M50 thread

Sam Russell · 11-11-2015 11:51pm

Nichard Dixon wrote: »

In France they have solid lines in the vicinity of exits, these would give a clear basis for prosecution. if you are in lane 2 near the exit then you have to stay there.

The road marking change seems a wise one, especially if there is small amount of tarmac added on the left.

That, together with the new lane making for on ramps would certainly help.

Irish Steve · 12-11-2015 1:03am

In the States, they go further, and have solid barriers in the vicinity of some junctions, wrong side of the barrier, you go to the next junction, works very well at stopping lane jumpers on the exit and the entry side.

I'd have no argument if Lanes 2 & 3 of the M50 were blocked from before Blanchardstown to after Valleymount, so Lanes 2 & 3 were only for "long distance" traffic on that section.

Carawaystick · 12-11-2015 5:48pm

Nichard Dixon wrote: »

In France they have solid lines in the vicinity of exits, these would give a clear basis for prosecution. if you are in lane 2 near the exit then you have to stay there.

The road marking change seems a wise one, especially if there is small amount of tarmac added on the left.

Where is the solid line?

Alun · 12-11-2015 6:00pm

Nichard Dixon wrote: »

In France they have solid lines in the vicinity of exits, these would give a clear basis for prosecution. if you are in lane 2 near the exit then you have to stay there.

I've not seen actual solid lines, but I do remember seeing lines like these in those situations ...

https://www.google.ie/maps/@50.9372324,1.9346899,210m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en

Sam Russell · 12-11-2015 6:56pm

They use a dotted line similar to the RSA long dotted line (where the white is more than the gap) as opposed to the dotted white line where the white is shorter than the gap. [If I have explained it properly]. This goes to separate the first lane from the faster lanes - works best in three lane motorways.

I think a solid white line would work. This is used just as the M50 traffic joins the N4 traffic before Liffey Valley turn off.

hognef · 12-11-2015 10:12pm

Sam Russell wrote: »

They use a dotted line similar to the RSA long dotted line (where the white is more than the gap) as opposed to the dotted white line where the white is shorter than the gap. [If I have explained it properly]. This goes to separate the first lane from the faster lanes - works best in three lane motorways.

I think a solid white line would work. This is used just as the M50 traffic joins the N4 traffic before Liffey Valley turn off.

If I'm not mistaken, France is similar to most European countries in using an unbroken line to indicate 'no overtaking / do not cross the line', with a long line / small gap being more of a warning to take special care when overtaking/ crossing.

Carawaystick · 13-11-2015 10:22am

heres a 3 lame example, its a different kind of broken white line.

Considering the amount of cars/lorries who swing across hatched markings, here, different line styles are probably not going to make much difference.

celticbest · 13-11-2015 10:24am

Junction 3 on the M50 SB has a solid white line, doesn't really work as most people don't obey it and just cross it anyway.

https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.4104523,-6.2307758,3a,75y,270.8h,80.01t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s5eAvV0KUyN8PazCdruB6mg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

As I said before the only way to stop people crossing Hatch Markings or Solid whit lines like is to have Bollards in place which physically stop people being able to cross...

sgarvan · 16-11-2015 2:04pm

J6 SB has been realigned and this morning the difference was noticeable but not as much as it could be. There wasn't a come to standstill there today, the cars on the mainline moved slowly.

Cars are still coming down the slip road and slowing down/breaking or stopping to enter the mainline. Bollards were placed at the edge of the join but possibly could be placed out further.

Hopefully this is just teething problems with the new layout and will improve.

sgarvan · 17-11-2015 11:56am

Mainline up to J6 SB went backwards this morning. Back to a sea of red break lights. I counted 10 cars that drove down the off ramp with indicators on and stopped at the end and insisted on pulling out straight away. I beleive there is a flashing sign highlighting a new layout.

17-11-2015 7:44pm

sgarvan wrote: »

Mainline up to J6 SB went backwards this morning. Back to a sea of red break lights. I counted 10 cars that drove down the off ramp with indicators on and stopped at the end and insisted on pulling out straight away. I beleive there is a flashing sign highlighting a new layout.

Dipsticks! Irish drivers tend to ignore signs, there should be a garda traffic car there to wave them on

Alun · 17-11-2015 7:46pm

There is a flashing sign saying "new road layout" but no hint of what those changes are, and the old lane direction sign is still there.

Idbatterim · 17-11-2015 7:51pm

was on this joke today after arriving into the airport at 7:30am, i live in Ballinteer and will be driving through town in future, what a total and utter joke!

a proper north south rail link is desperately needed, I think it would take quite a lot of pressure off the m50...

