Trams in Galway?

Unrealistic · 23-09-2015 3:23pm

GerardKeating wrote: »

That's a bit of a myth, quoted from another thread on boards.ie "taxation spend per head of population is €550 per annum in Dublin and €26,000 pa in Leitrim."

Depending on which statistics you choose you can make the case that stark or it can be more nuanced. If you show local authority funding only it will be very stark but if you add in wider government spending; social welfare, health and (especially) public sector pay etc.; it becomes more balanced.

outsidein98 · 26-09-2015 1:44pm

All talk of a GLUAS is pure fantasy. It will never be funded by central government. It simply isn't going to happen. This city is too small. It could only feed a narrow part of the town. Plus the disruption caused by it's building in a town with an already chronic traffic problem would be disastrous.

Build the damm bypass and re-organise the bus service to a greater frequency and lower the fares.

Stop talking about this GLUAS nonsense.

TerrorFirmer · 26-09-2015 2:21pm

The figure for light rail is €700 million and you'd have to knock a lot of existing structures.

killilea92 · 28-09-2015 1:02pm

upgrading the bus network would serve a better purpose.. Esp for commuters

killilea92 · 28-09-2015 1:03pm

more cycle lanes

killilea92 · 28-09-2015 1:04pm

and a more efficient park n ride scheme

cooperguy · 08-10-2015 12:44pm

Unrealistic wrote: »

Depending on which statistics you choose you can make the case that stark or it can be more nuanced. If you show local authority funding only it will be very stark but if you add in wider government spending; social welfare, health and (especially) public sector pay etc.; it becomes more balanced.

You can't reasonably use figures for Public Sector pay or Social Welfare to compare how differert regions are funded though.

Unrealistic · 09-10-2015 12:58pm

cooperguy wrote: »

You can't reasonably use figures for Public Sector pay or Social Welfare to compare how differert regions are funded though.

The original quote was "taxation spend per head of population is €550 per annum in Dublin and €26,000 pa in Leitrim." Social Welfare payments and Public Sector Pay are, by definition, "taxation spend".

Redistribution of LPT receipts is one way regions are funded but decentralising the RSA to Ballina/Loughrea, Child Benefit to Letterkenny, Citizenship to Tipperary etc. achieves the same result by a slightly less direct method. Or you could argue the flipside that centralising such a large part of Public Sector pay in Dublin has a self reinforcing effect in that it boosts the employment opportunities there, thereby boosting house prices and the LPT revenues from which local authorities are partially funded.

I don't think there is any individual 'right' way to do the comparison but you can see the clearest picture by taking into account the various different possible comparisons.

makeorbrake · 20-10-2015 8:08am

A BRT system would be the way to go. Lower costs, more flexible. That doesn't mean that it's always better than light rail - both can be used and integrated together. However, for where Galway is at right now, BRT would be the best starting point.

Robbo · 29-10-2015 4:02pm

Given the week that's in it, zombie ideas are on the prowl and groaning "less than €30 million per kilometerrrrrrrrrrrrrr".

Anyone know when the budget for a "research trip" to Ogdenville, North Haverbrook or Brockway might be set?

cgcsb · 29-10-2015 4:41pm

At least he's trying to do something for Galway, more of the same please. In this country though I'd say BRT is the best we'll get and that's not half bad if it's done properly. Won't hold my breath though.

makeorbrake · 29-10-2015 7:53pm

cgcsb wrote: »

'd say BRT is the best we'll get and that's not half bad if it's done properly.

Can be used as a pre-cursor to trams - using the same routes but at a fraction of the cost.

Not comparable cities in any way but experienced BRT in Bogota a few years back. So long as the services are timely and crucially the routes are well planned and interchange at the right places, then the user is not really going to give a hoot if it's running on wheels or rails.

Would all go down to the planning though - and where possible, priority given to BRT buses where-ever possible - including ability to gear traffic light system to prioritise.

Would make sense to be getting on with a project like that rather than proposal and counter proposal of schemes we simply can't afford. If we're ever flush again, a BRT route could be upgraded to tram (if deemed appropriate) - and designed so that it's interchangeable with other existing BRT 'routes'.

