Sinn Féin-A responsible thread for adults.

Hannibal · 06-06-2012 10:58am

purplepanda wrote: »

SF becoming a government in a democratic state that they refused to acknowledge until recently, boycotted & called a British "puppet" for decades while their "military" wing carried out murder & mayhem, a cartel stil run from one side of the border in effect.

Then SF party supporters call for Irish passport holders in Northern Ireland to be given the vote whilst their neighbours are excluded ? What about parity of esteem? :rolleyes: More like a proposal to increase their vote! :rolleyes:

They appear to be nothing but opportunists & chancers, perhaps if they became the ruling government in Northern Ireland & proved their credientials across the whole community they would deserve a chance but not until then.

As for their loony left polices LOL

You do know that everyone born in the North is entitled to an Irish passport under the GFA? It's about including people from the North in as much as possible plus SF have proposals for allowing seats and full speaking rights to all elected MP's from the North.

More and more young protestants are taking Irish passports in the North as it allows them cheaper education across in England and Scotland.

JustinDee · 06-06-2012 11:05am

Dotsey wrote: »

More and more young protestants are taking Irish passports in the North as it allows them cheaper education across in England and Scotland.

???
How exactly?

Richard · 06-06-2012 11:49am

JustinDee wrote: »

???
How exactly?

In Scotland, not England.

In Scotland, Scottish students don't pay fees, but those from England, Wales and Northern Ireland do. Under EU law, other EU students must be treated the same as local Scottish students. There is a loophole, however, that those students from elsewhere in the UK are entitled to free tuition in Scotland if they have a (non-British) EU passport.

So some NI students are getting Irish passports to qualify. It's a loophole, however, not some awakening of latent Irish nationalism.

In terms of Sinn Fein, I will certainly never vote for them, but it is much better that they have made the transition to democratic politics and that people vote for them, rather than they feel marginalised and go back to "war".

COYW · 06-06-2012 11:49am

Dotsey wrote: »

They are already in government in the north and if current trends continue with the slim chance of this present government being re-elected there is a strong possibility that SF could be a partner in govnerment here within the next few years.

Do you really believe that? SF are making gains in lower working class areas but they need to capture votes from the middle classes, if they want to move to the next level in politics down here. Those in the middle classes will not buy into the tabloid style brand of politics promoted by SF at the moment. The likes of that stunt they pulled that day before the referendum, does absolutely nothing positive for the perception of the party in the eyes of middle and upper class people.

Following on from that, the established parties will not go into power with SF, as is. It would alienate a sector of their core vote. No mainstream party is going to risk that.

Laminations · 06-06-2012 11:51am

Dotsey wrote: »

You do know that everyone born in the North is entitled to an Irish passport under the GFA? It's about including people from the North in as much as possible plus SF have proposals for allowing seats and full speaking rights to all elected MP's from the North.

More and more young protestants are taking Irish passports in the North as it allows them cheaper education across in England and Scotland.

Giving unionists Irish passports in an attempt to include them in Irish politics will probably work as well as republicans inclusion in British politics- where they refuse to take their seats at Westminster. Hocking them Irish passports will not dilute their sense of britishness or their will to stay in the union.

Your proposal is daft and a plain attempt to boost SFs vote by allowing republicans in the north vote. Why not all Irish passport holders in the whole of Britain rather than this one part? Why not smerican holders of Irish passports? You vote in the country that the policies will effect and where the budget is spent. Northern Ireland's policies and budget is dictated by Westminster and Stormont. Don't try and engage in the biggest case of gerrymandering ever

Laminations · 06-06-2012 12:00pm

celtictiger32 wrote: »

if im allowed to reply without vilification i totally agree with your first point of course sinn fein should be open to criticism as any party should, but criticise them for that and not any of the stuff some of their members have been involved in in the past. i dont think anyone has asked for unquestioning respect, as far as im concerned respect is earned and while their policies mightnt allign to yours or the next man they have put themselves in a repectable position in regards to recent election results. as regards the threat you refer to can you please specify who, when and where the threat was made?

You can't have it like that.

Criticism of party- acceptable
Criticism of policies -acceptable
Criticism of party members - not acceptable (because they have all this baggage that you want us to forget because of the GFA.

Simple. If you don't want to be pulled up on your links with PIRA then clean house. No one criticises Pearse Doherty or Mary Lou on their shady past because they are new blood. SF needs new blood just like FF needs new blood. Will that make me like them? Probably not (for the reasons I've given in the many FF renewal threads).

