Elite armed squad to tackle gangland crime in Limerick

Random · 13-09-2008 9:49pm

"The bomb has been planted". "Go go go!"

timmywex · 13-09-2008 11:46pm

metman wrote: »

A pic I hadn't seen before of an ERU entry team.

Love the little piece coming down on the 2 middle lads to protect the marriage vegetable as it were! :L

exbootie · 14-09-2008 9:56am

eroo :There are plenty of units throughout the world with the word 'Ranger' in their unit designation.However,most of these are nothing like ARW or US RANGERS,they have either different roles or are just conventional units.So one cannot say there are 'ranger wings' throughout the world.As for SEALs,that is pure speculation on the journalists part.

No the Royal Irish Regiment rangers actually have combat experience,

To claim the ARW are regarded as a more professional unit (as the article does) then US Navy Seals is one of the most ludicrous things Ive read in a long time. As are the absurd claims that it operates to a higher standard.

"US Navy SEALs in elite forces tests and beaten them."

Total bollocks, the ARW came third in a military comp won by an Italian SWAT team, an Austrian SWAT team came 2nd.

US Navy SEALs are too busy in the Hindu Kush, Sudan and Iraq to take part in charity "comps".

metman · 14-09-2008 11:54am

To come onto a forum and start out by slagging off another poster, not to mention a special forces team, who regardless of what you believe, are all very fit, dedicated, motivated and better trained and experienced than you or I, reads as childish and immature. Don't be a walter, we've got enough of those as is. :rolleyes:

Eru · 14-09-2008 1:50pm

metman wrote: »

To come onto a forum and start out by slagging off another poster, not to mention a special forces team, who regardless of what you believe, are all very fit, dedicated, motivated and better trained and experienced than you or I, reads as childish and immature. Don't be a walter, we've got enough of those as is. :rolleyes:

You beat me to the punch on this one.

NOw I wont even bother replying to the posters comments

exbootie · 14-09-2008 2:01pm

metman wrote: »

To come onto a forum and start out by slagging off another poster, not to mention a special forces team, who regardless of what you believe, are all very fit, dedicated, motivated and better trained and experienced than you or I, reads as childish and immature. Don't be a walter, we've got enough of those as is. :rolleyes:

Yer right.

The average 18 yr old squaddie in the BA has more combat experience then the most experienced soldiers in the ARW, I am not disrespecting them just stating reality.

If newspapers are going to post articles on the ARW operating at a more professional level then US army/Navy special forces units, who have seen combat ops in theatres around the globe, pointing out that reality is fair.

This is the stuff the SEALS, Royal Marines etc have been doing in the Kush, Sangin, Zumbahlah etc. You tell me about the ARW doing something even remotely on this level and I will eat my words.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FcXWZ0XVuw&feature=related

Satan Polaroid · 14-09-2008 2:15pm

metman wrote: »

A pic I hadn't seen before of an ERU entry team.

SO: "Not another bloody Passport!"

civdef · 14-09-2008 3:03pm

Exbootie, all well and good if you're into playing special forces top trumps, but far more suited in the miltary forum than here in a thread about the Gardai, thanks.

patsyjoe · 14-09-2008 6:13pm

Supposedly what happens is that all the heavy weapons etc are locked in a satelite controled lockbox/safe. when the RSU are repsonding to an incident, they have to get to a certain location where they make contact with an authorising Inspector. when their location is confirmed thro incar GPS, the Inspector hits a button and sends a signal to the safe and unlocks it to allow access to the weapons. the sigs are supposedly being kept in the cabin of the car where the members can get quick access to them.

As a failsafe, ha, if the members give an incorrect location to the Inspector or the GPS shows they are not were they saw they are, the safe won't be opened.

Accordingly to the powers that be, it is the role of the RSU to assist in armed/seige incidents who can contain the area pending arrival of the ERU. should be interesting. Hope it works as well as they say. Might create more scope for us lowly members for a bit of movement if ur not in the 'click'.

exbootie · 14-09-2008 6:22pm

metman wrote: »

Source; Independent.ie

Comment from former SAS trainers of armed Police in the UK.

