Cannabis should be legalized in Ireland To pull Our country out of ression

daithicarr · 18-10-2009 12:38pm

Prohibition of cannabis has completely failed, its more readily available, cheaper and stronger than when i was a kid.

There are far more harmful legal substances available, banning them wouldnt work either.

As for legalising small amounts, it still leaves control of vast amounts of money in criminal hands. These criminals often use the proceeds of cannabis to import guns and stronger drugs such as cocaine, heroin etc.
If it was taken out of their hands, the amount of money and power they would have would drop significantly.

As for making it more available to children, i think it would be the opposite, when i was growing up it was much easier to get cannabis, the dealer didint give a rats ass about your age. It also introduces you to a seedier criminal world where stronger stuff is offered/pushed

we are wasting huge resource fighting it, and as well as saving those could add the resources the criminals now gather to the legitimate economy, while it alone wont save us, large amounts of money will be freed up.

electrogrimey · 21-10-2009 1:59am

I'd just like to point out that weed isn't technically legal in Amsterdam. The whole coffeeshop thing started as an illegal movement. Someone opened up a coffeeshop, but got quickly shut down. They opened up again somewhere else, and got shut down. Then more people started opening up until the authorities couldn't control it anymore, so they just kinda left them to it. (Someone verify this, this is what I heard when I was over there, and I'm pretty sure I read it somewhere too)

Legalizing weed could turn Dublin into a ridiculous tourist destination though. People already see Dublin as the Amsterdam of alcohol, and come over here to drink, so if weed was legalized Dublin'd become the drugs capital of Europe, with mashed tourists falling all over the place. It'd be better to legalize weed in somewhere out of the way, like Athlone. Give them some tourism for once.

weedfreedomtinp · 02-11-2009 11:53pm

rubadub wrote: »

Yes, and the price would have to be inline with illegally sourced products, just like tobacco cannot be overpriced or people would turn to black markets more.

tobacco is not overpriced no

thebman · 03-11-2009 12:01am

yeah most people I know who smoke still buy legally. Given the option of legal and illegal, most people will pick legal even if it costs more because most people prefer to know what they are getting and most people don't want to break the law.

weedfreedomtinp · 03-11-2009 12:10am

electrogrimey wrote: »

I'd just like to point out that weed isn't technically legal in Amsterdam. The whole coffeeshop thing started as an illegal movement. Someone opened up a coffeeshop, but got quickly shut down. They opened up again somewhere else, and got shut down. Then more people started opening up until the authorities couldn't control it anymore, so they just kinda left them to it. (Someone verify this, this is what I heard when I was over there, and I'm pretty sure I read it somewhere too)

Legalizing weed could turn Dublin into a ridiculous tourist destination though. People already see Dublin as the Amsterdam of alcohol, and come over here to drink, so if weed was legalized Dublin'd become the drugs capital of Europe, with mashed tourists falling all over the place. It'd be better to legalize weed in somewhere out of the way, like Athlone. Give them some tourism for once.

yes thats true Amsterdam is not exactly legal ,, but you are allowed to carry 5 grams of cannabis and grow 5 plants ,, for personal use,,

i personally think ,,

athlone is in the arse of ireland,,

be best is to give it to big citys and make more money from taxes ,,

ive heard people saying that , how can we charge tax , simple the same way we do with alcohol & tobacco

also if it is made legal , it will start a full new industry.

thousands of different uses.

first of all the growing end.

then you have all the textile products.

come on ireland

open your eyes this drug is not as harmful as the alcohol or tobacco you've been publicly advertising for years.

And its just under heroin and coke in the list of most harmful drugs,

This Chart Is By

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Professor David Nutt

[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The psychopharmacology of depression, addiction, insomnia and other disorders[/FONT]

drug%20study%20bbc.gif

weedfreedomtinp · 03-11-2009 12:30am

Overheal wrote: »

Tobacco was never made illegal, and Alcohol is not simple or profitable to distill your closet.

when the alcohol prohibition was around there was a lot of money to be made .. it caused so much trouble the only way to stop it was to legalize it again .. the alcohol prohibition made the names such as Al Capone
and many other big gangsters ,

so we should learn from these and realize prohibition does not work..

bogwarrior33 · 20-11-2009 5:47pm

bleg wrote: »

Haha, death isn't listed as a side effect of caffeine. Thread is ridiculous. I doubt that cannabis is in short supply for those that want it. Other than for some restricted medical conditions I see no reason why it should be legalised.

