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Shooting Forum - Firearms licencing information


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Sig/Gsg 1911

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    #32
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    Here's a update : my mate also put in for one of the gsg1911 and guess what it was granted unrestricted today in the post but no sooner has he got it, he gets a phone call to say it now is revoked. It seems that the chef super stepped in over the super that signed it off... The revoke is in the post... Nuts


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    #33
    rowa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,296 ✭✭✭rowa


    Tackleberry. wrote: »
    Here's a update : my mate also put in for one of the gsg1911 and guess what it was granted unrestricted today in the post but no sooner has he got it, he gets a phone call to say it now is revoked. It seems that the chef super stepped in over the super that signed it off... The revoke is in the post... Nuts

    He has a good case in the district court there, what grounds are given for the revoking of the licence ? Its not a restricted firearm if its restricted to 5 shots. I didn't think a super could be overruled by a chief super, under the law the super is the person designated to make the decision if its a non-restricted firearm. Does that mean to get a licence in your district you have to get two thumbs up ? One from the super and another from the chief super ?


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    #34
    Witcher
    Registered Users Posts: 14,436 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Some supers must have won their post in a raffle..haven't a clue:pac:


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    #35
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    rowa wrote: »
    He has a good case in the district court there, what grounds are given for the revoking of the licence ? Its not a restricted firearm if its restricted to 5 shots. I didn't think a super could be overruled by a chief super, under the law the super is the person designated to make the decision if its a non-restricted firearm. Does that mean to get a licence in your district you have to get two thumbs up ? One from the super and another from the chief super ?


    I guess because they can't decide between themselves whether it is or is it not restricted. Therefore can't decide what rank needs to make the call.


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    #36
    juice1304
    Registered Users Posts: 1,805 ✭✭✭juice1304


    I would ring the FPU as said before they are there for things of this very nature and they are pure gents and quite understanding. :) funny phone number though 01 6661911:confused::P


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    #37
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,055 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    That's the sort of mess that needs to go to the District Court, it sadly sounds like :(
    There's precedent for licencing GSG's; but if the case is lost, there'll be a court decision that would mean that a lot of people's licences will become void...


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    #38
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    juice1304 wrote: »
    I would ring the FPU as said before they are there for things of this very nature and they are pure gents and quite understanding. :) funny phone number though 01 6661911:confused::P

    Thats on page 2 of this thread. (FPU reply)


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    #39
    Rovi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,570 ✭✭✭Rovi


    At the very least, this person needs to see if the 'Revoked' bit can be expunged from the record.
    As it stands now, and even if they throw their hat at this particular firearm and try for a different one or forget about it entirely, they must now tick the 'Yes' box to the "Have you ever had a firearm certificate revoked?" question in the Previous History section of the application form.
    This could be like a bad smell following them around for the rest of their shooting life :(


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    #40
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users Posts: 14,950 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Not quite,the revoked recinded matter becomes irrevelant after think 12 years without any further incidents.Says so on the aplication forms,or did at least.

    Sounds again like another clusterFK..For a revockation there has to be a good reason,especially after just granting it.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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    #41
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,532 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Sorry to hear you were refused Tackleberry.

    Although I do not think that this firearm should require a restricted license I am not surprised that some of the PTB have decided that it should.

    Not so long ago I posted "Due to the look of the GSG some may argue that it should require a restricted license".


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    #42
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users Posts: 14,950 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Sparks wrote: »
    That's the sort of mess that needs to go to the District Court, it sadly sounds like :(
    There's precedent for licencing GSG's; but if the case is lost, there'll be a court decision that would mean that a lot of people's licences will become void...

    However a DC isnt a court of record..IOW it is on a case by case judgement of a district justice.What one judgement in Cork mightnt hold in Kanturk.They can say there is a decision by a judge somplace on a simmilar case,but a DJ isnt bound to follow it.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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    #43
    rowa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,296 ✭✭✭rowa


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    However a DC isnt a court of record..IOW it is on a case by case judgement of a district justice.What one judgement in Cork mightnt hold in Kanturk.They can say there is a decision by a judge somplace on a simmilar case,but a DJ isnt bound to follow it.