“We thought that police firearms officers were far more concerned with their personal image, dressing in body armour and looking ‘gung ho’, rather than their professional capabilities. I’m not surprised at the number of mistakes over the years.
“There is no assessment of physical fitness, no psychological profiling, nothing. It’s a major problem.”

"One of the soldiers said: “When the tension starts to rise and the adrenaline is flowing, the ‘red mist’ seems to descend on armed police officers who become very trigger-happy. This has been shown time and again in training exercises.”

CLADA · 14-09-2008 6:53pm

patsyjoe wrote: »

Supposedly what happens is that all the heavy weapons etc are locked in a satelite controled lockbox/safe. when the RSU are repsonding to an incident, they have to get to a certain location where they make contact with an authorising Inspector. when their location is confirmed thro incar GPS, the Inspector hits a button and sends a signal to the safe and unlocks it to allow access to the weapons. the sigs are supposedly being kept in the cabin of the car where the members can get quick access to them.

As a failsafe, ha, if the members give an incorrect location to the Inspector or the GPS shows they are not were they saw they are, the safe won't be opened.

Accordingly to the powers that be, it is the role of the RSU to assist in armed/seige incidents who can contain the area pending arrival of the ERU. should be interesting. Hope it works as well as they say. Might create more scope for us lowly members for a bit of movement if ur not in the 'click'.

A lot of supposedly's there:(

Your last paragraph is correct, everything else is off the mark.

There's no remote unlocking system, no GPS, no weapons in the cabin of the car and they are controlled by the regional D/Supt.

Sorry to hear you're not in the "click", don't give up yet:D

JonAnderton · 14-09-2008 7:58pm

and i know for a fact that the button to send the gps signal is behind glass which can only be broken by a hammer which can only be accessed by a sgt and inspector turning two red keys at the same time.. If its not done precisly the same time.the mp7s will explode
Thats true you know.

exbootie · 14-09-2008 8:08pm

civdef wrote: »

Exbootie, all well and good if you're into playing special forces top trumps, but far more suited in the miltary forum than here in a thread about the Gardai, thanks.

Yes, but I was responding to a point another poster made, which was off topic. It was not me who originally went off topic.

Eru · 14-09-2008 9:31pm

exbootie wrote: »

Yer right.

The average 18 yr old squaddie in the BA has more combat experience then the most experienced soldiers in the ARW, I am not disrespecting them just stating reality.

If newspapers are going to post articles on the ARW operating at a more professional level then US army/Navy special forces units, who have seen combat ops in theatres around the globe, pointing out that reality is fair.

This is the stuff the SEALS, Royal Marines etc have been doing in the Kush, Sangin, Zumbahlah etc. You tell me about the ARW doing something even remotely on this level and I will eat my words.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FcXWZ0XVuw&feature=related

Ok, how do I put this, go to the military sites if you want to compare military to military.

From what I have experienced the people that shout the most about military abilities and compare A to B tend to be Walters or reserves instead of stand up genuine members of these forces who show more respect to their fellow soldiers.

As for 18 year old squaddies, sorry but the British army are in Afghan and Iraq at the moment whereas the ARW have and will continue too be a part of the fast response units for various UN tours which still remains in Chad and has completed 73 previous overseas missions which is a far higher figure than your average 18 year old squaddie as you put it.

Now Im not doubting the British army is seeing action at this moment in time but no one here is bad mouthing the SAS either for the simple reason that we are adults with sensible brains. If you read the article which speaks of this you will see we dont agree with the writer and accept there is no justification for some of the claims.

However by your own admission the ARW were the highest ranked military special forces (finishing 3rd behind 2 police special forces) in the last campaign (which had over 30 teams in it from all over the globe) which puts your comments above from the SAS trainer into context. I do however accept that neither the SAS or Seals were present at that tournament which begs the question, what are you basing your comments on? Exactly how can you condemn the ARW so quickly?

