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US customs can copy your hard drive

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    #32
    Ghost Train
    Registered Users Posts: 30,051 ✭✭✭✭Ghost Train


    Stephen wrote: »
    They can "compel" you to decrypt your stuff for them too.

    well with truecrypt you can have hidden containers inside your encrypted containers, offering you plausible deniablity...because the hidden container looks like random data would inside the outer container

    but best to wipe your laptop before you travel and have a clean setup. Make sure anything you'll need is available over the internet through secure connections


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    #33
    FearDark
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,425 ✭✭✭FearDark


    FTW!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acVc6H7wYbA


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    #34
    netwhizkid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,558 ✭✭✭netwhizkid


    Just do what the South Africans do and use the latest Pigeon net. They are collecting the worlds biggest prawn collection for BHO.


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    #35
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    FearDark wrote: »
    FTW!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acVc6H7wYbA
    that's actually worth loosing a finger for.


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    #36
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Deleted User wrote: »
    or email to self and not ingest anything? :rolleyes:

    Wheres the fun in that?


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    #37
    Hal1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,720 ✭✭✭Hal1


    Pr0n at his finger tips. :pac:


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    #38
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    Or create a super virus, store it on your lappy and start travelling back and forth to US with a fake beard.


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    #39
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    Magnus wrote: »
    Or create a super virus, store it on your lappy and start travelling back and forth to US with a fake beard.

    That would'nt work you would never be stopped, but if your old or have an infant with you or have the countrys' highest military award or a US senator.:)

    http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/02/27/war.hero.cnna/


    http://leahy.senate.gov/press/200803/030408b.html fourth paragraph down


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    #40
    petes
    Registered Users Posts: 8,382 ✭✭✭petes


    Or you could just buy an 'off the shelf' internet program, hack into the military servers and claim you were looking for aliens.


    I swear I didn't know that was on my laptop!!


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    #41
    Fulton Crown
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,493 ✭✭✭Fulton Crown


    Turd Ferguson wrote: »
    Pussy

    He hasn't got one ..has to injest (piles).

    OK ?


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    #42
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Joking apart, why would anybody carry sensitive or confidential data on a laptop? I keep it on the company server and log in whereever I travel.


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    #43
    Gone Drinking
    Registered Users Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭Gone Drinking


    Avah Deep Ghetto wrote: »
    Joking apart, why would anybody carry sensitive or confidential data on a laptop?

    Why would anyone try and suck their own penis? I dunno, its human nature i guess.


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    #44
    Manic Moran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,244 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Zillah wrote: »
    Some lunatics fly a plane into a building and a nation gives away its freedom.

    Terrifying.

    Unrelated. It's an issue of border security: Until you're admitted into the country, you have no freedoms afforded by that country. This is very long-standing policy, goes back well beyond 2001.

    On a related note, for example, INS and Border Patrol have enhanced powers within a reasonable distance of the border. (30 miles or so) Searches and detentions which would be unConstitutional in the rest of the country are given far greater leeway in the border area. Again, this is long-standing and settled law unrelated to 9/11.

    NTM


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    #45
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    Unrelated. It's an issue of border security: Until you're admitted into the country, you have no freedoms afforded by that country. This is very long-standing policy, goes back well beyond 2001.

    On a related note, for example, INS and Border Patrol have enhanced powers within a reasonable distance of the border. (30 miles or so) Searches and detentions which would be unConstitutional in the rest of the country are given far greater leeway in the border area. Again, this is long-standing and settled law unrelated to 9/11.

    NTM

    That's fine for all you tourist's:) but when the government uses these powers to circumvent laws that protect an American citizen's rights thats something else.



    http://www.aclu.org/privacy/spying/areyoulivinginaconstitutionfreezone.html


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    #46
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,827 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Magnus wrote: »
    Just a heads up for anyone planning to travel to USA. I travel there for business and will maybe have to start mailing myself sensitive corporate information now, or store it on a company server while travelling (probably a good idea anyway...).



    http://www.mobilecomputermag.co.uk/20080801763/us-customs-can-copy-your-hard-drive.html
    http://www.nysun.com/national/customs-agents-copy-travelers-laptop-phone-data/80735/
    because mailing it will protect it..