    Its about time that the gardai simply give a security and background check on the applicant and the rest of the application is handled by a central all ireland office thats free of opinions and applys the law fairly.
    Its a postcode lottery and an inefficient mess at the moment.


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    #44
    dax121
    Registered Users Posts: 463 ✭✭dax121


    rowa wrote: »
    Its about time that the gardai simply give a security and background check on the applicant and the rest of the application is handled by a central all ireland office thats free of opinions and applys the law fairly.
    Its a postcode lottery and an inefficient mess at the moment.
    +1 on that. imagine someone makeing a decision on ur application where their personal views dont come into play. just you meet all the requiremants you get your firearm. oh maybe one day :rolleyes:


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    #45
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users Posts: 14,950 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    SOP in Europe. I remember going to the equivelency of the county council office in Germany to get somthing changed on my paperwork.

    Dealt with by a polite German civil servent and got chatting to him,quite unusual in itself,but maybe my Irish charm worked on him:p ,who stated quite clearly that he was anti gun.

    BUT as he said"That is my own personal opinion.Were it found out that because of my belifs I was causing trouble,I would be simply out of work in the civil service!"

    Blessed be the German beauracrat!!:pac: Somone who does their job efficently and at quarter the price of his Irish counter part.If all the correct boxes are ticked and the correct revelant paperwork is supplied.Sign off and stamp it,job done.After that it is somone elses problem.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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    #46
    newby.204
    Registered Users Posts: 1,335 ✭✭✭newby.204


    rowa wrote: »
    There used to be a clause in the commisioners guidelines that stated a .22 pistol could be considered for a non restricted licence if it was restricted to 5 rounds and had a barrel length of over 112mm (i think). I checked last night and this paragraph has been deleted, so it appears moves are afoot to restrict licenceable pistol to whats on the list alone.
    This was never the intention or reason behind the list so i am told, but once again the gardai have bent the rules to suit themselves.

    http://garda.ie/Documents/User/SI%20337%202009%20Firearms%20%28Restricted%20Firearms%20and%20Ammuntion%29%20%28Amendment%29%20Order%202009.pdf

    5. Article 4(2) of the Principal Order is amended—
    (a) in subparagraph (d) by the deletion of the word “rim-fire”, and
    (b) by the substitution of the following subparagraph for subparagraph
    (e)—
    “(e) the following short firearms designed for use in connection
    with competitions governed by International Olympic Committee regulations:
    (i) air-operated firearms of 4.5 millimetres (.177 inch)
    calibre;
    (ii) single shot firearms using 0.22 inch long rifle rim fire
    percussion ammunition;
    (iii) other firearms using 0.22 inch long rifle rim fire percussion ammunition provided that the maximum magazine capacity of such a firearm does not exceed five
    rounds and that the barrel length of the firearm is
    greater than 10 cm.”.


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    #47
    cw67irl
    Registered Users Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭cw67irl


    I was talking to a dealer ho imports these today and while the Gsg 1911 isnt on the old paper lst it is on the Garda Pulse system as an approved unrestricted 22 pistol, Your dealer should be able to confirm this with the Gardai for you!


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    #48
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    Tis been a long time 10 times in court and 5 actual days sitting but the final court date sat during the week and now waitng on the final result as the Judge will make his deccission later in early Sept.
    Kinda expecting another Lucy report..well hopefull of it.

    Love to tell everyone how it went but we willl have to wait till Sept, all i will say is William Eagn pulled a rabbit out of his hat that will haunt Garda Brooks for a long time.. looking forward to this judement.


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    #49
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    Sparks wrote: »
    That's the sort of mess that needs to go to the District Court, it sadly sounds like :(
    There's precedent for licencing GSG's; but if the case is lost, there'll be a court decision that would mean that a lot of people's licences will become void...

    Hopefully tis ends tomorrow..
    Apparently the State withness is being investigated by Gsoc because of his evidence, he was the only state witness so it has to go in our favour. Nargc played a big part in bringing this to light with the Commissioner and Dept of Justice
    Fingers crossed tomorrow is a good day.