Robbo · 18-03-2017 1:53pm

Another few volts have been thrown into this corpse in the City Trib this week by breakdown insurance pitchman Conor Faughnan and An Taisce's Derek Hambleton. Yes, An Taisce are advocating infrastructure. This is possibly a situationist prank.

It's now pitched as a two line system with the tantalising prospect of it being unconnected at the final interchange.

The lines pitched are as follows:

East(er Bunny) Line: Airport - Parkmore East - Parkmore West - Ballybrit Business Park - Ballybane - Renmore - Lough Atalia - Ceannt Station
Spaghetti Western Line: Barna - Cappagh - Western Distibutor Road - Dunnes/Lidl/Aviva - Seamus Quirke Road - UCHG - Eyre Square

Apparently the advantages this has over say a bypass are that it doesn't require "lay(ing) concrete across green areas while also destroying 41 family homes in the process". I'm no engineer but if you can find a way of threading those routes through those areas without the use of a CPO or concrete, I'd love to hear your monorail song.

Our old friends in Trampower are quoted and reckon it should be done by 2020 for the City of Culture with "a minimum of disruption". As previously noted, they don't exactly have pedigree or experience in delivering these type of things outside of a press release.

rabjoshu · 18-03-2017 2:03pm

Robbo wrote: »

Apparently the advantages this has over say a bypass are that it doesn't require "lay(ing) concrete across green areas while also destroying 41 family homes in the process". I'm no engineer but if you can find a way of threading those routes through those areas without the use of a CPO or concrete, I'd love to hear your monorail song.

Just remove one motorist lane and convert to tram tracks. Problem solved. next!

18-03-2017 4:17pm

rabjoshu wrote: »

Just remove one motorist lane and convert to tram tracks. Problem solved. next!

No, just no.

Built the bypass and stop wasting time even thinking of a rail line the will benefit so few compared to a proper ring road.

Mrs OBumble · 18-03-2017 4:22pm

rabjoshu wrote: »

Just remove one motorist lane and convert to tram tracks. Problem solved. next!

Wow ... an even brighter suggestion.

That way we could have disconnected tram lines, just like Dublin, and heaps more one-way streets (cos taking one motorist lane out of many streets would only leave one)..

dinneenp · 18-03-2017 9:55pm

Why not just have more bus lanes, more buses and routes?
1.cheaper. Much, much cheaper.
2. Quicker to build
3.'out of hours' could be used by cars.

Guffy · 18-03-2017 10:00pm

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Wow ... an even brighter suggestion.

That way we could have disconnected tram lines, just like Dublin, and heaps more one-way streets (cos taking one motorist lane out of many streets would only leave one)..

Tbf, ya their not connected but one ends a 2 min walk away from where the other starts. Ceannt station is on eyre square like.

makeorbrake · 18-03-2017 10:15pm

dinneenp wrote: »

Why not just have more bus lanes, more buses and routes?
1.cheaper. Much, much cheaper.
2. Quicker to build
3.'out of hours' could be used by cars.

BRT system is the way to go. Both pubic transport and ring road need to be funded. We don't have the funding to do a full on tram system. Therefore, we can either talk about it for 40 years (how long is the ring road being talked about at this point?) or we can cut our cloth to measure and go with BRT.

Furthermore, BRT has the flexibility to bridge over those gaps where we can't completely close off a lane of a section of street to 2-way traffic. Furthermore, it could act as a precursor to a full-on system (i.e. if the next generation conjure up Celtic Tiger 2, they can have at it with a replacement system).

Otherwise, BRT can be designed such that we get all the advantages of a fixed system - without having to lay down expensive tracks and pay for expensive trams, etc.

biko · 20-03-2017 10:05am

When the prospect of trams will materialise, then discussion in Galway city forum can be had.
Right now it's just speculation and discussion.

Middle Man · 21-03-2017 9:17pm

To me, a Luas type tram would in conjunction with mainline commuter services from Tuam etc. would make sense given the narrow lateral spread of the city. With the proposed Galway Ring Road in place, it might be possible to run a line from West of Knocknacarra, through Rahoon, Shantalla, past NUIG and GUC Hospital, Eyre Square (interchange with mainline), Wellpark, Mervue, Ballybane, and Doughiska.

