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The Sad Reality

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    #32
    craigybagel
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭craigybagel


    SafeSurfer wrote: »
    craigybagel wrote: »
    He is up against what many people see as a ginger idiot, a communist, a terrorist and a vegatarian nutcase.QUOTE]

    I doubt may people would see it in those terms or choose to vote for a political party based on the leader's hair colour, vegetarianism etc.

    Obviously that statement was something of an exaggeration, but lets face it, the alternatives to FF aren't all that great, are they?


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    #33
    takun
    Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭takun


    craigybagel wrote: »

    Obviously that statement was something of an exaggeration, but lets face it, the alternatives to FF aren't all that great, are they?

    Maybe not, but even so a number of them are vastly preferable.


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    #34
    craigybagel
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭craigybagel


    takun wrote: »
    Maybe not, but even so a number of them are vastly preferable.

    Oh indeed. What I think of Cowen and co is a lot worse than the terms I used for the others! But they are another reason I worry about the results of this election, and the odds of a seemingly surprisingly strong FF performance.


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    #35
    one eye
    Registered Users Posts: 40 ✭one eye


    Hi all. My point is that a lot of people anticipate a FF wipeout.
    History teaches us that there is solid core vote for FF, and despite what they say in polls or interviews, come election day they will put the 'X' beside the FF candidate. That one particular candidate in a western constituency was in effect guilty of perjury is expected to be returned to the Dail, instead of being in jail.


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    #36
    craigybagel
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭craigybagel


    one eye wrote: »
    Hi all. My point is that a lot of people anticipate a FF wipeout.
    History teaches us that there is solid core vote for FF, and despite what they say in polls or interviews, come election day they will put the 'X' beside the FF candidate. That one particular candidate in a western constituency was in effect guilty of perjury is expected to be returned to the Dail, instead of being in jail.

    And that is going to be the big question of this election. How badly will the FF vote collapse? How much of the core FF vote will change their minds? That question will decide this whole election.


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    #37
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    Don't forget, FF have been in power for most of the past 85 years - that's a lot of time to dole out patronage and indulge in clientelism and embed their 'own' in all levels of society and this when coupled with their populist policies and everyman promises to get and retain power at all costs is first amongst the reasons why there is this 'core' FF vote - grubby vote-getting meets grubby Irish voter=FF


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    #38
    fat__tony
    Registered Users Posts: 587 ✭✭✭fat__tony


    up them Schteps wrote: »
    I think your crossing a line there jackass!

    I personally will be voting FF for the reasons that I do not feel Enda Kenny will run the country as well as he thinks he will (I think Enda is like a little boy right now, can see the finish line and is just talking the talk until he is in power and will end up bringing in the same policies as FF) and I do not want labour in government as I disagree with their policies, I obviously have other reasons based on the parties policies but I'm focussing now on the general points. In the last few weeks boards has just turned into a FF bashing website were the same opinions come up over and over again.

    I know this has been mentioned earlier in the thread but if were all being rational and logical creatures and remove all personal connections to the way the country was run, can you honestly say FG/LAB wouldn't of done the same thing as FF....? I mean back in 06/07 FF were being crucified by the opposition as they weren't spending enough and now FG/LAB are praying these comment aren't brought up again. The Irish electorate forget these things so easily. I put the question to boards.ie members, and don't just flog me here cause it will get you thanks etc, but Do you honestly believe FG/LAB wouldn't of done the same thing as FF if they were in power? I believe the answer would be yes!

    Is that the best you can do? Thats the best reason you can come up not to vote for FG because you view Enda Kenny as a little boy?

    Absolutely pathetic reasoning and typical of the idiotic mindset which still plagues the country. FG have stated their policies already but you've probably ignored them and focused purely on Enda's personality.

    As for the rest of your post, you really are clutching at straws in terms of credibility. FF won the 07 election, they were in power and they made all the abysmal decisions over the past 4 years, not FG/Labour.


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    #39
    Pal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,115 ✭✭✭Pal


    I think the country is going to end up with some seriously inept/undesirable people getting elected if the poll on boards.ie is to be believed.

    Quite worrying. Don't want to personalise it but Dublin West and Dublin Central are good examples of unorthodox voting patterns leading to a poorer representation for us all.


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    #40
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    Pal wrote: »
    I think the country is going to end up with some seriously inept/undesirable people getting elected if the poll on boards.ie is to be believed.

    Quite worrying. Don't want to personalise it but Dublin West and Dublin Central are good examples of unorthodox voting patterns leading to a poorer representation for us all.


    I don't understand when you say 'unorthodox voting patterns' in relation to Dublin Central.
    The FF vote is understated, Workers Party and Greens overstated.
    FG and SF and Labour are in line with Sindo poll published today for DubC:

    Sindo Poll Excluding Don't Knows (boards poll)

    Lab 30% (32%)
    FG 24% (22%)
    FF 16% (5%)
    SF 13% (14%)
    Ind 16% (23%)>(inc 7% WP)
    GP 1% (4%)


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    #41
    LoanShark
    Registered Users Posts: 949 ✭✭✭LoanShark


    I think FF will come out way better than what is being predicted.. I would also put it on the table that I believe the next government will be FF/FG with Enda running the show...Out of all the policies that is being talked about theirs seem to be more achievable and easier to implement..

    And For the record... I will be voting FF and I am also unhappy with the way things have gone in this country for the last number of years.. I think Enda will make a good taoiseach and he deserves the chance to run the country, when you look at the way he rebuilt Fine Gael to the party they are now... thats just my input..


