Festina lente

average_runner · 05-03-2013 10:43am

Great time Ray, but please dont change your log name before a race, i was looking for it on Sunday on my phone but couldnt find it anywhere!!

Well done again

nerraw1111 · 05-03-2013 3:24pm

Great stuff Ray. Knocking those times down.

You targetting a marathon time?

RayCun · 05-03-2013 3:27pm

2.4x, x depends on my next half

nerraw1111 · 05-03-2013 3:40pm

Excellent. You're going great guns, not to mention pics in Fit magazine etc

Some improvement in the hm time given it was less than a year when you went sub sub 40.

RayCun · 05-03-2013 3:52pm

Next race is the national 10k/Great Ireland run, and probably the K-Club 10k a week later. So the goal for the next 6/7 weeks is to get back to the regular training plan - 10 runs/week, ~110k, sessions on Tuesday and Saturday, long run on Sunday - without the all-over stiffness I have at the moment, made worse by Sunday but there before, and without this ****ing knee pain that kicks in every time I sit down for more than 10 minutes. Or drive. Or go to sleep on my side. :rolleyes: (which is I'm sure the major cause of the stiffness and tension)

To get there -
proper stretching after every run
easy stretches in the morning
icing every hour when at home
foam rolling every evening
glute exercises at my desk
back to the core work I stopped last month because of my knee
physio Saturday and again next month

I liked it better when my training plan was
run
run some more
:rolleyes:

Holiday at the beginning of May, two weeks of light running (but maybe keep up the stretches etc, then
Sportsworld 5 mile (a few hours after flight back)
Dunshaughlin 10k
national half
Rathfarnham 5k
Dublin Novice XC
Dublin marathon
and a winter of XC

maybe the odd Marlay parkrun or midweek BHAA race along the way.
Will talk to the coach about marathon-specific training in June, if I'm back on track by then.

Cleanman · 05-03-2013 8:56pm

Well done Ray, you're absolutely flying!

What glute exercises do you do at your desk? I could do with doing a few of those myself!

RayCun · 05-03-2013 11:00pm

If you are sitting at work, try sitting on your hands so you can feel your glutes then squeeze your glutes as if you are going to stand up then release, do this 10times, several times a day

Gavlor · 05-03-2013 11:37pm

RayCun wrote: »

If you are sitting at work, try sitting on your hands so you can feel your glutes then squeeze your glutes as if you are going to stand up then release, do this 10times, several times a day

Am I the only person thinking 'Ron burgundy'??

RayCun · 09-03-2013 12:09pm

just 3 runs this week, all slow, 26.21 total.
Decided to take a complete break from running for a week. Physio again yesterday and the first suggestion was to consider an MRI, but I'm going to go with a week of rest/stretching/strength/rolling/icing, and see how it goes. Feel a lot better after the rubdown yesterday, but we'll see how it goes...

Kurt Godel · 10-03-2013 3:26pm

<<buys Ray a beer>>

pconn062 · 10-03-2013 3:28pm

De-modification!?? :eek: Hopefully not to be followed by a closed account!

RayCun · 10-03-2013 3:56pm

Nah, I just don't have the time for modding - or, not the time, the space in my head for thinking about boards things. I'll keep posting, but I don't want to have to post. Club admin is taking over that time and more...

pconn062 · 10-03-2013 4:14pm

I'm with you on the club admin stuff, I'm on the committee of my club and we've already started planning our road race which isn't on until July!

Hope the knee is holding up.

RacoonQueen · 10-03-2013 4:51pm

Who's going to be hitler mod now? First D'pop, now you... :eek:

jcsmum · 11-03-2013 11:53am

RayCun wrote: »

Nah, I just don't have the time for modding - or, not the time, the space in my head for thinking about boards things. I'll keep posting, but I don't want to have to post. Club admin is taking over that time and more...

