning songs etc and you have a very eye capturing (if your using the colored shell cases) pro looking freebie for less than half the price meaning you could double the amount you could normally give out with the same budget. it's all about maximum resources people :)

    btw these are shell cases:

    clear-c-shell.gifCSHELL_COLOURS.jpg


  • #24
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    wrong forum for pimping sky-line , next time it'll be a swift ban

    welcome to boards btw :):):)


  • #25
    okeeffed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5 ✭okeeffed


    Can you tell me what backline equipment i need for a live gig, ie does every musician need a monitor, and where i can rent stuff like mics? cheers


  • #26
    henessjon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 377 ✭✭henessjon


    usually the in house will have a pa for you or if not....
    answer here
    how big is the venue how many will be in the audience? no definite correct answer

    beg borrow that stuff i havent made loads cash gigging


  • #27
    The Volt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭The Volt


    Looking to get an all ages charity gig going in the cty centre in aid of Cystic Fibrosis, our drummer was born with it and we're always looking for ways to raise a few quid. Complete beginner in organising gigs.

    I'm aware that all ages gigs cost a lot to run, any pointers?


  • #28
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    it will be very hard to set up an all ages gig in a venue. pubs are either not interested because theres very little in revenue for them and / or leads to many complaints and hassle for the venue. TBMC used to be a regular all ages gig venue but they've banned them outright due to the amount of hassle

    basically it'll be hard to set one up


  • #29
    The Volt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭The Volt


    I expected that.. :(


  • #30
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    unfortunately this is one of the main reasons that the number of all ages gigs being run in both Dublin & around the rest of the country has dried up significantly

    it can be done if you can convince the venue your well organised and are persistent and polite etc, etc


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  • #31
    The Volt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭The Volt


    Yeah its a shame, the city's crying out for all ages gigs


  • #32
    Pat D. Almighty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 668 ✭✭✭Pat D. Almighty


    Voodoo runs all ages gigs on a Saturday afternoon as far as I know


  • #33
    The Volt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,957 ✭✭✭The Volt


    I enquired into setting one up. €2000 was the quote given, It'd be hard to break even, yet alone raise a few quid


  • #34
    Bastack
    Closed Accounts Posts: 66 ✭✭Bastack


    Hi all,

    We are a new Dublin based band and looking for our 1st support gig to get us going. We are all experienced musicians with many years under our belt. Our music is Pop / Rock with a funk feel to it.

    We are looking to get a support slot in a place like Voodoo, Dorans etc. Does any one need a support slot?

    Any advice would be great. Thanks

    Brian


  • #35
    upsidemark
    Registered Users Posts: 29 ✭upsidemark


    Hi,
    I just start gigging with my new band UpsideUp last month and I'm just looking for a bit of advise. Each one of these questions should probably be a whole new thread, but hopefully I can get a few responses here anyway.

    Q1. What should we do at gigs when not performing? ie...drink, mingle, give out cd's, mailing list, etc...? Any suggestions much appreciated.

    Q2. I used the same gig broker to get support slots for our first few gigs. I can get friends and family to pay €7 - €10 but how do I get more people to go? Are there venues with ready made audiences?

    Q3. Is it worth it in the early stages to pay for flyers / posters?

    Q4. What other merchandising would be a good idea for a band just starting out? ie...t-shirt, cd's?

    Any suggestions of some successful ideas that has worked for your band would be greatly appreaciated.

    UpsideMark


  • #36
    velouria07
    Closed Accounts Posts: 15 ✭velouria07


    Hi,
    Does anyone have any contacts for Showcase night promoters in Dublin and around the country?? We're mad for gigs!


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  • #37
    ECF
    Registered Users Posts: 53 ✭✭ECF


    An Originals band putting on a gig that needs 300 people to attend.

    Any ideas on what best approch is to sell tickets.
    General consenssus from random punters is not to buy a ticket although they still want to attend the gig!!

    Should tickets be given away for free when a crowd that big is required.

    Any suggestions appreciated.


  • #38
    crashbangwollop
    Registered Users Posts: 34 ✭crashbangwollop


    I am in an original band and we are almost ready to start giggin... I have been playin in cover bands since I was 12, but an original band is new to me (and more importantly what i want to do), what venues shud i be lookin at (nationwide)? We wud love to do a few support gigs first, anyone any ideas on that? All we want to do is play our music, but its hard finding the right venue... I would love to have a manager to arrange gigs as we are totally committed and willing to play every night of the week, any suggestions?


  • #39
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    wheres abouts are you based?


  • #40
    crashbangwollop
    Registered Users Posts: 34 ✭crashbangwollop


    Based in Galway, but willing to travel nationwide


  • #41
    daycent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 842 ✭✭✭daycent


    Don't do it!!! It's a soul destroying and frustrating process that can only end badly!!!!!

    I'm only half joking;)


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  • #42
    Jimkel
    Closed Accounts Posts: 590 ✭✭✭Jimkel


    Here's a few tips for original bands starting out:

    * Get your stage confidance in front of your mates in the likes of Voodoo lounge and Dorans, then get the hell out of there and start playing in pubs and clubs outside Dublin city to strangers. Dublin City is SATURATED with young rock bands and whens the last Dublin rock band you've seen make it big time ...hmmm U2! My point is Most Irish bands that make it big nowadays tend to come up outside dublin, because it's not as saturated in the smaller towns and citys and it's easier to gain attention. Remember many pub and club owners know one another and if you impress one they will spread the word and get you more gigs.

