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Pet Cats roaming -V- Pet Dogs roaming

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13

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    #62
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    doctor evil wrote: »
    Well why not? MC are a large breed of cat that are not dopey. MC are becoming more popular.

    Cats in general can be a nuisance to farmers esp if they farm chicks or fish as well as damaging silage bails.

    Many Feral families began on farms. Farmers have always wanted cats around to kill vermin.


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    #63
    Mo60
    Closed Accounts Posts: 485 ✭✭Mo60


    TooManyDogs wrote: »
    Mo60 wrote: »
    In the real world is there any other country in Europe where they have this discussion about cats roaming? Every country I have been to I see cats, that are obviously pets, wandering about.

    I wonder how nuisance cats are dealt with in all those other countries? As vermin?



    I think it would look fine!

    Cats are certainly not treated as vermin in the European countries I've been to, even though they are here.

    As for the garden it looks fine - according to you. Do you really think its likely that every cat owner would catproof their garden in this way?


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    #64
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    I am beginning to get this vision of farmers scouring their fields for rampant Maine Coon Cats - mine used to live on the sofa :rolleyes:.

    There are reasons why there aren't many examples of cats ownership being regulated in other parts of the world because it wouldn't work. It would be impossible to enforce & it would be very unpopular as the vast majority of cat owners let their cats roam. Even if an EU law was introduced Ireland would be the last country to adopt it - we still haven't signed the European Pet Animal Convention from 1987 !

    The Animal Welfare Bill should make it an offence to shoot or trap a cat. If cats need to be culled or trapped it should only be done by a licensed & supervised operator. SPCA's, Rescues & Vets could be exempt.

    Whist I applaud the efforts of those who build extensive cat runs I can equally see that some residents would object to large structures appearing in their neighbourhoods. We could end up with more objection to the cat runs than to the cats.


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    #65
    planetX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,441 ✭✭✭planetX


    Mo60 wrote: »
    In the real world is there any other country in Europe where they have this discussion about cats roaming? Every country I have been to I see cats, that are obviously pets, wandering about.

    Regarding the enclosed garden in a previous post, how would it look if every house that had a cat did the same to their garden?

    Not Europe, but I lived in a neighbourhood in the States where cats were not allowed outside- they were also supposed to be declawed. You were also not allowed to hang washing outside, have a satellite dish, have visitors park outside, and we got complaints about my 5 yr old niece and 3 yr old nephew laughing too loud when they were playing outside.
    Hope we aren't going to end up down the same anally retentive path in this country...


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    #66
    OldmanMondeo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭OldmanMondeo


    gigawatt wrote: »
    by law dogs are the responsibility of the owner, cats are not.
    dogs should not be allowed to wander as they have a stronger guarding instinct than a cat and would be more likely to attack a human being than a cat would. a cat will generally shy away if approached by a stranger, and if chased by a dog, it will usually try to escape, only standing its ground if cornered.
    the part I dont understand is why anyone cares if there are cats wandering in their neighbourhood considering that they keep vermin levels low.
    before anyone jumps to conclusions I have both cats and dogs and I adore them equally. They are different species and different rules apply to them based on their behavioral instincts.

    Sure by that reasoning we should let the snakes back in.

    Any pet should be kept under control. This idea of cats being the wondering type is bull. I know people with Cats who do not let them wander where they want. Personally I think cat owners who let their cats roam wild are selfish. I have a dog and I don't let him wander. When walked I clean any mess up. I watch out for people who may be fearful of dogs, he is a boxer and some people thing these are a dangerous bred but my lad is a big puppy wanting to play all the time, and wither cross the road or move in a manor where the other person can pass without fear.


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    #67
    planetX
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,441 ✭✭✭planetX


    How many people think it would be cruel to keep a dog in the house 24 hours a day? Maybe try it for a week and see how it goes?
    When's the last time you could drive your cat to the beach for a long run on the sand, or to the park to play ball?


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    #68
    jimmi3nuts
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭jimmi3nuts


    If you have problems with cats pizzing and crapping in your garden, do the following as the owners obviously don't give a toss about them.
    mix some antifreeze with a little cat food. 1 teaspoon is enough to do a few cats. They love the smell and taste of antifreeze, and will not come back again after having the last supper at yours!