Ray has his priorities right! :cool:

Letyourselfgo · 11-03-2013 12:53pm

Fair play to you for the time put in as mod, you did a cracking job.

pconn062 · 23-03-2013 11:05pm

Ray, came across this page, the first post has some good stretches for patellar tendonitis. You probably have most of them already but just in case.

Also I totally recommend one of these, I got one after the last time I had PT and it really helped when I got back to running. Takes some of the pressure of the tendon itself. You feel like a bit of a douche with it but it's worth it!

RacoonQueen · 24-03-2013 11:30am

Yeah thats the strap I use when I'm having probs. It really takes the pressure off.

Keep up the strength work, stretching and foam rolling CONSTANTLY when it goes away Ray. Otherwise it will reoccur over and over and over. Trust me.

pconn062 · 24-03-2013 12:27pm

Forgot to link the page. :cool:

theboyblunder · 27-03-2013 9:45pm

How is the knee ray? Back on the road?

RayCun · 27-03-2013 10:21pm

planning to get out this weekend, give it a go

RayCun · 30-03-2013 5:08pm

No, still not right

Went out yesterday and today and I could feel it both runs, and it was stiff afterwards. I could continue to run on it, just like I could run last month, but have goals for the year and continuing to train isn't going to bring me any closer to them. Another couple of weeks of stretching, icing, and resting...

Month|2010|2011|2012|2013
January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13
February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8
March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93
April|72|106.33|201.18
May|75.9|107.13|175.21
June|90.2|64.85|150.09
July|118.1|126.92|242.21
August|124.4|168|240.27
September|154|171.75|203.69
October|108.7|191.2|229
November|58.4|128.9|283.87
December|83|166.58|285
Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604
[/QUOTE]

pconn062 · 30-03-2013 6:28pm

Sorry to hear that Ray, extremely frustrating. When you say you can feel it do you mean you can feel "something" or actual pain? I wouldn't worry too much about the stiffness afterwards, that's normal with PT when you get back to running (in my experience) and usually goes away. But you're right, another week off won't do any damage to your fitness. At least you will have a core of iron after this!

Dotcomdolly · 30-03-2013 6:33pm

pconn062 wrote: »

Sorry to hear that Ray, extremely frustrating. When you say you can feel it do you mean you can feel "something" or actual pain? I wouldn't worry too much about the stiffness afterwards, that's normal with PT when you get back to running (in my experience) and usually goes away. But you're right, another week off won't do any damage to your fitness. At least you will have a core of iron after this!

He's breaking his Easter eggs against his rock hard abs

RayCun · 30-03-2013 7:26pm

pconn062 wrote: »

Sorry to hear that Ray, extremely frustrating. When you say you can feel it do you mean you can feel "something" or actual pain? I wouldn't worry too much about the stiffness afterwards, that's normal with PT when you get back to running (in my experience) and usually goes away.

I didn't really feel pain when I ran even last month, but I can/could feel the left knee reacting differently to the right. I don't know how to describe it, jarring more maybe? And then the same pain/stiffness when driving or using stairs yesterday - not as severe, but the same thing.

pconn062 · 30-03-2013 10:25pm

RayCun wrote: »

I didn't really feel pain when I ran even last month, but I can/could feel the left knee reacting differently to the right. I don't know how to describe it, jarring more maybe? And then the same pain/stiffness when driving or using stairs yesterday - not as severe, but the same thing.

It's a tough one Ray, best to give it another week and then see. I remember a few years ago I had the same problem and it went on for weeks and weeks. Eventually I got tired off the take a week off/try a run/still sore thing so just went back to training and eventually the thing just went away. Not saying this is good advice but just something worth remembering.