    * Don't party too hard, drugs ruin bands, look at Aslan, they also stop great bands from ever really getting anything together.

    * The internet is a great tool, but don't be lazy, the BEST and most effective way of getting gigs fast is by getting out there and meeting people.

    * Don't just walk into places hand them a demo and leave. doing this rarely lands a gig, in fact the demo's rarely get listened to. just like people who walk into stores and hand a cv to a member of staff asking them to give it to the manager. The CV usually ends up in the bin and someone who was recommended to them usually gets the job. Making friends in the right places and word of mouth will get gigs. I have played in hundreds of different pubs and clubs so far and I never once used a demo to get these gigs.

    * My original band played all over Ireland for 5 years, 2 - 3 times a week and we never had myspaces or bebos. We were supporting signed bands and in talks with record Companys attending signing parties and the like, unfortunatly Life, Women, Partying and musical differences split us up while we we're at our peak. Be watchful of this. Keep your focus and keep it clean.

    And a quick message to the young "original" artists out there, if you want to get good fast come try professional session work for a year or so, you will learn allot from the experienced musos.


  • #43
    KoRn101
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭KoRn101


    A lot has to be said about this topic really, and these posts have been invaluable to our explansion, but i have to say there is not that much online to promote bands, like a 3rd party who can assist! We have been lucky and found a great site that has done all the above and has helped our band out dramatically as well as boards.ie, increased the intrest shown and put a lot of time and effort into us and a lot of other bands, we asked them what they wanted out of it and they just replied, "we just love new irish bands!"

    I thought that was a brilliant summation of how a manager/promoter should be for your band, one who is not 100% driven by money but one who is actually interested in the music!

    So if you are going to pursue your bands future more, have a sit down and think about how much you want it, how much it means to you and set goals, listen to all the issues addressed above and you'l find yourself in a position you didnt think was ACTUALLY possible!

    Best of luck to all you new bands! Gotta love em!


  • #44
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    KoRn101 wrote: »
    I thought that was a brilliant summation of how a manager/promoter should be for your band, one who is not 100% driven by money but one who is actually interested in the music!

    To be blunt a manager like that will fail time and time again and if nothing else shows your naivity. I have seen many "managers" operate on the good faith policy and it only ends one way. On the other hands the ones who get paid have both more time AND more incentive.

    The rest of your post doesn't make much sense other than a thinly disguised sounding ad though I may be wrong :D


  • #45
    KoRn101
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭KoRn101


    miju wrote: »
    To be blunt a manager like that will fail time and time again and if nothing else shows your naivity. I have seen many "managers" operate on the good faith policy and it only ends one way. On the other hands the ones who get paid have both more time AND more incentive.

    The rest of your post doesn't make much sense other than a thinly disguised sounding ad though I may be wrong :D


    Maybe it is naivity, i guess i just feel that our manager is a part of our music, maybe he will fail, but im sure we will learn from it!

    The rest of my post is bassically just trying to say that you can spend a lot of time putting so much work into gigging and playing for little or no money to sstart and that maybe you should step back and see if you can cope with it! :)

    And GOD no advertisments from me! I recieved an infringment and thought i was banned, i was devastated! But got word back that im NOT actually banned! :) GREAT success!

    Oh and was SOO not in the best state this morning writing the post! :D Only fully alive now really!


  • #46
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    KoRn101 wrote: »
    Maybe it is naivity, i guess i just feel that our manager is a part of our music, maybe he will fail, but im sure we will learn from it!

    Point I'm making is while you want a manager who "believes" in the band and while it is an important aspect it's not the be all and end all.

    For example a more money orientated manager would be thinking about selling MP3s , Merch etc at the gigs which in turn helps to finance further gigs , promotion , recording.

    We all know where I'm going with this. I wrote an article on band management and various aspects of it a while ago an active copy of which is here.


  • #47
    KoRn101
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭KoRn101


    VERY nice article on managers man.. Appreciate that!


  • #48
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    cheers, always nice to have a supportive comment as many of those articles took me a LOOOONNNNG time to write :D


  • #49
    BangedUpDrummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56 ✭✭BangedUpDrummer


    the wayward are a newly formed band..where looking for any bands to gig with or any numbers of promoters that will help us..also some feedback on our tunes at www.myspace.com/thewaywardmusic would be greatly appreciated!


  • #50
    LowEndFreq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29 ✭LowEndFreq


    miju wrote: »
    Point I'm making is while you want a manager who "believes" in the band and while it is an important aspect it's not the be all and end all.

    For example a more money orientated manager would be thinking about selling MP3s , Merch etc at the gigs which in turn helps to finance further gigs , promotion , recording.

    We all know where I'm going with this. I wrote an article on band management and various aspects of it a while ago an active copy of which is here.

    That was a great article man, i understand a lot of stuff now that i didn't know before! Cheers!


  • #51
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    glad you enjoyed it and found it useful / learned things as its my main aim and what I've always enjoyed doing

    I've a whole heap of articles I wrote when I was running www.cpu.ie . I have emailed dionsiseire most of them so over the next while they should all appear up on goldenplec in one shape or form


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