Proposed changes to site look

21-02-2015 11:37pm

I'll be honest, I've heard a LOT of people say "i've heard of reddit but I found it impossible to use so I never joined". I don't think it's a road we want boards going down when the idea is to be more user friendly

Having the OP at the top sounds lovely when the OP is 2 lines.
When you're in PI and it's nearly a novel, that is just not going to work. You know all those times people quote the OP and we say "ffs stop it, I'm not scrolling past all that?"... like that but worse.

User info on the left is vital for quick glances at stuff, mod related or otherwise. Join date comes in handy a lot.

Usual issue with too much whitespace and needing alternating shading like we do now.

The view of sticky threads etc on the right seems nice.

I think hiding the categories away will make it even less obvious for new people that there is an apt place for their topics, and I don't know about anyone else but I really use those dropdowns a lot and don't want extra clicks going hunting for them.
Reddit only has a small number of default fora showing on the homepage and you've to go hunting for the rest. Granted they have about 5 million subreddits so it's more of a genuine issue, but trying that on boards would mean a lot less traffic for a lot of the fora, imo, because they might be harder to find
Also I don't know about anyone else but that straight line menu thing always means settings to me, not "here's more topics we hid away". (or are you saying it's in browse? i dont know??)
If you can find a way of tidying up the existing categories or doing more filters instead, then leaving them at the top like now, I think that would be a better plan

Honestly though I think what we have is more user friendly now.
The new views look like they're going to overwhelm new people, while losing functionality for existing ones

Ehhh sorry I know you guys appreciate constructive criticism and I'm trying to be positive, I just can't, and all that white still makes it harder to look at for more than 4 seconds =/

nesf · 22-02-2015 12:39am

Zaph wrote: »

Reddit is an abomination that's impossible to read because of those threaded views. I don't mind if the upgrade includes them for those who want them, as long as they're not the default and you can still read things in the current format.

Having threading as an option is worse than pointless, if you want threading to work properly it has to be the default otherwise you have a mess where replies to posts are not shown as replies in threaded view because a post didn't quote the post they were replying to and the system cannot know to mark it as a reply to the first post.

Not arguing for it as a default or anything, I think there would be too much resistance to such a change.

Into The Blue · 22-02-2015 9:38am

Zaph wrote: »

Reddit is an abomination that's impossible to read because of those threaded views

Happy days, I thought I was missing something/getting old

Discodog · 22-02-2015 2:20pm

nesf wrote: »

Are you saying that trying to stop the site from making a loss is a bad idea? It's no longer the case for the whole internet that a banner ad or two can make ends meet.

Maybe the owners should be more open about it rather than trying to sneak in extra adds. I am sure that we would all appreciate honesty & we want the site to continue. If there is a revenue problem then how about a forum to discuss the ways to increase it without upsetting the users ?

Are people really put off by the look of Boards ? It seems to me that the trend is for shorter comment. Maybe the new, possibly younger posters, have a low boredom threshold

Out of curiosity I took a look at Reddit - I won't be back.

Gits_bone · 22-02-2015 2:51pm

Into The Blue wrote: »

Happy days, I thought I was missing something/getting old

Reddit is the best site on the internet. It has everything you need/want.

People always say they don't know how to use it so they don't give it a chance. You need to create an account and then mess around for a few hours.

Want to see the highest rated comment in a post? Can do that.
Want to see the most controversial comment in a post? Can do that.
Want to see the newest comments in a post? Can do that.

Wouldn't work on boards unless it was the default way of doing it as others have said.

nesf · 22-02-2015 5:46pm

Discodog wrote: »

Maybe the owners should be more open about it rather than trying to sneak in extra adds.

They're showing a mock-up of the new layout, ads included, they tell us they're moving the sponsored threads to the right sidebar. We can easily see what's different to the current logged out view (pretty much only ad size and where the sponsored links are as far as I can tell). If they're trying to sneak in extra ads they're doing a poor job of it.

_Kaiser_ · 22-02-2015 8:06pm

Do we know yet why there's a need to tinker with the layout at all? - I get it, vBulletin = old/bad, new engine = good, but I don't see the point in change just for the sake of it.

Nor do I see the point of aping Reddit or whatever other sites Boards is trying to emulate. It's a forum, not Twitter, Facebook etc... if you want to improve it and get more hits do things like...

- Improving the mobile apps. The Android one anyway is worse than the touch site (which itself isn't bad actually)
- Enough with the overzealous "please don't sue" moderation that has threads shut down/locked for no real reason
- Consistency is key. There are forums where moderation is wayy too severe, others where it's barely present at all leading to trainwrecks

Maybe a (very prominent) survey as to why people come here and what they like/dislike might be useful? Multiple choice with additional comments for each question to keep it consistent.
I say this as this thread in itself is talking about a fairly significant change to the functionality of the site and has only 107 posts to-date.. mostly from regs and mods.