In UN duty the ARW are currently the first response team in Chad and for all UN missions. The Seals are not involved in any duties. The SAS are present in one region only and thats Cyprus. Now the ARW are not in Cyprus but then again, that might be because the Irish UN duty there is performed by unarmed members of An Garda Siochana.

So are you in the SAS? ARW? or ever faced them in combat? I doubt it. Are you a police officer? ERU, CO19? Very much doubt that either.

Hmmm, just reading your post again, where the hell is Zumbahlah? Theres no such place and I would be confidant that any GENUINE British soldier that has served in Afghan would remember how to spell the areas they served in.

Now why dont you go pick up the latest edition of 'Battleships' top trumps or Janes and make desk judgements.

metman · 14-09-2008 9:43pm

Karl, subtle as always

Have you ever thought about a transfer to TSG?

Eru · 14-09-2008 9:47pm

metman wrote: »

Karl, subtle as always Have you ever thought about a transfer to TSG?

Ha ha ha, seriously though. I have looked at jumping ship but its not an option for family reasons. Wouldnt be going from one raining, cold country to another though, give me sun, sea and an easier life.

exbootie · 14-09-2008 10:08pm

Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Ok, how do I put this, go to the military sites if you want to compare military to military.

From what I have experienced the people that shout the most about military abilities and compare A to B tend to be Walters or reserves instead of stand up genuine members of these forces who show more respect to their fellow soldiers.

As for 18 year old squaddies, sorry but the British army are in Afghan and Iraq at the moment whereas the ARW have and will continue too be a part of the fast response units for various UN tours which still remains in Chad and has completed 73 previous overseas missions which is a far higher figure than your average 18 year old squaddie as you put it.

Now Im not doubting the British army is seeing action at this moment in time but no one here is bad mouthing the SAS either for the simple reason that we are adults with sensible brains. If you read the article which speaks of this you will see we dont agree with the writer and accept there is no justification for some of the claims.

However by your own admission the ARW were the highest ranked military special forces (finishing 3rd behind 2 police special forces) in the last campaign (which had over 30 teams in it from all over the globe) which puts your comments above from the SAS trainer into context. I do however accept that neither the SAS or Seals were present at that tournament which begs the question, what are you basing your comments on? Exactly how can you condemn the ARW so quickly?

In UN duty the ARW are currently the first response team in Chad and for all UN missions. The Seals are not involved in any duties. The SAS are present in one region only and thats Cyprus. Now the ARW are not in Cyprus but then again, that might be because the Irish UN duty there is performed by unarmed members of An Garda Siochana.

So are you in the SAS? ARW? or ever faced them in combat? I doubt it. Are you a police officer? ERU, CO19? Very much doubt that either.

Hmmm, just reading your post again, where the hell is Zumbahlah? Theres no such place and I would be confidant that any GENUINE British soldier that has served in Afghan would remember how to spell the areas they served in.

Now why dont you go pick up the latest edition of 'Battleships' top trumps or Janes and make desk judgements.

"the SAS are present in one region only and thats Cyprus."

Yer right,all three SAS battalions are not in A-Stan, nor Iraq, the Kush or Somalia rather sitting on their arses in Cyprus. Is that why three members of 23 SAS were recently killed in A-Stan ? I bow to your superior knowledge that because the ARW came third in a charity comp to Italian and Austrian Police units and beat mainly Police SWAT teams and SF units most people have never heard off in orienteering, shooting and other events they are the dogs bollocks, even though the average 18 yr old rifleman in the BA has more combat experience and the ARW have never seen combat. Excuse my poor spelling, that must further make you right.
They are indeed without ever firing a bullet ones the worlds most experienced SF units, lets ignore the fact the SAS and Yanks have been in dozens of theatres.

"The Seals are not involved in any duties".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Plk8fRSsrgc

I dont want to get into debate on this, as the mod said its the wrong thread.

JonAnderton · 14-09-2008 10:13pm

have anyone mentioned that my dads better than your dad yet?..

deadwood · 14-09-2008 10:15pm

"....okay look, i've said too much already. I might be putting my colleagues, er...I mean...lives at risk..."
:P

metman · 14-09-2008 10:20pm

If you come on to this forum giving it the big un, either put up or shut up fella.