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    #50
    Wadi14
    Registered Users Posts: 877 ✭✭✭Wadi14


    I have just read all the posts on this thread from start to finish. wow its more gripping than an episode of Love Hate at this stage. Good luck tomorrow Tackleberry . I have an application gone in for a Hammerli Xesse so waiting myself to see how it pans out.


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    #51
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    Mate told me that William Eagn has a date got this month (Oct) also for the High court challenge. Best of luck to all.


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    #52
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users Posts: 14,950 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Go Get I'm!!:cool:
    Friday week Limerick DC for the modular sporting rifle and three other lads for handguns.This is the rematch that I predicted three years ago when they were granted initially to everyone here in Limerick.:mad:
    Break a leg to anyone in the DC and HC this month.:pac:

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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    #53
    mrbrianj
    Registered Users Posts: 383 ✭✭mrbrianj


    Just a quick question lads,

    Who foots the bill for the court cases and solicitor work?


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    #54
    LIFFY FISHING
    Registered Users Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭LIFFY FISHING


    Anyone I know who was in court so far paid their own legal fees.


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    #55
    Sparks
    Registered Users Posts: 40,055 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Mod Note:
    Guys, you all know this but just for the new folks - discussing a sub judice case is grounds for a contempt of court hearing (see here for more details) so until the judgement is in, the content of the case is off-limits here (that the case is happening isn't, that's just public domain information that's up on courts.ie amongst other places).

    That said, good luck all and I think we're all waiting on the outcome of this one with baited breath...


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    #56
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    It would seem we are being put on the long finger..after taking another day off work expecting a judgement it would seem the state saving face is key, meetings apparently have been taking place behind closed doors our judge told us, with who I don't know but not with our council as he was surprised to here this info..we where given a promised date in early Nov so that's something..
    Oh and the judge apologised for the hole misunderstanding/delay etc..
    He is a great judge for this case but 14 days and nearly 2yrs of this is withering.
    My centre fire refusal is starting mid Oct in the same court hope he is the Judge.


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    #57
    Varmint Shooter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 60 ✭✭Varmint Shooter


    You lads are getting some run around :(

    Meetings behind closed doors with unknown participants & agendas sure that's why we're in this mess !!!!!!!


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    #58
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users Posts: 14,950 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    Me speculates the whole thing is being long fingerd until they see what befalls them with the test cases in the high court in Oct so there is precedent then for the DC cases.And yes there have been Byzanthine and Machevellian plots afoot behind the scenes all Summer again.:( Fortuneatly looking to our benefit.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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    #59
    Tackleberry.
    Registered Users Posts: 1,243 ✭✭✭Tackleberry.


    Grizzly 45 wrote: »
    Me speculates the whole thing is being long fingerd until they see what befalls them with the test cases in the high court in Oct so there is precedent then for the DC cases.And yes there have been Byzanthine and Machevellian plots afoot behind the scenes all Summer again.:( Fortuneatly looking to our benefit.

    I'd be hoping that the high court date in October is the only sitting before our date and that noting will get decided at it.. also there is no fixing what happened at our hearing, I reckon they are big time worried about the fall out that may happen from other criminal/firearm cases that may well appeal any decision where this state wittiness ever gave his expert evidence...
    Im going to let this thread sit till Nov.. I'll say no more.


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    #60
    dc99
    Registered Users Posts: 371 ✭✭dc99


    Hi,

    Firstly, I heard about that rabbit that Mr Egan pulled out of the hat (more like launched an exocet....... ). Brilliant court work I must say.

    I haven't heard anything about HC this month and one of the cases in, is mine (or it is part of the whole thing - may not be a sample case).

    I wonder if all the excitement we had earlier in the year that got us all wound up was in anticipation (or should I say apprehension), by AGS, of the current goings on?
    Every thing looks to be gaining momentum in favour of us the target/sports shooters?
    Or will it end up being a busted flush?


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    #61
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users Posts: 14,950 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    I got the feeling that the cases on Friday in Limerick ,in relation to .22 uppers and pistols was a test flight to see how they would do in the HC. If that was the case ,they flew very well.:)

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



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