Gits_bone · 22-02-2015 9:18pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Do we know yet why there's a need to tinker with the layout at all? - I get it, vBulletin = old/bad, new engine = good, but I don't see the point in change just for the sake of it.

Nor do I see the point of aping Reddit or whatever other sites Boards is trying to emulate. It's a forum, not Twitter, Facebook etc... if you want to improve it and get more hits do things like...

- Improving the mobile apps. The Android one anyway is worse than the touch site (which itself isn't bad actually)
- Enough with the overzealous "please don't sue" moderation that has threads shut down/locked for no real reason
- Consistency is key. There are forums where moderation is wayy too severe, others where it's barely present at all leading to trainwrecks

Maybe a (very prominent) survey as to why people come here and what they like/dislike might be useful? Multiple choice with additional comments for each question to keep it consistent.
I say this as this thread in itself is talking about a fairly significant change to the functionality of the site and has only 107 posts to-date.. mostly from regs and mods.

Agree with everything.

I don't know why boards can't create a term and condition where they accept no responsibility for what's posted on the site.

What is the difference between me slandering someone on facebook and on boards?

evolving_doors · 22-02-2015 10:02pm

Gits_bone wrote: »

Agree with everything.

I don't know why boards can't create a term and condition where they accept no responsibility for what's posted on the site.

What is the difference between me slandering someone on facebook and on boards?

The difference is that you can't slander someone on boards... and rightly so. Why would anyone feel the need to slander someone anyway?

Zaph · 22-02-2015 10:21pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

- Enough with the overzealous "please don't sue" moderation that has threads shut down/locked for no real reason
- Consistency is key. There are forums where moderation is wayy too severe, others where it's barely present at all leading to trainwrecks

What have either of these got to do with how the site looks or functions technically?

Gits_bone · 22-02-2015 10:21pm

Armelodie wrote: »

The difference is that you can't slander someone on boards... and rightly so. Why would anyone feel the need to slander someone anyway?

Sigh. It was an example of one thing not allowed on boards because of the "I'm going to sue" thing. Can't even mention where to watch streams now.

Zaph · 22-02-2015 10:26pm

Gits_bone wrote: »

Can't even mention where to watch streams now.

Well take that up with Mr. Sherlock and his buddies in government rather than directing your displeasure at Boards.

_Kaiser_ · 22-02-2015 10:52pm

Zaph wrote: »

What have either of these got to do with how the site looks or functions technically?

My point was that rather than trying to fix things that aren't broken (in terms of the current design and functionality) there are far better steps that could be taken to increase traffic to the site and revenue AND improve the overall experience as well.

Boards (a bit like Adverts last year) seems to have forgotten what the site is about and why people come here because of this drive to emulate other successful sites.. As I said, this isn't Facebook, Twitter, reddit or whatever they're aiming for and people come to Boards for completely different reasons to the above.

It seems to me that there's far too much effort going into tinkering with the display settings and not enough into assessing some of the deeper issues that would put people off using the site and indeed finding ways to highlight the uniqueness of Boards vs those others instead.

22-02-2015 11:01pm

Gits_bone wrote: »

What is the difference between me slandering someone on facebook and on boards?

Two things:

Facebook's owners aren't in Irish jurisdiction
Facebook's legal department's annual operating budget is a rather large multiple of Boards' combined gross revenue for the last 10 years

Gits_bone · 22-02-2015 11:14pm

28064212 wrote: »

Two things:
Facebook's owners aren't in Irish jurisdiction

Facebook's legal department's annual operating budget is a rather large multiple of Boards' combined gross revenue for the last 10 years

I wasn't aware of the sherlock law. So I retract my comment.

The law sucks, can't post replays of goals in the soccer forum either.

john the one · 22-02-2015 11:39pm

Totaaly off topic here and sorry about it but are we going to have an AMA with Glen Hansard?? Is that a little easter egg in the first picture?

22-02-2015 11:48pm

john the one wrote: »

Totaaly off topic here and sorry about it but are we going to have an AMA with Glen Hansard?? Is that a little easter egg in the first picture?

Re-read the OP

john the one · 23-02-2015 12:13am

28064212 wrote: »

Re-read the OP

silly me, boards 101

Gits_bone · 23-02-2015 12:15am

john the one wrote: »

silly me, boards 101

Maybe if the OP was stuck to the top you would have seen it

Turtwig · 23-02-2015 12:48am

Gits_bone wrote: »

What is the difference between me slandering someone on facebook and on boards?