As for respect. Election does not bring with it respect. I don't respect Lowry, I never respected Jackie Healy-Rae, Cooper-Flynn, Bertie. To demand respect just because you are polling well with the working class is a bit premature. You get respect from your record, conduct and policies. While I disagree with a lot of what Pearse Doherty says I think he is a good politician, he is about all I respect in SF.

Laminations · 06-06-2012 12:29pm

Richard wrote: »

In terms of Sinn Fein, I will certainly never vote for them, but it is much better that they have made the transition to democratic politics and that people vote for them, rather than they feel marginalised and go back to "war".

I agree. But entering politics is a double edged sword. It allows people vote for you and allows people ignore you /ridicule you. Just as you enter politics so too can you exit. The PDs were destroyed. We should be allowed contemplate and even suggest the destruction of SF (i.e. ignoring them out of existence) without the threat of a return to 'war'. I'd like to see SF either seriously reform or be replaced with another socialist left party (the nationalism they can take with them)

06-06-2012 12:36pm

Looney left policies, well said

celtictiger32 · 06-06-2012 12:39pm

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
and i get a warning!!! :rolleyes:

thecommietommy · 06-06-2012 1:08pm

Laminations wrote: »

Giving unionists Irish passports in an attempt to include them in Irish politics will probably work as well as republicans inclusion in British politics- where they refuse to take their seats at Westminster. Hocking them Irish passports will not dilute their sense of britishness or their will to stay in the union.

Your proposal is daft and a plain attempt to boost SFs vote by allowing republicans in the north vote. Why not all Irish passport holders in the whole of Britain rather than this one part? Why not smerican holders of Irish passports? You vote in the country that the policies will effect and where the budget is spent. Northern Ireland's policies and budget is dictated by Westminster and Stormont. Don't try and engage in the biggest case of gerrymandering ever

Far from been daft, most countries provides for a system for citizens currently residing or working outside of the state to vote in an election. Not sure of the system whether it's casting your vote by post or at your embassy, but it does exist. I'm sure it would be a relatively easy process to arrange in the 6 north eastern counties just across the border, voting booths could be in GAA halls etc. And if the unionists want or don't want to participate, well that could be their choice, that's democracy !!!

Here's how the Americans do it -http://travel.state.gov/travel/living/overseas_voting/overseas_voting_4754.html

Nodin · 06-06-2012 1:13pm

Laminations wrote: »

Giving unionists Irish passports in an attempt to include them in Irish politics will probably work as well as republicans inclusion in British politics- where they refuse to take their seats at Westminster. Hocking them Irish passports will not dilute their sense of britishness or their will to stay in the union.

Your proposal is daft and a plain attempt to boost SFs vote by allowing republicans in the north vote. Why not all Irish passport holders in the whole of Britain rather than this one part? Why not smerican holders of Irish passports? You vote in the country that the policies will effect and where the budget is spent. Northern Ireland's policies and budget is dictated by Westminster and Stormont. Don't try and engage in the biggest case of gerrymandering ever

It's not a "proposal". Everyone in the North is entitled to an Irish passport.

thecommietommy · 06-06-2012 1:31pm

purplepanda wrote: »

As for their loony left polices LOL

RVP 11 wrote: »

Looney left policies, well said

So SF ( and the ULA ) should be more like FG/Labour/FF ? Do you know the country is bankrupt ?

FG/Labour are in just implementiing FF looney polices anyway i.e. paying the bond holders regardless, appointing all their cronies to positions of high office in the civil service and judicary and breaking pay caps, clearing the way for bank bosses to give themselves pay rises, practically no reform of quangos, dragging their feet with closing of tax breaks for the super rich. i suppose.

FG/Labour were lambasting FF/GP/PDs for not doing enough about issues, that when they acted resulted in overheating of the economy. And the LP's paymaster, and bearded elders were tied at the hip to Bertie all the way through this debacle.

Obviously looney policies are A Ok with you.

Laminations · 06-06-2012 3:20pm

thecommietommy wrote: »

Far from been daft, most countries provides for a system for citizens currently residing or working outside of the state to vote in an election. Not sure of the system whether it's casting your vote by post or at your embassy, but it does exist. I'm sure it would be a relatively easy process to arrange in the 6 north eastern counties just across the border, voting booths could be in GAA halls etc. And if the unionists want or don't want to participate, well that could be their choice, that's democracy !!!