One commuter on the Commuting forum said that when Luas cross city is up and running, he will be taking Dart from one of the coastal suburbs, to tara street, walk to luas and then take it to Sandyford, instead of taking the car. Fingers crossed lots of people go for that option, it has to be better than sitting in the "upgraded" car park...

17-11-2015 8:01pm

Alun wrote: »

There is a flashing sign saying "new road layout" but no hint of what those changes are, and the old lane direction sign is still there.

OK, I can forgive drivers if the morons haven't changed the signs.
A "stay Left" message would help.

Alkers · 17-11-2015 8:54pm

As far as I'm aware the signs have been updated to reflect the new layout?

Alun · 17-11-2015 9:39pm

Simona1986 wrote: »

As far as I'm aware the signs have been updated to reflect the new layout?

They weren't when I was there at the end of last week. Could have changed by now, of course.

sgarvan · 17-11-2015 11:01pm

Flashing sign say New Road Layout Ahead and permanent signs have been updated.

Bright orange flashing sign should be enough to highlight the change. The rest comes with driver awareness which we as a nation don't have unless it is dashing to the outside lane!

BoatMad · 23-11-2015 2:20pm

I see variable speed limits legislation is being proposed for the M50

celticbest · 23-11-2015 2:27pm

BoatMad wrote: »

I see variable speed limits legislation is being proposed for the M50

Gantries are already in place, not sure how much work is required to add the signage and connect it the NTA management centre.

sgarvan · 23-11-2015 3:02pm

BoatMad wrote: »

I see variable speed limits legislation is being proposed for the M50

Good stuff and about time. Will only work if variable speed cameras are added so you are penailised for breaking speed limit.

m0nsterie · 03-12-2015 12:33pm

marno21 wrote: »

The line markings for the merges at the N3/M50 interchange for the N3/M50 north/southbound and the Airport interchange on the M1 southbound are being amended on a trial basis from:

to

The airport roundabout to M1 southbound line marking changes are active since this morning. Let's hope it makes a difference.

BoatMad · 03-12-2015 12:45pm

sgarvan wrote: »

Good stuff and about time. Will only work if variable speed cameras are added so you are penailised for breaking speed limit.

Don't think it will make any significant change. The main issue on the m50 is slow speed, ie drivers that use the middle lane or even the outer lane as an on ramp to try and skip queuing at exits coupled with the ridiculous 4 junctions , ( firhouse, Tallaght, ballymount , naas ) almost on top of one another.

Close and or amalgamate firhouse, Tallaght, Ballymount , segregate off ramps lead ups , and you'd go along way to improving m50 flow.

Deedsie · 03-12-2015 3:13pm

A lot of people advocate an outer ring road from the M50. Would a ring road joining the M50, (south of Rathfarnham Golf Club) N81, N7, M4, M3, M2 and M1 outside the Dublin county boundary from the N7 resolve the issue or would that just move the congestion out from the M50.

I think the only real solution in Dublin will be large scale public transport

BoatMad · 03-12-2015 3:27pm

I think the only real solution in Dublin will be large scale public transport

i see, like " big" busses

Irish Steve · 03-12-2015 8:37pm

Deedsie wrote: »

A lot of people advocate an outer ring road from the M50. Would a ring road joining the M50, (south of Rathfarnham Golf Club) N81, N7, M4, M3, M2 and M1 outside the Dublin county boundary from the N7 resolve the issue or would that just move the congestion out from the M50.

I think the only real solution in Dublin will be large scale public transport

IF a new motorway outside the M50 was to be built, the most critical aspect would be that ALL junctions would have to be proper full free flow junctions with no traffic lights, or 30 Kph loops that make it impossible to merge safely at lane speeds, regardless of the direction of travel, which is one of the major limitations of the M50 at present. The suggestions above also would do nothing to resolve the shambles at the junction of the M50 and M11, Travelling to Rosslare a couple of weeks ago on a dry Tuesday evening we were delayed by 20 minutes at that merge, and this suggestion would do nothing to solve the problems there.

Before any new public transport plans are put in place, an in depth survey of where people are coming from and going to is required, as I don't think there has been a proper in depth survey of what's required, and an updated public transport system to serve central Dublin is not likely to be the answer, given the number of large trading estates and office complexes that are outside the M50 ring, and employ significant numbers of people.

The airport is another pressure point, both in terms of how it's serviced, and the numbers of people that work there, and some of them require access at seriously unsocial hours that at present are not served at all by public transport.

One of the issues of putting in an outer motorway would be what happens in relation to the M50 bridge toll, the outer motorway will also have to cross the Liffey at some point, so there will have to be some sort of change to deal with the disparity. Another issue will be that using an outer motorway will involve significantly longer distances to get from (say) Bray to Swords, that may discourage people from using the outer orbital route.