Absolutely no difference to you. If you don't believe me try slandering someone on facebook who's a penchant for suing others. The difference comes from the publisher side. Facebook publishes the material just like boards does. Facebook just happens to be a monster publisher. Boards is a tiny slug that could easily be squished by any ongoing legal battle.

Getting back on topic. I don't think changing to a reddit-like interface would necessarily be a bad thing. You're not going to take a slice out of facebook or twitter. Not without seriously compromising the standard of discussion. So targeting the audiences interested in more niche discussions might be an idea. I think reddits a counter intuitive mess though. Probably best not to be spawned in its image.

There a rule somewhere that most people only spend enough time on a webpage to read 18% of its content. Boards in its current format will never appeal to that audience. If redditors are your target audience, which I doubt, then change to something like that. Other wise, get rid of the bloody white.

Drift · 23-02-2015 2:26am

1. I think conversations and social interaction evolve on boards.ie because posts move on from the original topic. If a move was made to threaded sytle "comments" after an initial post (ala reddit) I think boards would lose one of its best selling points. In my opinion it would become much of a "journal.ie" type thing where one person posts a big opinion piece and everyone else gives a short one or two line agree/disagree comment. The threading of the "comments" would, in my opinion, stifle the conversation and reduce social interaction.

2. I use the navigation bar at the top a lot. Removing it would slow down my navigation through the site and probably reduce the number of fora I visit.

3. As everyone else said - date and time on the posts is essential. Even more essential if you go down the "threddit" route. (See what I did there!

)

4. I think I slightly prefer version 2 - I'd like if the "forum name" and "poster name" positions were swapped on the cover page.

5. Will the box on the right hand side be a big space waster in the long run? About 20% of my screen space is currently underused on boards because of the gap under the posters name (only when posts are long ones obviously). If a further 20-25% is taken off the right hand side it just means more scrolling.

6. I like the snappy short break between posts. It's tidy. How will signatures show up? Or can we ditch them altogether???!!! (Pretty please)

Hope that's of some help!

laugh · 23-02-2015 9:23am

For someone who looks at a computer screen all day, everyday, must come in black!

LizT · 23-02-2015 3:48pm

Don't like hiding the categories away, I think it will make it more difficult for new uses to navigate the site. I like having them at the top of the page and it would be more user friendly to keep them there, especially for new users (granted categories like Rec and Soc might not immediately make sense to new users but seeing cats like Region, Edu, Science, Sports along with all the others at the top would surely give new users a basic idea of how the site is laid out?)

Hate the idea of the OP at the top, will be a nightmare in any thread where the OP is even moderately long.

Think you'll be doing mods a disservice hiding away the join date and user stats, it comes in handy very often. Might also be useful for new users to see that their responses are coming from established users.

The idea of keeping stickies etc at the side is good practice for new users but for those familiar with a forum, seems a bit redundant.

Sorry for the negativity but it's nearly always easier to point out what you don't like rather than what you do :P

Dades · 23-02-2015 4:04pm

Regarding the hiding of the categories, I'm going to hold my opinion until I see what type of awesome drop-down we get when we click it.

We all know the categories are due a refresh, maybe it's time to think outside the box.

Also, not enough people use the excellent search box at the top of the page which does a fantastic job of matching a poster's subject matter with a relevant forum via simple keyword entry. This needs to be promoted.

Squall Leonhart · 23-02-2015 9:57pm

Version 2 would certainly be my preference.

As per others posts, I too would like to see a dark theme, white is harsh on the eyes after a day at a computer screen.

Posy · 23-02-2015 9:59pm

After reading this thread, I am now a convert to the dark theme. Can't believe it took me so long! :cool:

Comhrá · 24-02-2015 10:10am

If it must be changed, the I vote for version 2 but I would prefer if it were to be left as it is.

ash23 · 24-02-2015 3:31pm

I know version 2 is cleaner but I find it harder to read because of lack of contrast. I think I'd prefer the darker blue of version 1 with the paler blue of the tabs to make them stand out. My eyesight isn't the best :rolleyes:

K-9 · 24-02-2015 4:11pm

Dades wrote: »

Regarding the hiding of the categories, I'm going to hold my opinion until I see what type of awesome drop-down we get when we click it.

We all know the categories are due a refresh, maybe it's time to think outside the box.

Also, not enough people use the excellent search box at the top of the page which does a fantastic job of matching a poster's subject matter with a relevant forum via simple keyword entry. This needs to be promoted.