Here's how the Americans do it -http://travel.state.gov/travel/living/overseas_voting/overseas_voting_4754.html

His proposal wasn't to allow all ex-pat Irish passport holders a right to vote in Irish elections - it was to specifically allow Irish passport holders in Northern Ireland this right. Citing rights of American overseas voters would only be relevant if their policy applied only to Americans in Canada and nowhere else.

Allowing all Irish passport holders a right to vote here regardless of where they reside is a different argument - one which Dotsey was not making

Laminations · 06-06-2012 3:23pm

Nodin wrote: »

It's not a "proposal". Everyone in the North is entitled to an Irish passport.

??
see above

His proposal was affording Northern Ireland residents the right to vote here because they hold Irish passports. Unless you apply this to all Irish passport holders it is a proposal aimed at favouring SF.

Dotsey wrote: »

Any Irish passport holder in the north should be brought further into our political system and be allowed vote in presidential elections, and all northern MP's should be allowed speaking rights in the Dáil. They should not be treated like second class citizens of this country just for being born on the opposite side of the border they're as Irish and you and I.

THAT is a proposal, and a daft one at that

Fenian Army · 06-06-2012 3:35pm

Its not SFs fault that all the other parties abandoned the north is it?

Laminations · 06-06-2012 3:43pm

Fenian Army wrote: »

Its not SFs fault that all the other parties abandoned the north is it?

?
It was agreed in the Anglo-Irish Treaty, voted for in the Dail and put to referendum where it passed. It was also accepted in the GFA that 'the majority of people in the North wished to remain as part of the United Kingdom, and that Northern Ireland's present and continuing status as part of the United Kingdom was a reflection of that wish'

You may feel aborted but until it changes, Northern Ireland is UK, same as London is UK. I hope it will change and know over time it will change. But until then, allowing Irish passport holders there the right to vote here (while not allowing them in London or anywhere else) is an opportunistic proposal by SF supporters

FTA69 · 06-06-2012 3:49pm

JustinDee wrote: »

Another dipso republican fallacy is that there was no such leader known as Padraig Pearse. He was either Patrick Pearse or PH Pearse. Never gaelicised his name.

Considering he was editor of an Irish language publication and principal of a school in which the Irish language featured heavily, he did in fact use the Irish version of his name on a regular basis.

Hannibal · 06-06-2012 9:07pm

Laminations wrote: »

??
see above

His proposal was affording Northern Ireland residents the right to vote here because they hold Irish passports. Unless you apply this to all Irish passport holders it is a proposal aimed at favouring SF.

THAT is a proposal, and a daft one at that

Daft because you say it's daft. It's not about whether it favours Sinn Féin or not, it favours IRISH CITIZENS which is more important. It's upto the other parties to try then to engage people over the border

The bit I bolded is daft, becuase you're agreeing with what I was saying while contradicting yourself in the previous sentence.

Gerry Adams 21/04/2012

Sinn Féin President Gerry Adams TD has urged the Irish government to look closely at the electoral rules governing the French presidential election which begins today.
Teachta Adams said:
“Irish passport holders among the diaspora and citizens in the north should have the right to vote in Irish Presidential elections. This must be a priority issue for the constitutional convention.”
Teachta Adams pointed out that today: “Almost one million French citizens living abroad and in its overseas territories have the right to vote in the French presidential election.
“The Irish government has committed to discussing voting rights for emigrants in Presidential elections in the constitutional convention.”
The Sinn Féin leader said: “Sinn Féin has been consistantly pressing the Irish government on voting rights for the diaspora and for citizens in the north in recent years.
“I have raised this matter on a number of occasions directly with the Taoiseach in the Dáil and in our recent conversations on the constitutional convention.
“Specifically in our recent submission to the Irish government on the constitutional convention Sinn Féin has called for it to have a mandate that will allow it to discuss ‘the extension of voting rights for northern citizens and citizens in the diaspora’.”

JustinDee · 07-06-2012 8:56am

FTA69 wrote: »

Considering he was editor of an Irish language publication and principal of a school in which the Irish language featured heavily, he did in fact use the Irish version of his name on a regular basis.

Never once. Not ever.
'Patrick' or 'PH'.