    THIS USER HAS ALREADY BEEN BANNED-SO STOP REPORTING THIS POST-ITS DOING MY HEAD IN GETTING NOTIFICATIONS OF A REPORTED POST EVERY FEW MINUTES ESPECIALLY WHEN I DEALT WITH THIS HOURS AGO


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    #69
    Hellrazer
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,581 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    jimmi3nuts wrote: »
    If you have problems with cats pizzing and crapping in your garden, do the following as the owners obviously don't give a toss about them.
    mix some antifreeze with a little cat food. 1 teaspoon is enough to do a few cats. They love the smell and taste of antifreeze, and will not come back again after having the last supper at yours!



    Idiot--banned from the forum for good.


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    #70
    giddybootz
    Registered Users Posts: 867 ✭✭✭giddybootz


    Wow I never even really realised that cat runs existed like that. My family home always had a cat until 2 years ago. It's in a nice quiet residential area of Dublin...really small road...and half the neighbours have/had cats too. All were allowed wander into eachothers garden. It never dawned on me that people would be irritated by this.

    I have a cat now but he is indoors as we live in an apartment and he only has 3 legs. I would never have dreamed of keeping a cat indoors before....seems cruel IMO...but Tony Tripod needs to be kept in so he doesn't trap or hurt himself.

    There are some good points in this thread and if anything I see the cat runs being more for the cats safety then to stop them from annoying the neighbours.


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    #71
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    planetX wrote: »
    Not Europe, but I lived in a neighbourhood in the States where cats were not allowed outside- they were also supposed to be declawed. You were also not allowed to hang washing outside, have a satellite dish, have visitors park outside, and we got complaints about my 5 yr old niece and 3 yr old nephew laughing too loud when they were playing outside.
    Hope we aren't going to end up down the same anally retentive path in this country...

    The USA has some weird laws because they are invariable instigated on a State level rather than nationally. The same thing happens here with Local Authority bye laws.


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    #72
    Hellrazer
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,581 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    Can people stop reporting the comments by the user that I banned.

    It has already been dealt with and Im leaving the post there as a warning to anyone else that wants to suggest killing cats.


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    #73
    Traonach
    Closed Accounts Posts: 419 ✭✭Traonach


    I have a dog and a cat.
    I don't let the dog roam, but he get's plenty of walks and goes to work with me. I don't let him roam for his own safety.

    My cat is a former feral cat. I tried to train he on a leash, but he just wouldn't take to it. I'm not going to put him in a cat run or a cage as some people have suggested. He's let out around 15 minutes a day for a run into the fields, but he mostly stays around the garden. He's let out at the weekend for longer periods. He's never let out during the night or at dawn/dusk. He always wears a collar with 5 bells on it to stop him killing birds. The bells work. I would prefer to keep him indoors the whole time for his own protection, but he love his little runs.


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    #74
    Posy
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 27,527 Mod ✭✭✭✭Posy


    ppink wrote: »
    Can I ask then who is responsible for a neighbours cat coming into my garden and injuring my dogs? I am sure this will happen when they catch him.
    On two occasions, a dog got into my garden and tried to attack my cat. Both dogs had collars and were obviously not strays. It can happen the other way around too. :(
    Mo60 wrote:
    As for the garden it looks fine - according to you. Do you really think its likely that every cat owner would cat-proof their garden in this way?
    Would you not need planning permission or something for that?

    My neighbours children sometimes come into my garden to retrieve a football that's come over the wall. If they ever complained about my cat (hypothetically, he doesn't go next door) being in their garden I think I would find it a tad hypocritical!


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    #75
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Posy wrote: »
    Would you not need planning permission or something for that?

    Probably not as it is a "temporary" structure but lots of developments have their own conditions - some won't let you put up a washing line so a cat run would definitely be out. It might also depend on whether your neighbours complained.

    By the way the Electronic shock collar manufacturers are aware that cats could provide a potential market. Many are now offering cat shock collars whilst other companies offer traditional electric fencing. I would hate to see us go this way.


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    #76
    Shanao
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 919 ✭✭✭Shanao


    SillyMangoX wrote: »
    I've seen a Maine Coone take down a fully grown male hare, like actually kill it and bring it home! :eek: The same cat also took down a pine martin in the owners shed! The pine martin was in perfect health so it's not like it was an easy target, the cat just killed it! :eek::eek: The cat is an absolute beast of a thing, he's bigger than a lot of dogs I have seen and to be honest I wouldn't put it past him going for a small lamb, I would hope he wouldn't though. (He's not mine, belongs to a friend of my parents)

    Have you ever seen a normal cat hunt? All cats are capable of killing rabbits and hares, one of ours came home with a dead stoat once!! Maine coons may be big, but they're not stupid. There is a world of difference between a hare and a lamb and like all predators, they will not take the risk if there is too large a chance of them being harmed by their prey. These are not small lions and tigers, they are the domesticated version of the wild cat.