There's so many categories, forums and sub forums, it just doesn't seem to fit with the way things are designed anymore!

The search box is the way to go but it's hard to teach old dogs like me new tricks.

Posy · 25-02-2015 9:28am

I always use the search box!
My brain gets too tired figuring out if something is Rec or Soc or in a sub-forum, plus I'm pretty impatient.

Gits_bone · 25-02-2015 11:20am

Yeah I use the drop down menu a lot.

wnolan1992 · 26-02-2015 1:04am

I haven't used the dropdown since the new search box arrived. So much handier to use that to find a specific forum.

mirrorwall14 · 28-02-2015 6:54pm

Oh please please don't do threaded views! And "newest first" is completely un-necessary if you have a jump to last post button so I'm not sure why you'd want it?

This feels like a weird cross between reddit, facebook and rollercoaster.ie allof whom piss me off no end to browse on! If you have to chose one then 2 is better but whatever you do please don't make the newest first the default because it drives me batty on another site and I stopped browsing it coz it kept forgetting me resetting to oldest first.

nesf · 28-02-2015 9:22pm

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

Oh please please don't do threaded views! And "newest first" is completely un-necessary if you have a jump to last post button so I'm not sure why you'd want it?

This feels like a weird cross between reddit, facebook and rollercoaster.ie allof whom piss me off no end to browse on! If you have to chose one then 2 is better but whatever you do please don't make the newest first the default because it drives me batty on another site and I stopped browsing it coz it kept forgetting me resetting to oldest first.

Threaded view as default isn't on the table and I believe they've said newest first won't be default either.

CatInABox · 10-03-2015 8:39pm

Have to admit, I came in here to take a look at the new styles, and am now very paranoid! The first thoughts that went through my head were

"Hey, that's my name in those new designs!"
"Oh cool, they gave me a new avatar!"
"Hey wait, how do they know I have a big nose?"

Very paranoid indeed.

I'd go with the second one anyway, but then you guys probably already knew that.

Red Alert · 30-03-2015 1:49pm

What's the actual need for a new style? I think at last boards has actually got a very good default theme.

Harry Palmr · 30-03-2015 6:40pm

I'm on old school - it I die (or it dies).

Cienciano · 01-05-2015 11:52pm

laugh wrote: »

For someone who looks at a computer screen all day, everyday, must come in black!

Definitely. Ive been using the black theme for years. Far easier on the eye.

I can't really judge the new changes till I tried them out. I'm a fan of the reddit layout, it's great being able to customise the top bar of reddit with all your favourite subs. It's a bit like having your bookmarks toolbar on your browser.

dr.bollocko · 10-05-2015 12:37am

I don't mind about category and lay out. An admirable attempt to make the place more navigable. But the search functions are still in need of a major overhaul.

Joya · 18-05-2015 7:58pm

Joya wrote: »

possibly, i sent some msi file for testing but not sure anyone is there at this stage lol :d

btw could you do something on UI for the pages, so that the profile image with user name and indicator of new posts in followed topics be brought to screen always even if you resize the browser to say, half of the screen (e.g. for that part to dynamically is brought back underneath the boards.ie logo and search box)

edit:
and also to remove or put above this "announcement box on the right that takes so much of the screen width (and again - pushes the button with new posts indicator to the right - the thing that is really important to user :-D

just a thought!

my post from other thread and shimi said to post it here, i reaaallllyyy hope you will consider the issue with the profile picture plus name plus new posts indicator - thanks a mil!!

Attached Image

Dav · 19-06-2015 10:55am

Hello all, I wanted to give this a bump to show you some of the work in progress on the new menu we're planning on using.

So you can see that there's the headings across the top as normal, then when you hover (or tap on a touch screen) you get the sub-headings on the left hand side and the contents on the rest of the menu. It's big, yes, but if you're looking to use the menu, then the chances are you're not looking at the content on the screen at the same time

I'm running a 1920X1080 screen resolution for reference.

Dav · 19-06-2015 11:10am

Here is the same screen on a 1024 X 768 resolution - the res of an older model iPad and still one of the more popular web browsing devices out there. It shows off how the site shrinks though as the screen resolution gets smaller.

[edit]
Ignore those +'s after every forum, it was something Jason was working on that he's removed as I was taking the screenshot.

Dav · 19-06-2015 11:12am

And finally, a mobile screen. You can see there's a significant change and we've replaced the headings with the "hamburger" (=) button. You tap on each heading to roll out the sub-headings/forums and you tap the level above to roll them back a level.

wnolan1992 · 19-06-2015 11:16am

Dav wrote: »

Hello all, I wanted to give this a bump to show you some of the work in progress on the new menu we're planning on using.