Why criminalise it? Costs the State an absolute fortune prosecuting cannabis related offenses. Demand has not depreciated, in spite of the continual toughening of sentences for those convicted. Despite the fact that hundreds of millions of euros have been spent on scientific research trying to justify its criminalisation, over 50 years, no conclusive evidence has yet emerged indicating cannabis is as dangerous as the laws deem it.

The recent events in England regarding the decision to reclassify cannabis, despite recommendations from the government appointed advisory council (ACMD) on the misuse of drugs that cannabis is in no way as dangerous as other legal drugs, indicates that there are other motivations behind the continuing persecution of millions of regular cannabis users in that jurisdiction.

The sacking of Professor Nutt, the chair of the ACMD, and the blatant disregard for the scientific, evidence based arguments laid out in their reports, illustrates the baseless nature of drug prohibition in the developed world.

We should perhaps examine more closely the economic and political interests in keeping cannabis illegal. How many civil servants are employed directly in the prosecution of cannabis laws?

Imagine an Ireland where cannabis was legal? Courts free to deal with crimes of a serious nature, political corruption perhaps? Planning corruption? Gardaí having to deal with more genuine criminals, devoting their resources to ensure they actually get convictions in more murder and rape cases?

Cannabis users are soft targets and boost Garda crime prevention stats. The DPP loves cannabis criminalisation, the accused rarely plead innocent and they are in plenty of supply.

Fuhrer · 23-11-2009 4:31pm

bogwarrior33 wrote: »

Why criminalise it? Costs the State an absolute fortune prosecuting cannabis related offenses.

How much?

bogwarrior33 · 23-11-2009 5:38pm

It is difficult to determine for Ireland, as study in this area has not been extensive. But we could compare ourselves fairly with the US. They are currently liberalising their approach to cannabis criminalisation on a state by state basis. Yet in 2007 cannabis related arrests in the US were at 872,721, with 88% of those being for simple possession. The total costs, including law enforcement, judicial proceedings and imprisonment was estimated to be between $5-15 billion annually (2003 figures). The US population is approximately 75 times that of Ireland, so a figure of $70-210 million would be a rough indication of costs for Ireland.

Many will argue that the US has greater law enforcement resources per capita which it happily commits to cannabis prohibition, but I would argue that Ireland places a disproportionate importance on cannabis prohibition that many other developed countries. If the magnitude of cannabis seizures can be indicative of such an approach.

If we are to look at usage rates, Ireland is significantly higher compared with other European countries with liberal cannabis laws (Spain and the Netherlands). So it is not fair to reason that our costs would be in line approximately to the US on a per capita basis, after all Irish politicians and Gardaí have made it abundantly clear they supported the US approach with the failed Reaganite "War on Drugs". We have a conservative approach to cannabis, from a legal perspective (completely opposing the social consensus among the under 40s that cannabis is comparable to alcohol in harm). The case law surrounding cannabis in this State indicates a narrow view of its harm from the judiciary, most of whom are happy to apply the maximum penalties on accused.

These estimates would be served of course by more concrete statistics derived from independent audits and surveys. Unfortunately, as is the case in many other jurisdictions, funding for research in this area is generally exclusive to those studies proposing to show the harm in cannabis use. Studies implying a general overview of the situation are not welcomed by a political system that has a vested interest in cheap political points scoring from soft targets. They all want to be tough on criminals, and the overwhelming majority of cannabis users are not inherently criminal, lacking the requisite mindset to avoid the long arms of the law.

bogwarrior33 · 23-11-2009 5:48pm

Fuhrer wrote: »

How much?

I should give you the few figures for Ireland I am currently aware of, but I assure you this is an area I am very interested in studying further. We have over 400,000 criminal cases heard in Irish courts every year with over 10,000 (2006 figure) cannabis related. Take into account cost of court time, free legal aid which a majority of these cases apply to, Garda time, and all other areas of the economy affected by such proceedings, the costs dramatically mount up.

