Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2011/2012

18-02-2012 8:49pm

Honestly, I feel like I am f*cking done with this team.

It's one thing supporting the team through rough patches, it's quite another supporting a team that looks like it couldn't give a sh*t and a manager that won't change the tactics when it's needed.

F*ck that, life is too short.

Drexel · 18-02-2012 8:51pm

KeithAFC wrote: »

It was probably worse because this competition was more realistic for us and we played like that!

Milan for me was the worst performance ive ever seen from Arsenal. Milan werent even that good on Wednesday and scored 4.They just walked past our defense. Sunderland were great today. They defended well, closed us down well and stopped us from playin any sort of game.

I think we can both agree that we need to step up our game massively from both performances or it could well be a 7th place finish with Newcastle,Liverpool and chelsea finishing above us

Sergio · 18-02-2012 8:51pm

Im sick to death of hearing the "We built a new stadium" excuse for our disgraceful performances on the pitch in the past few years.These performances have occured time and time again in the past few yrs 4-0 up against newcastle and end up conceding 4 goals to draw level.Got destroyed up at old trafford last august 8-2.What about the carling cup final last yr and our season imploding as a result.2-0 up against wigan and beaten 3-2.same with the blackburn game this year.
When are some of you so called Arsenal supporters going to wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
We need a new manager and a complete overhaul of our current squad because the players arent good enough!

Galvasean · 18-02-2012 8:53pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Honestly, I feel like I am f*cking done with this team.

It's one thing supporting the team through rough patches, it's quite another supporting a team that looks like it couldn't give a sh*t and a manager that won't change the tactics when it's needed.

F*ck that, life is too short.

My dad said the very same thing to me after the match today.
Worst part is I can't disagree with him.

I'll continue supporting regardless of results but this is one very unlikable Arsenal side.

greendom · 18-02-2012 8:53pm

Sergio wrote: »

Im sick to death of hearing the "We built a new stadium" excuse for our disgraceful performances on the pitch in the past few years.These performances have occured time and time again in the past few yrs 4-0 up against newcastle and end up conceding 4 goals to draw level.Got destroyed up at old trafford last august 8-2.What about the carling cup final last yr and our season imploding as a result.2-0 up against wigan and beaten 3-2.same with the blackburn game this year.
When are some of you so called Arsenal supporters going to wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
We need a new manager and a complete overhaul of our current squad because the players arent good enough!

With the money he's actually spent, i doubt anyone could have done much better.

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 8:55pm

greendom wrote: »

it's very easy to throw the 7 year thing around. But 5 of those years were while the stadium was being built and paid for. Wenger did a remarkable job to keep the team in contention during that period. That excuse is beginning to wear out though now.

So many of the players are just not good enough at the moment and it comes back to that question again. Are the board not releasing funds or are they available and Arsene doesn't want to spend. If it's the latter then its time for him to leave.

I couldn't care less if we played in a meadow full of cow's s*** as long as we played with a bit of fight and passion. Wenger should concentrate on the team and not on the stadium. All fans care about is winning and playing well and we are doing very little of that.

amacachi · 18-02-2012 8:58pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Honestly, I feel like I am f*cking done with this team.

It's one thing supporting the team through rough patches, it's quite another supporting a team that looks like it couldn't give a sh*t and a manager that won't change the tactics when it's needed.

F*ck that, life is too short.

Cool.

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 8:58pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

Song disgusted me today.

He was an absolute disgrace. He did it in a relatively subtle way so some of you mightn't have noticed, but I specifically watched him closely today and in both halves, in both positions, he was woeful.

In the first half when he was playing in defensive midfield, had you not known Arsenal FC's players or lineup, you probably would have assumed we was playing as a right wing forward. His positioning left me gobsmacked. The amount of times he went walkabout was astonishing. I said before the game that I thought he should be dropped for several games and I reiterate that now with greater emphasis.

There are obvious scapegoats in this team like Walcott, but Song's as bad. His poor performances have been hidden somewhat.

When he moved to CB, he was just as bad. I know this isn't his natural position but it wasn't even stuff like marking or positioning that annoyed me when he played here. I drew this (below) out to illustrate what pissed me off about him:

Red is Song Yellow is Chamberlain

I know that's crudely drawn but listen: This is from their second goal. Song, despite starting quite a margin ahead of Oxo finished over 20 yards behind him when tracking back. I know Chamberlain is quick but if you rewatch the goal you'll see pace is not what I'm talking about.

Song jogged.

Chamberlain ran his heart out.

The obvious contrast here is that Song is a ****ing centreback while chamberlain is a right winger!!!!

N.B. Bare in mind Chamberlain stopped and fumbled about on the line for a few seconds. So when you look at the above picture, note how Song's finishing position isn't even inside the box, despite Chamberlain being held up in the box for several seconds. And Chamberlain began this from on the ground.

Despicable.

You forgot Arteta's part in the goal where he was given a little bump and went down as if hit by an exocet.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 8:59pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Another prong to that argument is that while we could splash out megabucks on players, will it actually make a difference given the way the team is set up to defend?