The critical requirement will be to keep the politicians out of the design and routing discussions, and to ensure that the design and structure is not compromised by short sighted gombeens that have no idea on what's involved, or what the costs to the users of a bad design will be.

I'm not even sure that the NRA are really the right people to design some of the roads, when I look at the manners in which they compromised some of the N2 junction designs, I'm forced to the conclusion that the NRA are not always listening to local users around the areas that they are designing for. That's not encouraging, especially given that no matter how bad the mistakes or errors are, there's never any accountability or responsibility within the state and semi state services that make the mistakes in the first place.

The bottom line for the Dublin area is that the infrastructure of the Greater Dublin area has been massively neglected for a very long time, and that's now causing massive problems due to bad design, bad planning and inappropriate cost reductions that are now all combining to produce a perfect storm for the commuters that have very little choice over where they work, or live, and due to those same planning issues, those places are not closely located.

It would help if Dublin could make decisions for the Dublin area, but there are too many parish pump influences that are causing huge issues to the people and businesses that are trying to live and work in the area.

Probably the wrong thread to say this, but what's needed is a fundamental change at the very core of the way that our politics, and our state services operate, to make them responsive and accountable to the people. As things are now, too much of what is done "for us" is not being done with anything like the care or concern for those people that are affected by what happens in their areas.

Maybe, perhaps, with a lot of luck and some significant changes to the way things are done, we might see an improvement in the way that things are done, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

dubred · 04-12-2015 10:59am

Irish Steve wrote: »

IF a new motorway outside the M50 was to be built, the most critical aspect would be that ALL junctions would have to be proper full free flow junctions with no traffic lights, or 30 Kph loops that make it impossible to merge safely at lane speeds, regardless of the direction of travel, which is one of the major limitations of the M50 at present.
...
It would help if Dublin could make decisions for the Dublin area, but there are too many parish pump influences that are causing huge issues to the people and businesses that are trying to live and work in the area.
...

Case in point:

I was recently discussing the new traffic lights that have been installed on Ballinteer Road at the entrance to Delbrook Manor, having an affect on traffic exiting the M50 at J13 SB, the other person said 'that's where <a politician> lives'. Whether true or not it seems a strange place to put extra traffic lights, I have rarely seen queues trying to get out of this estate, why not at one of the other estates that exit onto this road, maybe they will be next if they are home to a politician that wants to get ahead of other road users!

These lights have been operating for a couple of weeks and seem to be on an automatic schedule, possibly in addition to pedestrian activation, so they go red when there is no traffic coming out of the estate.

Now, within about half a mile, we have 2 roundabouts and 3 (+1 after Wesley roundabout) sets of traffic lights impeding egress from the M50.

Most other junctions suffer from a similar setup of roundabouts/traffic light combos, but this development doesn't give me any confidence that there is any joined up thinking or will to deal with the M50 problems.

Jayuu · 07-12-2015 1:21am

What I'd like somebody to investigate is why Friday on the M50 Southbound seems so different to most other days in terms of traffic tailback. I use the M50 from the R139 aiming for the Blanchardstown exit every day. Most days I decide to come off at the Finglas exit and use the M2-M3 link because the tailback is generally back well before the Finglas exit. Yet unless there is some sort of accident or unusual circumstance on Friday traffic is generally clear until Blanchardstown.

I'd love to see some statistics on this to work out whether this is just my perception or whether the volume is lower on Friday because I don't really understand why this is. I would have though that if you had a need to use the M50 on a daily basis you would need to use it as much on Friday as you do on any other day of the week.

Am I alone in this belief or do other users of the M50 notice this?

07-12-2015 7:24am

Poets day! (piss off early tomorrow's Saturday)
Some people leaving work earlier, so the "rush hour" is extended, meaning fewer vehicles on the road at the same time.

Redsoxfan · 07-12-2015 10:32pm

In my experience, Friday morning tends to be easier. Friday evening tends to be worse, as was said, gets busier earlier.

But nowadays, Friday morning seems like any other morning. ****e.

Bummer1234 · 08-12-2015 4:15pm

Jayuu wrote: »

I'd love to see some statistics on this to work out whether this is just my perception or whether the volume is lower on Friday because I don't really understand why this is. I would have though that if you had a need to use the M50 on a daily basis you would need to use it as much on Friday as you do on any other day of the week.

Here is the NRA traffic counter for the roads around the country...Have fun!

Redsoxfan wrote: »

In my experience, Friday morning tends to be easier. Friday evening tends to be worse, as was said, gets busier earlier.

But nowadays, Friday morning seems like any other morning. ****e.

100% With Redsoxfan here, Friday morning can be in any sort of shape, Accident dependent really...Friday Eve would be busier all over the country with people heading home from work and leaving Dublin to there "Home-home" in some cases.

M50 thread

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