RayCun · 31-03-2013 8:33am

yeah, eventually I will get tired of being sensible

RayCun · 28-04-2013 5:00pm

14 runs this month, 82.07km:(
Starting to build up a little now, 30 to 40 minutes, 3 days in a row this weekend, and knees are a little sore. Not sore enough to stop, but enough to make me wonder if they'll get worse with more running. The rehab work will keep going for a while yet I think

Month|2010|2011|2012|2013
January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13
February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8
March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93
April|72|106.33|201.18|51
May|75.9|107.13|175.21
June|90.2|64.85|150.09
July|118.1|126.92|242.21
August|124.4|168|240.27
September|154|171.75|203.69
October|108.7|191.2|229
November|58.4|128.9|283.87
December|83|166.58|285
Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604

wrstan · 01-05-2013 8:27pm

Hi Ray

I read this article in April's Running Times entitled Retinking Running Health:
http://www.runnersworld.com/injury-prevention-recovery/rethinking-running-health

The article says that:

Overuse injuries have a lot to do with not paying attention to your body ... Injury is not [just] a physical event. It's the mind-body complex working together.

The following paragraph really struck a chord:

Successful distance runners tend to be Type A individuals: highly motivated, proactive, organized people who value their time. These traits often manifest in a "never miss a mile" mentality that can lead to personal bests and an impressive-looking training log. It also opens the door to injury, says Beecham. That's because compulsive training relegates important cues, such as a sore knee or tight hamstring, to the back of our minds, where more urgent demands take their place in the hierarchy of thought.

While I have no idea what type of person you are, this is definitely an impressive-looking training log with lots of PB's, so I though it may be relevant. Anyway reading the article certainly will not help you get back from an injury any quicker, but there are some points in there that I think may help most runners be more attuned to picking up cues for taking action to prevent or minimise injuries.

Just a thought! :rolleyes:

RayCun · 01-05-2013 9:41pm

Oh definitely. I wouldn't say I'm super organised in general, but if you're going to fit all the runs in you have to be somewhat compulsive about it, set yourself a plan and follow it. Maybe you don't do the session, or run a it shorter, but you still go out and run. The funny thing is a couple of weeks ago I was trying to get a few 30 minute runs in and finding it hard to find the time

RayCun · 05-05-2013 10:23am

4 runs, short and slow, now off for warm weather training
kmtd: 25.5

RayCun · 31-05-2013 8:42pm

Month|2010|2011|2012|2013
January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13
February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8
March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93
April|72|106.33|201.18|51
May|75.9|107.13|175.21|41.9
June|90.2|64.85|150.09
July|118.1|126.92|242.21
August|124.4|168|240.27
September|154|171.75|203.69
October|108.7|191.2|229
November|58.4|128.9|283.87
December|83|166.58|285
Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604

jaysus

So the plan when I was going on holidays was to keep building up the running, two days on one day off kind of thing, but the knee problem flared up again on the plane, spent the flight with my leg stretched out along the aisle or standing up :rolleyes: so I left the running gear in the suitcase.
Got back beginning of last week and went over to Ciaran Fitzpatrick. He had a poke and a twist and a quick feel, said the problem was actually muscular - a knot in the hamstring where is connected to my knee joint was pulling my knee out of whack, it wasn't moving properly, which meant <something> was getting inflamed, which was compressing the nerve. Cue 30 minutes determined massage of one spot at the back of my knee and a prescription of hamstring stretches.
About 4 hours of running since then and things seem to be holding up. I'm still ridiculously unfit, some stiffness in both knees, and my right hip/groin is making sure I don't even think about running fast. Still some twinges in the left knee, but not the near-constant sensation that something wasn't right. I'm even starting to think of less depressing titles for this log...

RayCun · 09-06-2013 8:06am

since the last update, four runs, three days of a bad cold, an email to set up another physio appointment because my knees are sore again :rolleyes:, and a new log title
- running around in circles, obviously
- and as a runner I've circled back to where I was however long ago
- which may yet drive me insane
- but mainly because of the uncanny resemblance

pconn062 · 09-06-2013 12:14pm

Hope you get a bit of a break soon Ray, you've had a rough time of it. The fitness won't be long coming back if you can get a decent run of training.