    Customs has more important things to do than pour over your profit and loss reports. Or my 1/2 illegal music collection. Beside the inconvenience of waiting while your drive is copied I dont see the worry.
    Joking apart, why would anybody carry sensitive or confidential data on a laptop? I keep it on the company server and log in whereever I travel.
    Especially this. How many stories have I read with white knuckles where a financial institution has let their lackey run around the streets of NYC carrying 250,000 social security records and credit card numbers in his hard drive? It is a very, very stupid way to transport sensitive data.


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    #47
    Sparky
    Registered Users Posts: 22,231 ✭✭✭✭Sparky


    make sure to clear any 4chan temp internet files before you travel ;)

    But in seriousness. Don't carry sensitive data.


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    #48
    Manic Moran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,244 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    artielange wrote: »
    That's fine for all you tourist's:) but when the government uses these powers to circumvent laws that protect an American citizen's rights thats something else.

    Just because one is an American citizen should not grant one immunity from customs enforcement or any other law. Most Constitutional rights (with regards law enforcement, particularly the 4th, 5th and 14th Amendments) are granted to anyone in the country, legal or otherwise.

    NTM


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    #49
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,811 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    artielange wrote: »
    That's fine for all you tourist's:) but when the government uses these powers to circumvent laws that protect an American citizen's rights thats something else
    There are no laws to protect an American citizen's rights.
    IIRC the president can revoke your citizenship.


    Back here, customs can enter your house any time they like.


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    #50
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    Just because one is an American citizen should not grant one immunity from customs enforcement or any other law. Most Constitutional rights (with regards law enforcement, particularly the 4th, 5th and 14th Amendments) are granted to anyone in the country, legal or otherwise.

    NTM


    I did not say they should be granted immunity but they should not be subjected to unconstitutional laws in the first place. Being stopped 100 miles from the border and having your car searched is so anti- 4th amendment.(unless your a tourist or terrorist):)And American citizen or other wise isn't provided that right.

    Back to the laptop

    http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2008/10/aclu-assails-10/


    The ACLU hopes that Congress will include changes to the border zone in traveler privacy protection bills that focus on prohibiting suspicion-less searches and seizures of laptops at the border. Congress is currently out of session and would not move on any legislation until sometime in 2009 at the earliest.


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    #51
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    There are no laws to protect an American citizen's rights.
    IIRC the president can revoke your citizenship.


    Back here, customs can enter your house any time they like.

    Thats what the 2nd amendment is for.

    Very hard to lose US citizenship

    Thats why I leave the door open.

    I really have to learn how to multi-quote:)


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    #52
    me-skywalker
    Registered Users Posts: 3,339 ✭✭✭me-skywalker


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    In the UK / US you can get done for refusing to reveal the password to encrypted files / disks if authorities request it (might need a warrant in the UK )

    im heading to america and friday and lets say they ask for my hard-drive and i say no and agree not to enter their country and return back to ireland.. is tehre any case for them to accept this offer even tho it will further increase there suspicions.


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    #53
    Manic Moran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,244 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    artielange wrote: »
    Being stopped 100 miles from the border and having your car searched is so anti- 4th amendment.(unless your a tourist or terrorist):)And American citizen or other wise isn't provided that right.

    Hang on, so you're saying that the searches are fine if you're a foreigner, but not if you're a Yank?

    NTM


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    #54
    Ghost Train
    Registered Users Posts: 30,051 ✭✭✭✭Ghost Train


    me-skywalker wrote: »
    im heading to america and friday and lets say they ask for my hard-drive and i say no and agree not to enter their country and return back to ireland.. is tehre any case for them to accept this offer even tho it will further increase there suspicions.

    You should ask them what would happen. Even is they don't request the hard-drive :pac:


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    #55
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    Hang on, so you're saying that the searches are fine if you're a foreigner, but not if you're a Yank?

    NTM



    Yes I am. If your a foreigner you would expect to be searched or stopped at a point of entry, even Americans expect this, no problem there. Its when they set up road blocks on the interstate and stop, detain,search and question without an kind of cause. Its un American and these laws were broadened after September 11th. They cover 100 miles from the border's,coast's or port's. 190 million Americans live within this area.


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    #56
    Manic Moran
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,244 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Manic Moran wrote:
    Hang on, so you're saying that the searches are fine if you're a foreigner, but not if you're a Yank?
    artielange wrote: »
    Yes I am

    So how would you establish that the person you've just pulled over is an American or a foreigner before pulling them over and questioning them? These sorts of laws pretty much by default need to be equally applied.