Now that's unfair I think!

Would you have said this a few weeks ago when we had Koscielny leading the defensive front with some wonderful performances.

Today our defence was jumbled about like crazy. First we have to play a right-footed DM at left back. He get's injured so we have to deploy our centre-back who is changing positions daily (which means its hard for him to adapt) at left back and bring on Squillaci to aid Djourou. These are our 4th and 5th choice centre-backs who might have never even partnered each other at CB afaik (i could be wrong but it probably wasn't more than once). Then we have to bring another CB off due to injury and deploy our only other option, a DM who's having a dreadful game anyway, at CB.

Our right-back and most stable player is only recently back from a horrific leg break and many on this very thread have noted how he doesn't seem to be at full fitness.

Do you really think defensive organisation was even a possibility during that?

And the wind was another factor in defensive uncertainty. (I know that sounds like a lame excuse but just think of the amount of misjudged headers today).

I'm not defending that side, because they were atrocious today. I'm simply saying that that is not the area that needs to be criticised!!

Lack of heart and ambition was a bigger problem today.

I'm asking for a little bit of reason.

Pepe LeFrits · 18-02-2012 9:00pm

Lads, stop kneejerking. Sure, our whole season has collapsed inside the space of a week, but it's only the 5th or 6th year in a row that it's happened. We just need to sort it out in summer and things will turn around.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:01pm

tayto lover wrote: »

You forgot Arteta's part in the goal where he was given a little bump and went down as if hit by an exocet.

Did I say who I blamed for the goal? I think not.

I was pointing out how the goal epitomised Song's pathetic performance today.

I suggest you read my post before replying with something like that.

Sergio · 18-02-2012 9:02pm

greendom wrote: »

With the money he's actually spent, i doubt anyone could have done much better.

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 9:05pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

Did I say who I blamed for the goal? I think not.

I was pointing out how the goal epitomised Song's pathetic performance today.

I suggest you read my post before replying with something like that.

AND my point is that Song is not the only one who is hiding.

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 9:05pm

Why can't our players track back like that James Mclean guy? And work as hard as Sunderland did? I don't understand this Arsenal team and Wenger. I can't understand why we lack such passion and just real balls. Get stuck in ffs.

greendom · 18-02-2012 9:05pm

Sergio wrote: »

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

i agree with that actually. Why he doesn't play with 2 midfielders with strong defensive aspects to their game like he used to with Petit and Vieira is beyond me. The defenders in the main aren't that bad (well there are some exceptions of course); it's just that they get very little protection in front of them

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:07pm

Sergio wrote: »

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

Again, misdirected criticism in my opinion.

He's built a very solid defence in:
Sagna; Mertesacker (Vermaelen); Koscielny; Santos

It's been disrupted massively by injuries.

If you're going to criticise, do so in the needed areas. As I've said, defensive problems weren't the cause of our downfall today. Lack of heart and bottle, and lack of attacking prowess cost us more.

Radharc na Sleibhte · 18-02-2012 9:07pm

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Lads, stop kneejerking. Sure, our whole season has collapsed inside the space of a week, but it's only the 5th or 6th year in a row that it's happened. We just need to sort it out in summer and things will turn around.

yeah, give it one more year

(lather, rinse, REPEAT)

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:08pm

tayto lover wrote: »

AND my point is that Song is not the only one who is hiding.

I agree wholeheartedly.

Name me an Arsenal player today who played better than Arteta.

amacachi · 18-02-2012 9:10pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly.

Name me an Arsenal player today who played better than Arteta.

Ox.

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:11pm

amacachi wrote: »

Ox.

The expected answer but I don't think so.

He was kept under wraps today. Couldn't do anything because of how well Sunderland defended.

The only time when he looked like doing anything was just after we'd gone 2 down, but by that time the game was over. Too little, too late.

Fuzzy_Dunlop · 18-02-2012 9:11pm

Sergio wrote: »

There you go again with the same old excuses.Its absolute bulls**t in my opinion.There have been defensive frailties in this team for a very long time going back to the famous keown/adams era.Its basic stuff at times that have cost us massively at crucial times of the season like learning to clear our lines and not getting caught on the break time and time again.These qualities have nothing to do with money or stadiums but bad coaching!

Obviously the money doesn't come into it when talking about individual performances and errors. However when you look at the overall performance of the team over the last few years, we have the 4th highest wage bill and consistently finish about 4th in the league and make the CL knockouts every season. We're performing exactly as you might expect given the amount we spend in wages (even neglecting how much less our actual transfer spending is). It's obviously not as good as we might hope but it's not exactly the great disaster that a lot of people would have you believe.

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 9:12pm

No one is putting in any tackles. No communication. There is no one talking on the pitch FFS. Arsenal FC and not one player is communicating.

Sergio · 18-02-2012 9:12pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

Again, misdirected criticism in my opinion.

He's built a very solid defence in:
Sagna; Mertesacker (Vermaelen); Koscielny; Santos

It's been disrupted massively by injuries.

If you're going to criticise, do so in the needed areas. As I've said, defensive problems weren't the cause of our downfall today. Lack of heart and bottle, and lack of attacking prowess cost us more.