Eru · 14-09-2008 10:29pm

exbootie wrote: »

"the SAS are present in one region only and thats Cyprus."

Yer right,all three SAS battalions are not in A-Stan, nor Iraq, the Kush or Somalia rather sitting on their arses in Cyprus. Is that why three members of 23 SAS were recently killed in A-Stan ? I bow to your superior knowledge that because the ARW came third in a charity comp to Italian and Austrian Police units and beat mainly Police SWAT teams and SF units most people have never heard off in orienteering, shooting and other events they are the dogs bollocks, even though the average 18 yr old rifleman in the BA has more combat experience and the ARW have zero combat experience. Excuse my poor spelling, that must further make you right.

"The Seals are not involved in any duties".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Plk8fRSsrgc

I dont want to get into debate on this, as the mod said its the wrong thread.

Ha ha ha, you make me laugh.

Kush is in Afghan, its not a different country you know . The SAS are 'training advisers only' in Somalia. Not in any conflict or battles and the country's civil war is over. In fact its mostly Ethiopian and Somalian soldiers fighting now. They are in Iraq and Afghan, no doubt about that and I didnt debate that point, in fact I agreed

1 SAS unit is on UN DUTY. Thats in Cyprus, you just insulted the very force your crowing about by insulting anyone doing UN duty there. Thats funny.

Now, how is having 4 SAS men killed in Afghan make them better than the ARW who lost no men in Chad so far or during the hostage rescue in East Timor back in 1999?

I wont bother anymore, prove your points by using some evidence other than Youtube for gods sake, its the ultimate tool of the deranged wannabee.

Ah, actually I see you dont rate ANY of the special forces that were at the tournament which was won by the Austrian 'Cobra' squad. Please, enlighten us. how do you rate the Special forces country by country? That sounds like the very thing you would be an expert at.

And my daddy would win, he can pick up houses with one hand!

JonAnderton · 14-09-2008 10:30pm

There's an easier way than that... hey, exbootie... what colour is the boathouse at Hereford?...

:D:D

deadwood · 14-09-2008 10:34pm

JonAnderton wrote: »

There's an easier way than that... hey, exbootie... what colour is the boathouse at Hereford?... :D:D

:pac::D:pac::D
Lovely.

exbootie · 14-09-2008 10:51pm

Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

Ha ha ha, you make me laugh.

Kush is in Afghan, its not a different country you know . The SAS are 'training advisers only' in Somalia. Not in any conflict or battles and the country's civil war is over. In fact its mostly Ethiopian and Somalian soldiers fighting now. They are in Iraq and Afghan, no doubt about that and I didnt debate that point, in fact I agreed

1 SAS unit is on UN DUTY. Thats in Cyprus, you just insulted the very force your crowing about by insulting anyone doing UN duty there. Thats funny.

Now, how is having 4 SAS men killed in Afghan make them better than the ARW who lost no men in Chad so far or during the hostage rescue in East Timor back in 1999?

I wont bother anymore, prove your points by using some evidence other than Youtube for gods sake, its the ultimate tool of the deranged wannabee.

Ah, actually I see you dont rate ANY of the special forces that were at the tournament which was won by the Austrian 'Cobra' squad. Please, enlighten us. how do you rate the Special forces country by country? That sounds like the very thing you would be an expert at.

And my daddy would win, he can pick up houses with one hand!

Please don't communicate with me again.

The Kush is also in Pakistan.

The SAS are with the CIA/Delta in Somalia as well as other places finding live bodies for the guantanumo express. In daily contacts/firefights, A-Stan is nothing like the ARW deployment to Chad.

The Cobra team are an Austrian Police team, please don't compare that to real soldering.

exbootie · 14-09-2008 10:53pm

metman wrote: »

Exbootie, we can end all the waltering easy enough, pm your service number and one of the lads on my team who is ex-reg RMP and currently a skipper in TA/RMP will gladly run you through the box.

