"Leap" into the unknown: The feedback thread

LXFlyer · 16-02-2015 11:15pm

Provided both journeys are within the short hop zone, then yes.

AlekSmart · 16-02-2015 11:30pm

Acacia wrote: »

Sorry lads, quick question as I couldn't find info on the leap card site...

I have a normal, adult Leap Card. I have to make two train journeys on Wednesdays, one going into Connolly Station and then a a train on a different line, but leaving almost straight away from Connolly. So for example, I arrive in Connolly at 9.05 and my subsequent train leaves at 9.10.

The first time I did this journey I tagged on at my starting station and tagged off when walking through the barriers at Connolly. I then turned back around and tagged on and went back through the barriers (looking like an eejit!:pac:) and tagged off after the journey on the next train. The next week I tried to do this however, when I tried to tag back on at Connolly the barriers wouldn't open and some error message displayed basically saying I couldn't tag back on. Credit was not on issue as I topped up that morning.

The ticket guy standing at the barriers let me through after I explained what happened.

Last week, to avoid the same thing happening, I just simply hopped onto my next train departing Connolly without tagging off. When I got to my final destination I tagged off, but seemed to be down a good bit of credit.

Sorry for the tl;dr post but does anyone know what exactly the right procedure is here?! Ta!

Could there be a time issue at play here ?

You don't give a Tag-On Time for the initial journey,so it could concievably be a situation where you are being charged two maximum fares ?

AngryLips · 17-02-2015 10:15am

In London there are touch-on points inside stations for transiting passengers as a way of avoiding going over the time limit between touch-on and touch-off and incurring the maximum fare unnecessarily. Is there a similar facility in Connolly? I was traveling from Maynooth to Blackrock the other day and experienced this issue. I would expect that they should install such points in the three city-centre stations. Speaking of which, does anyone know what time maximum time is between touch-on and touch-off?

Dravokivich · 17-02-2015 10:20am

It used to be stated as 90 minutes when Leap first went live, but it hasn't been said anywhere since. Unsure if it's still 90 minutes or if it's changed.

LXFlyer · 17-02-2015 10:34am

AngryLips wrote: »

In London there are touch-on points inside stations for transiting passengers as a way of avoiding going over the time limit between touch-on and touch-off and incurring the maximum fare unnecessarily. Is there a similar facility in Connolly? I was traveling from Maynooth to Blackrock the other day and experienced this issue. I would expect that they should install such points in the three city-centre stations. Speaking of which, does anyone know what time maximum time is between touch-on and touch-off?

The pink oyster readers in London are route validators. They are located only at 16 interchange stations in zones 2, 3 and 4 and are there to ensure that the cheapest fare is charged on pay-as-you-go epurse trips. In other words, that the user has avoided zone 1.

AngryLips · 17-02-2015 11:35am

lxflyer wrote: »

The pink oyster readers in London are route validators. They are located only at 16 interchange stations in zones 2, 3 and 4 and are there to ensure that the cheapest fare is charged on pay-as-you-go epurse trips. In other words, that the user has avoided zone 1.

But there is nothing to stop similar card readers being placed inside barrier zone of major stations in the city centre for transiting passengers to use for the purposes I'm suggesting ...especially if the maximum time between tag-on and off is 90 minutes. Throw in up to 40 minute wait times for Dart on a Sunday and suddenly this becomes an issue.

syklops · 19-02-2015 12:58pm

Really wish they would put a few more leap readers at major stops.

DvB · 19-02-2015 1:17pm

syklops wrote: »

Really wish they would put a few more leap readers at major stops.

Agree.

The single biggest issue I have is a lack of readers at suburban stations, every evening I get off at Clonsilla station, which has 1 reader per platform, there's always a queue exiting the platform which would easily be addressed by providing another 1 or 2 readers.

My other gripe is the frequency that the readers are faulty at suburban stations, at least once a week I'm in touch having to get my return trip refunded due to being unable to tag off, additional readers would help this, at least if there's more than onereader if one is faulty the second is there as a back up.

Dravokivich · 19-02-2015 1:19pm

The issue with Clonsilla is locking down access to the station house. Same thing happens in Leixlip Confey. And in Lousia bridge, they don't want anyone to exit from the platforms, making everyone use the small footbridge.

Penalise their paying customers...

Sometimes you're better off not being one, except for if you were to be caught and fined...

L1011 · 19-02-2015 3:03pm

Does the Leap 90 credit not apply to return journeys? Their radio ads imply it does, but I was charged two normal fares for a Point-Jervis Jervis-Point trip (1.70 each way) yesterday.

If it doesn't, its off to the ASAI about the ad...

wench · 19-02-2015 3:15pm

L1011 wrote: »

Does the Leap 90 credit not apply to return journeys? Their radio ads imply it does, but I was charged two normal fares for a Point-Jervis Jervis-Point trip (1.70 each way) yesterday.

If it doesn't, its off to the ASAI about the ad...

No, it doesn't apply to luas fares unless there is a change of mode to/from bus/rail

Does this Leap 90 Discount apply to all Dublin Bus, Luas, DART and Commuter Rail trips?
...
N.B. It does not apply to Luas to Luas journeys or DART/Commuter Rail to DART/Commuter Rail journeys as these trips already have specific discounted fares.