Have to disagree.Our defense is still the main cause of our down fall.Mertesacker has been very poor at times,vermaelen has been unlucky with injuries but santos is far from proven.I know gibbs has been injured too and sagna also but overall we have been leaking far too many goals,Djourou was a disgace again today and was lucky to be still on the pitch after the 2 footed tackle.He also was the cause of their first goal.Koscielny has been our best player all season consistently strong and not afraid to get stuck in.

cson · 18-02-2012 9:13pm

Our usual Feb/Mar collapse in all competitions seems to be happening rather earlier in the season as the years go by.

I certainly won't begrudge RVP his move in the summer, a player of his level deserves to be winning trophies and I don't think we're going to be doing that for some time.

Disenchanting.

MagicMarker · 18-02-2012 9:14pm

Wenger and Arsenal are like a couple who have been in a long term relationship since their teens that's grown stale, they both know it's over but are too afraid to admit it to each other.

Once they go their separate ways they'll both wonder why the fúck they didn't do it sooner!!

tayto lover · 18-02-2012 9:14pm

ImpossibleDuck wrote: »

I agree wholeheartedly.

Name me an Arsenal player today who played better than Arteta.

My only problem with Arteta is that he is too slow in delivering the final pass into the strikers and he usually holds it up too long allowing defenders to get back. Cesc was brilliant at giving the early defence-splitting ball. He was weak for their 2nd goal but played well enough otherwise. Nobody played well today imo apart from little Chamberlain who never gave in. He is still a bit raw though.

emergingstar · 18-02-2012 9:17pm

cson wrote: »

Our usual Feb/Mar collapse in all competitions seems to be happening rather earlier in the season as the years go by.

I certainly won't begrudge RVP his move in the summer, a player of his level deserves to be winning trophies and I don't think we're going to be doing that for some time.

Disenchanting.

Keep him for his final year, can't sell again just take the hit on the transfer fee

KeithAFC · 18-02-2012 9:19pm

A pretty big away following yet again and the players just don't care. What was it, 5 thousand went to AC Milan and something like 4 thousand people to this game? Going all the way up to Sunderland from London and to get such a sad performance and work ethic from the players is a disgrace.

cson · 18-02-2012 9:20pm

Szczesny, Sagna, Koscielny, Vermaelen, Arteta, Song, Chamberlain and RVP are the only players out of the matchday squad today I would want to be still there come August. It may be a little quick to give up on Ramsey but I don't think he's good enough to be starting for a side with Champions League pretensions [and after the last week or so, pretensions are all they are].

I'm starting to believe that our injury situation is less to do with being unlucky and more to do with what goes on in training and conditioning.

We've lost key players for every season as long as I can remember for huge amounts of time. RVP, Fabregas, Wilshere, Vermaelen, Rosicky [when he was useful] and the desperately unlucky [cos tbf thats what they were] injuries to Eduardo and Ramsey [who looked a much better prospect at that time than he does now].

Kolo Toure got malaria one season. I mean ffs, what professional footballer gets malaria?!

ImpossibleDuck · 18-02-2012 9:22pm

Sergio wrote: »

Have to disagree.Our defense is still the main cause of our down fall.Mertesacker has been very poor at times,vermaelen has been unlucky with injuries but santos is far from proven.I know gibbs has been injured too and sagna also but overall we have been leaking far too many goals,Djourou was a disgace again today and was lucky to be still on the pitch after the 2 footed tackle.He also was the cause of their first goal.Koscielny has been our best player all season consistently strong and not afraid to get stuck in.

I struggle to see how you can say that. If this had been last season I'd agree. We saw against Milan how important Mertesacker is, because Vermaelen's too similar to Kos. Santos is not proven but he'd be a hell of a lot better than Vermaelen playing there!

Yes, Djourou is awful, but that's exactly my point!! There isn't a hope in hell he'd be on the pitch if we weren't so hampered by injuries!

tayto lover wrote: »

My only problem with Arteta is that he is too slow in delivering the final pass into the strikers and he usually holds it up too long allowing defenders to get back. Cesc was brilliant at giving the early defence-splitting ball. He was weak for their 2nd goal but played well enough otherwise. Nobody played well today imo apart from little Chamberlain who never gave in. He is still a bit raw though.

I could see why you'd say that but I don't think Arteta's that kind of player. He wasn't bought to replace Cesc, he's not the same type of player as Cesc.

I think he's overlooked by too many Arsenal fans. Often he gets the ball, takes two or three striding touches forward and plays a clean, fast ball forward. In stark contrast we have Ramsey, who'll pick the ball up, take a touch left, take a touch right, look behind him, and eventually play a 5-yard pass sidewards.

I know it's not exactly fair to heap the creative burden on him, but he's not delivering in the creative sense.

I'm not saying I know more than you, or anything of the sort, but during the next game or two watch Arteta and look at the amount on constructive forward balls he plays compared to Song, Ramsey, Rosicky or whoever is playing with him in the centre.

Arsenal Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2011/2012

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