If you come on to this forum giving it the big un, either put up or shut up fella.

*3671*89

If I gave the full number potentially you could access my social security details.

deadwood · 14-09-2008 10:56pm

exbootie wrote: »

Please don't communicate with me again.

Woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh!

Jay112 · 14-09-2008 11:09pm

Lads how did the conversation go from RSU in Limerick to '' 4 SAS men killed in Afghan '' haha!
Great to see the rsu lads about, have come across them a few times.

JonAnderton · 14-09-2008 11:14pm

Wow, we bringing this back on topic:eek:...lol...

Yeah, a mate of mine saw them in Cork last week kitting up on the side of the road.. He seemed impressed..

Jay112 · 14-09-2008 11:17pm

JonAnderton wrote: »

Wow, we bringing this back on topic:eek:...lol...

Yeah, a mate of mine saw them in Cork last week kitting up on the side of the road.. He seemed impressed..

It was worth a try Jon lol, the moderator might have noticed my analytical ability, i feel a promotion:D

metman · 14-09-2008 11:24pm

Jon do you honestly expect us to believe your mate was impressed in Cork?

Could you take your waltering some place else please.

JonAnderton · 14-09-2008 11:32pm

Did I say Cork, I meant Limerick/Galway/Waterford/Dublin*

*Delete as appropriate for which ever maes mystory the most believable

Phototoxin · 14-09-2008 11:36pm

Despite the decrease in gangland violence in the city since the city's criminal gangs came under the intense focus of the Criminal Assets Bureau and ongoing garda investigation, senior officers are taking no chances. A tentative truce between the warring sides was agreed last May, but this deal was greeted with great scepticism by gardai.

lolz sounds like the shield !

metman · 14-09-2008 11:40pm

Phototoxin it has not yet been confirmed that Farmington's Strike Team, lead by Detective Vic Mackey, are being deployed in Limerick.

Detective Mackey was unavailable for comment.

deadwood · 14-09-2008 11:46pm

JonAnderton wrote: »

Did I say Cork, I meant Limerick/Galway/Waterford/Dublin*

*Delete as appropriate for which ever maes mystory the most believable

Where does exbootie (what is that an ex-member of Destiny's Child?) live?

metman · 14-09-2008 11:50pm

I pm'd him, but he has not replied.

Both myself and Jon maintain his username is a reference to the Royal Marines.

Eru · 15-09-2008 8:16am

exbootie wrote: »

The Cobra team are an Austrian Police team, please don't compare that to real soldering.

Had to point out that comment before someone goes on the ignore list.

deadwood · 15-09-2008 10:31am

Karlitosway1978 wrote: »

The Cobra team are an Austrian Police team, please don't compare that to real soldering.

Those Austrians are crap at wiring motherboards, alright.

deadwood · 15-09-2008 10:40am

metman wrote: »

I see the queues at the canteen in Templemore haven't improved!

lordhawhaw · 15-09-2008 12:18pm

We have been successful at soft power in lebannon, Cyprus and Kosovo.
Why the gung ho in civilian policing? Can they learn anything from the Defence forces?

It was patently clear that Senior Officers had neglected to read the Barr report. They appeared fascinated with US swat tactics but forgot that an Garda Siochana is governed by the European Convention on Human Rights, constitutional right to life and Irish criminal law.

All of which are not on the lists of concern of the US swat and tactical forces.

I can only hope that officers will attempt to minimise to the greatest extent possible, recourse to lethal force? but poor oul silly billy Nacie managed to mention Task Force and Summons Serving in the same sentence at the press conference/ launch. (Well done Nacie, good boy,sit boy, double helping of biscuits and milk for you!!

I think some officers felt that they were ready for an Iranian Embassey style confrontation, but dont appreciate the demarcation between civilian policing and a situation where the Rangers get the nod.