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    #42
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    Kenny has ruled out any coalition with FF or SF today.

    I think it would be a very foolish FG to rely on FF support for a FG minority government if it comes down to that.


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    #43
    ilovesleep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭ilovesleep


    gambiaman wrote: »
    Don't forget, FF have been in power for most of the past 85 years - that's a lot of time to dole out patronage and indulge in clientelism and embed their 'own' in all levels of society and this when coupled with their populist policies and everyman promises to get and retain power at all costs is first amongst the reasons why there is this 'core' FF vote - grubby vote-getting meets grubby Irish voter=FF

    I think you are right. IMO the FF fanbase would be of the older generation, who grew up in extreme proverty. For the first time in their lifes they saw growth and wealth under FF (but started by FG/LAB) and bertie called it the celtic tiger. But as we now know FFs time was all a farce built on lies and deceit.


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    #44
    Aishae
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,800 ✭✭✭Aishae


    When Cowan stepped down as leader of FF (but remained as Taoiseach) saying it was for the good of the party; i wondered if this was a well orchestrated move to get a fresh face leading FF into the election as Cowan and co. knew if he stayed they might be in trouble.
    everything that has happened since - and even in the run up to the fiasco in the Dail around the time of the resignations - tells me 'yes, it seems they are too wise to way the public works' because they know - that by getting rid of some deadwood and appearing all fresh faced it will make a portion of the electorate believe it's a changed party.

    eg - in how many constituencies did an FF'er step down to give another FF'er in the constituency a better chance?
    its all about the good of the party.

    when they made the 4 year plan and the accepted the bail out they knew the incoming government would have to deal with it. so whoever that was wouldnt be popular and they could bounce back at the NEXT election instead. possibly saying 'i told you so' they know the majority will forget about what happened. they have too many spin doctors and advisors.....

    going by recent days though - the sad truth is they might do better than expected. some people just dont have a grasp on politics and they dont want to but they still feel they should vote and its usually the FF supporters.


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    #45
    craigybagel
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭craigybagel


    And it makes me very happy. Thank you Ireland!


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    #46
    Laois_Man
    Registered Users Posts: 5,758 ✭✭✭Laois_Man


    In the same way as we can say in hindsight that whoever was to win the last election in 07 was gonna be in for i hiding in the election following the 08 worldwide crisis, in my opinion, we can say with foresight that the team who wins this election will get a similar hiding in 2016 if this government survives that long. So in my opinion, you will be looking at Taoiseach Martin then!


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    #47
    colsmiff
    Registered Users Posts: 29 ✭colsmiff


    Well it looks like the OP was overlly pesimistic, FF /GP wiped out with 31 of the sitting TDs kicked with half the seats declared, FG and Labour replacing them , with support from SF and INDs. WHat we actually need now is an emergency govt, using the best from every party and show a united front to the ECB/IMF


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    #48
    danger man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 51 ✭✭danger man


    craigybagel wrote: »
    I hate Fianna Fáil. I hate their smugness and their arrogance, I hate the way their policies destroyed the economy of the country, I hate the fact that their legacy after 13 years in power is a 3rd world health system, a crumbling education system, and public service that is a beurocratatic nightmare sucking up what little money we do have to appease the unions and FF supporters. And most of all, I hate the way unemployment levels have shot up as a result of all of the above, and the fact that as a 24 year old with a degree, I couldn't find work in Ireland and I now live in Birmingham. And that there are tens of thousands of people like me all in the same boat.

    I would love to see Fianna Fáil shot down at the next election, and made to properly pay for the damage they've caused, and really feel the anger of the electorate.

    But its not going to happen.

    I've been lurking on the Political and General Election Boards for the last month, and I've read posts from so many people who feel the same way as me. And seen, both here and in polls, gleeful predictions that Fianna Fáil will be down to 30, maybe even into the 20's, after the election. That the likes of Mary Hanafin, Mary Coughlan, perhaps even Micheál Martin himself will lose their seats.

    Nothing would give me greater pleasure than to see that happen, but I think I need to inject some pessimism into this forum. Nobody organises an election, and galvanises the electorate, like FF does. Noone has the loyalty, especially amongst the elderly, that FF does. They've replaced Biffo with someone who is seen as being a young, hard working and popular man. He is up against what many people see as a ginger idiot, a communist, a terrorist and a vegatarian nutcase.

    Come February 26th, and the results coming out, I expect to hear the phrase "the huge swing to Labour/SF/FG shown in the polls doesnt seem to be happening" quite a lot. Whilst we will still probably have a FG/Lab government, FF won't die. They are like cockroaches. 45 seats minumum.

    So am I being unneccesarily pessimistic, or are the good people of boards.ie deluding themselves?

    terrorist ?? who is a terrorist ?


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    #49
    craigybagel
    Registered Users Posts: 67 ✭✭craigybagel


    colsmiff wrote: »
    Well it looks like the OP was overlly pesimistic, FF /GP wiped out with 31 of the sitting TDs kicked with half the seats declared, FG and Labour replacing them , with support from SF and INDs. WHat we actually need now is an emergency govt, using the best from every party and show a united front to the ECB/IMF

    Thats why I bumped this post back up last night, I was the OP who was overly pessimistic and I wanted to enjoy being proved wrong. Given the quality of the remaining TD's in this dail, I would say that the best from every party would leave you only with mostly FG ministers, and a small amount from Lab. Which is what we're going to get anyway.


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