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    #77
    SillyMangoX
    Registered Users Posts: 4,002 ✭✭✭SillyMangoX


    Shanao wrote: »
    Have you ever seen a normal cat hunt? All cats are capable of killing rabbits and hares, one of ours came home with a dead stoat once!! Maine coons may be big, but they're not stupid. There is a world of difference between a hare and a lamb and like all predators, they will not take the risk if there is too large a chance of them being harmed by their prey. These are not small lions and tigers, they are the domesticated version of the wild cat.


    I've seen plenty of normal cats hunt, my 2 are forever catching mice and shrews in my garden! I know that Maine Coons aren't stupid but at the same time if something were to happen that a particularly small/ sick lamb was to be rejected / somehow separated from it's mother, I'm sure the cat would see it as easy pickings. (as would any other cat big enough to see it as pray I'm sure!)


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    #78
    djrichard
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 360 ✭✭djrichard


    Im very happy that idiot got banned for posting up on how to kill cats. I understand the moderators probably annoyance at everyone complaining about it. I also understand the thought behind leaving the post as a warning to anyone else considering posting up that sort of material.

    Im concerned that a small minority will read that and do it. I was aware of that method of poisoning, but there may be a lot of people who do not know. Would it be possible for the mods to edit the content, including the posts afterwards quoting it, so that the particular chemical used isnt available for anyone to stumble across who either hates cats, or for those that would find it funny to experiment.

    My cat is kept indoors 24/7 except when I take it out, the thought of vile people doing such a thing repulses me and it angers me that all I feel is hate towards these people.


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    #79
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,634 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    djrichard wrote: »
    .

    Im concerned that a small minority will read that and do it. I was aware of that method of poisoning, but there may be a lot of people who do not know. Would it be possible for the mods to edit the content, including the posts afterwards quoting it, so that the particular chemical used isnt available for anyone to stumble across who either hates cats, or for those that would find it funny to experiment.

    .

    It should also be emphasized that the poisoning of any species(eitheir wild or domestic) is now totally illegal apart from certain rodents. In addition all meat based poisons have been banned for all species to protect wildlife and pets.


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    #80
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Birdnuts wrote: »
    It should also be emphasized that the poisoning of any species(eitheir wild or domestic) is now totally illegal apart from certain rodents. In addition all meat based poisons have been banned for all species to protect wildlife and pets.

    However poising cases are still occurring. My Vet had one a few weeks ago so go to a Vet if you have any doubts.


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    #81
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,323 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    The poster put their finger on it ( not literally luckily!) when they mentioned the s€*%%ing ; both dogs and cats. it's an unpleasant & dislikable thing to have to do ; & unfortunately the majority of cat owners dismiss it as something that's " not their job " or with disbelief at the suggestion.
    1 cat X 1 time a day X 365...
    10 cats etc
    That's a LOT of cat s**^ being left about; on streets, in small city gardens, being walked on & into carpets/floors etc.

    ( & the same for people like my neighbour down the road who thinks he's above picking up after his two ( lovely) obese fatso dogs ..;(

    A lot of people in my area have both cats & dogs & it's lovely to see the excitement on little kids faces when they spot a cat & they can pet it & it sits there purring it's toes off.
    I watched a neighbour teaching his son yesterday how to pat a passing cat & not hurt or
    scare it ; big gulp moment!


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    #82
    frozenfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭frozenfrozen


    what's worse, cats shi.tting in others gardens or the dog shi.t left behind on path ways by dogs? at least cats attempt to bury theirs.


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    #83
    TooManyDogs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,634 ✭✭✭TooManyDogs


    frozenfrozen wrote: »
    what's worse, cats shi.tting in others gardens or the dog shi.t left behind on path ways by dogs? at least cats attempt to bury theirs.

    Both are equally unpleasant and neither should be tolerated.


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    #84
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    TooManyDogs wrote: »
    Both are equally unpleasant and neither should be tolerated.

    It has to be tolerated until you have law & enforcement to prevent it. There is a thin line between some people not tolerating it & taking out their anger on the innocent cat.


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    #85
    doctor evil
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,114 ✭✭✭doctor evil


    Discodog wrote: »
    It has to be tolerated until you have law & enforcement to prevent it. There is a thin line between some people not tolerating it & taking out their anger on the innocent cat.

    Thats a stretch to put not tolerating and cruelty side by side. A lot of your posts DD are a stretch!


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    #86
    TooManyDogs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,634 ✭✭✭TooManyDogs


    Discodog wrote: »
    It has to be tolerated until you have law & enforcement to prevent it. There is a thin line between some people not tolerating it & taking out their anger on the innocent cat.