Also, there's in my mind, no reason not to reopen the rail line to Tuam as well as building a number of new stations near Renmore, Roscam as well as Tuam and Tuam North P+R taking advantage of the new N17 Ballygaddy Interchange. Where there is a will, there is a way as the people who got Ireland West Airport built back in the 1980's recession proved - what I'm saying is, pull out all the stops, get the infrastructure built and you'll probably never regret it in the future!

GerardKeating · 24-03-2017 10:44pm

rabjoshu wrote: »

Just remove one motorist lane and convert to tram tracks. Problem solved. next!

But on the west-side of the City, the Seamus Quirke Road is possibly the only road with two lanes in each direction, so which roads are you planning to take motoring lanes from.

And on the east side, perhaps Bothar na dtreabh, Sean Mulvoy Road etc.

what_traffic · 24-03-2017 10:58pm

Came across this on Twitter.

http://catherineconnolly.com/light-rail-is-the-solution-to-the-traffic-problem-in-galway/
Galway West TD. PR on the 22-03-2017. Light-rail is the solution to the traffic problem in Galway

what_traffic · 24-03-2017 11:02pm

what_traffic wrote: »

Came across this on Twitter.

http://catherineconnolly.com/light-rail-is-the-solution-to-the-traffic-problem-in-galway/
Galway West TD. PR on the 22-03-2017. Light-rail is the solution to the traffic problem in Galway

"
In this context Deputy Connolly welcomes the recent statement by Conor Faughnan, Director of Consumer Affairs with the Automobile Association (AA), calling on all stakeholders to urgently re-examine the case for light-rail in Galway city.
"

Anybody have a link to this?
Is this really true that even the AA know that Light Rail is the only viable solution?

marno21 · 24-03-2017 11:05pm

The AA realise that the traffic growth in Galway and other cities in Ireland is unsustainable and needs to stop. There is just nowhere for these cars to go.

Light rail to take those who are forced to drive and don't particularly want to off the roads would make the drive more pleasurable and efficient for those who insist on driving.

GerardKeating · 24-03-2017 11:05pm

what_traffic wrote: »

"
In this context Deputy Connolly welcomes the recent statement by Conor Faughnan, Director of Consumer Affairs with the Automobile Association (AA), calling on all stakeholders to urgently re-examine the case for light-rail in Galway city.
"

Anybody have a link to this?
Is this really true that even the AA know that Light Rail is the only viable solution?

Personally I would like a light rail system for the City, but it will eat up a lot more houses that the outer by-pass.

what_traffic · 27-03-2017 12:20pm

GerardKeating wrote: »

Personally I would like a light rail system for the City, but it will eat up a lot more houses that the outer by-pass.

How so?

Middle Man · 27-03-2017 1:56pm

GerardKeating wrote: »

Personally I would like a light rail system for the City, but it will eat up a lot more houses that the outer by-pass.

I guess that in time, we'll be knocking quite a few houses nationwide to render our urban areas fit for purpose in the 21st century. One idea is a create appropriate roads with one traffic lane and one tram lane each way with plenty of room in the reservation for island platforms - there will always be cars and while we shouldn't focus on car capacity, we should bear in mind that fit for purpose access with proper road standards would be appropriate - remember that even with no private cars in cities, buses, deliveries, taxis, adapted vehicles all need to be taken into account and 60kph (tram speed) on such roads should be considered reasonable.

If you want to reduce the number of private cars, then implement measures conducive to that principle in the car parks - for example, reduce the number of available car spaces before 10am or use a pricing structure that's geared against commuter parking - simple.

Cycling provision to Dutch standards would require a massive rework of our urban areas unless we want to go back to the dark ages. However, the most important provision in urban areas should be for trams and pedestrians - even express underground walkways with travelators beneath city centre streets should be considered - this would allow conditions more conducive to social interaction at street level while providing for efficient transit beneath.

However if we don't want to be in the dark ages, then we do have to get over our love affair with property - most 20th century fabric has little architectural merit and is dispensable - sure many of our Georgian streets are more modern in terms of urban layout and can accommodate the tram. Much of our 20th century "urban design" is pants - many streets are far too narrow!

Trams in Galway?

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