RayCun · 09-06-2013 3:16pm

I'd even sketched out a rough training plan earlier in the week based around the race series and maybe the marathon. It was very sensible, rest days, slow progression of time and sessions, physio dates pencilled in...
But I ran two days in a row, my knees got sore again, and I realised that
- if I drew up a plan I would stick to it, run when I shouldn't, and more than likely feck myself up again
- whatever times I ran in the race series I'd be unhappy with. I could run 2.58 in DCM and ten minutes later I'd be kicking myself and saying, "yeah, but it could have been 2.4x..."
Better to just knock it all on the head. If I'm fit for crosscountry season, great, no targets before then

Mr Slow · 09-06-2013 3:50pm

You're a testament to 'with age comes wisdom'

Sorry to hear about the knee, I really hope you can get to the bottom of it and get back out there, I know how much it sucks a5s when you can't.

RacoonQueen · 09-06-2013 6:02pm

RayCun wrote: »

since the last update, four runs, three days of a bad cold, an email to set up another physio appointment because my knees are sore again :rolleyes:, and a new log title
- running around in circles, obviously
- and as a runner I've circled back to where I was however long ago
- which may yet drive me insane
- but mainly because of the uncanny resemblance

I *hate* to break it to you, but it's a long time since you had brown hair to fully resemble a loop the loop

jcsmum · 10-06-2013 11:13am

I feel awful for you Ray, especially as you put so much into the club & are helping so many people with their marathon and half marathon plans. You deserve a whole pile of good karma.

So true about our singlet and not just in your case. We have many loopy members!

RayCun · 30-06-2013 11:02am

June 1 7.68k 5.33 av pace 159AHR
>June 9 27.46k 5.20 pace 161AHR
>June 16 38.22k 5.28 pace 158AHR
>June 23 35.7k 5.25 pace 163AHR
>June 30 35.34k 5.13 pace 161AHR

Back to the physio again a couple of weeks ago as the knee pain started coming back. More painful session this time, working on my quad because that seems to be setting off the pain in/under my knee - all a bit of a mystery still though, best guess this time is that muscles here are pulling other muscles there which are causing this to swell, which... The prescription for now is lots of knee strengthening exercises, so I have a resistance band and I'm doing 10 knee lifts on each leg, 10 times a day. I can continue to run, but only on grass, no hills, and should be allowed start some faster sessions again this week. So the last month has seen me get up at 6 most weekdays for a 30 minute run around a local park, building up a bit longer on the weekends.
(for comparison's sake, the week of 11-17 February was 94k at 5.04, 148AHR, so I am way, way off fitness)

Month|2010|2011|2012|2013
January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13
February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8
March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93
April|72|106.33|201.18|51
May|75.9|107.13|175.21|41.9
June|90.2|64.85|150.09|89.72
July|118.1|126.92|242.21
August|124.4|168|240.27
September|154|171.75|203.69
October|108.7|191.2|229
November|58.4|128.9|283.87
December|83|166.58|285
Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604

statss · 30-06-2013 11:19am

I feel your pain. The strength exercises C. Fitz had me doing to fix my ankle really worked, it took about 3 weeks for the effect to be noticed but the discipline in doing them was very beneficial....I keep at them now even though it's "better". Hopefully you are not too far off that stage yourself now.

Mr Slow · 01-07-2013 11:37am

RayCun wrote: »

(for comparison's sake, the week of 11-17 February was 94k at 5.04, 148AHR, so I am way, way off fitness)

I'm glad to see you're getting back out there Ray and hopefully you can put this behind you. I know it's tough running at paces that once felt like walking and seeing the hr so high, I just made peace with it and then it wasn't such a drag anymore. You haven't been off that long so it should come back pretty quickly.

Dory Dory · 12-07-2013 7:40pm

Hey there...any progress on the knee(s)?? You've been on my mind...wondering how you are doing...and if there is any running joy??

RayCun · 12-07-2013 8:00pm

Dory Dory wrote: »

Hey there...any progress on the knee(s)?? You've been on my mind...wondering how you are doing...and if there is any running joy??