Leap T&C

L1011 · 19-02-2015 3:33pm

Thanks. Ad is deliberately misleading then...

Spanish Eyes · 20-02-2015 9:48am

Say you have a Leap Card with a 30 day rambler.

Then you add credit for the epurse on the same card.

You are only making one bus journey on a particular day, full fare using the right hand validator, no need to use the driver's machine.

How does the bus validator know to deduct that fare from the purse and not one of your 30 days on the rambler ticket?

wench · 20-02-2015 9:54am

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

How does the bus validator know to deduct that fare from the purse and not one of your 30 days on the rambler ticket?

It doesn't, they haven't perfected the psychic interface yet

If it is before 8pm, go to the driver and he will deduct the single fare.
If it is after 8 the validator won't start a rambler ticket day and will default to single fare.

Aard · 20-02-2015 3:39pm

wench wrote: »

No, it doesn't apply to luas fares unless there is a change of mode to/from bus/rail

Leap T&C

Omg you're kidding!

Easily solved with a shneaky 60c (free) city centre fare between Luases though right!?

Spanish Eyes · 20-02-2015 7:24pm

wench wrote: »

It doesn't, they haven't perfected the psychic interface yet

If it is before 8pm, go to the driver and he will deduct the single fare.
If it is after 8 the validator won't start a rambler ticket day and will default to single fare.

That's brilliant, I love a bit of humour, and I probably deserved it!

But honestly, why is a LEAP Card with a purse AND a rambler more difficult to use than if you had them on separate cards?

So if I have a LC with a purse only, I can hit the validator for my full price journey.

If I have a LC with a purse and Rambler, I need to see the driver even if the journey is full price?

Yay. That is so convenient both for me and the passengers. Dwell time!

Two separate LCs is the answer. Another fiver so. Just in case I forget that I need to see the driver for my full price one off journey, and use up one of my Rambler Days!

AlekSmart · 21-02-2015 12:16am

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

That's brilliant, I love a bit of humour, and I probably deserved it!

But honestly, why is a LEAP Card with a purse AND a rambler more difficult to use than if you had them on separate cards?

So if I have a LC with a purse only, I can hit the validator for my full price journey.

If I have a LC with a purse and Rambler, I need to see the driver even if the journey is full price?

Yay. That is so convenient both for me and the passengers. Dwell time!

Two separate LCs is the answer. Another fiver so. Just in case I forget that I need to see the driver for my full price one off journey, and use up one of my Rambler Days!

No need for Two LC's at all.

One LeapCard can hold up to 5 products,and the user can switch between them.

Bear in mind that when the initial choice is made on any given day,the card will default to that choice for the remainder of the day unless it's altered again.

So if a person chooses the E-Purse mode at 0700,then that card will continue in that mode for the rest of the day,unless The Customer requests it to revert.

All part of the service

Spanish Eyes · 21-02-2015 5:54pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

No need for Two LC's at all.

One LeapCard can hold up to 5 products,and the user can switch between them.

Bear in mind that when the initial choice is made on any given day,the card will default to that choice for the remainder of the day unless it's altered again.

So if a person chooses the E-Purse mode at 0700,then that card will continue in that mode for the rest of the day,unless The Customer requests it to revert.

All part of the service

Thank you.

But, but, if I point my LC at the validator, and I have a purse amount and a Rambler what product does it deduct from?

I would imagine, (as another poster above said) that if I am using the purse, even if it is full fare and normally I would use the validator for this, I instead have to go to the driver to ensure that the validator does not deduct from my Rambler.

That defeats the purpose of speedy entry onto the bus surely?

But maybe I am missing something important, I often do!

markpb · 21-02-2015 6:30pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

if I point my LC at the validator, and I have a purse amount and a Rambler what product does it deduct from?

This had been explained already. If you have already used a rambler that day, the rambler will be used. If it's before 8pm, a new rambler will be used. After that, the fare will be deducted from your purse.

If you don't want the default behaviour, you can ask the driver to issue the ticket you want.

This is the logic that Dublin Bus have decided will suit the majority of people. It may not suit you if you're in the habit of buying ramblers that you don't want to use.

I'm lost, does this not make sense to you or do you have a very way that it could work?

Spanish Eyes · 21-02-2015 10:11pm

markpb wrote: »

This had been explained already. If you have already used a rambler that day, the rambler will be used. If it's before 8pm, a new rambler will be used. After that, the fare will be deducted from your purse.

If you don't want the default behaviour, you can ask the driver to issue the ticket you want.

This is the logic that Dublin Bus have decided will suit the majority of people. It may not suit you if you're in the habit of buying ramblers that you don't want to use.

I'm lost, does this not make sense to you or do you have a very way that it could work?

No, I just want to use the validator all the time with my LC. Whether I use the Rambler for multiple journeys, or the purse for a one off full fare.

I am so sorry that I am stupid. Can't help it sometimes!

Frank Grimes · 21-02-2015 10:28pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

No, I just want to use the validator all the time with my LC. Whether I use the Rambler for multiple journeys, or the purse for a one off full fare.