Sorry mods. I didn't bring it up again.

junder · 07-06-2012 9:52am

Dotsey wrote: »

Laminations wrote: »

??
see above

His proposal was affording Northern Ireland residents the right to vote here because they hold Irish passports. Unless you apply this to all Irish passport holders it is a proposal aimed at favouring SF.

THAT is a proposal, and a daft one at that

Daft because you say it's daft. It's not about whether it favours Sinn Féin or not, it favours IRISH CITIZENS which is more important. It's upto the other parties to try then to engage people over the border

The bit I bolded is daft, becuase you're agreeing with what I was saying while contradicting yourself in the previous sentence.

Gerry Adams 21/04/2012

Sinn Féin President Gerry Adams TD has urged the Irish government to look closely at the electoral rules governing the French presidential election which begins today.
Teachta Adams said:
“Irish passport holders among the diaspora and citizens in the north should have the right to vote in Irish Presidential elections. This must be a priority issue for the constitutional convention.”
Teachta Adams pointed out that today: “Almost one million French citizens living abroad and in its overseas territories have the right to vote in the French presidential election.
“The Irish government has committed to discussing voting rights for emigrants in Presidential elections in the constitutional convention.”
The Sinn Féin leader said: “Sinn Féin has been consistantly pressing the Irish government on voting rights for the diaspora and for citizens in the north in recent years.
“I have raised this matter on a number of occasions directly with the Taoiseach in the Dáil and in our recent conversations on the constitutional convention.
“Specifically in our recent submission to the Irish government on the constitutional convention Sinn Féin has called for it to have a mandate that will allow it to discuss ‘the extension of voting rights for northern citizens and citizens in the diaspora’.”

In terms of northern Ireland, how does in benefit irish passport holders, the irish president has no jurisdiction In northern Ireland so it makes not a jot of difference to their life's, only group that stands to benefit is sinn fein who would finally have a chance at the symbolic job of president

bluesteel · 07-06-2012 10:36am

SVI40 wrote: »

I do wonder then they, and all the other political parties, realise there is no letter v in the Irish alphabet?

Vótáil doesn't seem like the imperative either...
All the Tá and Níl seemed ungrammatical too, as does "Seas suas d'Éireann"

surely it should be "Caith Vóta as son/i gcoinne"

RMD · 13-06-2012 1:51am

bluesteel wrote: »

Vótáil doesn't seem like the imperative either...
All the Tá and Níl seemed ungrammatical too, as does "Seas suas d'Éireann"

surely it should be "Caith Vóta as son/i gcoinne"

Without intending to sound snobby / elitist as a whole the demographic SF appeal aren't the most "educated". Simple slogans which are heavily simplified / Anglicized appeal to a larger range in comparison to correct grammar and word choice leading to less people understanding it.

celtictiger32 · 13-06-2012 5:51am

Laminations wrote: »

You can't have it like that.

Criticism of party- acceptable
Criticism of policies -acceptable
Criticism of party members - not acceptable (because they have all this baggage that you want us to forget because of the GFA.

Simple. If you don't want to be pulled up on your links with PIRA then clean house. No one criticises Pearse Doherty or Mary Lou on their shady past because they are new blood. SF needs new blood just like FF needs new blood. Will that make me like them? Probably not (for the reasons I've given in the many FF renewal threads).

As for respect. Election does not bring with it respect. I don't respect Lowry, I never respected Jackie Healy-Rae, Cooper-Flynn, Bertie. To demand respect just because you are polling well with the working class is a bit premature. You get respect from your record, conduct and policies. While I disagree with a lot of what Pearse Doherty says I think he is a good politician, he is about all I respect in SF.

no one criticises pearse doherty or mary lou?

junder wrote: »

In terms of northern Ireland, how does in benefit irish passport holders, the irish president has no jurisdiction In northern Ireland so it makes not a jot of difference to their life's, only group that stands to benefit is sinn fein who would finally have a chance at the symbolic job of president

of course it does, people in the north more often than not consider themselves irish, so the irish president is their president

RMD wrote: »

Without intending to sound snobby / elitist as a whole the demographic SF appeal aren't the most "educated". Simple slogans which are heavily simplified / Anglicized appeal to a larger range in comparison to correct grammar and word choice leading to less people understanding it.

didnt work you did sound snobby/elitist

VinLieger · 13-06-2012 11:01am

celtictiger32 wrote: »

no one criticises pearse doherty or mary lou?