Mossticles · 24-11-2009 3:25pm

I (along with so many people I speak to about it) am massively in favour of legalisation. I have smoked for about 10years and have maintained a consistent career path through University and through various decent office jobs.

Having done plenty of reading about research on the internet, I believe Cannabis has far fewer health consequences than alcohol and cigarettes. I still don't smoke cigarettes and only see them as something to add to a joint, seeing as though cannabis is so expensive here in Ireland, Silk Cut Ultra all the way. Also, I have no doubt that smoking cannabis can have a demotivating effect, I know of no-one who can smoke loads the night before and want to run a marathon first thing in the morning (personally I like to start with a lazy one

).

I believe cannabis should be legalised and older generations who were brought up to think it's really dangerous, it's the devil and a sin against God etc. etc, should look at someone who smokes. They don't turn into a craving maniac and go wild, they sit down, relaxed and peaceful. It doesn't lead them to hit the streets looking for Heroin, and definitely not cocaine to wreck the feeling.

I could rant for absolutely ages but instead I have a basic experience to highlight. . .

I was with 10 friends, having a few beers at about 10:30pm. 2 housemates were upstairs trying to sleep with an important meeting the next morning. 5 friends went out to the club drinking, 5 of us stayed back...smoking cannabis in the living room. 2am came, back came the drinkers. They cracked open another beer, singing and shouting, knocking over tables and chairs and laughing their drunken heads off. The other 5 of us, smiling and chatting, tutting the Irish Legal System as we watch the housemates come in time and time again asking for hush.

Drunken louts making noise and a mess, Stoned chaps chilled out smiling and laughing. The next day, the 5 of us were first up, having breakfast, watching as the others gradually made it to the kitchen, reaching for asprin and water and then back to bed with their hangovers.

With one last thing to say however, when smoking cannabis regularly, it's very important to know when to give it a rest for a day or two, or however long is necessary to bring your brain power back to 100%. Any decent user will appreciate this.

Come on Ireland, at least give it a try.

pueblo · 26-11-2009 1:35pm

genericguy wrote: »

A major reason I think it isn't being legalised or even tolerated in this country is because of our government's affinity for the vintners - because i could tell you for damn sure if somebody could stay at home for a smoke and a few take-out beers with their friends, the only people to suffer would be those poxes with the cheek to charge 5 and 6 euro for a pint of piss.

Without wanting to sound too conspiracy theory, genericguy has a point. Drugs (be they legal or otherwise) are big business.

A UN report said the global (illegal) drug trade generated an estimated $321.6 billion in 2003, making it one of the most lucrative global industries.

It would be foolish/naive to underestimate the lobbying power of the global tobacco and alcohol industries.

My opinion is that we should REGULATE all drugs for the following 6 reasons:

1. It would seriously diminish the power and cash flow of organised crime.

2. It would free up law enforcement to do real police work

3. It would make drug abuse a 'social' not a 'criminal' problem.

4. It would mean an element of quality control and give government agencies a chance at intervention/education where needed, saving lives in the long run.

5. The tax revenue from sales would be a huge boost to their economies.

6. It would make it harder for kids to get drugs.

weedfreedomtinp · 27-11-2009 2:14pm

pueblo wrote: »

My opinion is that we should REGULATE all drugs for the following 6 reasons:

1. It would seriously diminish the power and cash flow of organised crime.

2. It would free up law enforcement to do real police work

3. It would make drug abuse a 'social' not a 'criminal' problem.

4. It would mean an element of quality control and give government agencies a chance at intervention/education where needed, saving lives in the long run.

5. The tax revenue from sales would be a huge boost to their economies.

6. It would make it harder for kids to get drugs.

i agree 100% on them points

weedfreedomtinp · 27-11-2009 2:14pm

cannabis should have some review done soon ,,

RedPlanet · 27-11-2009 2:23pm

So you've got a grand total of 4 signatures, despite overwhelming backing on this forum.
What does that tell you about online petitions?

pueblo · 27-11-2009 3:42pm

RedPlanet wrote: »

So you've got a grand total of 4 signatures, despite overwhelming backing on this forum.
What does that tell you about online petitions?

It actually tells you more about stoners than online petitions

Mossticles · 29-11-2009 10:27am

I carry on this discussion with people everywhere, and in South Korea the other day a guy gave me a real eye-opener, which i'm sure you've thought of before and I see it was touched on in a recent post.