One thing is for sure, none of the officers have ever experienced the adrenalin, and psychological myopia which can obliterate rational judgement. The De Menezes shooting is a classical example of poor judgement occasioned by hyper-stress.[

Eru · 15-09-2008 12:35pm

lordhawhaw wrote: »

We have been successful at soft power in lebannon, Cyprus and Kosovo.
Why the gung ho in civilian policing? Can they learn anything from the Defence forces?

It was patently clear that Senior Officers had neglected to read the Barr report. They appeared fascinated with US swat tactics but forgot that an Garda Siochana is governed by the European Convention on Human Rights, constitutional right to life and Irish criminal law.

All of which are not on the lists of concern of the US swat and tactical forces.

I can only hope that officers will attempt to minimise to the greatest extent possible, recourse to lethal force? but poor oul silly billy Nacie managed to mention Task Force and Summons Serving in the same sentence at the press conference/ launch. (Well done Nacie, good boy,sit boy, double helping of biscuits and milk for you!!

I think some officers felt that they were ready for an Iranian Embassey style confrontation, but dont appreciate the demarcation between civilian policing and a situation where the Rangers get the nod.

One thing is for sure, none of the officers have ever experienced the adrenalin, and psychological myopia which can obliterate rational judgement. The De Menezes shooting is a classical example of poor judgement occasioned by hyper-stress.[

I really dont understand this post. What are you getting at here?

Your speaking in past tense as if the RSU has just blown up a room full of nuns.

Another point, people speak about the Rangers handling situations but its the ERU that handles hostage situations and armed incidents within the Republic. Ireland doesnt have any allowance for martial law so its impossible for the army to take over control or operations from An Garda Siochana as has been demonstrated over the past 10 years with the ERU carrying out operations and even when the army has been deployed its under the supervision of the civil powers where the Gardai retain control.

Oh and its An Garda Siochana, not the army thats operational in Cyprus but your right, we are doing a great job.

Whats with all the soldiers getting confused lately? Its simple, your soldiers, were police and firemen are firemen. When we go to a fire or medical emergency we NEVER even try to take control from the experts, which is DFB neither are we telling the rangers how to do things in Chad.

Guess its true, the more you know the less you show

JonAnderton · 15-09-2008 1:19pm

lordhawhaw wrote: »

We have been successful at soft power in lebannon, Cyprus and Kosovo.
Why the gung ho in civilian policing? Can they learn anything from the Defence forces?

It was patently clear that Senior Officers had neglected to read the Barr report. They appeared fascinated with US swat tactics but forgot that an Garda Siochana is governed by the European Convention on Human Rights, constitutional right to life and Irish criminal law.

All of which are not on the lists of concern of the US swat and tactical forces.

I can only hope that officers will attempt to minimise to the greatest extent possible, recourse to lethal force? but poor oul silly billy Nacie managed to mention Task Force and Summons Serving in the same sentence at the press conference/ launch. (Well done Nacie, good boy,sit boy, double helping of biscuits and milk for you!!

I think some officers felt that they were ready for an Iranian Embassey style confrontation, but dont appreciate the demarcation between civilian policing and a situation where the Rangers get the nod.

One thing is for sure, none of the officers have ever experienced the adrenalin, and psychological myopia which can obliterate rational judgement. The De Menezes shooting is a classical example of poor judgement occasioned by hyper-stress.[

Sorry,who are you saying had poor judgement and were hyperstressed?..i hope it wasnt the firearms team.

If so,not only have you displayed an igorance to armed policing in general,but also of the specific incident you feel qualified to reference

Shame that this forum is becomming full of this behaviour.some of us spend more time trying to explain certain FACTS to the igorant then we do enjoying the banter and craic this place was intended to be..shame

dredre · 15-09-2008 1:23pm

JonAnderton wrote: »

Sorry,who are you saying had poor judgement and were hyperstressed?..i hope it wasnt the firearms team.

If so,not only have you displayed an igorance to armed policing in general,but also of the specific incident you feel qualified to reference

Shame that this forum is becomming full of this behaviour.some of us spend more time trying to explain certain FACTS to the igorant then we do enjoying the banter and craic this place was intended to be..shame

Is the ignorance because the firearms team were not showing poor judgement or hyperstress or because the poster doesn't know if this is the case or not?

lordhawhaw · 15-09-2008 1:26pm

I am well aware to the Gardai's presence in Cypress.