Nobody criticises them for involvment in the troubles or less than legal activities that more than a few memebers of SF are implicated in

celtictiger32 wrote: »

of course it does, people in the north more often than not consider themselves irish, so the irish president is their president

Yeah except they arent and he isnt so kind of a useless point there

celtictiger32 wrote: »

didnt work you did sound snobby/elitist

Still doesnt mean hes wrong, the vast majority of SF supporters are working class or part of the less well educated groups of society, its most likely because SF consistently reduce any political points they make to incredibly simple jargon that ends up usually missleading these people into thinking everything in politics can be boiled down to a simple yes or no argument. Nothing is as simple as a yes or no argument as there is always multiple points of view that need to be taken on board and heard for everything in politics.
Its also a case of SF like to tell these people exactly what they want to hear which is why they are polling so well, since they dont have to make any hard decisions regarding who does and doesnt get money etc and because of this they can always take the more popular side of anything they want which no government is ever able to do specifically this one thanks to the god awful situation we are in.

junder · 13-06-2012 11:58am

celtictiger32 wrote: »

Laminations wrote: »

You can't have it like that.

Criticism of party- acceptable
Criticism of policies -acceptable
Criticism of party members - not acceptable (because they have all this baggage that you want us to forget because of the GFA.

Simple. If you don't want to be pulled up on your links with PIRA then clean house. No one criticises Pearse Doherty or Mary Lou on their shady past because they are new blood. SF needs new blood just like FF needs new blood. Will that make me like them? Probably not (for the reasons I've given in the many FF renewal threads).

As for respect. Election does not bring with it respect. I don't respect Lowry, I never respected Jackie Healy-Rae, Cooper-Flynn, Bertie. To demand respect just because you are polling well with the working class is a bit premature. You get respect from your record, conduct and policies. While I disagree with a lot of what Pearse Doherty says I think he is a good politician, he is about all I respect in SF.

no one criticises pearse doherty or mary lou?

junder wrote: »

In terms of northern Ireland, how does in benefit irish passport holders, the irish president has no jurisdiction In northern Ireland so it makes not a jot of difference to their life's, only group that stands to benefit is sinn fein who would finally have a chance at the symbolic job of president

of course it does, people in the north more often than not consider themselves irish, so the irish president is their president

RMD wrote: »

Without intending to sound snobby / elitist as a whole the demographic SF appeal aren't the most "educated". Simple slogans which are heavily simplified / Anglicized appeal to a larger range in comparison to correct grammar and word choice leading to less people understanding it.

didnt work you did sound snobby/elitist

Still dies not explain how it benefits Irish passport holders in northern Ireland since the Irish president has no jurisdiction here, might as well vote for the president of the moon for all the difference it makes. Moreover with such a drop in support for a united Ireland is it really just as close to a united Ireland As sinn fein are going to get

Only 7pc of voters in Northern Ireland would vote for a united Ireland this year.

And, according to a new poll, even when asked if they would vote to remove the Border in 20 years' time, the figure increases only to 32pc.

Significantly, the proportion of the Catholic population that favours unity now or in 20 years is also a minority -- just 48pc.

People in the North were asked: "If a Border referendum was held within the next year how would you vote?" They were given the options "Yes", "Yes, in 20 years", "No, keep Northern Ireland" and "No opinion".

This allowed the pollsters to distinguish support for unity as an immediate political priority and as a longer-term ideal.

Protestants were overwhelmingly against Irish unity, but the Catholic population was more divided.

Just 7pc of Catholics would vote for it now and a further 41pc would opt for it in 20 years' time, 48pc in all.

The proportion of Catholics offering no opinion on the issue matched the percentage in the population as a whole, 14pc.

This was a low opt-out rate compared with other questions.

If these 'don't knows' are ignored, 63pc of people in Northern Ireland, including 44pc of Catholics, want Northern Ireland to remain a separate entity even after 2032.

Across all social classes and among both men and women, support for removing the Border now is below 14pc.

It is often argued by commentators and politicians that if the Catholic population ever replaces Protestants as the majority, then Irish unity will inevitably follow.

This assumption tribalised local politics for most of Northern Ireland's history.

Sectarian

The new figures indicate that this 'sectarian headcount' model is no longer entirely valid.

Instead, a substantial minority of Catholics, nearly half, and an overwhelming majority of Protestants (96pc) favour the status quo.

The findings come from a major new survey commissioned by the 'Belfast Telegraph' and carried out by polling company LucidTalk.