The Alcohol industry would suffer MASSIVELY from Legalisation. There would be a safer, more enjoyable (in my opinion) way of socialising with friends...and without paying out your nose too. I'm certain the top dogs are nudging the decision makers away from legalisation.

A coffee shop in Oregon in the States opened it's doors on the 9th November, to medicinal users of course. Thankfully I'm healthy and (unfotunately) won't be able to take advantage of medicinal smoke, but places like this will open people's eyes so they can see it doesn't make us go loopers after we smoke it. Just smile way more

professore · 29-11-2009 10:56am

Mario007 wrote: »

they were considering this kind of an idea in the czech republic. they thought it would increase the tax revenue etc. but when research has been done into it they found that when people smoke cannabis they drink a lot less. then there was the issue of putting money to the health system to deal with the attics etc. and basically the result was, that it would only bring around 1 million korunas into the economy, which is marginal sum really. so they abandoned it.

with regards to holland they have a completely different system over there. their health system is best in the eu, the university students get hand on experience on their course while in college and there are many other things as well. its not just cannabis;)

They obviously have a big vintners lobby over there too. Imagine if people drank less ... look how much money that would save in Gardai, A & E, legal bills etc ... I'm convinced.

pueblo · 01-12-2009 10:31am

BJC wrote: »

The vast majority of the people who are in favour of legalisation come up with ridiculous barely researched ideas and can't spell.

It's not Heroin, it's not crack, there are negative effects but since when does the government make everything thats bad for us illegal?

Half of you nuts are such spelling nazis! Frankly it's shameful, petty and rude!

Have a look at your own crappy post first with incorrect use of capitals.:rolleyes:

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 11:42am

weedfreedomtinp wrote: »

you will always find some one who gets high does not cause trouble and that is a fact as it makes people pacifists

Same as ecstacy.

kraggy · 01-12-2009 12:34pm

I'd be up for giving the following a chance:

Governement-employed scientists/horticulturists grow it to a strength not surpassing medium-strength weed in Holland

Government shops sell it

Government takes money in sales and taxes, creates employment in shops, and labs, and also in hotels, transport etc when we do have the thousands of people from abroad and the north coming into this jurisdiction to enjoy it.

But I would any seedy, behaviour such as selling drugs on the streets punishable by hefty sentences.

Don't want Dublin/Cork/Galway turning into Amsterdam-type ****holes.

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 12:44pm

Amsterdam is indeed a grotty place. If this is the end-product of cannabis decriminalisation, you can keep it.

RedPlanet · 01-12-2009 12:48pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Amsterdam is indeed a grotty place. If this is the end-product of cannabis decriminalisation, you can keep it.

Oh sure, blame the coffee shops but not the sex shops is it?

Gurgle · 01-12-2009 12:50pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Amsterdam is indeed a grotty place. If this is the end-product of cannabis decriminalisation, you can keep it.

Typical crap you hear from people who have only ever been there for a weekend on the piss.

Try dragging yourself out of the red-light district for an hour or two next time you're there.

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 12:52pm

RedPlanet wrote: »

Oh sure, blame the coffee shops but not the sex shops is it?

Sure whats the difference. One follows the other.

Gurgle wrote: »

Typical crap you hear from people who have only ever been there for a weekend on the piss.

Try dragging yourself out of the red-light district for an hour or two next time you're there.

lolz, i don't have to pay for sex. Only losers need to do that, eh?

d4v1d · 01-12-2009 12:58pm

would anyone in this country have the balls to try and bring this up in the government? one person i know of, luke flanagan (i think that's his name), aka ming the merciless, and he was so quickly ridiculed and shot down that it would be enough to disuade anyone else from even trying.

personally i voted for him. what else could i have done. even though people know of many good reasons why all recreational drugs should be brought into a controlled business environment, what is anyone going to do?

does anyone have any ideas on how to bring this concept forward and get it seriously discussed at leinster house? there are two problems i can see with this, the government don't want to deal with it and the importers/distributers certainly don't want the government dealing with this as they'd lose a fortune.

whynotwhycanti · 01-12-2009 1:07pm

Amsterdam is one of the great cities of the world, it has far far more to offer than Dublin or any other Irish city cobined.