So you can see that there's the headings across the top as normal, then when you hover (or tap on a touch screen) you get the sub-headings on the left hand side and the contents on the rest of the menu. It's big, yes, but if you're looking to use the menu, then the chances are you're not looking at the content on the screen at the same time I'm running a 1920X1080 screen resolution for reference.

That's a really nice design. I really like it.

Can I ask though, why move Regional to the top bar as opposed to something like Rec which would (I assume not knowing the figures) have higher traffic?

I dunno, to me it just seems a bit out of place with the others that are there.

Oh, and please, please help my OCD by moving the "Boards.ie" tab before the "Talk To..." tab... that's been irking me since that tab was implemented. :pac:

Myrddin · 19-06-2015 11:17am

Dav wrote: »

I really like that actually, great work. One thing that immediately springs to mind though, would it be possible to better highlight which exact subheading is currently expanded? For instance, in this pic, have it so that only Rec & Hobbies shows up in white, & the other categories/sub-headings are greyed out unless you hover over them (which means only one can be white at any given time)? I see the little red marker, but purely going by the picture, it's not the clearest way to indicate whatever is expanded...

19-06-2015 11:21am

Nice work. Couple of points:

The black looks very out of place. Is that the standard skin? What's wrong with the classic Boards blue?
What's with all the '+'s on the 1024 image? Only some of those forums have further sub-forums. And why aren't there '+'s on the 1920 image? How do you access, for example, "Home Brewing" in "Beer & Wine & Spirits", or even know it's there?
On the desktop, do you click or hover on the left-hand Categories? If it's hover, it's going to be very annoying trying to move a mouse from left-hand side to the contents without hovering on anything else

Dav · 19-06-2015 11:23am

Regional forums are different in a sense though - the discussion centres around a geographical area rather than a topic. So whilst the Home & Garden section might be where we'd talk about wanting some DIY work done, the Dublin City forum is where I'd go if I wanted to get recommendations for a plumber in my locality for example.

The "current" subheading can and probably should get some more definitive highlighting alright - as you said Myridin, the little red line is there for this purpose, but it's maybe a bit too subtle and there's definitely scope to make it more immediately obvious.

We're also thinking about bullet pointing the items on the left to make them more distinct as some of them wrap onto a second line.

wnolan1992 · 19-06-2015 11:35am

Dav wrote: »

Regional forums are different in a sense though - the discussion centres around a geographical area rather than a topic. So whilst the Home & Garden section might be where we'd talk about wanting some DIY work done, the Dublin City forum is where I'd go if I wanted to get recommendations for a plumber in my locality for example.

Ah, I get you. Perfectly reasonable way to look at it. Shame my brain isn't reasonable at times. :P

Bullet points would be a good idea too btw.

Cheers Dav, great work.

Dav · 19-06-2015 11:40am

28064212 wrote: »

Nice work. Couple of points:
The black looks very out of place. Is that the standard skin? What's wrong with the classic Boards blue?

What's with all the '+'s on the 1024 image? Only some of those forums have further sub-forums. And why aren't there '+'s on the 1920 image? How do you access, for example, "Home Brewing" in "Beer & Wine & Spirits", or even know it's there?

On the desktop, do you click or hover on the left-hand Categories? If it's hover, it's going to be very annoying trying to move a mouse from left-hand side to the contents without hovering on anything else

It's just work in progress at the moment, we'll get a more appropriate colour palette applied in due course
I edited in a comment about about the +'s - they were just something Jason was testing as I took the screen shot and they're gone again.
It's based on a hover - I don't think it's any more or less difficult to use than any other menu, but it's something we'll keep an eye on - it could be that a click is a better option to "lock" in that selection on the left, but I'd personally feel that it's a little bit unintuitive that way.

Dades · 19-06-2015 11:51am

28064212 wrote: »

[*]On the desktop, do you click or hover on the left-hand Categories? If it's hover, it's going to be very annoying trying to move a mouse from left-hand side to the contents without hovering on anything else[/list]

Half the furor over the current menu was people freaking out over having to click to open up sub categories. I think people will want this to hover-open, no matter what. It should be possible to introduce a tiny delay which might make it easier.

Dav, is the "burger" icon to open topics still on the cards (as per the original screens)?

In the above example - are the Arts sub categories expanded by default and the user moves left to expand any other category?

I believe that however you open the categories menu, the main categories must expand directly beneath that button/link. That might involve shifting whatever opens those categories to one side, which would also be a good thing as having "Topics" in the center top is just plain odd.

Like the general proposal though, other than that!

Proposed changes to site look

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