Another study, published by the Community Relations Council in February, found that Catholics are already the majority population for people under the age of 30.

Despite this, the new survey shows that support for Irish unity is marginally lower in the 18-24-year-old group -- 36pc compared with 37pc in the population as a whole.

- Liam Clarke

Irish Independent

JustinDee · 13-06-2012 12:04pm

Fenian Army wrote: »

Its not SFs fault that all the other parties abandoned the north is it?

The small matter of the will of the majority of the inhabitants of this island opted for what we have now. Thats what democracy entails. Its a pity certain quarters ignored this and that some still do.

No-one was "abandoned" or caught up in any other melodramatic paint-up scenario.

Laminations · 13-06-2012 12:10pm

junder wrote: »

Only 7pc of voters in Northern Ireland would vote for a united Ireland this year.

And, according to a new poll, even when asked if they would vote to remove the Border in 20 years' time, the figure increases only to 32pc.

Significantly, the proportion of the Catholic population that favours unity now or in 20 years is also a minority -- just 48pc.

Figures like these don't matter to militant republicans. They claim they represent the minority against an 'oppressive' majority. They don't seem to think they require a mandate ever. And instead of getting off their working class, chavvy funeral attending, balaclava-clad fat arses and trying to make their home (Northern Ireland) a better place, they choose to wave guns around and read hate speeches and blame the Brits for everything, the same Brits that are paying their dole.

celtictiger32 · 13-06-2012 12:35pm

junder wrote: »

Still dies not explain how it benefits Irish passport holders in northern Ireland since the Irish president has no jurisdiction here, might as well vote for the president of the moon for all the difference it makes. Moreover with such a drop in support for a united Ireland is it really just as close to a united Ireland As sinn fein are going to get

Only 7pc of voters in Northern Ireland would vote for a united Ireland this year.

And, according to a new poll, even when asked if they would vote to remove the Border in 20 years' time, the figure increases only to 32pc.

Significantly, the proportion of the Catholic population that favours unity now or in 20 years is also a minority -- just 48pc.

People in the North were asked: "If a Border referendum was held within the next year how would you vote?" They were given the options "Yes", "Yes, in 20 years", "No, keep Northern Ireland" and "No opinion".

This allowed the pollsters to distinguish support for unity as an immediate political priority and as a longer-term ideal.

Protestants were overwhelmingly against Irish unity, but the Catholic population was more divided.

Just 7pc of Catholics would vote for it now and a further 41pc would opt for it in 20 years' time, 48pc in all.

The proportion of Catholics offering no opinion on the issue matched the percentage in the population as a whole, 14pc.

This was a low opt-out rate compared with other questions.

If these 'don't knows' are ignored, 63pc of people in Northern Ireland, including 44pc of Catholics, want Northern Ireland to remain a separate entity even after 2032.

Across all social classes and among both men and women, support for removing the Border now is below 14pc.

It is often argued by commentators and politicians that if the Catholic population ever replaces Protestants as the majority, then Irish unity will inevitably follow.

This assumption tribalised local politics for most of Northern Ireland's history.

Sectarian

The new figures indicate that this 'sectarian headcount' model is no longer entirely valid.

Instead, a substantial minority of Catholics, nearly half, and an overwhelming majority of Protestants (96pc) favour the status quo.

The findings come from a major new survey commissioned by the 'Belfast Telegraph' and carried out by polling company LucidTalk.

Another study, published by the Community Relations Council in February, found that Catholics are already the majority population for people under the age of 30.

Despite this, the new survey shows that support for Irish unity is marginally lower in the 18-24-year-old group -- 36pc compared with 37pc in the population as a whole.

- Liam Clarke

Irish Independent

who held the survey, liam clarke?

Laminations · 13-06-2012 1:01pm

celtictiger32 wrote: »

who held the survey, liam clarke?

Well, no.

"The findings come from a major new survey commissioned by the 'Belfast Telegraph' and carried out by polling company LucidTalk."

Read the posts you're quoting.

RMD · 13-06-2012 5:42pm

I'll put money on it Republican posters will try to find some way of discrediting that survey as it doesn't suit their ideology of everyone hoping for an UI. I'd love to see an UI eventually, but if people honestly think that it's overwhelmingly supported by Catholics up north they're living in lalaland. Religion is becoming less paramount up north now that there is peace, a certain religion no longer means a certain political view accompanying it.

Sinn Féin-A responsible thread for adults.

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