Went there when younger with friends, only stayed around the red light district that is full of tourists. Not a very nice area, seedy, dirty. It is not the Ducth people who make it like this but the foreigners and tourists. There is such a huge influx of stag parties, groups of friends that want to go to coffee shops etc. This does not reflect badly on the Dutch but other governments who have tried to ban these things, drugs and prostitutions and have failed as there is such a huge demand for this that their people end up traveling to this place. Go to Rotterdam, exact same laws as Amsterdam, not nearly as many tourists and not seedy or dirty.

Have been to Amsterdam again recently with girlfriend. Stayed in Museum district in city centre. Only went into red light district during day as she wanted to see what it was all bout. During the day in fact it is not really seedy or dirty at all, No more dirty than our own city centers. However, go outside the red light district and the city has so much to offer. It is affordable, beautiful, great public transport (trams and subway system), good food, good bars, museums, parks, shops, amazing architecture and if you want, go smoke a big joint. It’s a great place, that is far cheaper than rip off Ireland. If decriminalizing dope leads to us being a fraction as efficient as the Dutch then im all for it as im sick of this rip off country with terrible services.

P.S. Have you ever seen a couple of loved up people on ecstacy being aggressive as I never have. Its the booze that turns our streets into dangerous places on a night out and uses up the resources of our accident and emergency services.

Gurgle · 01-12-2009 1:23pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

lolz, i don't have to pay for sex. Only losers need to do that, eh?

Couldn't agree more, but its clear from your previous post that you saw no more of the city.

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 1:24pm

Gurgle wrote: »

Couldn't agree more, but its clear from your previous post that you saw no more of the city.

Well that was a silly assumption on your part, now wasn't it?

RedPlanet · 01-12-2009 1:28pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Sure whats the difference. One follows the other.

Long term cannabis lowers libido, it doesn't increase it.
Therefore in a locality where cannabis use is rife, you'd expect less sex, not more.

Gurgle · 01-12-2009 1:28pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Well that was a silly assumption on your part, now wasn't it?

Nope, perfectly reasonable assumption.

Flamed Diving wrote:

Amsterdam is indeed a grotty place

Though now I have a new assumption: You were never there at all, you're just spouting shìte about stuff you know nothing about.

EI111 · 01-12-2009 1:32pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Well that was a silly assumption on your part, now wasn't it?

In fairness I don't think grotty is a word many people would associate with the city of amsterdam outside the de wallen area which contains the red light district.

whynotwhycanti · 01-12-2009 1:34pm

to add, the only similarity that there is between coffee shops and the prostitution in Amsterdam is that they are both decriminalized, it ends there. They do not follow each other as you point out.

Example of this is the 2006 world cup in Germany. Prostitution was decriminalized with temporary brothels being set up in cities. What followed was the same seedy behavior you would see in the red light district, mainly drunk tourists paying fro sex in front of everybody There was no cannabis around as this was illegal. You have failed to back up your point with any facts. Troll? or just plain ignorant

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 3:27pm

RedPlanet wrote: »

Long term cannabis lowers libido, it doesn't increase it.

All the more reason to criminalise it then.

Good.

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 3:32pm

Gurgle wrote: »

Nope, perfectly reasonable assumption.

What? That I spent ALL my time in the Red Light District when I visited there? No, that's just silly. Does your mind work in extremes only? It seems that way.

Gurgle wrote: »

Though now I have a new assumption: You were never there at all, you're just spouting shìte about stuff you know nothing about.

Also a silly assumption, and also based on dichotomous thinking. Hey, not only is the world not black & white, but there are loads of colours too. Check it out sometime.

whynotwhycanti · 01-12-2009 3:36pm

long term drinking and cigarette smoking also lowers your libido, but these two substances are legal. Care to comment

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 3:38pm

whynotwhycanti wrote: »

long term drinking and cigarette smoking also lowers your libido, but these two substances are legal. Care to comment

I assume that's addressed to me. I don't drink or smoke, if they could be effectively outlawed, I would support it.

whynotwhycanti · 01-12-2009 3:42pm

It was directed at you and thank you for responding. The fact is, cannabis is criminalised so at present you have nothing to worry about. if you are against cigs and alcohol also, why not spend your time trynig to get them outlawed as they are legal, socially accepted and a hug part of our society. Cannabis will never or at least for a long long time be decriminalised in this country so don't worry about it. We're just talking about a 'what if' scenario as politicans would never suggest this as it would be political suicide.