    That's the problem though, until more cat owner's take responsibility for their cat's actions there will always be some people who will take their anger out on the innocent cat, because the faceless owner doesn't care. More cat owners have to get over the "it's in a cat's nature/it's what cat's do" and take responsibility for their pets, regardless of the minimum care the law demands. If dog owners were only to enforce the minimum requirements the law demanded for their pets the dog world would be in a much sorrier place


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    #87
    Discodog
    Registered Users Posts: 15,823 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    doctor evil wrote: »
    Thats a stretch to put not tolerating and cruelty side by side. A lot of your posts DD are a stretch!

    Well feel free to argue your point & constructively criticise mine. If people feel angry & cannot see a solution then there is always the possibility of cruelty. For example I have seen plenty of cases of homeowners throwing stones at cats. I am sure that the ISPCA & the local SPCA's could give you plenty of examples.
    TooManyDogs wrote: »
    That's the problem though.......

    I agree but I cannot see the majority of cat owners changing & I can't see any likelihood of a change in the law - except that Ferals may become protected.

    At the end of the day there is no excuse for cruelty because it can never be the fault of the animal. There might be an excuse to be cruel to the owner but not the cat :D


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    #88
    TooManyDogs
    Registered Users Posts: 1,634 ✭✭✭TooManyDogs


    Discodog wrote: »
    I agree but I cannot see the majority of cat owners changing & I can't see any likelihood of a change in the law - except that Ferals may become protected.

    At the end of the day there is no excuse for cruelty because it can never be the fault of the animal. There might be an excuse to be cruel to the owner but not the cat :D

    I totally agree with you that there's no excuse for cruelty to cats, it's something I hate. The equation will remain the same, if cat owners don't change, and the law doesn't change then why expect other peoples attitude towards roaming cats to change? It seems to me a lot of cat owners are expecting the attitudes towards cruelty to roaming/feral cats to change without them putting in any spade work themselves to help the problem. Until that happens cats will always be viewed as vermin by some people and dispatched as such.


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    #89
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,323 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    Many people have kids & small city size gardens. There are quite a lot of cats on my estate : : about 4 in my immediate area. 4 x 365 ( just once a day) x 2 (years) is a whole lode if cat s*** just left about with no thought or care at all to pick it up.
    Dogs can't ( typically!) scale high wall & get into back gardens & **** in sandpits, etc where kids play in the " security" of their own homes.

    O & my neighbour has been letting their cat out to s*** in my garden for years now: it upsets the dog who goes NUTS when the cat is outside the window scratching around in it's
    " favourite" bush. And this then upsets my other neighbour who has to listen to the dog. When I clear the leaves or have to clear the spot I then get in on myhands I have to garden with waterproof gloves on. Like many people and estates ours has managed landscaped areas with stones/pebbles laid on top. The cats*** is left lying everywhere.
    Not exactly fair on anyone.


    Im Sure people have examplesof this for dogs too but many people pick up aftertheir dogs & if they dont you can organise for them to be fined or call the digwarden on them.

    I've seen no signs for catwardens or fines for cat owners.
    Perhaps introducing this would be an easy way to make sure people started managing their pets more; thou I'd like to see a catwarden up a tree with a net trying to get a cats ID!!!


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    #90
    Kash
    Registered Users Posts: 1,065 ✭✭✭Kash


    I can't see how cat related legislation could be enforced in real life.

    Short of perhaps only allowing cats out on leads, which I would assume most cat owners would find difficult if the cat was not introduced to it at an early age.

    As the cat can quickly get out via any open window and then effectively go wherever the hell he pleases, easily scaling 8-10 ft fences, you would need to turn your home into a prison to prevent it.

    I live in the country with no nearby neighbours, so the cat and dogs can shit where they please as far as I am concerned. If I was out walking the dogs in public areas, I would always use a pooper-scooper. But if they go in fields or under bushes, then, well, that's just part and parcel of country life - along with horeshit on the roads, cowpats in the fields, birdpoo everywhere, and not to mention all the random doo-doo left by all the random beasties.

    Maybe the topic only really applies to those in built up areas.


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    #91
    Sassy58
    Registered Users Posts: 78 ✭✭Sassy58


    Themadhouse wrote: »
    6888723029_24a0f907b6.jpg




    Taken last yr. It has grown up a bit more since then and has been somewhat tidied.:)

    Ohhhhhhhhhhh I do so love the adoreable Freddy I spot in the picture he is such a handsome cuddley boy


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