Karlitosway can you say for certain that the ERU learned lessons from Abbeylara?

A small phone call to professonals would have helped!

5 mins of Siege strategy for Dummies , designed for especially for Gardai, politically promoted beyond any sense of ability.

Also an Garda Siochana need only certify a civil emergency and request the Minister to deploy the Rangers.

The men and women of the defence forcess who have served over a million days of restraint and negotiation and soft power in the worlds hot spots and would be able to teach the Gardai some proper peacekeeping techniques.

I dont like the idea of our own Civilian Police using the H&K mk7 that all.

if a situation calls for the deployment of that sort of fire power the Rangers ought be called in.

surely you will agree with me, Karlitosway.......

JonAnderton · 15-09-2008 1:29pm

because the poster doesnt know what he's talking about.if he did,he'd know that in the type of operation he referenced,the firearms team,how can i put this without causing offence..acted correctly.if the poster knew what he was referencing,he'd know that

JonAnderton · 15-09-2008 1:33pm

ok..this is getting ridiculous know..you forgot, in your rush to insult law enforcement officers everywhere,your intention to have soldiers patroling our streets.how many baricade/seiges did 'the wing' resolve last year?

dredre · 15-09-2008 1:33pm

Fair enough, Jon. I accept that you are likely privy to details that are not available publicly which support this assertion. It is difficult from the outside however to reconcile this with what has made it's way into the public domain regarding this incident.

Speaking more generally, it must be acknowledged that firearms teams along with all other professionals experience moments of poor judgement and hyperstress. I felt that if you were saying that to suggest this was being ignorant then that is incorrect.

On the other hand, the subsequent post here from lordhawhaw is offensive and does nothing to contribute to an informed debate on the issue. Clearly the poster has an axe to grind.

JonAnderton · 15-09-2008 1:37pm

the effects of incidents on firearms officers has been discussed to no end with myself and a few others being heavy contributers and i agree with you.

However,comments he has made show that he doesn't even posess the facts that are well publicised

I, along with many others on here im sure,am begining to get annoyed at the blatant insults being leveled here.

Witcher · 15-09-2008 1:39pm

lordhawhaw wrote: »

I am well aware to the Gardai's presence in Cypress.

Karlitosway can you say for certain that the ERU learned lessons from Abbeylara?

A small phone call to professonals would have helped!

5 mins of Siege strategy for Dummies , designed for especially for idiot Gardai, politically promoted beyond any sense of ability.

Also an Garda Siochana need only certify a civil emergency and request the Minister to deploy the Rangers.

The men and women of the defence forcess who have served over a million days of restraint and negotiation and soft power in the worlds hot spots and would be able to teach the Gardai some proper peacekeeping techniques.

I dont like the idea of our own Civilian Police using the H&K mk7 that all.

if a situation calls for the deployment of that sort of fire power the Rangers ought be called in.

surely you will agree with me, Karlitosway.......

First of all its a H&K MP7, and why do you not like them using it, they've

been using the Uzi long enough, afraid of change are we? :rolleyes:

Its a gun...they are an armed response unit who need guns....and they

were given guns...whats the issue?

As far as I can see you read the paper heard about the new MP7's and

said "oh dont like the look o' that, they'll be out to shoot us next"

As for the Abbeylara issue, that's been debated at length here before and it

had a tribunal, I don't think that needs to be resurrected again, it's over at

the end of the day, the man is dead, maybe that could have ended

differently but we'll never know, let him rest in peace

JonAnderton · 15-09-2008 1:49pm

i'm begining to think that certain posters should have a 'warning:this poster does not base his opinion on any factual evidence and although
Ignorant to the topic,still feels qualified to level judgement' stuck on the top of his post

Fyr.Fytr · 15-09-2008 2:04pm

Even i find some of the new post to be ridiculous

Elite armed squad to tackle gangland crime in Limerick

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