Pace2008 · 01-12-2009 5:33pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Sure whats the difference. One follows the other.

Would you mind lending me your copy of Reefer Madness once you're finished with it?

All the more reason to criminalise it then.

Good.

You're just moving goalposts now.

Flamed Diving · 01-12-2009 5:47pm

Pace2008 wrote: »

Would you mind lending me your copy of Reefer Madness once you're finished with it?

You're just moving goalposts now.

These posts are getting barmy. Are you guys all wacked out on the old laughing grass?

hatrickpatrick · 01-12-2009 6:02pm

Smoking cannabis, like any drug, is a personal choice which is nobody's business except the person contemplating it. It should solely be that person who makes the decision.

Consenting adults should be allowed to do anything which does not infringe the rights of anyone who did not get a choice. In saying that, I accept that publicly smoking cannabis, just like tobacco, could have second hand effects and should be regulated just like tobacco is, but it's not the government's job to make people's personal morality decisions and they should never have the power to do so.

kraggy · 02-12-2009 10:35am

d4v1d wrote: »

would anyone in this country have the balls to try and bring this up in the government? one person i know of, luke flanagan (i think that's his name), aka ming the merciless, and he was so quickly ridiculed and shot down that it would be enough to disuade anyone else from even trying.

personally i voted for him. what else could i have done. even though people know of many good reasons why all recreational drugs should be brought into a controlled business environment, what is anyone going to do?

does anyone have any ideas on how to bring this concept forward and get it seriously discussed at leinster house? there are two problems i can see with this, the government don't want to deal with it and the importers/distributers certainly don't want the government dealing with this as they'd lose a fortune.

Emmet Stagg, Labour TD, suggested we have a discussion on the matter a few months ago.

Google news stories with his name in it and something is sure to come up. He was on The Last Word about it at the time.

Makes perfect sense to at least debate it.

Pace2008 · 02-12-2009 1:18pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

These posts are getting barmy. Are you guys all wacked out on the old laughing grass?

Your unfounded link between cannabis and sexual deviance reminded me of those old anti-marijuana propaganda movies:

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:14pm

Sin & insanity. Two more reasons to keep the stuff banned.

pueblo · 02-12-2009 2:18pm

As I understand the law, every crime has a victim, or at least a potential victim. Everything from tax evasion to speeding affects 'someone else' in some way or other.

Where is the victim with cannabis use? Where is the crime?

pueblo · 02-12-2009 2:19pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

Sin & insanity. Two more reasons to keep the stuff banned.

Explain to me how sin and insanity are 'reasons' for keeping cannabis illegal?

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:20pm

pueblo wrote: »

As I understand the law, every crime has a victim, or at least a potential victim. Everything from tax evasion to speeding affects 'someone else' in some way or other.

Where is the victim with cannabis use? Where is the crime?

I'd imagine the folk who deal in these shipments are the forgiving kind...

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1109/1224258394029.html

Spare me the cottage industry myth.

pueblo · 02-12-2009 2:23pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

I'd imagine the folk who deal in these shipments are the forgiving kind...

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/1109/1224258394029.html

Yes of course these scumbags are criminals and commit crimes, no argument there.

But someone who grows a plant in their own house for their own use, where is the victim/crime there?

Also, you have just made the most persuasive argument for regulation. Regulate it and you seriously limit the funding going to organised crime.

Flamed Diving · 02-12-2009 2:25pm

pueblo wrote: »

Yes of course these scumbags are criminals and commit crimes, no argument there.

But someone who grows a plant in their own house for their own use, where is the victim/crime there?

I'm afraid that isn't quite the same question.

RedPlanet · 02-12-2009 2:25pm

Flamed Diving wrote: »

I'd imagine the folk who deal in these shipments are the forgiving kind...

There's no need for shipments when folks are permitted to grow it in their own homes and gardens.

Cannabis should be legalized in Ireland To pull Our country out of ression

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