    There are two issues here, one is whether or not these border proximity zones are a good idea, and the other is if the laws should be unequally applied within them. I would argue that no matter the size of the zone, be it one meter or one hundred miles, that the laws be applied equally and fairly.

    On the other matter, it is to be noted that due to the inability (and some would argue, unwillingness) to properly secure the border, the various random checkpoints some distance in may well be useful. US citizens are not beyond breaking US customs laws, after all. I recall one thread here by a Boardsie whose better half got nabbed by an agent boarding a Greyhound Bus in Buffalo.
    Its un American and these laws were broadened after September 11th. They cover 100 miles from the border's,coast's or port's. 190 million Americans live within this area.

    True, but when's the last time you were stopped by Border Patrol? You make it sound like the Constitution does not apply as a rule, in fact it's a fairly select set of exceptions by a fairly specific set of officers for a fairly specific cause. There's plenty of other exceptions not related to Homeland Security. DUI checkpoints have been upheld, for example. If you drive into California on the Interstate, you'll hit an agricultural inspection station within about 30 miles of the State Line, where they have the authority to search your vehicle if they have a mind to. No Constitutional right is unlimited, the trick is to make sure that any exceptions are fairly narrowly tailored and serve a vital government interest.

    NTM


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    #57
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    Manic Moran wrote: »
    So how would you establish that the person you've just pulled over is an American or a foreigner before pulling them over and questioning them? These sorts of laws pretty much by default need to be equally applied.

    Well thats the question isn't it, but since you ask I would do like most state law enforcement does it, with some kind probable cause. Your speeding then we pull you over and find out your illegal ,terrorist, etc. But you are right everyone should be treated equally under the law, just don't stop,detain,search people to find out who they are.(while there is no reason to think that they have been traveling across a border)


    [QUOTE=There are two issues here, one is whether or not these border proximity zones are a good idea, and the other is if the laws should be unequally applied within them. I would argue that no matter the size of the zone, be it one meter or one hundred miles, that the laws be applied equally and fairly.[/QUOTE]

    I would argue that 100 miles is a little on the extreme side and unlawful. And if illegally in the country it doesn't matter 3 things will happen, 1 you will be let go,2 you will be detained tried and convicted,serve time(you'll get all the rights US citizens have then, except for the one on bail and you will be deported,3 They will detain you and deport you.


    [QUOTE=On the other matter, it is to be noted that due to the inability (and some would argue, unwillingness) to properly secure the border, the various random checkpoints some distance in may well be useful. US citizens are not beyond breaking US customs laws, after all. I recall one thread here by a Boardsie whose better half got nabbed by an agent boarding a Greyhound Bus in Buffalo.[/QUOTE]

    Because something is useful doesn't make it constitutional,racial profiling, wiretapping, torture. I don't know the Boardsie story, but coming from Canada on a bus to a city on the US border shouldn't be a big surprise that they might want to make sure every one on the bus is legal.


    [QUOTE=True, but when's the last time you were stopped by Border Patrol? You make it sound like the Constitution does not apply as a rule, in fact it's a fairly select set of exceptions by a fairly specific set of officers for a fairly specific cause. There's plenty of other exceptions not related to Homeland Security. DUI checkpoints have been upheld, for example. If you drive into California on the Interstate, you'll hit an agricultural inspection station within about 30 miles of the State Line, where they have the authority to search your vehicle if they have a mind to. No Constitutional right is unlimited, the trick is to make sure that any exceptions are fairly narrowly tailored and serve a vital government interest.NTM[/QUOTE]

    One time to many. Those are all state issues and state enforcement agency's, and they still need probable cause to search your vehicle.(unless you give consent)We should leave it to the people to decide what serves a vital government interest and not the government otherwise we might end up in Iraq:rolleyes:

    Before I die I going to learn how to multi-quote:)


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    #58
    artielange
    Closed Accounts Posts: 307 ✭✭artielange


    This is odd that the defendant decrypted his z drive and showed it to the agent, then he was arrested. Agent turns off computer can't get back to encrypted drive.


    http://federalevidence.com/blog/2009/march/compelling-access-encrypted-laptop


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    #59
    JG009
    Registered Users Posts: 2,482 ✭✭✭JG009


    I would have everything encrypted with truecrypt. As other poster mentioned you can have hidden volumes, and encrypted containers in encrypted containers and so on. I downright refuse, or just say I am sorry I dont know the password. There is no technology or programme than cant get past the level of encryption truecrypt uses. Nosey fecks.


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