Definite improvements actually - the knee exercises finally paying dividends maybe, and also I've started cycling in and out of work for a bit of low-impact movement. About 50k last week, including a tempo session at the club, first proper session in months. Will be about 60k this week, including another session and a group run yesterday... paying for that today it has to be said. Starting to look forward to racing again finally...

Dory Dory · 12-07-2013 8:03pm

RayCun wrote: »

Definite improvements actually - the knee exercises finally paying dividends maybe, and also I've started cycling in and out of work for a bit of low-impact movement. About 50k last week, including a tempo session at the club, first proper session in months. Will be about 60k this week, including another session and a group run yesterday... paying for that today it has to be said. Starting to look forward to racing again finally...

That news is most excellent!

RayCun · 14-07-2013 11:00am

July 1-7
52.52 km Pace 5.07 AHR 163
First club session back was a 2x20 minute tempo run, 4.12 and 4.21 pace :rolleyes:

July 8-14
69.94km 5.33 AHR 152
Tuesday was a pyramid session of sorts, hard work, Thursday we went for an 'easy' run which quickly got to 4.30/4.40 pace, and this morning I went for a 'long' run, 85 minutes, 15k:rolleyes: 5.40 pace.

I'm still having trouble with paths, especially concrete, but feel okay on grass. A long way to go though.

jcsmum · 15-07-2013 11:02am

RayCun wrote: »

July 1-7
52.52 km Pace 5.07 AHR 163
First club session back was a 2x20 minute tempo run, 4.12 and 4.21 pace :rolleyes:

July 8-14
69.94km 5.33 AHR 152
Tuesday was a pyramid session of sorts, hard work, Thursday we went for an 'easy' run which quickly got to 4.30/4.40 pace, and this morning I went for a 'long' run, 85 minutes, 15k:rolleyes: 5.40 pace.

I'm still having trouble with paths, especially concrete, but feel okay on grass. A long way to go though.

You looked super comfortable on Thursday. Nice to see you back training!

digger2d2 · 16-07-2013 9:12am

jcsmum wrote: »

You looked super comfortable on Thursday. Nice to see you back training!

Good to see you back Ray!

RayCun · 28-07-2013 4:46pm

July 15-21
48.63 km Pace 5.29 AHR 160
Step-back week last week and physio on Saturday, just a maintenance massage. Had to bail on the Tuesday session of 800s - first one was fine, but a sharp pain in the knee when I started the second. Tried to walk it off and go with the second group instead but no dice.

July 22-28
47.27km 5.11 AHR 158
Monday I overslept :rolleyes: and gave blood in the evening, which ruled out Tuesday, overslept again on Wednesday. For the club session Thursday evening, a tempo run, I had the bright idea of pacing off PVincent. Worked great for the first 20 minutes, a group of us went around at 4.27, but I didn't realise he was planning to push the second run, I ended up being dragged around at 4.04.

Knee is improving steadily but I'm having a bit of trouble with my right achilles/heel so I'm sitting here with a squash ball under my foot...

RayCun · 04-08-2013 1:15pm

week -> August 4th
70.72km, 5.41 average pace, AHR 156
not much to report... ran most mornings, and I think I'll have to start making a bit more of an effort on those morning runs, because pace and heart rate are both very easy. I'm crawling out of my bed and into the running gear, so I tend to sleepwalk around, need to wake myself up a bit. Today was a decent run, up to Tymon and an hour round the grass, 5.20 pace overall but then I'm very slow at the start.

Month|2010|2011|2012|2013
January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13
February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8
March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93
April|72|106.33|201.18|51
May|75.9|107.13|175.21|41.9
June|90.2|64.85|150.09|89.72
July|118.1|126.92|242.21|147.92
August|124.4|168|240.27
September|154|171.75|203.69
October|108.7|191.2|229
November|58.4|128.9|283.87
December|83|166.58|285
Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604

Yay, treble figures

RacoonQueen · 04-08-2013 6:29pm

Good to see things improving for you Ray. Are you going to get back doing some fast stuff with the club?

Festina lente

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