I am so sorry that I am stupid. Can't help it sometimes!

The validator has no way to know if you want to use the rambler or the purse and as there is no way to tell the validator it has to default to one option and the default is using the rambler, unless you interact with the driver or it is after 8pm in which case the default is the purse.

LXFlyer · 21-02-2015 10:41pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

No, I just want to use the validator all the time with my LC. Whether I use the Rambler for multiple journeys, or the purse for a one off full fare.

I am so sorry that I am stupid. Can't help it sometimes!

Really why do you have to make everything about using public transport a huge drama?

The machine is not a mind reader.

You are going to have to accept that if you load a rambler ticket onto the card that you use the righthand validator, and that if you want to use the epurse you will need to use the driver's machine.

This is not difficult - I do it all the time.

Please stop making simple things like this more difficult than it actually is.

Spanish Eyes · 21-02-2015 10:45pm

Frank Grimes wrote: »

The validator has no way to know if you want to use the rambler or the purse and as there is no way to tell the validator it has to default to one option and the default is using the rambler, unless you interact with the driver or it is after 8pm in which case the default is the purse.

That was exactly my point.

I shouldn't need to interract with the driver when using the purse for a full price one off journey, where the Rambler is loaded aswell.

I wouldn't need to do that if I had a purse only LC, is that correct?

Thanks. I feel better now.

Two Leap Cards. YES> because I couldn't be ar$ed going to the driver when I don't need to.

I know my circs probably don't fit all commuters. But they fit mine!

Spanish Eyes · 21-02-2015 10:49pm

lxflyer wrote: »

Really why do you have to make everything about using public transport a huge drama?

The machine is not a mind reader.

You are going to have to accept that if you load a rambler ticket onto the card that you use the righthand validator, and that if you want to use the epurse you will need to use the driver's machine.

This is not difficult - I do it all the time.

Please stop making simple things like this more difficult than it actually is.

I know it's not difficult. It's just a pain.

The validator is quick, easy and painless.

But I have to interract with the driver when I have a one off full price journey on the purse.

And I see everyone else flashing through the validators. I could do that too, but only if I have two LCs

Which I do now, feck the fiver, it is so much more convenient.

I just wanted clarification, that's all.

And thanks to all, you have provided it.

moxin · 26-02-2015 8:57pm

Thought I'd share as I don't see it mentioned. I've noticed people at high density peak hour stops paying extra(2.60 instead of 2.05 to last terminus from town) using the right validator on buses so as to avoid queuing and to get a seat. No need in theory to pay 2.60 as there are no 14 stages on the journey! I did it myself last week as I was knackered and didn't fancy standing most of the way. Cunning plan(have to interact with driver with Leap to get cheaper fare) by DB to get extra dosh?

punisher5112 · 26-02-2015 9:33pm

moxin wrote: »

Thought I'd share as I don't see it mentioned. I've noticed people at high density peak hour stops paying extra(2.60 instead of 2.05 to last terminus from town) using the right validator on buses so as to avoid queuing and to get a seat. No need in theory to pay 2.60 as there are no 14 stages on the journey! I did it myself last week as I was knackered and didn't fancy standing most of the way. Cunning plan(have to interact with driver with Leap to get cheaper fare) by DB to get extra dosh?

Some do this as they will use the full cap so makes no difference.

Its no cunning plan to get extra money its your choice to over charge yourself.

It would be so much easier if it was tag off but it can't be as lots would tag off while staying on the bus especially in double door buses.

Bring on the introduction of the RPU and start catching fare evaders and ones comitting fraud with dodgy passes.

bg07 · 26-02-2015 9:49pm

moxin wrote: »

Thought I'd share as I don't see it mentioned. I've noticed people at high density peak hour stops paying extra(2.60 instead of 2.05 to last terminus from town) using the right validator on buses so as to avoid queuing and to get a seat. No need in theory to pay 2.60 as there are no 14 stages on the journey! I did it myself last week as I was knackered and didn't fancy standing most of the way. Cunning plan(have to interact with driver with Leap to get cheaper fare) by DB to get extra dosh?

They could have annual, monthly or rambler tickets or as suggested already they could have hit their weekly cap

MOH · 26-02-2015 10:58pm

On the whole 90 minute refund thing, the DB website states that if the second journey is a city centre fare, the full amount will be refunded.
What's not clear is if the first journey is a city centre fare - do I get a euro off the second fare?

I assume not, since that would make no sense, but reading all the T+Cs imply that is the case.

LXFlyer · 26-02-2015 11:56pm

MOH wrote: »

On the whole 90 minute refund thing, the DB website states that if the second journey is a city centre fare, the full amount will be refunded.
What's not clear is if the first journey is a city centre fare - do I get a euro off the second fare?

I assume not, since that would make no sense, but reading all the T+Cs imply that is the case.

Any time you pay the city centre fare, the next fare discount will only be equal to that fare.

gaius c · 18-04-2015 6:05pm

Set up auto top up over a week ago and used the bus today to find that there was no credit on the card.

What gives???

"Leap" into the unknown: The feedback thread

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